Feed Pets Raw Food: Aug 20, 2007

Monday, August 20, 2007

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11932

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Halo Harris
1b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Halo Harris
1c. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Yasuko herron
1d. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Sabrina

2a. Re: Iodine requirments
From: Halo Harris
2b. Re: Iodine requirments
From: Sandee Lee

3a. Re: Can You Give Too Much Organ Meat?
From: Tina Berry

4. Stinky chicken
From: Ivette Casiano

5. Back to raw
From: beckie716

6a. Re: Need reassurance
From: John and Jeni Blackmon

7a. Re: forgot on my last message
From: Morledzep@aol.com

8a. Re: fatty meats question
From: Morledzep@aol.com
8b. Re: fatty meats question
From: cmhausrath
8c. Re: overfeeding (was: fatty meats question)
From: Laurie Swanson
8d. Re: overfeeding (was: fatty meats question)
From: cmhausrath

9a. Re: Pig's tails???
From: Morledzep@aol.com

10a. Re: whole duck
From: Morledzep@aol.com
10b. Re: whole duck
From: Loretta Luja

11a. Re: need more bone
From: verrelli
11b. Re: need more bone
From: Sandee Lee

12a. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Casey Post
12b. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Purity

13a. How much to feed a puppy?
From: vickies_28
13b. Re: How much to feed a puppy?
From: Sandee Lee

14a. Re: feeding digestive tract
From: costrowski75

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:27 pm ((PDT))

I do have a plug in cooler, last time we used it my husband and I wound up with a dead battery. I told him don't leave the cooler plugged in with the car off. Well that didn't work. We were out in the middle of nowhere with a dead battery. I figure we'll need around 30 lbs of raw and we don't have a whole lot of room. I think if I can keep the food cold that will be the most important. This is why I am leaning toward the packaged raw just to get buy for the week because of the variety I would have to put together. I can probably pick out different meals everyday with Primal. Have you used pre-packaged ever?
Halo

pelirojita <kerrymurray7@gmail.com> wrote:

> Lauren <lfunaiol@...> wrote:
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "h.halo" <h.halo@> wrote:
> >
> > Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen
> prepackaged
> > raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
> > of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
> > sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
> > Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
> > a cooler and no refrigeration.
> > Halo
> >
Hi Halo,

We were just out of town and our dogsitter took our dog camping for 4
days (lucky dog...great dogsitter) while we were away. I had packaged

Recent Activity

114
New Members

Visit Your Group
SPONSORED LINKS

Dog health product
Diet and nutrition
Dog health
Dog health food
Dog health problem

Yahoo! TV
Want the scoop?
Check out today's
news and gossip.

Beauty & Fashion
on Yahoo! Groups
Share style tips
and advice.

Yoga Resources
on Yahoo! Groups
Take the stress
out of your life.

---------------------------------
Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________

1b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:28 pm ((PDT))

My pup is a Saint and he has a huge appetite he probably eats around 4 lbs a day which makes it a little more difficult that is like 28 lbs of raw for the week. I have got to think of a way to do this and this is why I am leaning toward the prepackaged food just for the 7 days its a no mess thing and compact. I don't believe there are any stores around. The campground has ice.
Halo

Mike Frantzen <hoover1203@yahoo.com> wrote:
I just went camping for a week with 2 dogs. I put in containers their frozen raw food and then put in the cooler. This was enough for about 4 days. I bought for the remainder at a Wal Mart. It worked out fine.

Chris F.

Halo Harris <h.halo@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Lauren,
Not too sure on the stores in the area. We have been camping in the past

Recent Activity

114
New Members

Visit Your Group
SPONSORED LINKS

Dog health product
Diet and nutrition
Dog health
Dog health food
Dog health problem

Yahoo! TV
Staying in tonight?
Check Daily Picks &
see what to watch.

Yahoo! Groups
Moderator Central
Connecting a world
of moderators

Endurance Zone
on Yahoo! Groups
Communities about
higher endurance.

---------------------------------
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________

1c. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:42 pm ((PDT))

>You could just feed them what you normally do, to make is easier feed meals just for the >night.

Hi.I agree. And,you can bring canned Salmon(in water),Canned Jack Mackerral(in water),Canned Sardine(in water) with can opener and it can become one easy meal that needs no refrigiration!

I am curious but,pre-packaged raw food does not need any refrigiration or freezer to store?

yassy

---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________

1d. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Sabrina" odonata24@yahoo.com odonata24
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:26 pm ((PDT))

How about freeze dried raw food? I went camping with raw food and had
a difficult time sharing the cooler with our food and prepared raw
food for the dogs.
Later, a friend suggested freeze dried raw food for future camping
expeditions. Nature's Variety makes some:
http://naturesvariety.com/content.lasso?r=1951391&page=1334&-session=naturesvariety:47FEC548140572FA2AJIGxFBD025
it is also great for treats too.

Happy Camping!
Sabrina

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "h.halo" <h.halo@...> wrote:
>
> Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen prepackaged
> raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
> of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
> sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
> Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
> a cooler and no refrigeration.
> Halo
>

Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Re: Iodine requirments
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:46 pm ((PDT))

Would the kelp have to be fed everyday to inhibit thyroid function. Or if it was given sporadially like once a week would it be safe. Some raw feeder told me she gives it a few times a week.
Halo

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote:
George,

Everything required is found in the appropriate diet. Kelp is one item I
would never recommend using as a supplement since it can inhibit thyroid
function.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "gevan1a" <gevans@sycomtech.com>

Recent Activity

114
New Members

Visit Your Group
SPONSORED LINKS

Dog health product
Diet and nutrition
Dog health
Dog health food
Dog health problem

Yahoo! TV
Love TV?
Listings, picks
news and gossip.

Popular Y! Groups
Is your group one?
Check it out and
see.

Moderator Central
Get answers to
your questions about
running Y! Groups.

---------------------------------
Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

2b. Re: Iodine requirments
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:57 pm ((PDT))

I don't know, Halo. But that's the problem with supplementing "just in
case"!! You have no way of knowing what is required, how much is too much
and how it is going to affect your dog. Best to save the supplements for
when there is a known need...especially something like kelp that is known to
mess with the thyroid. Hypothyroidism is rampant these days anyway...no
sense in adding to those issues! Best to let their body get what it needs
from an appropriate diet.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Halo Harris" <h.halo@yahoo.com>

> Would the kelp have to be fed everyday to inhibit thyroid function. Or if
it was given sporadially like once a week would it be safe. Some raw feeder
told me she gives it a few times a week.

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: Can You Give Too Much Organ Meat?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:53 pm ((PDT))

"I'm still trying to figure out these ratio, of 80/10/10...but I think they
are getting more than that 10% organ meat, now that I really think about it.
Can they get too much organ meat and what problems can it cause?"

Only if you were feeding all organs for a long period of time; just feed
them mostly meat with a little bone and a little organ and don't worrry
about exact percentages.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4. Stinky chicken
Posted by: "Ivette Casiano" ivettecasiano@yahoo.com ivettecasiano
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:11 pm ((PDT))

<<I purchased a stew hen for like $1.88 and it was sealed well
> (vaccuum packed) and when I got home it smelt like rotting. I
> couldn't stand the smell to take it out of the bag so I tossed it
> out instead of giving it to my dog. Should I have still gave it to
> him?>>

I purchased a few whole chickens on sale once and a couple of them were stinky but I fed it to my dog anyway because I'd read here that some people's dogs eat stinky chicken and they're ok. They were also vacuum packed. I suspect that it was the cause of his vomitting that evening then having diarrhea for the next four days until the chicken was gone. We ruled out everything else he had eaten and felt awful that I had fed it to him instead of throwing it out or taking it back to the store for putting meat like that out for human consumption.
I'll never do that again.

Ivette Casiano
"Live for today, plan for tomorrow"

---------------------------------
Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5. Back to raw
Posted by: "beckie716" beckie716@yahoo.com beckie716
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:12 pm ((PDT))

Hello! My name is Beckie. I live in Wyoming and have a great dane
named Lena (7 years old). (3 cats too). My dog recently suffered a
near fatal gastric torsion.

I used to raw feed. I have always believed a species appropriate diet
was the best thing to do. However my dog always looked almost
skeletal. She started to lose weight on the raw diet, no matter the
amount, or the type of meat (I tried pork and other fatty meats to put
weight on her).At best, she maintained her scrawny weight(100-110#'s).
People started to ask me if I was to poor to feed my dog. I was
actually spending a fortune on her. Once, she stayed at my mom's
house, ate IAMS and gained weight. Reluctantly, I changed her over to
IAMS.

Now with this gastric torsion, I see that I should have stayed on the
raw diet. However, I have a few concerns about switching back over.

1:no matter how starving she is, if she doesn't like it, she won't eat

it.
2:She seems kind of afraid of food since her episode.

3:she used to "hork" foam+some of her meal nearly every time. really
bad for my carpets

4:Raw feeding sources were/are hard to find here. (maybe there are a
few more raw feeders here now, we could order together)

Thank you,
sincerely,

Beckie Wilson

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6a. Re: Need reassurance
Posted by: "John and Jeni Blackmon" jonjeni777@sbcglobal.net jeniavidiva
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:16 pm ((PDT))

Brandi,
I don't know if you ever got any reply's so here goes.
Sounds like you have the chicken down pretty good. You have a good mix of items going on, and good sizes for the different dogs too, that's ok.
Now for the puppies, they shouldn't be missing meals, if you can help it. When people say it's ok for dogs to miss a meal it is usually after they have gorged on a really big meal, and you probably don't want a puppy to do that, they are growing and developing and they need certain nutrients, spread over time, and they need them regularly, so try to give them meals at least once a day, if they are at least over 40 pounds. If your puppies are over 8 months old, and giant breed dogs, then one meal a day is fine, but you really shouldn't purposefully gorge them, until they are adults, over a year, and are used to the diet.
And when they do gorge, you want to give them raw meaty bones, and things to keep them held over until the next real meal. Like pigs feet, Racks of ribs, or stuff like that. Something that is not a meal.
And remember, it doesn't have to be an exact science, so you don't have to do too many birds, stick to chicken, if it is the cheapest, game hens, have too much bone, not enough meat, and cost more, so your dogs will have runny poos. The whole chickens are great. But add some organ meat (with whole chickens it comes in the chicken, or you can buy some liver) about once a week. And maybe boneless chicken, or the turkey is good if it is cheap too, that has alot of meat on it too. And pork has good fat so that will help with the skin and make the hair and coats good.
You want to not buy ground too much, so that they can chew it up themselves, unless it is cheap and you are adding it to the mix, so they have more meat, then it is ok, but not a norm. They need to do the work.
As for the adult dogs eating once a day, it's fine if you want, but hard to do some once and others twice, you can split the adults food into half so they get some when the puppies eat each time, that's always how we did it, so they felt like they were included.:) They might still be a little hungry, but will get more when you feed them again with the puppies in the eve.
Hope that helps, you are doing a great job keep it up. Get everything on sale, and buy in bulk, ask the butcher if they will buy you stuff in bulk ahead of time when you have a payday. Like a case at a time. See about getting into a coop group buy online, we have Capital City Raw Feeders here in Sacto, see if there is anything where you are at.
Keep asking questions
Jeni

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

7a. Re: forgot on my last message
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:18 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 4:00:50 AM Pacific Standard Time,
equusray@yahoo.com writes:

that cooking bones is a no-no. If I take those out, cook the rest,
and give the bones separately will it be ok?

feeding bare naked bones is not necessary, and IMO a BAD idea.. what are you
trying to accomplish by taking the bones out and feeding them separately from
the meat?

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

8a. Re: fatty meats question
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:29 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 1:47:23 PM Pacific Standard Time,
kerrymurray7@gmail.com writes:

My 3 year-old 40+lb lab mix has a barely visible waist and no tummy
tuck and his ribs are in there somewhere I just can't see them. We
are almost 2 months in to our rawfeeding journey and he has lost about
2 lbs but we need to drop significantly more. He will eat pretty much
anything I put in front of him and has tolerated everything well. So
far that has primarly been whole chickens (from store, so no feet,
neck or head) with giblets, pork (rump roast, I think), some beef
(mostly beef heart and ribs as that was what I could afford).

Kerry,

slow weight loss is GOOD weight loss. how much food is he currently eating
at each meal? keeping in mind that with the 2 - 3% beginner rule you should be
feeding less than 1 lb per day.

i found that my fat dogs lost weight better when we went to every other day
feedings. they got bigger more involving meals and the fat came off in a
matter of months.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

8b. Re: fatty meats question
Posted by: "cmhausrath" cmhausrath@yahoo.com cmhausrath
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:35 pm ((PDT))

"pelirojita" <kerrymurray7@...> wrote:

> my previous post regarding this issue yielded one
> response (this list moves fast!) so please bear with me.

No worries -- Yahoo had a temper tantrum this weekend, it seems, so a
lot of messages piled up and were posted all at once. Lots to catch
up with!

> I have the opposite problem. I need to get weight off my dog.

Just remember, it's not an immediate process. Be patient, and don't
go getting TOO radical (removing ALL fat) in your rush to drop your
dog's weight.

> I have
> shrunk his portions and am making a concerted effort to up the
> exercise

Mmmkay, those are both good starts -- but so is a thyroid workup.
Search through the archives about full-panel thyroid testing (or
maybe somebody will repost the info) -- your dog may have a good
reason why he's not losing weight.

> Should I take the skin off the chicken?

Some of it, okay. Certainly don't remove ALL the skin, or all the
fat -- dogs need a goodish amount of fat in their diets!

> Should I remove the layer of fat from the back of the ribs that he
so
> enjoys ripping and tearing?

I would, if it's the globby fat pads I usually see. I'd much rather
remove a few concentrated fat deposits, and leave the majority of the
skin, than do the reverse.

> Are there leaner cuts or specific types (i.e.goat, venison etc.) of
> meat I should be feeding?

Chicken and turkey are generally lean, but do tend to have those fat
deposits. Pork is just generally fatty (as is lamb), so you might
avoid it or feed it in small quantities until your dog's weight is
under control. Beef can be lean or fatty, but it's usually easy to
tell which you're buying or to trim external fat (unlike pork, where
the fat is more marbled-in). Venison, goat, and rabbit all tend to
be VERY lean: good choices for a fat dog. Fish might be good, too,
at least for some not-too-high-fat variety.

> I can get very high quality beef tongue for $1/lb which I was going
to
> try next, is this too fatty for a pudgy dog?

Tongue can be really fatty, but it's also a great chewy meat. I'd
definitely get some -- you may just need to feed it in small
quantities for now.

> Or should I just rely on reducing portions, with the idea that I can
> significantly up the exercise in about a month when things start to
> cool down at night?

Primarily, yes. But two final notes: again, please do check on his
thyroid. If he's got a real medical reason for his weight, starving
him won't make him significantly skinnier! Second, bear in mind that
it can be easy to overfeed on raw. (At least, I often find I'm
inadvertently overfeeding because I'm so excited about all the
wonderful things I found for my dog to eat!) Your dog may just be an
easy keeper, and not even need quite 2% of his body weight daily to
maintain a healthy weight. I sometimes find that I'm adding an egg
(or two) here & there, or some extra treats, or an extra ground-beef-
stuffed Kong, and oh-let's-just-finish-off-this-leftover-chicken, and
whoops -- I overfed by a couple pounds this week!

Good luck & please keep us posted --

-- sandy & griffin (looking very trim lately, though his mom isn't)

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

8c. Re: overfeeding (was: fatty meats question)
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:47 pm ((PDT))

Hey, Sandy--I was just going to post about this! Now that I've found a
good variety and my freezer's full, I'm feeding more and my dog is
gaining weight! I have to restrain myself! :-)

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "cmhausrath" <cmhausrath@...> wrote:
Second, bear in mind that
> it can be easy to overfeed on raw. (At least, I often find I'm
> inadvertently overfeeding because I'm so excited about all the
> wonderful things I found for my dog to eat!)

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

8d. Re: overfeeding (was: fatty meats question)
Posted by: "cmhausrath" cmhausrath@yahoo.com cmhausrath
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:32 pm ((PDT))

"Laurie Swanson" <laurie@...> wrote:

> Now that I've found a
> good variety and my freezer's full, I'm feeding more and my dog is
> gaining weight! I have to restrain myself! :-)

LOL -- I tend towards extremes, in whatever I do, and the poor dog is
no exception. Most of the time we're in a perfectly happy normal
place, but once a month or so I'll decide either that he's a fatty
fat pup and needs to be trimmed down (in which case he'll get only
tiny meals for a week or so) or that he's looking a bit thin and
needs fattening (in which case he'll get overfed for a week or so).
Invariably he switches pretty quickly from looking a bit rotund to
fighting trim!

Come to think of it, though, he doesn't seem to mind the moderate
fluctuations. I haven't weighed him in ages, but I'd bet his weight
doesn't actually change more than a couple pounds. For a gorge-and-
fast predator, I doubt that's any big deal at all! His best weight
is right around here:
http://rawfeddogs.net/PhotoGalleries/ViewPhoto.php?album=19&pos=1
and I'm pleased to say that's just about how he looks now =)

-- sandy & griffin (stuck with his extremist human, but not much the
worse for wear)

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

9a. Re: Pig's tails???
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:33 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 5:05:50 AM Pacific Standard Time,
pam.vojtas@datacore.com writes:

OK, what did I buy ? There were 4 in a pack fir $1.29/lb, and I couldn't pass
them up!

Pam,

you bought what the package says.. pig tails. they are great chew toys, or
snacks for my dogs. i can't get them often though.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

10a. Re: whole duck
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:41 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 10:00:02 AM Pacific Standard Time,
luja@comcast.net writes:

Maybe I should go back and get more duck then. At 1.39/lb they seemed
like a steal!
So your dogs do well on duck with no digestion problems?

Loretta,

At $1.39/lb for duck i would fill up a freezer.. we can't get those kinda
prices here in southern CA (at least not that i've seen, except through the
buying group we are members of). Ducks are $4/lb or more even at the cheap stores.

my akita pup LIVES for duck.. she would turn down almost any other kind of
bird to eat duck. sometimes we get some stinky farts.. but it's mostly lamb and
pork that make the bad farts.. but any fatty food releases gas.. lol.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________

10b. Re: whole duck
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:31 pm ((PDT))

@At $1.39/lb for duck i would fill up a freezer.. we can't get those kinda
prices here in southern CA (at least not that i've seen, except through the
buying group we are members of). Ducks are $4/lb or more even at the
cheap stores.

Catherine,

I wish I already had a freezer. We just paid around 17 bucks for a duck
a couple weeks ago for a big dinner I cooked, and now I feel stupid for
paying that much. Now the sign for the ducks said "Special $1.39 w/o
head". I've never seen a frozen duck WITH a head!! It's usually $1.79
I'm gonna look for a used freezer and head back there.

@sometimes we get some stinky farts.. but it's mostly lamb and
pork that make the bad farts.. but any fatty food releases gas.. lol.

My older dog
gets stinky farts with almost anything so we are used to it!!

Loretta

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

11a. Re: need more bone
Posted by: "verrelli" ktverrelli@bellsouth.net verrelli
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:43 pm ((PDT))

Sandee
before when I was feeding her a pre-fab frozen (northwest natural)
and chicken necks - she wasn't fat and didn't have an issue with her
glands - one month on all meat and she has put on weigh (that's my
problem due to not regulating the size) but also she has developed
the anal problem.

I know they don't NEED veggie but don't know if it would hurt

Kellie
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Kellie,
>
> Dogs get all the fiber they require from meat and bones. Veggies
are not
> required to regulate and could be contributing to anal gland problems.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________

11b. Re: need more bone
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:58 pm ((PDT))

Kellie,

Whatever the problem is, it is not due to lack of veggies. You may need to
work on the meat/bone ratio. The appropriate amounts will produce nice firm
stools which will express the anal glands. Veggies are not going to do
that.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "verrelli" <ktverrelli@bellsouth.net>
before when I was feeding her a pre-fab frozen (northwest natural)
and chicken necks - she wasn't fat and didn't have an issue with her
glands - one month on all meat and she has put on weigh (that's my
problem due to not regulating the size) but also she has developed
the anal problem.

I know they don't NEED veggie but don't know if it would hurt

Kellie

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

12a. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:48 pm ((PDT))

> Arghhhhh! I just checked my dog's teeth tonight and both of his upper
> fourth premolars are chipped to where I can see pink. So off to the
> vet I go. His teeth are otherwise healthy so I'm sure a root canal
> will probably be the way to go. We regularly check his teeth out, so
> this seems to have been done pretty recently.

Rachel,

I recommend against root canals as do several others here - you want to do a
lot of research on that before you commit to anything. Bad teeth get
extracted at my house, end of story.

Also keep in mind that tooth damage is cumulative and while the breaks may
be recent, the microfractures may have been happening for a long time.
There are a number of factors involved with tooth strength, including the
biggie - genetics.

Casey

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________

12b. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Purity" purity21_99@yahoo.com purity21_99
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:26 pm ((PDT))

My vet agrees that the best option, since he's a hard chewer, is to do
an extraction. One tooth is definitely broken down to the pulp, so
that one will be pulled out. The other one is still a question mark
and he will re-evaluate it during the surgery. He doesn't think it
broke off down to the pulp and if that's the case, that one will stay
in. Thanks everyone for your responses.
Rachel

> I would do a bit more research before running off to get root canals
> on these teeth. They will not hold up and could cause other
> problems down the road. It's far better to just have the teeth
> pulled.

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

13a. How much to feed a puppy?
Posted by: "vickies_28" vickies_28@yahoo.com vickies_28
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:30 pm ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: PLEASE REMEMBER TO SIGN YOUR MESSAGES.***

I have a basset hound puppy, 5 months old. He weight about 38-40 lbs
but looks VERY skinny, like bones. I started feeding him raw despite
the creams of my husband and everybody around me. He refused to eat
kibble or any other food for 3 straight days after we got him. When I
gave him liver and raw chicken with bone - what a difference. So my
question is - how much to give him?
I used to feed another basset raw diet - but that one ate veggies and
cottage chese, and eggs and whatever he could get - and he was much
bigger - around 72 lbs. But with a 5-month old puppy I am lost.
Please share how much you feed.
Thanks

Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________

13b. Re: How much to feed a puppy?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:41 pm ((PDT))

A good starting place is 2-3% of his expected adult weight per day. What
exactly have you been feeding?

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "vickies_28" <vickies_28@yahoo.com>

Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

14a. Re: feeding digestive tract
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:21 pm ((PDT))

"jmwise80" <jmwise80@...> wrote:

> I was curious of the general consensus on feeding an animals
digestive
> tract.
*****
If it's in the corpse, feed it and let the dog decide whether it's
edible. If it's not in the corpse, don't bother with it. Seems
reasonable enough to me.

> I have "heard", and we all know we have "heard" some pretty good
stuff,
> that the bad bacterial stuff happens in the digestive tract
> particularly in the colon.
*****
What bad bacterial stuff do you mean? What happens in the colon is
digestion, that's not bad, that's good.

What wolves eat of is whole prey. Since in the wild they can pick
and choose, sometimes they eat the digestive tract and sometimes they
don't. My guess is sometimes life is good enough that they are not
forced to eat the intestines, or that sometimes the intestines are
simply unappealing.

If you aren't comfortable feeding the digestive system, don't. If
you aren't comfortable feeding burst road kill, don't. I've no
problem feeding whole intact critters to my dogs but I'm not sure I
would opt for an old, busted up one.

You're allowed to draw the line.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

All information on this list represents personal opinion only. By staying on this list, you agree to never hold anyone from this list or associated with this list liable for any information posted through this list. You agree to take personal responsibility for your learning, and for personal responsibility for what you feed yourself, your family, and your dogs, cats, ferrets, or any other animal that lives under your care. If you don't agree, please unsubscribe immediately.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

<*> Your email settings:
Digest Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join

(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
mailto:rawfeeding-normal@yahoogroups.com
mailto:rawfeeding-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
rawfeeding-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------------------------------------------------------

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11931

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Lauren
1b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Halo Harris
1c. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Halo Harris
1d. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: pelirojita
1e. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Mike Frantzen

2a. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Purity
2b. Re: Broken Teeth
From: mariasmom2001
2c. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Sandee Lee
2d. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Purity

3a. Re: Duck and organ question
From: Laurie Swanson

4a. fatty meats question
From: pelirojita
4b. Re: fatty meats question
From: Yasuko herron
4c. Re: fatty meats question
From: Halo Harris

5a. Camping
From: Belinda Mitchell
5b. Re: Camping
From: Halo Harris

6a. Re: Iodine requirments
From: Sandee Lee

7a. Re: Me again Poultry Cost and QUESTIONS.....necks?
From: Sandee Lee

8. Feeding possum
From: sallycouper

9a. Re: found goodies at Asian market
From: Laurie Swanson
9b. Re: found goodies at Asian market
From: diannem200400

10a. Re: need more bone
From: Sandee Lee

11a. Re: traveling with raw/Coleman cooler ?s
From: Michael Moore
11b. Re: traveling with raw/Coleman cooler ?s
From: Halo Harris

12a. Re: Can You Give Too Much Organ Meat?
From: Morledzep@aol.com

13a. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
From: Morledzep@aol.com

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Lauren" lfunaiol@yahoo.com lfunaiol
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:50 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "h.halo" <h.halo@...> wrote:
>
> Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen
prepackaged
> raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
> of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
> sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
> Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
> a cooler and no refrigeration.
> Halo
>
Hi Halo,

How long will you be camping? If not for too long away from a store,
just pack a cooler with normal raw meaty bones. If you start off with
most of it frozen and packed in ice, you will do fine.

Lauren

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

1b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:20 pm ((PDT))

Thanks Allison, I never thought of that. Great suggestion. I really don't like the pre-packages raw you its hard to tell whats in it.
Halo

Alison Maffett <sweettuth23@yahoo.com> wrote:
You could just feed them what you normally do, to make is easier feed meals just for the night. Just throw each meal into a zip lock bag and put all but one nights into the freezer first and feed them that. Alison

----- Original Message ----
From: h.halo <h.halo@yahoo.com>

Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have

a cooler and no refrigeration.

Halo

<!--

#ygrp-mlmsg {font-size:13px;font-family:arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;}
#ygrp-mlmsg table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;}
#ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {font:99% arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;}
#ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {font:115% monospace;}
#ygrp-mlmsg * {line-height:1.22em;}
#ygrp-text{
font-family:Georgia;
}
#ygrp-text p{
margin:0 0 1em 0;}
#ygrp-tpmsgs{
font-family:Arial;
clear:both;}
#ygrp-vitnav{
padding-top:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;margin:0;}
#ygrp-vitnav a{
padding:0 1px;}
#ygrp-actbar{
clear:both;margin:25px 0;white-space:nowrap;color:#666;text-align:right;}
#ygrp-actbar .left{
float:left;white-space:nowrap;}
.bld{font-weight:bold;}
#ygrp-grft{
font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;padding:15px 0;}
#ygrp-ft{
font-family:verdana;font-size:77%;border-top:1px solid #666;
padding:5px 0;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg #logo{
padding-bottom:10px;}

#ygrp-vital{
background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:2px 0 8px 8px;}
#ygrp-vital #vithd{
font-size:77%;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:bold;color:#333;text-transform:uppercase;}
#ygrp-vital ul{
padding:0;margin:2px 0;}
#ygrp-vital ul li{
list-style-type:none;clear:both;border:1px solid #e0ecee;
}
#ygrp-vital ul li .ct{
font-weight:bold;color:#ff7900;float:right;width:2em;text-align:right;padding-right:.5em;}
#ygrp-vital ul li .cat{
font-weight:bold;}
#ygrp-vital a {
text-decoration:none;}

#ygrp-vital a:hover{
text-decoration:underline;}

#ygrp-sponsor #hd{
color:#999;font-size:77%;}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov{
padding:6px 13px;background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov ul{
padding:0 0 0 8px;margin:0;}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li{
list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;font-size:77%;}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li a{
text-decoration:none;font-size:130%;}
#ygrp-sponsor #nc {
background-color:#eee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:0 8px;}
#ygrp-sponsor .ad{
padding:8px 0;}
#ygrp-sponsor .ad #hd1{
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold;color:#628c2a;font-size:100%;line-height:122%;}
#ygrp-sponsor .ad a{
text-decoration:none;}
#ygrp-sponsor .ad a:hover{
text-decoration:underline;}
#ygrp-sponsor .ad p{
margin:0;}
o {font-size:0;}
.MsoNormal {
margin:0 0 0 0;}
#ygrp-text tt{
font-size:120%;}
blockquote{margin:0 0 0 4px;}
.replbq {margin:4;}
-->

__________________________________________________________
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

---------------------------------
Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Yahoo! Autos new Car Finder tool.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

1c. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:21 pm ((PDT))

Hi Lauren,
Not too sure on the stores in the area. We have been camping in the past where the stores are 1/2 hour away for ice. I can always call the campground and find out for sure. Will be camping for around 7 days.
Halo

Lauren <lfunaiol@yahoo.com> wrote:
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "h.halo" <h.halo@...> wrote:
>
> Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen
prepackaged
> raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
> of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
> sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
> Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
> a cooler and no refrigeration.
> Halo
>
Hi Halo,

How long will you be camping? If not for too long away from a store,
just pack a cooler with normal raw meaty bones. If you start off with
most of it frozen and packed in ice, you will do fine.

Lauren

---------------------------------
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

1d. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "pelirojita" kerrymurray7@gmail.com pelirojita
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:49 pm ((PDT))

> Lauren <lfunaiol@...> wrote:
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "h.halo" <h.halo@> wrote:
> >
> > Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen
> prepackaged
> > raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
> > of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
> > sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
> > Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
> > a cooler and no refrigeration.
> > Halo
> >
Hi Halo,

We were just out of town and our dogsitter took our dog camping for 4
days (lucky dog...great dogsitter) while we were away. I had packaged
up each day's meal for my dog in individual baggies and frozen them
(per excellent advice from this list). It seems the dogsitter just
threw everything in their cooler (one of those coleman ones that
claims to keep ice for 5 days) and fed from the cooler with no problems.

If you are going for a week, either get the 5-day Coleman cooler, you
could probably push it to 6 days if that was a dedicated frozen foods
cooler without a lot of opening and closing going on (we love ours, we
did a 3-day slot canyon backpacking trip where temps were in the 100s
where we parked our truck, after we hiked out under some rough
conditions, we had cold beer waiting for us!). Or, I have seen those
coolers that you can plug in to your car's lighter. Our truck's
lighter will keep things powered up even when the truck is not
running, but our Honda's lighter shuts off with the car. So a plug-in
cooler may only be useful for certain vehicles and may be expensive.

Have fun,
Kerry

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

1e. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Mike Frantzen" hoover1203@yahoo.com hoover1203
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:22 pm ((PDT))

I just went camping for a week with 2 dogs. I put in containers their frozen raw food and then put in the cooler. This was enough for about 4 days. I bought for the remainder at a Wal Mart. It worked out fine.

Chris F.

Halo Harris <h.halo@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Lauren,
Not too sure on the stores in the area. We have been camping in the past where the stores are 1/2 hour away for ice. I can always call the campground and find out for sure. Will be camping for around 7 days.
Halo

How long will you be camping? If not for too long away from a store,
just pack a cooler with normal raw meaty bones. If you start off with
most of it frozen and packed in ice, you will do fine.

Lauren

---------------------------------
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

---------------------------------
Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Purity" purity21_99@yahoo.com purity21_99
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:21 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Laurie Swanson" <laurie@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Rachel,
>
> What kind of dog is this? How long raw-fed?
>
> Laurie

Hi Laurie,
He's a 4 yo Shepherd/Border Collie mix. He's been on prey model raw
now for about 6 months. Before he was on something closer to BARF off
and on for 2 years.
Rachel

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

2b. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "mariasmom2001" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:35 pm ((PDT))

Hi Rachel,

I responded earlier this morning but yahoo is still screwy and my
messages aren't getting through! :))

I would do a bit more research before running off to get root canals
on these teeth. They will not hold up and could cause other
problems down the road. It's far better to just have the teeth
pulled.

We have discussed this frequently on the list. Do some searching in
the archives and look back to some of the discussion from when Dr.
Joubert was a guest on the list.....

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/26726

Sandee

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Purity" <purity21_99@...> wrote:
>
> Arghhhhh! I just checked my dog's teeth tonight and both of his
upper
> fourth premolars are chipped to where I can see pink. So off to the
> vet I go. His teeth are otherwise healthy so I'm sure a root canal
> will probably be the way to go. We regularly check his teeth out,
so
> this seems to have been done pretty recently.

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

2c. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:12 pm ((PDT))

Rachel,

Get those teeth pulled rather than having root canals done. Root canals
will not hold up and have a high incidence of creating further problems.

You might want to look back at some of the messages when we had a veterinary
dentist as a guest on this list.....

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/26726

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Purity" <purity21_99@yahoo.com>

Arghhhhh! I just checked my dog's teeth tonight and both of his upper
fourth premolars are chipped to where I can see pink. So off to the
vet I go. His teeth are otherwise healthy so I'm sure a root canal
will probably be the way to go.

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

2d. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Purity" purity21_99@yahoo.com purity21_99
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:16 pm ((PDT))

Sandee,
Thanks for your imput. It does definitely make sense since dogs chew
on harder stuff than we do.

Rachel
> Rachel,
>
> Get those teeth pulled rather than having root canals done. Root
canals
> will not hold up and have a high incidence of creating further
problems.
>
> You might want to look back at some of the messages when we had a
veterinary
> dentist as a guest on this list.....
>
> http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/26726
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: Duck and organ question
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:22 pm ((PDT))

Hi Mariola,

Pork melt is pig spleen. It's a good organ and my dog loves it.
Rotate it in with your other organs, all of which make up prox. 10%
of the diet.

I think the stomach is bleached or something--I never buy it. I'm
sure there's info in the archives if you want to do a search.

I think it's fun to go looking for new and different things, too, and
I've made my husband go with me once or twice just so he could share
in my hobby. :-)

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mariola9000" <mariola9000@...>
wrote:
>> What is a pork melt? Is it worth buying? What about a pork stomach?
> Valuable?
>
> It was quite fascinating to see and buy these organs, but
> unfortunately my husband does not share in my excitement. On the
> contrary, he finds it disgusting. I guess I have to be happy he
> accepts raw feeding.

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4a. fatty meats question
Posted by: "pelirojita" kerrymurray7@gmail.com pelirojita
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:46 pm ((PDT))

Hello rawfeeding experts,

I tried searching the archives for this info but came up with few
relevant posts, and my previous post regarding this issue yielded one
response (this list moves fast!) so please bear with me.

I have been reading the posts about recommendations for putting on
weight for the American Bulldog foster that a recent poster is
bringing home (very cute dog, btw, congratulations on your new guy.)

I have the opposite problem. I need to get weight off my dog. I have
shrunk his portions and am making a concerted effort to up the
exercise (challenging, as he is not very heat-tolerant and it is still
in the 90's here at night), but should I also be feeding leaner cuts
of meat and taking the skin off the chicken?

I'm a vegetarian so not very knowlegeable about cuts of meat,
especially which are fatty and which are lean. My specific questions are:

Should I take the skin off the chicken?
Should I remove the layer of fat from the back of the ribs that he so
enjoys ripping and tearing?
Are there leaner cuts or specific types (i.e.goat, venison etc.) of
meat I should be feeding?
I can get very high quality beef tongue for $1/lb which I was going to
try next, is this too fatty for a pudgy dog?

Or should I just rely on reducing portions, with the idea that I can
significantly up the exercise in about a month when things start to
cool down at night?

Thank you in advance.

Kerry
Tucson, AZ

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

4b. Re: fatty meats question
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:23 pm ((PDT))

> I need to get weight off my dog. I have shrunk his portions and am making a concerted >effort to up the exercise (challenging, as he is not very heat-tolerant and it is still
>in the 90's here at night),

Hi.As exercising goes,you can put dog on trade mill or do swimming on beach with dog or daily walk after temp went down or do ball throwing inside the house and play with dog.

I read somewhere that if the dog gets puggy,you reduce 10% of total intake amount from recent feeding meal and don't cut back too drastically.

I think that just like people neess time to loose weight,I think loosing weight on dog would not be like in a couple days so, you may want to try reduced amount a month and see how it goes .

I think dog needs fat and skin too so, I think skin off or cut off fat would not be necessary.

Only if the dog got bowel problems,it maybe good idea to cut off fat and skin off some.

> but should I also be feeding leaner cuts of meat?

If I were you,I mix up faty meat some days,leaner cut some days and I would just cut back portion and see how it goes.

I did not see Turkey in your menu.My dog likes Turkey,and it is leaner meat.

>Should I remove the layer of fat from the back of the ribs that he so
>enjoys ripping and tearing?

I would leave it asis,andjust cut back portion about 10% from what you are currently feeding.

>I can get very high quality beef tongue for $1/lb which I was going to try next, is this too >fatty for a pudgy dog?

Tongue in general is fattier,but I think you can give it to your dog with little less than you normally feed.

yassy

---------------------------------
Building a website is a piece of cake.
Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

4c. Re: fatty meats question
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:14 pm ((PDT))

I noticed after I gave my dog a beef rib bone, his stool was all mucousy would you say that this is from the fat that was on the bone? Is the fat something I should be concerned with as far as putting weight on the pup?
Halo

Yasuko herron <sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I need to get weight off my dog. I have shrunk his portions and am making a concerted >effort to up the exercise (challenging, as he is not very heat-tolerant and it is still
>in the 90's here at night),

Recent Activity

114
New Members

Visit Your Group
SPONSORED LINKS

Dog health product
Diet and nutrition
Dog health
Dog health food
Dog health problem

Yahoo! TV
Love TV?
Listings, picks
news and gossip.

Fitness Edge
on Yahoo! Groups
Learn how to
increase endurance.

Share Photos
Put your favorite
photos and
more online.

---------------------------------
Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5a. Camping
Posted by: "Belinda Mitchell" dubhruah@velocitynet.com.au dubhruadh
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

>
> I am currently away for 2 and 1/2 weeks showing with a friend and
> between we have 12 Ridgebacks, Hungarian Vizsla, a PWD and a cat.
> We are in a tent but have power, however that is used for the
> laptop and jug - everything else is unpowered. All our food was
> purchased and frozen solid before we came. I had a ten hour drive
> and my friend a five hour drive to get to the centre where the
> shows are being held.
>
> Tips for travelling with raw:
>
> 1. Get the best esky (cooler) that you can - I used a Ice-Mate
> 200litre version last time and it remained frozen/cold for well
> over a week. This time I purchased a Waeco 145 litre.
> 2. The bigger the pieces you freeze the longer it stays frozen.
> This is one time that I go for mince or ground as this will remain
> frozen in the centre keeping the outside cool for a longer time. I
> feed six dogs and the cat (actually this trip I am feeding 7
> dogs). The containers with mince are 5 and 10 litre containers - a
> five litre will feed my six/even for one meal with sardines and eggs.
> 3. Pack your esky so that there is little free space - stops the
> warmer circulating and defrosting your food. Pack the spaces with
> newspaper, dog blankets, plastic bags (that you can later use as
> poo bags)
> 4. Use large plastic bottles with frozen water as your ice blocks -
> again the bigger the better - solid blocks take longer to melt than
> normal ice cubes, partly because ice cubes are somewhat hollow and
> have a large surface ratio therefore defrosting quicker.
> 5. Only open the esky once a day if that as depending on the
> outside weather will depend on how long it takes your food to defrost.
> 6. Have a separate esky for human food as you are more likely to go
> into it several times a day for milk etc
> 7. When travelling (or stopping in one place for a time) make sure
> that you wrap your esky to provide further insulation. My esky is
> on the back seat of the car (when driving) on top of a silver
> backed tarp silver side facing the esky and then bedding/dog
> blankets are wrapped around and on top. Keeps food frozen for much
> longer.
>
> Cheers
>
> Belinda
>

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________

5b. Re: Camping
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:15 pm ((PDT))

Wow! and I thought going away for a week was a long time. I'll have to check into the cooler you recommended. We have a coleman cooler but its not the metal type. Thank you for the advise. Sounds like you have your hands full. I have a Saint puppy but he is like 12 pups rolled into one.
Thanks a bunch
Halo

Belinda Mitchell <dubhruah@velocitynet.com.au> wrote:

>
> I am currently away for 2 and 1/2 weeks showing with a friend and
> between we have 12 Ridgebacks, Hungarian Vizsla, a PWD and a cat.
> We are in a tent but have power, however that is used for the
> laptop and jug - everything else is unpowered. All our food was
> purchased and frozen solid before we came. I had a ten hour drive
> and my friend a five hour drive to get to the centre where the
> shows are being held.
>
> Tips for travelling with raw:
>
> 1. Get the best esky (cooler) that you can - I used a Ice-Mate
> 200litre version last time and it remained frozen/cold for well
> Cheers
>
> Belinda
>

---------------------------------
Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Yahoo! Autos new Car Finder tool.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6a. Re: Iodine requirments
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:19 pm ((PDT))

George,

Everything required is found in the appropriate diet. Kelp is one item I
would never recommend using as a supplement since it can inhibit thyroid
function.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "gevan1a" <gevans@sycomtech.com>

I was talking to a fellow raw feeder today. She leans more towards
Billingshurst. She told me that she suppliments with kelp powder for
the iodine. I did a little research and found that iodine is only
really present in fish as far as meat goes. I'm still very new at this
and wanted some other opinions. I did read that iodine is nessacery
for proper thyroid function in dogs.

Then I thought - where would a wolf get iodine? Is it really important?

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

7a. Re: Me again Poultry Cost and QUESTIONS.....necks?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Ive,

You are going to be better off buying whole chickens rather than small bony
parts like necks. Chickens regularly are on sale so start watching your
local markets for prices, get a few chickens and cut them into quarters.

I would avoid any bone that isn't slathered in meat. Pork bone doesn't
sound like it would be appropriate. When feeding pork, you want to feed
roasts....tons of meat, a little bone.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "ive_anbio10" <ive_anbio10@yahoo.ca>

So far I have been shopping around to find the best chicken prices
around. So far I have found that chicken necks come to be around 99c/lb
and stew hens for very cheap aswell. I found large chicken legs for
$1.99/lb and tried to bargain with the person for $1.50/lb if I bought
in bulk......ya didn't work to well....
Are all 3 of these prices good? and are all the meats good for my dog?
should I feed the necks regualrily or less regualr because of the high
amount of bones and less meat.

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

8. Feeding possum
Posted by: "sallycouper" salnz@xnet.co.nz sallycouper
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Hi,

I have just started looking into rawfeeding my two dogs and six cats.
I was thinking that once they were used to it I could introduce wild
rabbit, pig and possum as there are plenty in the surrounding
forest/bush. I am in NZ and possums are pests but they are suposed to
carry TB so would it be ok to feed them/ handle them raw? Would
freezing help? If so for how long? Any other precautions I should take?
Thanks
Sally

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

9a. Re: found goodies at Asian market
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:23 pm ((PDT))

Wow, I'm really surprised--your Asian markets didn't have any meat?
Maybe someone in your area will have more tips.

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "pigasus718" <pigasus718@...> wrote:

> The Asian markets only had fish and I asked at all 4.
> One lady even got offended when I asked about chicken feet??

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

9b. Re: found goodies at Asian market
Posted by: "diannem200400" diannem200400@yahoo.com diannem200400
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:14 pm ((PDT))

Hi Robyn:

Don't know about your area specifically, but if you have a large
Hispanic population, look for a "Carniceria" rather than a market.
These are usually small meat market/butcher/wholesalers, and if you
talk to the owner you can often order cases of stuff wholesale. Good
luck!

Dianne
In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "pigasus718" <pigasus718@...> wrote:
> No luck at the Latino market and the Mexican market didn't
> have anything different than the grocery.

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

10a. Re: need more bone
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:29 pm ((PDT))

Kellie,

Dogs get all the fiber they require from meat and bones. Veggies are not
required to regulate and could be contributing to anal gland problems.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "verrelli" <ktverrelli@bellsouth.net>

I think I need to get more bone into my dogs diet - since i noticed
one has a small Anal gland problem - I am hoping we can fix it before
having to take her in to the vet but I am calling vet today anyway to
see when I can get her in.

Here's the scenerio: she is small dog 18#, Scottish Terrier - I had
been giving Chicken Neck in AM (2) and more meat in PM - beef
heart/chicken thigh, beef rib etc or a mix with veggies. I know they
don't need them but maybe some dogs regulate better with it?? Also
after reading that necks were not good I switched to 1/2 chicken
breast (a whole breast was too much she is still a bit fat)

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

11a. Re: traveling with raw/Coleman cooler ?s
Posted by: "Michael Moore" m-tak@sbcglobal.net annemoore2000
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:30 pm ((PDT))

>>I'm assuming this means that it will also keep
frozen meat frozen right? Will it work for the freeze/gel paks too?<<

It does, although in extremely hot temperatures (90 degrees + ), the "5 days" rule doesn't "quite" apply -- stuff stays frozen for over 3 days, for sure. Sorry, I don't have the answer on the freezer/gel packs. I always use ice, although I often freeze larger ziploc containers and/or soda bottles for "larger" chunks 'o ice.

-- Anne Moore (M-Tak PWC and one goofy GSD rescue and a silly Golden rescue) in NW Ohio

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________

11b. Re: traveling with raw/Coleman cooler ?s
Posted by: "Halo Harris" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:16 pm ((PDT))

I don't have a good answer because its going to be hot and my experience even with a coleman cooler is everything melts. Most of the time, we make stops for ice and it melts and leaves a soggy mess. I don't like the pre-package food idea because I don't know the source of whats in this stuff but at least its sealed and if kept cold it would be fine. I could package my own but I still feel uneasy because of spoilage. If this happens then I have no other choice but to resort to the kibble which I don't want to do. I had to do this once a couple months ago and by the time we got home my pups ears were so inflamed it wasn't funny.
Halo

Michael Moore <m-tak@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>I'm assuming this means that it will also keep
frozen meat frozen right? Will it work for the freeze/gel paks too?<<

Recent Activity

114
New Members

Visit Your Group
SPONSORED LINKS

Dog health product
Diet and nutrition
Dog health
Dog health food
Dog health problem

Yahoo! TV
Love TV?
Listings, picks
news and gossip.

Moderator Central
An online resource
for moderators
of Yahoo! Groups.

Biz Resources
Y! Small Business
Articles, tools,
forms, and more.

---------------------------------
Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.
Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

12a. Re: Can You Give Too Much Organ Meat?
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:00 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 4:03:40 AM Pacific Standard Time,
Maiakitas@aol.com writes:

I'm still trying to figure out these ratio, of
80/10/10...but I think they are getting more than that 10% organ meat, now
that I
really think about it. Can they get too much organ meat and what problems can
it
cause?

Carla,

it's possible for a dog to eat too much organ meat.. yes. But you would have
to feed like 80% organ meat and 10% meaty meat for a long time to see any
side effects or for your dogs' health to be compromised.

the percentages are just GUIDELINES, they are NOT hard and fast rules.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

13a. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:05 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 8/20/2007 3:35:24 AM Pacific Standard Time,
kaebruney@yahoo.com writes:

I was wondering what you guys would recommend for a big dog who needs
to gain about 10lbs and has really dull coat. I mean, besides the
regular chicken, beef hearts, liver, kidney, sweetbreads.

Kae,

i don't see anything wrong with Petey. He's not the biggest american bulldog
i've ever seen, but they are generally healthier if they stay smaller.

he doesn't look too skinny either, his chest is very well filled out. he
SHOULD have a narrow waist and firm muscly hips.

there is more to a raw prey model diet than chicken, beef hearts, liver,
kidney and sweetbreads. there is MEAT from lots of animals, pork, lamb, goat,
emu, duck, turkey (its getting close to thanksgiving.. ). organs and hearts from
ALL of these animals and more if you can get em.

Remember Variety is what makes this diet work, don't get stuck in a chicken
rut.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

<*> Your email settings:
Digest Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join

(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------------------------------------------------------

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11930

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: diarrhea, concerned/frustrated newbie
From: Casey Post

2a. Re: Chicken allergy?
From: costrowski75
2b. Re: Chicken allergy?
From: Giselle

3a. Re: uh... can i feed him these things?
From: Giselle
3b. Re: uh... can i feed him these things?
From: pigasus718

4a. Re: Me again Poultry Cost and QUESTIONS.....necks?
From: Andrea

5a. Re: Duck and organ question
From: Yasuko herron

6a. Re: need more bone
From: delcaste
6b. Re: need more bone
From: swilken61

7a. Re: pork neck bones
From: Yasuko herron

8a. Re: whole duck
From: Loretta Luja

9a. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Yasuko herron
9b. Re: Broken Teeth
From: Laurie Swanson

10a. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
From: kaebruney
10b. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
From: delcaste

11a. Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: h.halo
11b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
From: Alison Maffett

12. feeding digestive tract
From: jmwise80

13a. Re: forgot on my last message
From: Laurie Swanson

14.1. Re: What can I feed?
From: Yasuko herron

15a. Re: Iodine requirments
From: Shirley

16a. Re: Test
From: Loretta Luja

17a. Re: found goodies at Asian market
From: pigasus718

18a. Re: prey blood
From: Loretta Luja

19a. Re: chicken backs question
From: Sandee Lee

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: diarrhea, concerned/frustrated newbie
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:32 am ((PDT))

Louisa,

I missed your original post about the salmon, but tell me, are these dogs
healthy/old enough to fast them for a day? If so, that's what I'd do -
access to clean, fresh water, but no food to rest their guts.

Casey

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Re: Chicken allergy?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:49 am ((PDT))

"Kelly P" <picklesrfree@...> wrote:

If you can find some grassfed/pastured livestock, replace what you
can of the feedlot beef. Add fish body oil to her diet. You can add
lots--1000mg per 10lb of dog--for now.

Hot spots are infected wounds. They are infected by bacteria that is
on the dog already; a healthy immune system keeps the levels under
control and a compromised immune system cannot properly respond. In
addition to tweaking her diet and managing the fleas (yeah, like
that's easy or something), consider what else might be going on in
her life that's stressing her immune system.

Chris O

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

2b. Re: Chicken allergy?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:08 am ((PDT))

hi, Kelly!
I don't think its hot spots, my guess would be the fleas,
even if you aren't seeing any. Sensitive dogs can itch for an awfully
long time after just one flea bite.

Food allergies or intolerances are pretty rare, especially to raw meats.

Temporarily, I'd recommend a bath in a soothing oatmeal or pure
castile shampoo.

I wouldn't recommend adding extra Vit. 'E'. I add a good Salmon or
Fish Body Oil with no soy or other plant based oils added.

Just to be on the safe side, I'd also get a full panel thyroid test
run,and have my vet send it to Dr Jean Dodds for an diagnostic
evalaution and interpretation.
http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/diagnostic_testing.htm
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> My young dog I believe has hot spots. Since we got her at 3 mos, she
> itches and chews above her tail. At the time, I spotted one flea on
> her and took care of the problem. She's also been raw fed since we
> got her at 3 mos, chicken being the most prominent meat source and
> beef a close second.
>
> I used home remedies to rid her of fleas and keep them off.
>
> She is 7 mos now and every once in a while she still chews above her
> tail. She's been at a friend's house with 3 other dogs for the last
> two weeks and none of them show any signs of flea infestation. I just
> checked her over and found none.
>
> Unfortunately, she is still itching and has now created scabs above
> her tail that she ends up re-opening. She's also been scratching at
> her belly button, which is new.
>
> My guess is she's either allergic to chicken or that the humidity
> here combined with her thick fur is irritating her skin. I don't
> really know. So far, I've tried home remedies to relieve the itching
> and just reverted to Pro Pet Itch Relief tonight.
>
> ....perhaps I'm not feeding her enough organs or she's not getting
> enough vit E?....
>
> Any ideas would be helpful. I'd like to take her itching away
> permanently.
>
> Thanks for any help
>
> Kelly
>

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: uh... can i feed him these things?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:50 am ((PDT))

Hi, Ashley!

*YES**add meat* Pork Necks?
*YES* any kind of chicken?
*NO* does it have to have bones?
*YES* is boneless okay?
*YES* chicken thighs?
*YES* hearts and giblets?
>
*Take it slow, start with one protein (chicken is, a good one) and add
one new protein every week or so.* got any other suggestions to what I
can feed my English Mastiff?

*Start with one protein, add a new one every week or so. (pork, beef,
turkey, rabbit, lamb, goat, fish, etc.* Feed 3 meals a day until about
6-7 mo, then 2 meals a day.* He's 17 weeks old!! :D

*YQW!* Thanks for all the help you can give me!!

* Read all the files, and search the archives for messages from
newbies like you, read the responses. Read all the messages and
responses you receive every day, you'll learn a lot! Post Qs often,
you'll get good answers!*
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey
> ~*Ashley Smith*~
>

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

3b. Re: uh... can i feed him these things?
Posted by: "pigasus718" pigasus718@yahoo.com pigasus718
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:18 pm ((PDT))

Hi Ashley,
My EM is 12wks old and has done just fine with
everything I've given him.
I gave him an 8lb. pork shoulder this morning and he
tried really hard for about 20 minutes. It was just
too big I think, so I whacked off some large pieces
(head size) and he did just fine.
Don't be afraid to try.
Just be consistent and don't throw
too many different proteins at him at once.

Robyn

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4a. Re: Me again Poultry Cost and QUESTIONS.....necks?
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:51 am ((PDT))

I'm not sure where you are from, but the prices seem steep to me.
I'm in Central California and I often find unenhanced whole chicken
for $.99/lb, sometimes on super sale for $.60/lb. If I remember
right, you have a large Lab, right? For a dog that size I would stay
away from chicken necks. They are far too small and the dog could
try to swallow it whole. I'd keep trying to find cheap whole
chickens or chicken quarters if I were you.

> I purchased a stew hen for like $1.88 and it was sealed well
> (vaccuum packed) and when I got home it smelt like rotting. I
> couldn't stand the smell to take it out of the bag so I tossed it
> out instead of giving it to my dog. Should I have still gave it to
> him?

I'll feed my dog stinky meat, but I'm wary of any meat that becomes
stinky while sealed in an airtight container. Those anerobic
beasties give me the willies, so I probably would have thrown it out
too.

> I got pork bone today aswell.....

When you say bone, do you mean just bone? I don't give recreational
bones to my two, so I'm not sure if the red gums is normal. I'd try
to find a meaty bone for the dog to chew on so he can tear off meat
and sinew instead of just crunching on a large bone. Hope that
helps. Let us know what area you are in and we might be able to
point you toward some food resources.

Andrea

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5a. Re: Duck and organ question
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:52 am ((PDT))

>My question is about the duck. It is a whole bird - with the head still attached(eyes, beak), >feet.

Hi. You got real whole Duck?Envy you:-> I bought Duck(Frozen Whole but without head and feet) at Giant a couple days ago,and I will introduce it this week.

I prepped yesterday and it is just me but you can decide if that is what you like to do or not.

Since my dog never had Duck before,I still don't feel comfortable giving whole birds,so,just like theway you started out the chicken,I split the Duck (breast area to tail) in center and then,made it to 2 pieces.Now you have one piece with 1 wing and 1 leg,and the other the same way.

I weighed and it was about 3lb each. So,I cut into about the size my dog needs with combo meal with Elk she is currently on. So,quarter lb pice of Duch+Elk hunk meat will be this week's introductory meal for my dog;Corgi 30lb.

I chopped liver into maybe thumb nail size and, I put 1 piece of liver into 1 Duck piece zip bags but left about 3 bags without.I don't give liver yet though for about her first 3 meal just to see how she does with new meat.

But you can wait till you think your dog is ready. No problems. I justdid so, because my dog seems love organs and it is always the first thing she put into her mouth.

I got neck inside the bird and I can feed it with Elk. And so can you.
I mean,you know that what meat your dog is doing good on,so,give your dog the meat you know your dog does well on and give Neck as well. I think Neck alone is..not much meat I thought.

As for head,same deal.You maybe can cut it and give pairing up with nice hunk of Beef or something.Or,still attached and one piece of Duck is with head,you can make.

As for feet,Maybe you can use as snack just like chicken feet.

>Are duck bones as hard as turkey or chicken?

when I was prepping yesterday,without Cleaver,I could break the backbone with weight of my body(After I made cut with poultry scissor along the breast,I turned it over and push it to crack) and,it sounded in between chicken bone and Turkeybone.I think it is softer than Turkey,I imagine since I could crack with weight.

>I also bought a package of duck gizzards - should I perhaps start with gizzards and only >when she is able to eat those serve a bigger piece of the duck?

I think you can decide when you wannastart but then,if I were you,I see how the dog reacts with combo meal and,add liver to the combo meal and if the dog did ok,I try give gizzard if I want to give into my dog meal.I did not think I got gizzard inside my bird so,I have nothing to give other than liver and hearts that came with Duck.

>Do gizzards give dogs soft stool, or is it just liver?
I imagine that,any too much new things all at once would cause tummy upset,So,I go slow steady feeding.After I know for sure that my dog do good,I introduce new thing at a time.It maybe 3 days after,it maybe 1 week after.It depends on individual dog.

>What is a pork melt? Is it worth buying?

I have no idea but is it stomach content or something? I thought that stomach itself is considered tripe so,for stomack,maybe pork tripe you could call it?

No idea,maybe some one knows better.I am curious too.

I know that Green tripe is cow stomach and,I imagine if you get pork stomach,you can call it pork tripe??

>They also had beef lip, among other things. Is it as fatty as tongue?
I have never seen it.It is really a lips of cow in package?
Kind of yucky to imagine:-P I consider the stuff without bone as muscle -meal candidate but if it were nothing but skin and bit of bone like pork ear,I consider recreational/snack.

If you got it,then,you can try introduce it slowly from small amount to start and if thedog got loosestool,then,that means too much too soon or too fatty or something else so,you can cut back and control it.You have to test the water when start new thing.

>It was quite fascinating to see and buy these organs, but unfortunately my husband does >not share in my excitement. On the contrary, he finds it disgusting.

Yea,mine too. I sometimes let him feed my dog on his dayoff,so,he gets to see how my dog eats and,he doesn't mind watching my dog eating ,and laughing to see how much longer she keeps licking her shower curtain mat to clean up after finishing the meal. He can torelate watching her eating ,but he does not want to touch organ especially and when I prep organ and chopping,he makes so disgusting face. And he makes more disgusating face when I give my dog chicken feet and comments "Now,that is gross".

Anyway,I hope this helped you a bit,

yassy

---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6a. Re: need more bone
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:52 am ((PDT))

But also feeding them a whole chicken and trying to regulate them
isn't an answer either as they would eat the whole thing and look to
see if they can get some more ;) I thought about once a day but then
they still act as if they are starving and I have some older dogs who
need to have multiple meals.

> Kellie Verrelli

Hi Kellie, I too have 'starving' dogs. They will not self regulate so
if I were to feed them an entire chicken they would eat all of it.
Somedays I feed them once, maybe a drumstick or a thigh with their
organs and in the evening give them their chicken feet. This satisfies
them. Other days I feed them twice, meaty meals, pork, beef heart,
tongue, etc. These I cut up because they will gulp and I can only feed
them 6 oz. a day (3oz in a chunk they will gulp and vomit). After a
while they get used to not eating two meals or one meal consistently.

Silvina

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

6b. Re: need more bone
Posted by: "swilken61" powrfemme@aol.com swilken61
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:52 am ((PDT))

Someone else with more experience may jump in here, but my
understanding is that chicken necks alone are too bony, but as a part
of the diet they are okay.

stephany

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

7a. Re: pork neck bones
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:54 am ((PDT))

>I just bought some myself to feed to Siberians-3 years old and 5 months old. Are they OK >if I add extra meat with them?

Hi,BJ. Yea,pork neck bone is ok to feed and if the neck did not have much meat,add more meat to it. Bone itself is not too hard,and all consumarble.

Size wise, I may want to judge if it is too small to feed or not if I were you. I usually give bone bigger than my dog's mouth. No little chunk of bone like cut up 1 inch bone that you can get for soup stock making.The pork neck that I have got was about fist size or little bigger than that.So,I had no worry to give.

yassy

---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

8a. Re: whole duck
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:58 am ((PDT))

@Duck fat is good fat.. even for humans.. my dogs LOVE whole ducks. And fat
is GOOD for dogs, it gives them energy and it helps their coat and skin.

Catherine R.

Maybe I should go back and get more duck then. At 1.39/lb they seemed
like a steal!
So your dogs do well on duck with no digestion problems?

Loretta

Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

9a. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:58 am ((PDT))

>He'll sometimes get the back ribs, but mostly he gets pigs feet and turkey necks
>(with .added meat of course) and chicken quarters. Are the pig's feet too hard for him? Are >the ribs the culprit?

HI. Pork ribs are quite soft like chicken bone so,I doubt that it was culprit. Turkey neck.. I think Turkey bone is harder than chicken but it still is not too hard like beef bone. Chicken quarters..I think it is soft bone and easy to consume.

If you were feeding pig feet often,it maybe it. My dog spend quite time on it if I feed it and pork feet bone seems bit harder than rib harder than pork neck.

You may want to supervise while your dog eats.That way,you know right away what was causing the problems.

I don't leave my dog alone during meal time.

yassy

---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

9b. Re: Broken Teeth
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:16 pm ((PDT))

Hi Rachel,

What kind of dog is this? How long raw-fed?

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Purity" <purity21_99@...> wrote:
>
> Arghhhhh! I just checked my dog's teeth tonight and both of his upper
> fourth premolars are chipped to where I can see pink.

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

10a. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
Posted by: "kaebruney" kaebruney@yahoo.com kaebruney
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:23 am ((PDT))

Thanks for the compliment, but the pics are how he looked before.
Since the pics he's lost some weight and gotten a bit banged up.

*sad face*

Kae

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Giselle" <megan.giselle@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, Kae!
> Petey's a happy and handsome boy! If the pics posted represent
> Petey's condition right now, I don't think he needs to gain any weight
> at all, let alone 10 more pounds! Better nutrition surely, but not
> added weight. Raw feeding should give him a sleeker look and show more
> muscle definition.

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

10b. Re: Brought home my first foster - How do I get him back in shape?
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:26 am ((PDT))

> I was wondering what you guys would recommend for a big dog who needs
> to gain about 10lbs and has really dull coat. I mean, besides the
> regular chicken, beef hearts, liver, kidney, sweetbreads.
>
> Anything I should look to include? I do give the dogs eggs once or
> twice a week, but so far no one will take fish.
>
> thanks for the advice!
>
> Kae

Hello Kae, try giving him some fish body oil liquid/capsules or salmon
oil capsules. I am giving my pugs 2 capsules of the fish oil because
they had really dry skin. You might do a search regarding the amount of
fish oil to give your dog because it was being discussed not too long
ago. Try feeding him fatty meats, such as duck (I just learned this :),
leave the skin on the chicken he eats. BTW, Petey's a doll ;0)

Silvina

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

11a. Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "h.halo" h.halo@yahoo.com h.halo
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:42 am ((PDT))

Going camping. What is the best way to feed. I have seen prepackaged
raw. Are there any brands that are better than others. I have heard
of Primal and Columbia River not sure of the different companies that
sell prepackaged raw to take in a cooler.
Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have
a cooler and no refrigeration.
Halo

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________

11b. Re: Is PrePackaged raw ok for camping
Posted by: "Alison Maffett" sweettuth23@yahoo.com sweettuth23
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:21 pm ((PDT))

You could just feed them what you normally do, to make is easier feed meals just for the night. Just throw each meal into a zip lock bag and put all but one nights into the freezer first and feed them that. Alison

----- Original Message ----
From: h.halo <h.halo@yahoo.com>

Any suggestions? I would not want to depend on kibble just will have

a cooler and no refrigeration.

Halo

<!--

#ygrp-vital a:hover{
text-decoration:underline;}

____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

12. feeding digestive tract
Posted by: "jmwise80" jmwise80@yahoo.com jmwise80
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:15 pm ((PDT))

I was curious of the general consensus on feeding an animals digestive
tract.

I have "heard", and we all know we have "heard" some pretty good stuff,
that the bad bacterial stuff happens in the digestive tract
particularly in the colon.

As far as worrying about bacteria in raw meat, I know that there really
isn't alot to worry about.

My worry about this comes from 1 bad experience earlier this year. I
had picked up a deer off the side of the road to get blood for blood
tracking training. The guts of the deer had ruptured from getting hit
by a car. Since all the blood was in the chest and belly, that is
where I got it from. While I was doing this, the pup licked up quite a
bit of blood from the deers gut. The next day he had a solid black
bowel movement. About an hour later that turned into bloody, red,
projectile diarrhea(sp?) The vets said it was HGE and was probably the
result of contact with something bad about the deer. (Didn't blame my
diet! Yay!) Although they did say there really wasn't a way to tell
what caused it unless I could 100% isolate a trigger. The other thing
is that I don't know how long the deer was dead either. I am pretty
sure it was less than 8 hours and the temp was in the forties at the
time.

So...That is where my worries about this came from. Is it a legit fear
or ignorance on my part? I would love to hear any opinions on this.

Michael Wise

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

13a. Re: forgot on my last message
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:16 pm ((PDT))

Are you the Rachel that just posted about broken teeth? Different
email addresses are showing up, so not sure if that's what you're
referring to. Please clarify.

Thanks,

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "equusray" <equusray@...> wrote:
>
> that cooking bones is a no-no. If I take those out, cook the rest,
> and give the bones separately will it be ok?
>
> Rachel M.
>

Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

14.1. Re: What can I feed?
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:16 pm ((PDT))

>Pork neck ok?

Hi,Yes. You can.Just add meat to it.

>whatelse can i feed?

I answered to other post but I don't know the digest number I can refer to,so, I write here again.
=====================-
I don't feed weight bearing big animal's bone like knuckle bones.

And you decide what protin source you like to use and feed accordingly.

Chicken Whole/organ(liver)/gizzard/hearts/Feet(snack or treat)

Turkey Whole/Neck/heart/gizzard/tail

Pheasant Whole/giblet that comes with whole birds

Duck Whole/giblet that comes with whole bird/Neck/feet
(not introduced to my dog yet tho)

Cornish hen Whole

Beef Boneless meat/Ribs/Neck/Tail/Organs
(liver/kidney)/Heart/Tongue/Cheek/
Green Tripe

Pork Boneless
meat/Ribs/Neck/Tail/Organ(liver/kidney)/heart/feet/Tongue/
ear (snack or treat)

Lamb Boneless meat/Ribs/Neck/heart/Tongue

Goat Boneless Meat/Neck/Ribs/ Heart

Mutton Boneless meat/meat with bone

Elk Boneless Meat/Ribs/Tongue/heart

Buffalo Boneless meat/Ribs/heart/Tongue

Fish
Perch,Mahi-Mahi,Halibut,Flounder,Snapper,RocketFish,Shark,Squid,Scallop,Shrimp,

Clam(can),crab(can),Salmon(can),Mackerral(can),Sardine(can) etc...

You still can feed Quail, Emu,kangaroo,rabbit,ostrich etc etc list goes on but I
did not put them into my dog's menu.

yassy

---------------------------------
Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (32)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

15a. Re: Iodine requirments
Posted by: "Shirley" ssthunderpony@yahoo.com ssthunderpony
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:16 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "gevan1a" <gevans@...> wrote:

> Then I thought - where would a wolf get iodine? Is it really
important?
>
> -George
>

##### LOL , You got it brother *grin*

Billingshurst , schmilingshurst , et al are not a complete diet so
they feel the need to supplement but just as with ki**le companies
they have now idea what they really need to add.
Then the trouble begins .................
All vitamins and minerals work with each other in Natures balance so
when you screw up the equation by adding something it all becomes out
of whack causing chain reaction deficiencies of other related
vitamins and
minerals.

Raw prey model IS a complete diet. We call it a 'Model' diet because
that is what we try to do with different parts along with bone and
organ content.

Only thing missing could be some Omega 3s because of the scarcity of
grass fed meat. SO just give some Fish body oil caps that you can
find at any Walmart , etc.(not to be confused with cod-liver oil
which can build up to toxic levels)

If you are lucky you can get some 'real' prey once in a while.

Cheers,
Shirley
imagegermanshepherds.com
est. 1959

Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

16a. Re: Test
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:18 pm ((PDT))

Wow.
I thought you guys didn't like me or something!
After I posted a question yesterday I had silence
for 24 hours with not a single email!! Then this
morning around 200 emails came through from
3 different groups. Glad to see it wasn't something
I said! LOL

Loretta

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

17a. Re: found goodies at Asian market
Posted by: "pigasus718" pigasus718@yahoo.com pigasus718
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:18 pm ((PDT))

last week I made the round of the ethnic markets.
I went to 4 Asian markets, 1 Latino market, and 1 Mexican
market.
The Asian markets only had fish and I asked at all 4.
One lady even got offended when I asked about chicken feet??
No luck at the Latino market and the Mexican market didn't
have anything different than the grocery.
Did I go about this wrong or could it just be the area I'm in.
I'm in Western KY close to FT Campbell,KY(home of the 101st Airborne)
and Clarksville, TN. That's were I went to the markets.

I keep reading on here that people score great goodies at these
places, but mine was a bust.
Any suggestions?

Robyn
(apparently living in an ethnic food wasteland)

Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

18a. Re: prey blood
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:20 pm ((PDT))

@Uh, don't buy the jellied blood. It's salty, that congealed blood
from the Asian market.

I had a feeling something else besides blood was in there.
Thanks Jacinta

Loretta L

Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

19a. Re: chicken backs question
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:25 pm ((PDT))

Sue,

Generally frames indicate what's left once meat has been removed, although
it does seem to depend on location. In that case, a back would have more
meat...but neither has enough!! :)

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Susan DeLeon" <labonita_persians@yahoo.com>

Are chicken backs and chicken frames the same thing? If so, do chicken
backs have more meat?

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

<*> Your email settings:
Digest Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join

(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------------------------------------------------------