Feed Pets Raw Food

Wednesday, June 20, 2007

[rawfeeding] Re: Bad Vomit/ Need help

This is interesting, Pauline. The same thing happened to my dog
about a month ago and when I posted about it, someone else responded
that it had happened to their dog, too. I don't know...I thought
maybe I got some bad fish. It was only the second time my dog had
had it and the first time was ok. But yes--horrible smelling vomit
and burps! His stomach seemed upset for a couple days after that. I
fasted him for a day or two (he had had a big meal and I wasn't going
to feed him the next day anyway). It cleared up. I'm wary of
feeding it again myself, but I may try it later down the line. He
seemed fine w/sardines a couple times, so I might be more likely to
try that when I feel like doing fish again. It's not necessary to
feed fish, though.

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Pauline" <pblondeau46@...> wrote:
>
>
> Can someone please give me advice or encouragment?
>
> My Collie pup has been eating raw for two weeks now. Just now at
10:30
> PM she vomitted in my bedroom. It was a nasty one. It was full of
meat
> of some kind and it had brown liquid that smelled like sh**. I'm
sorry
> it's the truth.
>
> She seemed fine all day. She played, exercised fine, was in good
> spirits.
>
> This is what she ate today. She had half a full mackeral, first time
> with that and tonight she had a chicken quarter. So far she has been
> fine with the chicken and pork, but after this episode it makes me
> wonder about the mackeral. I even gave her some salmon before with
no
> problems.
>
> I know someone told me that Mackeral gave their dog nasty gas and
poop,
> but this came out of her mouth!!! Ewwwwwwww!
>
> I don't know where this came from and I don't know what to do now.
Can
> anybody give me some advice?
>
> Thanks Pauline
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>


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Finding raw meats TX was/Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Husband in a snit=venting

Texas is cattle country I have locker plant right in my town!
Check under Locker plants or Packing plants or Meat lockers
or Slaughter house! They do cattle and hogs at mine:-) it's way cheaper to buy from them,,,,,
Check your nearest Cattle auction.....And they can till you were they slaughter them!
Good Luck,Charlene


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[rawfeeding] Re: Ending the first week in a bit of a slump

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "emugirls" <emugirls@...> wrote:

> I've started with chicken quarters this week (our first week) -
> Maximus won't even consider these whole - I've been wacking them up
> with a cleaver and with a little "doctoring" he's finally eaten ...
> sometimes. I've added raw egg, salmon oil, and even a sprinkling of
> tamari. But he is turning his nose up at dinner probably every
other
> night now.

****Some people would wait the dog out in order to ensure not
creating a picky eater, but if I were you, I'd try another meat.
Some dogs really don't like chicken. Turkey or pork seem like the
best next choices in your case--see below.

I even added some heart tonight - bigger turning up of the
> nose from both of them :-(

****Chicken heart, I assume? Beef or pork heart would probably be
more well-received, but may want to save that for a bit later when
you've gotten things a little more under control. It can cause a bit
of loose stool for new dogs/if fed too much. People talk about
finding it at Wal-Mart and other stores.

> Their water intake has gone WAAAAAY down - it's really hot (high
90's)
> and yet they are not nearly drinking what they did while eating
> K***le. I don't think they are dehydrating - I'm just noticing how
> slow the water bowl is emptying.

****Yep, that's normal. Lots more water in raw.
>
> Chicken just doesn't seem to be working. We don't have a butcher
> around here - anything to do with meat will come from a "box store"
> (Walmart, Winco, Costco, Sam's, Albertson's etc.).
>
> I was looking at the meat dept. tonight - NOTHING was under $2/lb.
> They did have one thing on sale: Pork shoulder blade boston roast -
it
> was one big chunk of meat with bone for .99/lb (about a 4.5lb piece)
> till Friday. Is this something worth getting?

****So there is SOMETHING under $2/lb., no? This would be a great
choice. Most dogs love it and it's economical. If there's a ton of
fat, you might want to trim it a bit at first. Newbie dogs often
can't tolerate as much fat without getting loose stool.

****What about turkey? Is that reasonable in your area? That is an
easy way to get meat and bone (and eventually organs). I'd remove
some skin at first to prevent loose stool. Can you tell I've
experienced being up in the night letting the dog out a lot? :-)

How do I cut that up
> to a right serving size? There appeared to be a big ol'bone in the
> middle of this meat.

****Just feed and remove when the dog has had approximately the
amount you want him to, or cut off a hunk of meat so one serving has
bone and others do not, and alternate bony w/boneless.

I really need to have this "down" by the time he comes home.

****Take a deep breath...We will help you. But it does take time to
figure all this stuff out, and with your dogs not liking chicken,
it's a bit more challenging.
>
> I'm a detailed kind of person - can someone PLEASE give me specifics
> of what cuts of meat to buy (and how to find these affordably) and
> what I can realistically expect to pay for them?

****This all depends on where you live. But since those are chains
many people will know, maybe others can chime in. Sorry, I don't
shop at those particular stores much, so I'm not familiar w/the
prices there.

> Sorry for the whinge - I'm feeling a little down tonight with
everyone
> gone (even though I like the peace & quiet!) and frustrated at my
> furkids not eating this "wonderful" food!

****Hang in there, it will get better! It's only been a few days!


> THanks
> kirsty

****Hope that helps.

****Laurie
>


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[rawfeeding] Australian Listers?

Hi there - is there anybody from Australia on the list willing to mentor me?
I am in Perth and have started feeding raw recently (4 Belgian Shepherds).
I would love to get in touch with someone in Australia if possible since the
availability of raw food is somewhat different here.

Carla Spelt

Fauvetnoir Belgian Shepherds

Perth, West Australia

<mailto:fauvetnoir@bigpond.com> fauvetnoir@bigpond.com

www.fauvetnoir.id.au

_____


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[rawfeeding] pugs eating bones

++++Mod note: hello very new member. please sign all emails. We've got a thing about that! ++++++++++++++


I'm very new here but want to feed raw. I started with the premade
stuff and I'm already feeding ground turkey. Today I gave them a quater
of a chicken. I took it away from one pug because it seemed so much for
him. The other pug wouldn't touch it. Should I give the gnawed piece to
them again tomorrow?

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Re: [rawfeeding] RESPONSE TO GINNY ABOUT FISH OIL

On Jun 20, 2007, at 1:21 PM, alliecaracleo wrote:

> Wow to all this info. Thx. Am I to understand even if ingredients
> dont show any soy etc.., that soy can possibly be in the fish oil
> caps? The ones I purchase as for humans, just show fish oil as the
> ingredient.


They should say if it's in there. Sometimes it's down in the tiny
print, "Soy added for packing/product fullness" or something.


ginny and Tomo


All stunts performed without a net!


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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Salmon oil help please

On Jun 20, 2007, at 1:00 PM, alliecaracleo wrote:

> Hi Laura
> Is this a good price for salmon oil and how long will it last? Do you
> store it in a special way etc? 60.00 a gal on ebay. I wonder if this
> is a cheaper way to do rather than capsules.
> thanks for your info.
>
> Denise


I get it for about that from Timberwolf, too, and I think it's a
great price, and even more so compared to capsules. A gallon lasts a
LONG time. I pour some in a smaller bottle to keep in the fridge, and
put the big one back in the freezer. It will last virtually forever
in there. Timberwolf comes in nice square bottles that don't take as
much room, too. I usually buy one or two cases, and sell it off to my
coop and friends.


ginny and Tomo


All stunts performed without a net!


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Re: [rawfeeding] Bad Vomit/ Need help

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 02:47:53 -0000, Pauline wrote:

>My Collie pup has been eating raw for two weeks now. Just now at 10:30
>PM she vomitted in my bedroom. It was a nasty one. It was full of meat
>of some kind and it had brown liquid that smelled like sh**. I'm sorry
>it's the truth.

Is there any chance at all it could be sh*t?

Cathy

Busydog Ventures ~ www.busydogventures.com
Focused on healthy minds and bodies!

Looking for Conformation and Puppy Manners classes this summer?
Reproduction Seminar with Dr. Robert Van Hutchison in October 2007!

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[rawfeeding] Need raw feedback pls!

Hello fellow raw feeders! I have two LARGE questions for which I hope
to receive a response (and will definitely appreciate.)

A) My sister in law just got her 15 year old daughter a puppy (the
runt – not that the term `runt' ever mattered and definitely not when
you're feeding her (in this case hopefully) a raw diet. Well, I am
hoping my sister will agree to go that way. She is pretty squeamish,
re: the `handling raw meat' thing… The puppy is a boxer X
G/shepherd/husky, so is likely to be both big and active. She is also
finanially challenged, so have tried to make it as cost effective for
her as possible. Herewith the feeding advice I mailed her:

1) Get some small freezer bags and prepare and freeze whatever meat
you buy (a week at least in advance for your convenience) into puppy
portions.

1.2) Defrost in lukewarm water before giving to her (best feed her
outside) although dogs can tolerate frozen meat (not like cats).

2) You can start her off on chicken thighs, chicken drumsticks or
Maryland (quarter) cuts ON the bone 2-3 times per day. Raw bones
surrounded by lots of meat are fine for her, it's the COOKED bare
bones that cause all the cr@p.

2.1) Don't give her chicken necks, wings or backs to start - too bony
and you know how puppies gulp. Maybe Kailla (the owner/daughter)
wants to watch her eat for the first two weeks just to be sure. Also,
even when she gets big don't give her 'heavy' bare bones, like cow
leg bones / marrow bones, etc.

2.2) Once she's handled the first two weeks ok you can buy her beef /
pork ribs, whole chicken carcasses, including necks and backs, cheap
whole fish with scales, bones and all (like mackerel - which is a
great 'whole' food, but start her off early on fish, giving her bits
of raw flesh mixed in her food so she learns to appreciate it);

2.3) Give her a chicken foot once in a while to munch if you can
handle it.

3) Give her a meal of (mostly) cheap raw beef (like you'd buy for
goulash or similar), or chicken, or mutton mixed up with 1-2 raw
chicken liver, 1/4 of a beef or mutton heart and a raw egg 3 times
per week while she's growing.

3.2) Basically you can feed her whatever cheap meat you want - if its
fit for people its fit for dogs and cats.

4) She MUST get organ meat on average three times a week. Sorry...
Buy her a beef heart and just hand it to her. Toss her a chicken
liver before her main meal 2-3 times per week. Babe, I have heard of
vegetarians who have converted their animals over to raw, even though
they hate meat themselves, never mind handling it just so's their
animals get the benefit.

4.1) Don't worry about bacteria, or her getting salmonella from raw
eggs or that she'll attack children or your cats when she's bigger
(complete trollop) or any of that stuff. Go to the following two
websites to read more if you have any concerns about the above, or
anything else:

www.rawfeddogs.net - this one has great menus but don't look at the
pics yet if you're squeamish.

www.rawlearning.com - both are excellent but this is also very
informative.

It is seriously not complicated, inconvenient or expensive. Her poo's
will be small, non-stinky and will decompose within a few days - not
like those huge brown stinkbombs that mar the lawns of modern
suburbia. You will hardly need to pick sh!t up at all. And even if
you do, it will almost be a pleasure. Heee!! Let me know.

OK.. Question 2:

B) Pls help us out if you can.. My cats problem is that if he isn't
having the runs (which occurred when I gave him a large snack of
liver on its own and which I haven't done again since then) once in a
while (like once every 2 weeks) he's having these VERY solid, dry
(even if tiny) poo's which stick to his bum and (when I catch him at
it) get dragged out of the tray and rubbed off on couches, bed linen,
etc – which is hardly his fault but you know where I am coming from)
… Why is this happening and what can I do to help him?

Does he need more oil in his diet? Logically I wouldn't think so,
since how many wild cats get `enough' oil in their diet apart from
fish (when they are lucky enough to get fish in the first place) – Or
does he need something else that I'm missing?

Anyway, herewith his `schedule':

He's 4 ½ months old; He devours (in the BIGGEST sense of the word) 2
whole quails p/day, with heart, liver, kidney etc included. 2-3 times
per week he gets a fish oil capsule, beef meat, mutton brain, whole
fish, egg yolk; once a week I give him a small baby multivitamin dose
(just to be sure); he is not adverse to cows milk – I mean it doesn't
give him the squirts; umm, what else….

Pls help. Neither My hubby is definitely not a `cat' person (neither
am I truth be told) but he's sweet and naughty and beautiful and I
would hate to give this little dude his marching orders because he
cr@ps on our linen when I know it could probably be prevented…

Thanks. Nicole.

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[rawfeeding] Re: Dried fish treats

In theory they sound good to me, but I bought some dried frozen
anchovies (which would be a good source of O3--but not all dried fish
are) in the freezer section of an Asian market and after a few times of
giving small handfuls to my dog I noticed he would drink TONS of water
following them. They didn't list any salt, so I don't know if it's
just from the salt water or if the label wasn't correct or what.
They're so cheap (I got a pretty big box for $4 or $5) they might be
worth a try, but you might want to see if you can find out the
ingredients for sure and keep a lookout for any reactions. Anyone else
notice this?

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "cavkist" <cavkist@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have experience feeding these? Are they worthy and/or
> safe?

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[rawfeeding] How to store big bits

When you have a piece of something that will be enjoyed over a couple
of feeds, how do you store it? Wrapped up in plastic in the fridge?
On a plate? WIll it taint any other food in the fridge? Does it need
to be covered etc? How long do you keep it/will it last? etc etc
THanks
Kirsty

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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Formally, Concerning beef bones now grains and glands

John & Naiza wrote :
Many say jump in,
>it's not that easy. We have dogs to show etc

OK, I really don't see the point in this statement ??

YES JUMP RIGHT IN !!!!!

I may have not been feeding this way for decades (6 years now) and in that
time I have shown one of my dogs to his Grand Championship (Australia), got
his Tracking titile, Endurance Title and have also done some obedience with
him. 1 of my bitches is well on her way to her Grand also has her Tracking
title and Endurance title and has had 2 litters whilst being fed a Raw diet.
I have also weaned all the pups from these 2 litters on a raw diet, one of
the pups is a multi sweepstakes, class in group and glass in show winner.


I am not bragging, just trying to make it well know that you CAN do anything
with a raw fed dog - they may go through a bit of Detox symptoms in the
begining, but it doesn't last long.

I know - my breed is Weimaraners and you can't hide anything on a wei !!!!


Lisa
Greyhope Weis - Aust
http://www.users.bigpond.com/greyhopeweis
GreyhopeWeis@bigpond.com

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[rawfeeding] Re: Ending the first week in a bit of a slump

I think ol' Max has already learned if he holds out a few minutes,
Mama will jump in and make is food even better and easier to chew.
I suggest you put his quarter down and if he is not actively eating
it in 15 minutes, take it up until next meal. Don't do anything to
dress it up or make it easier to eat. Don't let him put another
thing is his mouth until next meal time and give him the same
quarter again. Repeat this process as long as necessary. He won't
starve. You are spoiling your little boy.

Don't worry about water intake. He is getting water in his raw
food. Don't forget that raw meat is 75% to 80% water. Kibble is
less than 10% water. As long as water is available, he will drink
what he needs.

You will probably have to cut up your cat's meat for a while. My
cats can handle a chicken leg or wing ok but their beef heart, pork
roast, deer roasts etc need to be cut up pretty small compared to
the dogs.

Yes, by all means get the Boston pork roast. I have the butcher in
the grocery store cut it into the sizes I want for my dogs.
(Usually it is cut in half.) If your grocery store doesn't have a
butcher and has everything pre-packaged, you can cut the meat with a
kinfe and a coping saw or other small saw to cut through the bone.
OR ... you can just put the hole thing down and when your dog
finishes with it, put the remainder up for next meal.

Buy most any kind of meat you can find cheap. You may feed mostly
chicken quarters and backs or whole chickens cut up and turkey necks
etc in the beginning. It takes a few months to really learn how to
shop for your animal's raw diet. Talk to the grocer about expired
meats or meats nearing expiration. Check with small independent
grocers about buying in bulk.

Don't get too upset, in 6 months feeding your dogs raw will be
second nature and you won't think anything about it. You will have
found how to get good deals on meat and how to talk to butchers and
grocers and talk them into helping you. The first few months can be
pretty discouraging sometimes. After that, its clear sailing.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale


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[rawfeeding] Re: Feed any different when teething?

ahh..puppies...Bubba is teething now and we got to keep one of his teeth.
i'm giving him lots to chew on right now and the colder the better..some nice
frozen stuff is excellent.

Lillian

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[rawfeeding] Re:1st day raw- dog went nuts, help!

when we brought home carol she was a very shy little puppy who never seemed
to adapt to our home. any time one of the other puppies had to be corrected
for misbehaving she took it personally and would go hide in her crate. I
couldn't raise my voice to even call the dogs down from the playroom. It was
crazy. After switching to raw carol's personality started to develop for the
better. Before she wouldn't come up to me at all and now she is an absolute
doll..then again probably just begging for food.

anyway, it might be that the barking is to get your attention becuase she
wanted more to eat. Our dogs acted like they couldn't get enough the first
couple days and we let them eat as much as they wanted a couple times. She will
probably calm down over time, give it some time.

Lil

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[rawfeeding] Re: Starting out with 9 week old Golden Retriever

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "julesandrudy" <jules.leman@...>
wrote:
>
> We are in New Zealand. I am confused and concerned because I am
still
> hung up on quantities and 'types of meat' to feed! Would anyone be
> kind enough to hold my hand through making the changes to RM, either
> through this forum or offline? I haven't started yet, but through
> reading and getting 'advice' have spend too many dollars on packaged
> food and supplements.
> I'm more confused than ever.
> In anticipation
> Jules
>
Hi Jules

I am in New Zealand too. This list is wonderful for information and
advice from very experienced people who fantastically give their time
to help us newbies. Search the archives. I've spent many many hours
doing this (LOL). My 4 month pup been raw for 3 weeks or so and loving
it. Pup is doing really well, but I must admit I am struggling
financially with it. Up till now I've been looking for supermarket
deals and found a few good deals through The Mad Butcher. Where are
you? I'm assuming all our supermarkets/Mad Butchers have the same
specials nationwide? Maybe we can share our 'good scores'. I'm
currently approaching the local butchers to see if we can do a deal
with expired meats. Feel free to contact me off-list. All the best !

Lynda (Paraparaumu)

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[rawfeeding] Re: 1st day raw- dog went nuts, help!

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "missy7880529" <toddashaffer@...>
wrote:
>
> I just adopted a 52 pound lab/retriever mix. 12months old.
> We've had
> her 3 weeks and she's been a very sweet, calm, submissive
> dog. Playful
> when you want her to be. She also is pretty obedient
> to commands. She
> was raised on Ol'Roy kibble. Today was her first day with
> a chicken
> carcass. I noticed after she ate that she was extra playful
> and has
> seemed a little hyper all day. Tonight after she dug up and
> ate the
> rest of the carcass she was REALLY hyper. She kept nosing all
> of us
> inside the house, so we let her out to play and she went nuts. She
> started barking at us in a demanding way. She would
> alternate bouncing
> at us barking loudly and then she'd do a play bow, so I read it
> as play
> but she would not listen to "NO". It seemed like she thought
> she was
> the boss of play time and was barking commands at us. So
> we ignored
> her until she settled down, put her into a submissive posture
> and now
> she is on a walk to let out the energy. Has anyone else had
> a dog's
> personality change on raw? Her former owner had her since a pup,
> described her as calm and easy even with small children. And
> she was!
> Til today. She is not showing food aggression. But she seems less
> submissive. It was frightening to realize she was not
> listening and I
> had no way to control her. Why did this show up with the new food
> source!? -Missy

Hey Missy,
Welcome to the world of raw feeding. What you have is a normal Lab
or Retriever puppy. Everything you talked about behaviorwise is
exactly the way a lab puppy acts. :) I don't think she has become
less submissive, rather happier and more energetic and more puppy
like. All these are good things. BTW: Taking her for a walk will
not be nearly enough exercise for her. You will need to let her run
a good bit to get sufficeint exercise.

Admittedly a lab puppy is not the easiest dog to control but by no
means is it impossible. Millions of people have survived lab
puppyhood. :) :) :)

The diet change may or may not have caused this dog to learn to love
life but everything you mentioned are good things. They show a
healthy happy puppy. The day will come when she gets old with bad
hips or arthritis and can hardly walk and has no energy nor desire
to play that you will wish for these days back again. Enjoy them
while you can. Possibly a training class or private trainer could
give you some help on learning to live with a dog like this. :) :) :)

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale


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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: The success of Raw feeding or How long have you been at it?

HI Katie,

I thought I would share my experience with my cat for you. For 12 years my cat had allergic reactions to almost every kibble diet that I tried. Chicken, fish, beef, turkey. I had her on hypoallergenic veterinary diets for years, but had to switch them frequently as she would start to vomit her food after being on them for a short time. She was itchy, and never had a hard bowel movement. I started her on raw last fall: turkey, chicken, and fish...we have not looked back since. The only thing she throws up now are hairballs, and that's pretty infrequent since she started on raw. As well, she has perfectly formed stools now....woohoo! The cooking of processed meat denatures the proteins and I am assuming that that is what may be causing the allergic reaction. As well, there are sooooooo many chemicals, preservatives, unnecessary grains to add to the mix....recipe for disaster for a sensitive stomach. If you haven't switched, try it. You'll know pretty early on in
your dog is not tolerating the chicken...my guess is that she will.

Shannon

Katie <kcrockett@mac.com> wrote:

??

and . . . this is my real question . . .
if the allergy test says the dog is allergic to say, chicken, did you find that he could eat raw
chicken?


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[rawfeeding] Re: Runny bowel movements-Felix

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:
>
> Let us know....
>

Jackson is now doing fine. I'm glad to say his stools are now perfect.
Seems like the problem was parasitosis. Although stool sample came back
negative, I have learned that identifying parasites in stool samples is
not easy,and a negative test does not mean the pet is parasite-free.
Careful attention to the symptoms is key. A course of Flagyl/Corid
appears to be doing the trick. Thank you all for your
help/advice/knowledge transfer.

Felix


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[rawfeeding] Re: Beef Heart

Denise,
Where do you get your beef heart (whole?) in Houston.
Thanks,
Lori C


--- In rawfeeding@yahoogro ups.com, "Denise Strother" denisestrother@.. .> wrote:
I'm in Houston and pay $1.19/lb right now.



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[rawfeeding] Re:New puppy with diarrhea...

Taylor,
I had the exact same issue with my puppy recently when I switched her to raw
-- my first week, I got so gung ho and fed her all sorts of stuff: ground
lamb, chicken legs, goat meat, chicken liver, eggs. She got overwhelmed and
repaid me with DREADFUL diarrhea at 2 a.m... and 4 a.m. and 6 a.m. and 6:30
... not really, but it seemed like it. (although I guess I'm lucky I have a
pup who actually wakes me up to go out at 2 a.m. when she has diarrhea). She
still seemed to be feeling good, still had an appetitie, wasn't dehydrated.

So I backed off a couple days, gave her a little pumpkin to firm things up
and some cooked chicken breast. That seemed to settle her down. Once her
stool got firm again, I introduced just chicken back. She got diarrhea for a
day or so, but again seemed to feel fine, and then her stools went back to
normal. After a week or so, I introduced turkey ... and this week I
introduced lamb. I JUST started giving her liver and some gizzards this
week. It's perfectly fine to wait to introduce organs, and it's perfectly
fine to go VERRRY slowly in introducing new protein sources. So long as your
pup seems to be feeling well, has an appetite and is not dehydrated, things
should be fine. If Lokie gets worse, or doesn't improve in several days,
though, I'd get to a vet.

Good luck with Loki.
Liz


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[rawfeeding] Moxie going to vet

Called vet, she said that since he is now dehydrated that I should bring
him in to get sub q fluids, and a shot to stop the vomiting. Says it
sounds like he has a stomach virus or bacteria. Which is good news,
hopefully that is all it is and he does not have a blockage. I will
write more later.
Prayers please, thanks for all,
Jai


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[rawfeeding] Re: From 2 Meals to 1...

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Laura Atkinson" <llatkinson@...>
wrote:
>
> I generally move puppies to 1 meal a day around 7-8 months...or when
> they can eat enough in one sitting to not have the runs from too large
> a meal.

This answers a question I was going to ask today! I'd love to switch
to once-a-day feeding but was worried about my 7-month-old boxer. Now
I know!

Sarah

P.S. Yesterday, I had the happy and brand-new experience of having
two of my dogs decide not to eat their evening meal simply because
they just needn't need any more food. Never before has a dog of mine
refused food unless it was sick (I've been lucky enough not to have
picky eaters). I was a little worried when my girl Duchess stopped
eating, because she's having a slightly harder time figuring out raw
food, but when my beautiful old Bandit--who took to raw as though he'd
been waiting for it all his life (well, I guess he has)--was similarly
uninterested, I understood that they were just satisfied. It was lovely.

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[rawfeeding] Re: Bacteria Infection?

Hi Guinnivere. We have been raw feeding for about 3 months and no
salmonella or e-coli in the dogs or in us. I remember being new. You
learn so much on this list! Dogs stomachs and intestines are
different than a humans. Their stomach acid is stronger than ours and
that helps to kill off bacterias. Also their intentinal tract is
shorter than a humans to the food is eliminated much faster. There
are over 9,000 members on this list and I doubt anyone has ever had a
problem with e-coli or salmonella when feeding raw.
Kimberly

> i have one question: has anyone ever personally (not heard of
through other people)
> experienced a salmonella or e-coli infection in their raw fed dog?
>
> thanks,
> guinnivere
>


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[rawfeeding] Re: New puppy with diarrhea...

Hi! Since this is a young pup, I have to ask how much are you
feeding and how many times a day are you feeding? Pups at that age
do well with eating 3 - 4 times a day. Maybe you are feeding to
much at one meal? If there is to much food at one meal, it can
cause diarrhea. Also, I would stick with chicken for a few weeks
before adding in pork. Pork can be very rich and can cause the
diarrhea. What chicken parts are you feeding? If it is boneless,
he may not be getting enough bone to firm him up. Have you taken a
fecal sample to the vet to check for parasites/worms? That could be
the cause in a young pup too. As for organs, I would start adding
them in a week or two, after you have the diarrhea under control
because to much organs can cause diarrhea too. Try searing tiny
bits of liver, he may not like the "squidgy" texture.
Kimberly

So far he has been getting chicken and pork. My concern is
> that he has had diarrhea since he started his new diet. When he
poos
> there is very little that comes out, and what does come out is
mostly
> liquid. He has had a few harder stools, but those have been rare. I
> was anticipating some diarrhea since his system is adjusting, and
he
> is otherwise in perfect health; a happy, bouncy, fluffy ball of
> energy.

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Re: [rawfeeding] Moxie and pork

Thank you Casey for your quick reply. I sure hope you or someone is
reading now. I made him stay in last night and all he did was drink
water and then after a bit throw it up. He is now dehydrated, the skin
on his neck stands up. I am real concerned, I do not know if he is sick
or if he has a blockage. But no swollen stomach, or pain there. Plus
no fever is what confuses me. I am raising him non-vaxed, and he is 4
months old. I do not think it is parvo tho, no diarreah nor fever.
Any ideas folks? I am calling the vet soon.
Jai

Casey Post wrote:
> Jai,
>
> That's hardly running a fever...
> BTW - any chance this is heat-related?
> Casey
>
>
>

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[rawfeeding] RE: About Fish Oil Ingredients

I hope no one minds my "butting in" on this fish oil discussion. A
feind of mine recommeded fish oil as a supplement for one of my cats
who has sporadic hyperesthesia episodes - fortunately, very mild
ones. Anyway, the fish oil she uses and recommended and which I
bought is Puritan's Pride Fish Oil (in gel capsules - I bought the
1200mg caps). The ingredients on the label read:
"... Gelatin, Glycerin. This product contains fish (herring, anchovy,
mackerel, sardine, sprat, salmon) ingredients. Laboratory tested to
meet strict quality control standards for potency, purity and
disintegration. Marine Lipid Concentrate."

Analysis:
Calories 10

Calories from Fat 10

Total Fat 1 g 2%**

Saturated Fat 0 g 0%**

Polyunsaturated Fat 0.5 g ***

Monounsaturated Fat 0 g ***

Cholesterol 0 mg 0%

Fish Oil 1,200 mg (1.2 g) ***

EPA (Eicosapentaenoic Acid) 216 mg ***

DHA (Docosahexaenoic Acid) 144 mg ***

Other Fatty Acids 48 mg ***

Omega-3 408 mg ***

If anyone is interested, Puritans Pride has a "Buy 1, take 2 Sale"
going on at the moment. I bought mine for $9.99 (1200 mg, 1000 soft
gels) and recieved THREE bottles.

Hugs to all your fur kids,

Phoebe
with Kaffe and Cato


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[rawfeeding] Re:The success of Raw feeding or How long have you been at it?

I have 3 generations of raw fed Chesapeake Bay Retrievers. And have been
feeding this way for 10 years. Oldest dog is 13 years old and she is the
only one to have ever eaten Kibble.

We have not had to clean teeth in 10 years. And no vet visits other than
for accidental injury while hunting and Rabies vaccine every 3 years.

Our litter sizes have been large, 9 to 13 puppies per litter. We wean on to
raw, by offering large pieces of raw meaty bones as teething toys at 3 - 4
weeks. Mom finishes the weaning process by 10 - 12 weeks, for puppies that
remain with us. For Puppies that are sold, they go to homes at 9 - 10
weeks, with raw feeding instructions.

Cathy Mahr

Http://retrieversetc.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[rawfeeding] Advice for a (hopefully) new raw feeder...

MODERATORS NOTE: SIGN YOUR MAILS PLEASE!


Helloo fellow raw feeders! I have two LARGE questions for which I
hope to receive a response (and will definitely appreciate)..

A) My sister in law just got her 15 year old daughter a puppy (the
runt) – not that the term `runt' ever mattered and definitely not
when you're feeding her (in this case hopefully) a raw diet. Well, I
am hoping my sister will agree to go that way. She is pretty
squeamish, re: the `handling of raw meat' thing… The puppy is a boxer
X G/shepherd/husky, so is likely to be big and active. Herewith the
feeding advice I mailed her:

1) Get some small freezer bags and prepare and freeze whatever meat
you buy (a week at least in advance for your convenience) into puppy
portions.

1.2) Defrost in lukewarm water before giving to her (best feed her
outside) although dogs can tolerate frozen meat (not like cats).

2) You can start her off on chicken thighs, chicken drumsticks or
Maryland cuts ON the bone 2-3 times per day. Raw bones surrounded by
lots of meat are fine for her, it's the COOKED bare bones that cause
all the cr@p.

2.2) Don't give her chicken necks, wings or backs to start - too bony
and you know how puppies gulp. Maybe Kailla (the owner/daughter)
wants to watch her eat for the first two weeks just to be sure. Also,
even when she gets big don't give her 'heavy' bare bones, like cow
leg bones / marrow bones, etc.

2.3) Give her a chicken foot once in a while to munch if you can
handle it.

2) Give her a meal of (mostly) cheap raw beef (like you'd buy for
goulash or similar) mixed up with 1-2 raw chicken liver, 1/4 of a
beef or mutton heart and a raw egg 3 times per week.

3) Once she's handled the first two weeks ok you can buy her beef /
pork ribs, cheap whole fish with scales, bones and all (like
mackerel - which is a great 'whole' food, but start her off early on
fish, giving her bits of raw flesh mixed in her food so she learns to
appreciate it);

3.2) Basically you can feed her whatever cheap meat you want - if its
fit for people its fit for dogs and cats.

4) She MUST get organ meat at least twice a week. Sorry... Buy her a
beef heart and just hand it to her. Toss her a chicken liver before
her main meal 2-3 times per week. Babe, I have heard of vegetarians
who have converted their animals over to raw, even though they hate
meat themselves, never mind handling it just so's their animals get
the benefit.

4.1) Don't worry about bacteria, or her getting salmonella from raw
eggs or that she'll attack children or your cats when she's bigger
(complete trollop) or any of that stuff. Go to the following two
websites to read more if you have any concerns about the above, or
anything else:

www.rawfeddogs.net - this one has great menus but don't look at the
pics yet if you're squeamish.

www.rawlearning.com - both are excellent but this is also very
informative.

It is seriously not complicated, inconvenient or expensive. Her poo's
will be small, non-stinky and will decompose within a few days - not
like those huge brown stinkbombs that mar the lawns of modern
suburbia. You will hardly need to pick sh!t up at all. And even if
you do, it will almost be a pleasure. Heee!! Let me know.

Question 2 (my personal question):

B) My cats problem is that if he isn't having the runs (which
occurred when I gave him a large snack of liver on its own once in a
while (like once every 2 weeks) and which I haven't done again since
learning not to) is that he's having these VERY solid (good), dry
(good), tiny (once again, good) poo's which stick to his bum (not so
good) and when I catch him at it are getting dragged out of the tray
and rubbed off on couches, bed linen, etc – which is hardly his fault
but you know where I am coming from) … Why is this happening and what
can I do to help him? Does he need more oil in his diet? Logically I
wouldn't think so, since how many wild cats get `enough' oil in their
diet apart from fish (when they are lucky enough to get fish in the
first place) – Or does he need something else that I'm missing?

Anyway, herewith his `schedule':

He's 4 ½ months old; He devours (in the BIGGEST sense of the word
&#61514; )
2 whole quails p/day, with heart, liver, kidney etc included. 2-3
times per week he gets a fish oil capsule, beef meat, mutton brain,
whole fish, egg yolk; once a week I give him a small baby
multivitamin dose (just to be sure); he is not adverse to cows milk –
I mean it doesn't give him the squirts; umm, what else….

Pls help. Neither My hubby is definitely not a `cat' person (neither
am I truth be told) but he's sweet and naughty and beautiful and I
would hate to give this little dude his marching orders because he
cr@ps on our linen when I know it could probably be prevented…

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RE: [rawfeeding] Re: Turkey Legs

I feed turkey legs when I can find them cheap enough – our dogs
have no problems with them. they just crunch, crunch swallow till
all gone.

Love in Him,
Lynn
and the Corgis
From Northern WI

"The direct use of force is such a poor solution to any problem,
it is
generally employed only by small children and large nations.
" -David Friedman

_____

From: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Giselle
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2007 10:27 AM
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [rawfeeding] Re: Turkey Legs

Hi, Liz!
What size dog does she have?
Any kind of bone pieces have never been a problem for me. Or my
dogs.
She could always just pick up the pieces she thinks are too
pointy.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> My sister recently switched to raw feeding (with my
encouragement)-.
> She is concerned with turkey legs. She tried them the other
night and
> she noticed they splintered more than the chicken legs. Now she
is
> scared to feed them.
>
> Anyone have experience with feeding turkey legs? I haven't
tried them
> yet.
>
> Liz T
> MN
>


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[rawfeeding] Starting out with 9 week old Golden Retriever

We are in New Zealand. I am confused and concerned because I am still
hung up on quantities and 'types of meat' to feed! Would anyone be
kind enough to hold my hand through making the changes to RM, either
through this forum or offline? I haven't started yet, but through
reading and getting 'advice' have spend too many dollars on packaged
food and supplements.
I'm more confused than ever.
In anticipation
Jules


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[rawfeeding] Re: New dog here, need some help

Hi, Jeni!
It would be ok, but depending on the protein you start her out on, it
might just be easier to feed with the bone.
You could start with boneless beef or pork.
Remember, smaller rather than larger portions at first. Since she's
tiny, 2-3 meals a day to start might be better for her.
You want to introduce one protein a week, to allow her system to
adjust and to be able to know exactly what is causing the problem if
she develops one.
As you introduce variety in proteins, you'll want to add variety in
body parts when you can't feed whole prey. Organs need to be added
gradually, too, but a bit at a time at first.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Giselle,
> would it be ok to start her out on meat and worry about bones and
stuff later?
> Jeni


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[rawfeeding] Re: New dog here, need some help

Hi Jeni

approximately 3 year old Pomchi, little dog. I want to switch her to raw. I
have never seen such a small mouth before,
Feed her anything your big dogs eat but cut a little smaller. Beef, mutton,
roo, tongue, heart, etc can be fed as slices about the same size as a bread
and butter plate, chicken and turkey cut into eighths instead of quarters,
organs, especially liver, cut into pieces small enough to cover a teaspoon.

When you feed chicken and turkey, pork hocks, lamb shanks etc, you may have
to ribbon the meat so her tiny mouth can get a grip, but almost certainly
this little girl will amaze you with what she can eat.

My last dog was a boxer and my current one is a Maltese, but believe me,
both are living room wolves - it's only the size that varies.

Cheers
Sue


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