Feed Pets Raw Food: Sep 6, 2007

Thursday, September 6, 2007

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12009

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Irritable Bowel Syndrome
From: Roxane
1b. It won't hurt them if
From: Kaitlin Fraser

2. raw food and weight gain in puppy
From: vickies_28

3a. Re: Just switched over tonight
From: wilsonfontaine
3b. Re: Just switched over tonight
From: wilsonfontaine

4a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
From: jmwise80
4b. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
From: Yasuko herron

5a. Re: Bone question
From: Rhonda
5b. Re: Bone question
From: Rhonda
5c. Re: Bone question
From: Yasuko herron
5d. Re: Bone question
From: Yasuko herron

6a. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: Barb
6b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: Rachael
6c. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: Eileen Dover

7a. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
From: mandajenwalker

8a. Salmonella
From: Roxane
8b. Re: Salmonella
From: Yasuko herron
8c. Re: Salmonella
From: Sandee Lee

9a. Source for Alligator Meat?
From: Jennie Stone-Gillihan
9b. Re: Source for Alligator Meat?
From: steph.sorensen

10a. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Marion
10b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Marion

11a. Re: BIG argument with a "holistic" vet!
From: Ivette Casiano
11b. Re: BIG argument with a "holistic" vet!
From: coriowen

12. Rabbit.... is it just me??
From: Terri Leist

Messages
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1a. Irritable Bowel Syndrome
Posted by: "Roxane" roxanegraham@yahoo.com roxanegraham
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:50 pm ((PDT))

Has anyone here done the raw diet for a dog with irritable bowel
syndrome? If so did it help.

Roxane

Messages in this topic (2)
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1b. It won't hurt them if
Posted by: "Kaitlin Fraser" fraserk7@hotmail.com fraserk7
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:16 pm ((PDT))

I can get beef scraps... meat... bones( it's where I get all my beef bones
from... it's free.. family knows the butcher).... but I could also get
things like the heart, and all the things they don't use... which is a lot
of of the cows, pigs... everything they use... I was wondering. It wouldn't
hurt for them to get none human grade right? Right now there beef is in
human cuts....

Kaitlin Fraser
Prince SJA therapy dog, CGN
Jester SJA therapy dog CGN
Wenlisa's Command Performance HIC, CKC PTd "Malo" A work of art in
progress.( Raw Fed, )
Sheep's Kin Unusually Unusaul Kiska- Another work of art in even more
progress.( Raw fed)

No dogs are vaccinated in my home.

" No one can walk into a room and bring as much joy, happyness and love as a
single dog can"

_________________________________________________________________
Enter to win a night a VIP night out at TIFF

http://redcarpet.sympatico.msn.ca/

Messages in this topic (2)
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2. raw food and weight gain in puppy
Posted by: "vickies_28" vickies_28@yahoo.com vickies_28
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:50 pm ((PDT))

Hi,
My puppy has been on raw for 3 weeks. Overall, doing pretty good with
some minor issues (no biggy). I weigh him every other week and noticed
that he gained 5 lbs since we got him 3 weeks ago. He was VERY skinny,
bones...I think he hasn't been eating much at the breeder's because all
she fed is kibble and he stragiht refuses to eat it (I tried for 3
days, when we just got him) Now he doesn't look too skinny as before,
kindda had rounded up a bit, I can fell his ribs and he doesn't look
fat to me at all. I've been feeding about 3% of his adult weight.

Anyway, my question is, what is the normal weight gain for a puppy? He
is 6 mo old now, basset hound male. We expect him to be around 65lbs
when fully grown.

Thanks
Vickie

Messages in this topic (1)
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3a. Re: Just switched over tonight
Posted by: "wilsonfontaine" wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com wilsonfontaine
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:51 pm ((PDT))

Thank you Christy I'm so relieved to hear your comment. I will get her screened asap.
THANKS!
wilson
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mikkeny" <mikken@...> wrote:
>
> Christy,
>
> I'm replying off list because I have some off topic information for
> you.
>
> First of all, yes, raw is absolutely the best for a seizure dog! So
> many dogs are triggered by grains, preservatives, artificial
> flavors/colors, etc. that's in dog foods that you pretty much HAVE
> to switch to raw!
>
> Secondly, while your girl is young, hypothyroidism is still a
> possibility, so I want you to consider getting her tested with a
> full six panel (http://www.itsfortheanimals.com/HEMOPET.HTM). Every
> seizure dog should be screened for hypothyroidism, IMO. If a dog is
> seizing because of hypothyroidism and you can raise thyroid levels
> with a simple (cheap, safe) thyroid hormone supplement, isn't it
> better to address the cause (hypothyroidism) than just he symptoms
> (pheno and all for the seizures that may be reduced or stop once the
> thyroid is back in range)?
>
> Thirdly, check out this site -
>
> http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/site_map.htm
>
> Just ignore the diet advice. So many of us completely respect Dr.
> Dodds' work with thyroid and epilepsy, but we agree that she drops
> the ball when it comes to diet. Hey, can't be brilliant in
> everything, right?
>
> But be sure to check out the "If I knew then what I know now"
> section and the one about low thyroid and seizures. Also the "Ice
> pack to stop a seizure" may be helpful to you.
>
> Best of luck with you and your rescue girl! Oh - and no more
> vaccines for her ever, ok? The vaccine/seizure connection is all
> too strong...
>
> Casey
>

Messages in this topic (10)
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3b. Re: Just switched over tonight
Posted by: "wilsonfontaine" wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com wilsonfontaine
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:52 pm ((PDT))

Thanks Casey!
Wilson

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mikkeny" <mikken@...> wrote:
>
> Christy,
>
> I'm replying off list because I have some off topic information for
> you.
>
> First of all, yes, raw is absolutely the best for a seizure dog! So
> many dogs are triggered by grains, preservatives, artificial
> flavors/colors, etc. that's in dog foods that you pretty much HAVE
> to switch to raw!
>
> Secondly, while your girl is young, hypothyroidism is still a
> possibility, so I want you to consider getting her tested with a
> full six panel (http://www.itsfortheanimals.com/HEMOPET.HTM). Every
> seizure dog should be screened for hypothyroidism, IMO. If a dog is
> seizing because of hypothyroidism and you can raise thyroid levels
> with a simple (cheap, safe) thyroid hormone supplement, isn't it
> better to address the cause (hypothyroidism) than just he symptoms
> (pheno and all for the seizures that may be reduced or stop once the
> thyroid is back in range)?
>
> Thirdly, check out this site -
>
> http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/site_map.htm
>
> Just ignore the diet advice. So many of us completely respect Dr.
> Dodds' work with thyroid and epilepsy, but we agree that she drops
> the ball when it comes to diet. Hey, can't be brilliant in
> everything, right?
>
> But be sure to check out the "If I knew then what I know now"
> section and the one about low thyroid and seizures. Also the "Ice
> pack to stop a seizure" may be helpful to you.
>
> Best of luck with you and your rescue girl! Oh - and no more
> vaccines for her ever, ok? The vaccine/seizure connection is all
> too strong...
>
> Casey
>

Messages in this topic (10)
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4a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
Posted by: "jmwise80" jmwise80@yahoo.com jmwise80
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:51 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth" <rainsou1@...> wrote:

Beef trachea is pure
> cartilage(glucosamine.)

I was under the impression that beef trachea was used for
chondroitin. What I have found said that glucosamine was derived
from chitin, the outer shells from crab and lobsters. With that
said, wouldn't you have to consume quite a bit of shells to derive
any significant amount of glucosamine. Here is one link I found when
I googled "dietary sources of glucosamine".

http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/glucosamine-000306.htm#Dietary%
20Sources

Correct me if I'm wrong, please. I'm still learning and may have
researched wrong. Wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last.

Michael Wise

Messages in this topic (8)
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4b. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:52 pm ((PDT))

>A good source of trachea is GreenTripe.com.

Hi,erica.Thanks for your info.Unfortunately,they arein CA,and I live in VA,so,quite expensive for shipping.I may see about waiting to cold months like Feb and see if the cost would drop down but,I donno...

How did you feed treachea?With lots of meat or cut with cleaver into small chunks andfed astreats or something? Or you just got Tripe with treachea in it??

thanks,

yassy

---------------------------------
Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.

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Messages in this topic (8)
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5a. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:51 pm ((PDT))

I am sorry what are large weight bearing bones?

Rhonda

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Andrea" <poketmouse45@...> wrote:

Messages in this topic (17)
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5b. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:52 pm ((PDT))

I worked through the raw issues until I hit a brick wall, if I give her
the meat with the bones she cannot digest the bones because of her EPI
and if I give her meat without the bones she will not get what she is
supposed to get from the bones. Plus a whole list of other issues.

She is doing really well on what she is on now, I have her on 80% grain
free organic kibble [Castor and Pollux] and I mix it with Spot Stew
[human grade meats and ingredients]

Rhonda

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Those are two compelling reasons to work through the raw issues and
get that
> girl off foods that are going to hasten the spread of these diseases.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
> From: "Rhonda" <rhonda18@...>
>
> Sorry I forgot to mention that I am not feeding Raw as I tried it and
> had too many complications, she is Diabetic and has EPI and she can't
> have the chicken bones as they are too hard to digest and other
issues.
>

Messages in this topic (17)
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5c. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:18 pm ((PDT))

>I worked through the raw issues until I hit a brick wall, if I give her the meat with >the bones she cannot digest the bones because of her EPI

Hi. Go to http://www.dogaware.com/specific.html and scroll down to SIBO and EPI and you find more info.

Just so you know that people who does homecook cannot use bone because bone gets cooked up,but those people are using ground Egg shell as calcium source.You maybeable to give shell instead of bone if thedog having hard time for bone itself,maybe?

yassy

---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.

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Messages in this topic (17)
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5d. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:25 pm ((PDT))

>I am sorry what are large weight bearing bones?

Hi. Leg bone like feumer or knockle bone or marrow bone;very thick densed bone from big animals.

I personally don't feed leg bone from 4 legged animals except pork.

yassy

---------------------------------
Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today!

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Messages in this topic (17)
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6a. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "Barb" behaven1@telus.net behavensnikko
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:52 pm ((PDT))

We have a 13 & 1/2 year old Sheltie that has been Raw fed,
supplemented with L-taurine, & mega Amino Acid Tabs & she seizures
mildly once every 6 months+/-Never been on any drugs & has not been
vacc'd since 8 weeks of age& not my doing!She is great on Raw!
Cheers/Barb
Behaven Shelties
Raw fed/Vaccine Free X 23+ years
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "wilsonfontaine"
<wilsonfontaine@...> wrote:
>
> ***EDITED BY MODERATOR. TRIM YOUR MESSAGES OR RISK DELETION.***
>
>
> Hi Sandee,
>
> Thanks for your quick reply. Here is a link to the page I read
warning against raw feeding
> for epileptic dogs.http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/
> Cautions_Raw_Food.htm
> I really want to continue feeding her Raw, I'm just looking for any
advise from anyone that
> has a dog that has seizures and is OK on the raw food.
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Wilson
>
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@> wrote:
> >
> > That's the first time I've heard that advice! Generally raw is
the first
> > change recommended for a dog with seizures. You definitely want
to avoid
> > carbohydrates and that would be pretty hard to do if you aren't
feeding raw.
>

Messages in this topic (8)
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6b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "Rachael" wi_gsd@yahoo.com wi_gsd
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:54 pm ((PDT))

My GSD has siezures (we think that's what they are...the other option
is mini strokes). Anyway, She has small seizures as though she is a
drunk sailor. She can't walk, looks confused and scared. In a couple
minutes, she is fine and walks away like nothing happened. (My point
being..they aren't grand mal seizures) I have started her on herbs
from my doggie chiropracter/alternative medicine vet. She has only had
1 seizure since I started these herbs and it was a very shortened
version when she first started the herbs. It has been 5 months now...
and no more seizures from what I have seen. I can give you her name
and website...if you are interested. I've had good luck so far. She
also gets herbs for her food allergies...which have also helped. I
feed her raw rabbit and pork heart. I add a small amount of vegggies
everyonce in a while...and a little olive oil.
Rachael

Messages in this topic (8)
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6c. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "Eileen Dover" millsmontreal@gmail.com wonderpei
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 8:04 pm ((PDT))

If it makes you feel better Wilson, I have an epilpetic dog and feed raw.

I think you will have to rule out what type of epilepsy your dog has,
(idiopathic or non-idiopathic), and you'll have to do this together
with your vet. This way you'll know what direction to follow as far as
treatment goes, but personally, I don't see why you should not
continue to feed raw.

While it's true that food could in rare cases trigger a seizure, these
types of foods are generally chemically altered, so I don't see why
raw should be ruled out other than a dog 'could' choke on a bone
during a seizure, but then, they could also choke on a piece of kibble
during a seizure.

Cheers
MM

>
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I had a painful experience with my Italian greyhound girl the other
day I thought she was
> going to die in my arms. She had a terrible seizure totally out of
blue. I have been raw
> feeding her for the past year and she has been very healthy, she is
only 4 years old. I read on
> the http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/ that raw feeding
is not advised for
> epileptic dogs. I'm a bit confused and was wondering if anyone had
any thoughts or
> experiences on this subject and any advise regarding the raw diet
and dogs that are epileptic.
>
> Thank you so much for any words of wisdom.
>
> Wilson
>

Messages in this topic (8)
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7a. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
Posted by: "mandajenwalker" walker1031@chartermi.net mandajenwalker
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:52 pm ((PDT))

Thanks everyone!
I had planned on starting him on the pills. I was just unsure as to
HOW the raw diet would help him. I didn't know if his body was
lacking something that it needed when he was on the kibble and if the
raw would give him what he needed to get the thyroid to work properly.
I don't know a lot about hypothyroidism and what the cause is. I
haven't had time to research it yet.
By the way, Chris O., Mister Louie is his nickname....how's ya know???
Thanks again everyone!
I appreciate it!
Mandy

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:
>
> "mandajenwalker" <walker1031@> wrote:
> >
> > I haven't put him on the meds that she gave me yet. I don't know if
> > that is the right thing to do or not. I don't want the meds to
> > interfere with my observation of the raw diet.....is that the right
> > thing to do? Should I be giving him the meds to? Or is the raw diet
> > going to help with his problem?
> *****
> Mandy, definitely put him on the meds. A good raw diet can help the
> immune system and do all sorts of great things to improve quality of
> life but it can't fix a busted thyroid. You will need to keep Louie on
> thyroid meds for the rest of his life and you will probably fine need
> to adjust his dosage several times along the way.
>
> Thyroid meds are the thing to do for Mister Louie.
> Chris O
>

Messages in this topic (5)
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8a. Salmonella
Posted by: "Roxane" roxanegraham@yahoo.com roxanegraham
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:54 pm ((PDT))

When you feed raw chicken, do you have to worry about salmonella?

Roxane

Messages in this topic (6)
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8b. Re: Salmonella
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:16 pm ((PDT))

>When you feed raw chicken, do you have to worry about salmonella?

Hi. Go to www.rawfed.com and choose myth section and you find all answers you may have.

asanswer to yourquestion,no,dog hasshorter intestin and before it gets infected,the bacteria gets passed with poop.

yassy

---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.

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Messages in this topic (6)
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8c. Re: Salmonella
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 7:14 pm ((PDT))

Since salmonella is everywhere, no. Just practice normal hygiene of washing
your hands when handling raw meat and you'll do fine.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Roxane" <roxanegraham@yahoo.com>

When you feed raw chicken, do you have to worry about salmonella?

Messages in this topic (6)
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9a. Source for Alligator Meat?
Posted by: "Jennie Stone-Gillihan" jstone3@bellsouth.net jenniep369
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:18 pm ((PDT))

Hello all. It's been quite a while since I've posted and in the
meantime we've been adopted by two puppy-mill rescued Miniature
Schnauzer ladies. They have quite taken over our hearts!! The younger
one, 3 yr. old Cleo, is consumed with some type of allergy. We went to
a great holistic vet today who wants to do a food elimination diet, but
I've fed Cleo so many raw meats, including rabbit and venison, that the
vet wants to use alligator meat of all things!!!??? I have searched
the web and it is EXHORBITANTLY expensive to have it shipped because of
the packaging, more than the meat itself from most sites. Does anyone
on the list, especially the RawFed Co-op in Atlanta, have the sources
to purchase alligator meat? Any info would be greatly appreciated, by
Cleo and me, both!!!

Thanks,
Jennie Gillihan and Cleo
Newnan, GA

Messages in this topic (2)
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9b. Re: Source for Alligator Meat?
Posted by: "steph.sorensen" steph.sorensen@yahoo.com steph.sorensen
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 8:02 pm ((PDT))

There's a rawfed co-op in Atlanta? Could I get the info to join that
please! And in the future, if you need alligator meat, I've considered
going hunting for them again in the future. It probably won't be until
next year, but I will likely do it again sometime.

You may want to call some of the southern Georgia Wildlife Management
Areas that have alligator hunts (through the Georgia Department of
Natural Resources website), find out when their alligator hunting is,
and see if you can't go down their and take carcasses off their hands.
Some people just want skins; others want meat. Either way, you are
likely to get some parts out of it, like legs and whatnot. Alligators
have fairly chunky legs, jowls, arms, etc. Their heads are solid bone
though, so stay away from that! :)

I hope that leads you in the right direction. Sometimes, you have to
get creative to get specialty meats.

-Steph
Scarlet
Lucy
Minkey

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Jennie Stone-Gillihan"
<jstone3@...> wrote:
>
Does anyone
> on the list, especially the RawFed Co-op in Atlanta, have the sources
> to purchase alligator meat? Any info would be greatly appreciated,
by
> Cleo and me, both!!!
>
> Thanks,
> Jennie Gillihan and Cleo
> Newnan, GA
>

Messages in this topic (2)
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10a. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Marion" mbldesigns@yahoo.com mbldesigns
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:18 pm ((PDT))

I tried raw chicken for dinner tonight and he wouldn't eat it. He got
up and turned away from his dish. Monday he ate some cooked chicken
but wouldn't eat it Tuesday, that's when I cooked up the
rice/oatmeal/chicken/pork goo and he ate about 3 spoonfuls of it
Tuesday night. He didn't eat Wednesday nor today. I'll be calling the
vet back tomorrow. He keeps looking at us like he's hungry, but he
won't eat anything we give him. He just turns his nose and won't eat
any of it. It's almost like he's skipping about 3 meals then he'll eat
a tiny bit and then nothing for a while.

Thanks,
Marion

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> I don't know...that's a long time for a sick dog to not eat. I'm not
> really comfortable with vets prescribing drugs without knowing what's
wrong.
> I would want to know. He could have something serious that may
require
> treatment. Just a simple blood test would reveal if there's anything
going
> on with liver, kidneys, pancreas, etc. 12.5 is not old for a small
breed.
>
> Have you tried chicken to see if he'll eat it? Try warming it up a
bit.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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10b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Marion" mbldesigns@yahoo.com mbldesigns
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 6:38 pm ((PDT))

OK we just tried raw chicken again, no luck. So we cooked it a bit. he
ate a couple, but not the ones that weren't cooked through and through.
So we're cooking them better and cooling and trying again.......nope,
he won't eat them. He ate 5 little pieces about the size of my
fingertip and won't eat anymore.

Thanks,
Marion

Messages in this topic (7)
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11a. Re: BIG argument with a "holistic" vet!
Posted by: "Ivette Casiano" ivettecasiano@yahoo.com ivettecasiano
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 8:04 pm ((PDT))

I found a holistic vet that encourages rawfeeding. She was wonderful the one time we went. She doesn't even push vaccination. She said we can sit down and discuss what we want and need. Why aren't there more vets like that?

Ivette Casiano
"Live for today, plan for tomorrow"

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (2)
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11b. Re: BIG argument with a "holistic" vet!
Posted by: "coriowen" COwen98@aol.com coriowen
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 8:24 pm ((PDT))

I'd like to know the answer to this question too, Ivette.
Cori

She doesn't even push vaccination. She said we can sit down and discuss
what we want and need. Why aren't there more vets like that?
>
> Ivette Casiano
> "Live for today, plan for tomorrow"
>

Messages in this topic (2)
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12. Rabbit.... is it just me??
Posted by: "Terri Leist" qahri@sbcglobal.net qahri
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 8:24 pm ((PDT))

I was offered some rabbits for $6.00 each. I weighed some already skinned that another person gave me & they weighed about 2lbs. Is that too much for rabbit? I mean, getting chicken, beef, & pork; isn't that enough variety? I would still have to kill & clean them. I know the price of beef, pork, & chicken, but I am unsure of rabbit. Do they really NEED rabbit??

Terri & the Raw Fed-"Muttly Crew" Kadin & Lilly:
Learn how: www.rawfeddogs.net

www.rawfed.com

www.rawmeatybones.com

Over exposure to the SON; actually PREVENTS burning!!

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Messages in this topic (1)
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[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12008

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Bone question
From: Sandee Lee
1b. Re: Bone question
From: Laurie Swanson
1c. Re: Bone question
From: Andrea
1d. Re: Bone question
From: Rhonda

2a. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Marion
2b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: coriowen
2c. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Sandee Lee

3a. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: karimlizette
3b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: wilsonfontaine
3c. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: Sandee Lee

4a. Re: Please, I really need your help
From: Tina Berry
4b. Re: Please, I really need your help
From: Morledzep@aol.com

5a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
From: millser25

6a. Louie is getting better....I think
From: Tracy Meal
6b. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
From: costrowski75
6c. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
From: Casey Post

7a. Seizures and Raw diet
From: salinastarroute
7b. Re: Seizures and Raw diet
From: Morledzep@aol.com

8a. ADMIN/Re: diatomaceous earth
From: costrowski75

9a. Re: fatty ribs. . .
From: costrowski75
9b. Re: fatty ribs. . .
From: Morledzep@aol.com

10a. Re: diatomaceous earth
From: Morledzep@aol.com

11a. Re: Please help, My dog is constipated
From: Morledzep@aol.com

12a. Re: Thank you!
From: Morledzep@aol.com

13a. Re: Rawfeeding Small Dogs
From: Denise Strother

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 2:41 pm ((PDT))

Those are two compelling reasons to work through the raw issues and get that
girl off foods that are going to hasten the spread of these diseases.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Rhonda" <rhonda18@gmail.com>

Sorry I forgot to mention that I am not feeding Raw as I tried it and
had too many complications, she is Diabetic and has EPI and she can't
have the chicken bones as they are too hard to digest and other issues.

Messages in this topic (13)
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1b. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:04 pm ((PDT))

Rhonda,

You're right--those bones aren't the safest (my dog has 2 chipped teeth
from them before I knew better--arrrgh!). What size is your dog? They
need edible bones, and they need big, awkward parts they have to sink
their teeth into and work at to help keep their mouths healthy. Best
is when those come together in their natural package of a prey animal
or a big hunk of one. This isn't always possible. I try to find meaty
hunks with a bit of bone in them that he has to tackle. But sometimes
I mix a hunk of boneless meat with some bony lamb necks. My 20 lb.
Boston completely eats lamb necks, ribs, and part of shanks; pork ribs
and necks; almost all goat bones (not sure about the long leg bones--
can't remember); any and all chicken, turkey, and rabbit bones.
Feeding bigger, like a half or whole chicken, or a whole rabbit, will
force your dog to dig in and work more for her food and clean her teeth
better. If you get skin-on, like with goat or pork, that helps with
teeth cleaning, too--they have to really gnaw on it and it gets all
around their gums, etc. When I give my dog a goat leg, he works on it
for about an hour. Now, I don't know if feeding something like a lamb
head is beyond your comfort zone right now, but when I recently tried
my first one (half a head), he looked the happiest he's ever been and
that kept him busy for a good hour or more and looked like it was great
for dental hygiene.

Other chewie ideas that you may be familiar with are bully sticks and
stuffing a Kong with ground meat and freezing for further challenge
(these keep my dog busy for a half hour or so). Not really any benefit
to the teeth, but if you just need something to fill in a boring meal
or day...

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Rhonda" <rhonda18@...> wrote:
I bought her "soup bones" to
> chew on but she gnaws and gnaws [did I spell that right?] and I feel
> like she is going to wear down her teeth, am I correct in thinking
this
> and should I be giving her a different kind of bone.

Messages in this topic (13)
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1c. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:07 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Rhonda" <rhonda18@...> wrote:

> So definitely bones are not good to give to just chew on because
> they will wear down the teeth? She loves to chew on her bones for
> hours. What is an alternative?

It isn't all bones that will wear down teeth, just the large weight
bearing bones. I give my pup whole beef feet or pork feet for chewing
fun. You could try whole slabs of beef ribs too.

Andrea

Messages in this topic (13)
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1d. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:43 pm ((PDT))

Well part of the reason I am not feeding Raw is that My puppy 30lbs has
EPI [Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency ]
and cannot eat chicken bones cause they are too hard on her digestive
system, but she loves bones and I wish I could find one that wouldn't
hurt her teeth.

Oh well it is back to Raw hide then.

Rhonda

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Laurie Swanson" <laurie@...> wrote:
>
> Rhonda,
>

Messages in this topic (13)
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2a. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Marion" mbldesigns@yahoo.com mbldesigns
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 2:57 pm ((PDT))

OK, thank you. So just wait on them to start eating again? Even if
it takes 2-3 days??? Bernie is so old it scares me to not see him
eating and he's weak and can't jump the 8inches on the back porch
like he was doing on the rawfeed after not being able to for the past
2 years.

The vet said Bernie is definitely not a well dog by no means, but
there just is no need to put him through tons of tests and I agree.
This med has worked in the past, possible giardia or bacterial
infection, but I've soaked his kibble in water before to get him to
eat, but we're never doing kibble again so I didn't know what to feed
him that he would want to eat

Where do I find slippery elm bark?

Thanks so much,
Marion

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Part of the problem may be that you have tried everything...raw,
cooked,
> pureed, rice, oatmeal, pumpkin, etc.
>
> If you are certain there are no serious medical issues, I'd fast
them, maybe
> use some slippery elm bark to sooth their intestines and start all
over with
> some nice easy to digest chicken breasts...raw of course...until
they are
> eating and digesting well.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang

Messages in this topic (5)
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2b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "coriowen" COwen98@aol.com coriowen
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:22 pm ((PDT))

You can find it at most health food stores and I used it for two of my
four when I first started on raw and it made them feel so much better
quickly.
Cori
>
> Where do I find slippery elm bark?
>
> Thanks so much,
> Marion

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________

2c. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:38 pm ((PDT))

I don't know...that's a long time for a sick dog to not eat. I'm not
really comfortable with vets prescribing drugs without knowing what's wrong.
I would want to know. He could have something serious that may require
treatment. Just a simple blood test would reveal if there's anything going
on with liver, kidneys, pancreas, etc. 12.5 is not old for a small breed.

Have you tried chicken to see if he'll eat it? Try warming it up a bit.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Marion" <mbldesigns@yahoo.com>

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "karimlizette" karimlizette@gmail.com karimlizette
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 2:58 pm ((PDT))

I just found some info on epilepsy and sent it to my mom. She has a 6
lb poodle who is having seizures. Don't quote me on this but I
thought this was worth a try. I found it at

www.rawdogranch.com under muscle meat

Muscle Meat - basically this is any meat without bones. Boneless
Chicken breasts, ground beef, turkey breast, beef or bison steaks,
beef heart (it really is a muscle and not an organ), pork butt, lamb,
deer meat, etc. Any boneless meat.
For our dogs we use beef heart and ground turkey. The beef heart is
rich in Taurine – an amino acid that has links to helping control
seizures. Dogs do not have a dietary requirement for taurine since
they can make it out of Vitamin B and amino acids currently in their
system. Cats cannot process taurine and must have some every day.
Taurine has also been shown to be a very effective supplement for
congestive heart failure.

You can get more info there. I hope this helps.

Karim

Messages in this topic (5)
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3b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "wilsonfontaine" wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com wilsonfontaine
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

***EDITED BY MODERATOR. TRIM YOUR MESSAGES OR RISK DELETION.***

Hi Sandee,

Thanks for your quick reply. Here is a link to the page I read warning against raw feeding
for epileptic dogs.http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/
Cautions_Raw_Food.htm
I really want to continue feeding her Raw, I'm just looking for any advise from anyone that
has a dog that has seizures and is OK on the raw food.

Thanks again,

Wilson

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> That's the first time I've heard that advice! Generally raw is the first
> change recommended for a dog with seizures. You definitely want to avoid
> carbohydrates and that would be pretty hard to do if you aren't feeding raw.

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________

3c. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:37 pm ((PDT))

Hi Wilson,

I did find that article and all I've got to say is consider the sources!
It's the all too common scare tactics about the dangers of bacteria from the
likes of Lisa Newman (we've discussed her nonsense frequently in the past),
recommending sources such as secondchanceranch which again is nothing but
fairy tales! I would ignore it!

You might want to do a search in the archives since we have discussed this
frequently on the list. Here are a couple to get you started.
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/107359
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/107357

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "wilsonfontaine" <wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com>
Thanks for your quick reply. Here is a link to the page I read warning
against raw feeding
for epileptic dogs.http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/
Cautions_Raw_Food.htm
I really want to continue feeding her Raw, I'm just looking for any advise
from anyone that
has a dog that has seizures and is OK on the raw food.

Messages in this topic (5)
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________________________________________________________________________

4a. Re: Please, I really need your help
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:05 pm ((PDT))

"Please help because I don't want to waste all my money buying inappropriate
meats and have my dogs suffer for mymistakes."

Deep breath - relax. Any raw meat is better than k** in a bag. I feed
whole chickens on sale for .69/lb when I can find them, otherwise they are
on deer meat all fall/winter with maybe one big boney meal per week and one
liver meal per week. They each get a raw egg daily with salmon oil (there's
a reason they call them german shedders) but seriously, I have four german
shepherds who either get chicken or deer meat. I prefer red meat year round
but ran out 2 months before hunting season starts. 10% bone, 10% organs and
80% meat - roughly and it doesn't have to be per meal, or per week, just
over the long run.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (13)
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4b. Re: Please, I really need your help
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:35 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 8:01:25 AM Pacific Standard Time,
ShankMa4@aol.com writes:

Does "meaty meat" refer to meat without bone?

YES..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (13)
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5a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
Posted by: "millser25" millser25@yahoo.com millser25
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:06 pm ((PDT))

Yassy,
A good source of trachea is GreenTripe.com. You can order frozen
trachea and frozen gullet, or you can order them ground in with the
green tripe. I get it ground in with the Green Tripe, and my dog
LOVES it!

Erica

Messages in this topic (6)
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6a. Louie is getting better....I think
Posted by: "Tracy Meal" hiddenpoetinme1@yahoo.com hiddenpoetinme1
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:07 pm ((PDT))

Hi Mandy,

You wrote:
I can't help but think I am seeing an improvement in his coat since
putting him on the raw diet. (If ya don't remember, he has completely
lost all the hair in his groin, legs belly and chest. He looks like
he is part Chinese Crested) I groomed him yesterday and he didn't
lose much hair at all even when I used the rubber curry brush. Just 2
weeks ago (before I started the raw) he was losing hair by the garbage
bag!

I am a newbie here, feeding raw for 2 months. My rottie has hypothyroidism. Her coat was horrible prior to meds and rawfeeding. The meds did help some but rawfeeding is helping her to regain a fuller shiny coat.

You wrote:
I haven't put him on the meds that she gave me yet. I don't know if
that is the right thing to do or not. I don't want the meds to
interfere with my observation of the raw diet.....is that the right
thing to do? Should I be giving him the meds to? Or is the raw diet
going to help with his problem? Just not sure.

The meds are very important. You can get her levels re tested after a while on raw to make sure she still needs to be on the medication.

Tracy

---------------------------------
Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.
Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (4)
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6b. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:34 pm ((PDT))

"mandajenwalker" <walker1031@...> wrote:
>
> I haven't put him on the meds that she gave me yet. I don't know if
> that is the right thing to do or not. I don't want the meds to
> interfere with my observation of the raw diet.....is that the right
> thing to do? Should I be giving him the meds to? Or is the raw diet
> going to help with his problem?
*****
Mandy, definitely put him on the meds. A good raw diet can help the
immune system and do all sorts of great things to improve quality of
life but it can't fix a busted thyroid. You will need to keep Louie on
thyroid meds for the rest of his life and you will probably fine need
to adjust his dosage several times along the way.

Thyroid meds are the thing to do for Mister Louie.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (4)
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6c. Re: Louie is getting better....I think
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:49 pm ((PDT))

>Should I be giving him the meds too?

Yes.

>> Or is the raw diet
> going to help with his problem?

No.

As Chris O. wisely says, the diet will help with all sorts of things, but it
will NOT cure hypothyroidism. Get him on the meds and retest him in the
near future to make sure his dosage is correct for him.

Casey

Messages in this topic (4)
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7a. Seizures and Raw diet
Posted by: "salinastarroute" rbee29@gmail.com salinastarroute
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:07 pm ((PDT))

Has anyone seen their dog stop having seizures by switching to a raw
diet? They have been occuring about 30 days apart.
Thanks,
Rob Bardenett

Messages in this topic (2)
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7b. Re: Seizures and Raw diet
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 4:11 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 2:08:49 PM Pacific Standard Time,
rbee29@gmail.com writes:

Has anyone seen their dog stop having seizures by switching to a raw
diet? They have been occuring about 30 days apart.

Rob,

yes, we had a list member years ago with a seriously epileptic dog that
stopped having siezures when he was raw fed. She sent me her journal to share with
folks that need it. If you email me off list i'll send it to you.

And my hubby had a epileptic golden/wolf cross that they discovered early on
that his seizures were worse when he got lots of sugary snacks (him and his
wife at the time were still childless and therefore the canine members of the
family were treated like children.. they even opened their own presents at
christmas.. lol).

He learned by trial and error and it has been proven that carbs cause or make
seizures more frequent and more difficult. Reducing the dogs' stress is also
a big help in controlling siezures.

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

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Messages in this topic (2)
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8a. ADMIN/Re: diatomaceous earth
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:27 pm ((PDT))

Please take this thread to RawChat.
Thank you.
Chris O
Mod Team

Messages in this topic (3)
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9a. Re: fatty ribs. . .
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:28 pm ((PDT))

"Bj" <seawindbullies@...> wrote:
>> I got some beef ribs for good price but noticed I got them that they
> are VERY fatty. I'd say more fat than meat. Is this ok to feed? I've
> heard too much fat would give the runs.
*****
Fat is part of a good raw diet. Our dogs can't get along without it.
But if the ribs have more fat than your dog is accustomed to eating,
perhaps you might trim fat and let your dog make do with what's left.
Later when you both have more experience, what is "too much" fat now
may be perfectly normal.

If I could try to cut some of it
> off but then there would not be much left of the ribs.
*****
There's never much left of the ribs. At least beef ribs. They can be
great for really getting into and great for ripping and gnawing and
nibbling but they aren't much about meat at all.

Chris O

Messages in this topic (3)
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9b. Re: fatty ribs. . .
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:32 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 11:56:42 AM Pacific Standard Time,
seawindbullies@yahoo.com writes:

got some beef ribs for good price but noticed I got them that they
are VERY fatty. I'd say more fat than meat. Is this ok to feed? I've
heard too much fat would give the runs. I could try to cut some of it
off but then there would not be much left of the ribs. Wondering if it
would be better to just throw them out? Thanks.

B.

dogs get energy from fat.. and sometimes too much fat will make looser
stools.. this is NOT a bad thing. it's a normal and natural thing.

do not throw away good ribs.. if you're not gonna use them, pack em up and
send them to me..

Catherine R.

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
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10a. Re: diatomaceous earth
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:39 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 12:06:13 PM Pacific Standard Time,
hjbartling@comcast.net writes:

I'm not sure how
to use it. If I don't see fleas on my three dogs, do I still need to put it
on them? Do I spread it on my carpets and vacuum it up? I know I need to
avoid breathing it in. I guess I need to keep my dogs out of the rooms while
spreading it, so they don't breathe it in. You see.....I'm totally unsure
how to use it.

Joanne,

I can tell you how i use the food grade DE. And PLEASE double check that
what you purchased is FOOD GRADE DE.

i put a teaspoon (approx) of the DE in the vacuum (mine is bagless.. if yours
uses bags put it in the new bag when you put it on the vacuum), vacuum the
carpet (unfortunately with bagless vacuums you to empty the canister several
times, so i have to re-add the DE to the canister).

Then after you're done vacuuming use a "poofy bottle" to lightly spread the
DE around the entire room.. and then go around the footboards and make a line
of DE (not too heavy, but you should be able to see it) all around the house.

IF you don't already have fleas or ticks.. i wouldn't bother putting it on
the furniture or on the dog's bedding.

I don't put DE on my dogs because i don't like the way it makes their hair
feel or the way it dries out their skin. but i do put a little in each of their
crates each week when i change and wash their blankets.

I'm not saying you have to do what i do.. but even with our tick infestation
it gives all of use some relief.. and this year is not as bad as years past..
so we might be winning the battle. Unfortunately i have neighbors that don't
seem to do anything to stop the ticks.. so i'm fighting a losing battle.

But my idea to spread the cedar bedding in the yard seems to have given us
the upper hand. i did that the same way i do the DE in the house.. i spread the
cedar bedding kinda dense around the fenceline and very sparingly on the rest
of the yard.. (disclaimer: i don't know if this is safe for cats or other
family pets).

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (3)
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11a. Re: Please help, My dog is constipated
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:40 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 6:26:34 AM Pacific Standard Time,
ShankMa4@aol.com writes:

My question is ... is the poop not supposed to be crumbly on the way
out. My dog has been having some crumbly poop. I may be feeding too
much bone 1. because of the crumbly poop and 2. because I have him some
beef off the bone and I saw his energy improve. What do you think?

Cindi,

the correct answer is that what comes out is directly impacted by what went
in.. this also depends on the dog, like i've said before some of my dogs can't
eat bone very often at all, and some can eat bone every day of the week with
no apparent side effects.

if you're feeding a lot of bone the poop will be white and possibly dry and
crumbly and CAN cause constipation (as i pointed out in Pugsley's case.. lol).

if you're feeding lots of chicken poops tend to be lighter in color and a
little on the dry side because chickens have more than their fair share of edible
bones..

if you're feeding more red meat and fewer bones the poop will be darker, and
often softer. And organs can make poop nearly black and squishy.

And ALL poop will get squishy or runny if there is no bone fed at all
regardless of the source of the meat or the color of the poop...

What is right is somewhere in the middle i suppose.. but after 4 or more
years of raw feeding we still do not have constant poop and we don't expect it and
we don't worry about it, unless of course, something like what happened to
PUgsley the other night happens..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (9)
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12a. Re: Thank you!
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 3:51 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/6/2007 3:18:15 AM Pacific Standard Time,
melanieabrams@yahoo.com writes:

I guess I could feed her inside, in the laundry room, for
example, but I worry about her getting raw meat on surfaces that
crawling baby hands could get at it. Even the outside makes me a
little nervous. I'm curious what other people do to solve concerns
about raw meat and babies in the same vicinity. Advice?

Melanie

No one in their right mind would call me a domestic goddess.. i'm a LOUSY
housekeeper by any standards. But i do take the cleanliness of certain things
seriously.

i'm not worried about salmonella.. it's all over in our environment, you
can't get away from it. the media or the chicken police have us all worried about
touching raw chicken when just the simplest of routines is all that is
necessary to clean up when you cook it or hand it to the dog.

i cut up my chickens IN the kitchen sink.. that way there is no mess on the
counter. i hand take the pieces to the dogs' eating areas, some eat in crates,
come eat on dog blankets and some eat on the back patio or their outside
kennels, then i go back to the kitchen and wash my hands and rinse the sink with
hotish water..

if my hands are particularly greasy from some kind of fatty meat like beef or
pork i will use a couple drops of regular Dawn dishsoap to help cut the
grease.

other than that, just washing the dog blankets weekly is about all i do to
clean up after the dogs.. i don't do anything to the outside.. the dogs clean up
what is on the patio, when there is any at all, Pugsley mostly takes his food
out to the dirt or under his bush to eat..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (12)
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13a. Re: Rawfeeding Small Dogs
Posted by: "Denise Strother" denisestrother@yahoo.com denisestrother
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 5:50 pm ((PDT))

I routinely feed rescue dogs that weigh 5lbs and less with no such
issues. Raw is great for toy dogs. Denise

> I have a 2 year old chihuahua that weighs only 7 lbs and she can
handle any chicken bones -- including the leg. She absolutely loves
raw meat.

>I have been told by another Chi owner that she's been told that their
teeth are not strong enough to chew bones.

Messages in this topic (5)
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[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12007

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
From: morkydzgrl
1b. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
From: wandaful
1c. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
From: Sandee Lee

2a. Re: Please, I really need your help
From: Yasuko herron
2b. Re: Please, I really need your help
From: morkydzgrl
2c. Please, I really need your help
From: Jeffrey Gentry

3a. How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Marion
3b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
From: Sandee Lee

4a. What to do about bone?
From: Purity
4b. Re: What to do about bone?
From: Tina Berry

5a. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
From: Purity
5b. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
From: Josephine Morningstar
5c. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
From: helpshelteranimals

6a. Re: Rawfeeding Small Dogs
From: Geri

7a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
From: Yasuko herron

8a. Bone question
From: Rhonda
8b. Re: Bone question
From: Sandee Lee
8c. Re: Bone question
From: Rhonda
8d. Re: Bone question
From: Rhonda

9. fatty ribs. . .
From: Bj

10. diatomaceous earth
From: Joanne Bartling

11a. Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: wilsonfontaine
11b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
From: Sandee Lee

12a. Color change in coat
From: Jeffrey Gentry

13. Louie is getting better....I think
From: mandajenwalker

Messages
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1a. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
Posted by: "morkydzgrl" ShankMa4@aol.com morkydzgrl
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 10:43 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:
Chris O, thanks for your reply.

> But a meal of kibble
> and meat is not likely to do any worse harm than loose stools if that.

Okay, now I can rest easy.

> Trying out raw meat as part of a kibble meal is not doing raw meat
> any favors. I don't quite know what you're hoping to find out by
> mixing the two, but you'll see better, healthier results forever with
> raw meat, meaty bones, and organs.

Yup, I hear-ya on the raw and kibble mix not doing raw meat any
favors! I understand that.

I think what I was trying to find out by feeding the raw meat was ..
would she actually eat it? Well she did. This sweet little pup is
actually my daughter's pup. The pup is in my care for the next three
months. I am 1.5 months into feeding my own dog this prey-model way. I
see there really is a large learning curve. Please read below.

First my own dog got sick from feeding the BARF method. I fed this
method for 2 months ... he went way down hill. Then I found you all
and I had some trouble by feeding ONLY chicken for 10 days. That
didn't work out well as his energy went down again and he refused to
eat. Then I went on to other meats (beef, lamb, pork) which is working
out better. He refuses chicken. I am also starting to figure out that
maybe I was giving too much bone cuz his poops were crumbly and his
energy went way up when I gave him a meal of just meat, no bone.

Eye yi yi, this isn't easy when there is no one to actually watch doing
it. Honestly, without the help of reading here, I would NEVER EVER be
able to try this. Which is probably why more people don't make the
switch. Honestly, this is scary, cuz we love our animals, want to do
better, and this is going against the tide ... BIG TIME!

So hence, the reasons above are why I am hesitant to give the little 5
lb. pup this food. I have made mistakes along the way and the last
think I want to do is make another mistake, although well intentioned,
with this little pup.

Any comment on the above are welcome.

Thanks!

Cindi

Messages in this topic (5)
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1b. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
Posted by: "wandaful" rondarosa@ftcnet.net rondaros
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:53 pm ((PDT))

Just want you to know that you have helped my peace of mind a lot, Cindi. I have a 2.5 lb pup that was rawfed but was so terribly constipated when I got him that the vet had to give him a suppository. So I went to kibble. Now I am back wanting to do the raw for both my dogs. I have a freezer bag full of 'prepared' raw, ground, and am thinking that is the problem, but wondering if I can feed it along with whole raw so it doesn't go to waste.
wanda

: Eye yi yi, this isn't easy when there is no one to actually watch doing
: it. Honestly, without the help of reading here, I would NEVER EVER be
: able to try this. Which is probably why more people don't make the
: switch. Honestly, this is scary, cuz we love our animals, want to do
: better, and this is going against the tide ... BIG TIME!
:
: So hence, the reasons above are why I am hesitant to give the little 5
: lb. pup this food. I have made mistakes along the way and the last
: think I want to do is make another mistake, although well intentioned,
: with this little pup.

Messages in this topic (5)
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1c. Re: My 5lb. pup had kibble and raw? Help
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:09 pm ((PDT))

Wanda,

Prepared mixes are generally high in bone content and lacking meat and fat
so that could definitely be part of the problem. You could try adding some
meaty meals to it.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "wandaful" <rondarosa@ftcnet.net>

> Just want you to know that you have helped my peace of mind a lot, Cindi.
I have a 2.5 lb pup that was rawfed but was so terribly constipated when I
got him that the vet had to give him a suppository. So I went to kibble.
Now I am back wanting to do the raw for both my dogs. I have a freezer bag
full of 'prepared' raw, ground, and am thinking that is the problem, but
wondering if I can feed it along with whole raw so it doesn't go to waste.
> wanda

Messages in this topic (5)
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2a. Re: Please, I really need your help
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 10:43 am ((PDT))

>can you explain the *'s. Do they the starred parts correspond to the animal above.

Hi,Cindi. I could make list length-wise,but i thought it would make posting size too big,so,I shortened it by putting 3 protins in 1 line,which was probably confusing to read?

Sorry about that. Read list down ,not to side,then, *means parts I have from animal I wrote above.

Would that be clear? If not,I make length wise list for you with word and send it to you privately.

But basically, poultry,I get everything whole,and then cut up to pieces.

For 4 legged animals like cow,I get listed parts. Like Mutton,for example,if I found suppliers that offer Neck,heart,tongue that i don't have, then,I would feed it. It is just that i could not find parts I wanted to get.That is all.

So,yea,if someone gives me Mutton tail,and if it looks edible to me,I get it andtest it to see if it is something I am comfortable feeding it or not.

As for Mutton,I listed boneless meat,Ribs only because those were only available things for me to get.

And..yes, my dog likes Turkey Neck,so,I get Turkey neck too other than buying whole Turkey.

and,I listed feet under Chicken because my dog loves chicken feet,and it is cheap too. So,I stock up chicken feet too.

It isall depend on how much available around you andwaht parts you like to feed,waht animals you like to feed,and what dogs likes etc...

Palette loves Mutton and Goat. Her nose get wet while waiting.

Onetime she cheated on me and she already started meal while i look back into fridge to get something for her to add to her Mutton meal. I forgot to put out with Mutton Rib meal..

She is usually very obedient dog and,she never start her meal if i not saying OK,but she started Mutton meal without my cue.

On the other hand, I once got Rabbit for her ;whole rabbit,but she stopped touching rabbit meal ,so,I gave it up,and pulled from menu.She really hated it.

Instead,I put Mutton in Menu which was good choice,and loving it.

Not sure why,but she does much better with Mutton than Lamb. Less fattier meats? Not sure I need to look info later.

Anyway, what you get is your choice anddecide menue with your dog. Like I said,Rabbit seems to be hit or miss sort of meal,so,you may want to risk it or you may not.Your choice.

Sorry,confusing you. Any more questions?

yassy

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (11)
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2b. Re: Please, I really need your help
Posted by: "morkydzgrl" ShankMa4@aol.com morkydzgrl
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:47 pm ((PDT))

Thanks for further explanation Yassy.

It helps to read about the rabbit and mutton and the preferences of
each dog, etc. Thanks!

No more questions for right now ... but I will be back later.

Thank you!

Cindi

Messages in this topic (11)
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2c. Please, I really need your help
Posted by: "Jeffrey Gentry" gentry.jeffrey@yahoo.com cresco299
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 2:03 pm ((PDT))

>Please help because I don't want to waste all my
money buying
inappropriate meats and have my dogs suffer for my
mistakes.

*I'm no expert by any means but I pretty much allow
the 10% bone in the
diet to come from either whole chickens or a Pork
shoulder. Beef can be
expensive and so I would rather my money be spent on a
sold chunk of
meat rather than risk having to throw away a bone that
I paid good money
for! I feed beef twice a week and it's typically from
either beef
brisket or an "Outside Round (Flat)" I typically get
these from grocery
stores or clubs and will pay anywhere from $1.65/lb
to $1.86/lb for
these cuts.

Jeff

____________________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search
that gives answers, not web links.

http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC

Messages in this topic (11)
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3a. How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Marion" mbldesigns@yahoo.com mbldesigns
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 10:43 am ((PDT))

Hi all,

I have 2 dogs who are sick right now. One worse than the other. Storm
is a 9 yr old shepherd (88 lbs) who is not eating much, he's been
picking at his food for the past few days. I watched him go outside
and saw his poo turned runny, so that's why he's not eating well.
I'm hoping his problem will resolve on its own. Any recommendations
for him?

Bernie on the other hand is very very sick. He's a 12.5 yr old male
Sheltie (48lbs) . He's had diarrhea for a week now, vomitted over
the weekend, and has been on and off food the whole time. I took him
to the vet on Tuesday and he's on meds now, metronidazole and
fenbendazole for worms that didn't show up in the fecal. He has this
about once or twice a year and this usually clears him up. However
this is the first time this is happening with rawfeeding, they've
been rawfed for several months now.

My problem with him is what on earth do I feed him. He was eating
chicken before all this started with no problem. Then he quit eating
that. I tried pork, ok he'll take a bite, but no more. Then over the
weekend when he got worse, I tried everything, rice, oatmeal, he
didn't want either. Got some canned pumpkin because that firms up
diarrhea and worked last time, he ate some and my hubby hid some pork
in it which he ate happily. Then he threw up that night and hasn't
wanted pumpkin since. He didn't eat at all Sunday, Monday I tried
cooking his chicken, he ate 1 meal and then didn't want it the next.
Then I tried raw chicken, he ate a couple pieces, then nothing
since. He turns his nose up at everything, chicken, raw and cooked,
pork, lamb, even liver now which he liked over the weekend. Oh I
make a goo that he used to like when we fed kibble, of cooked rice,
oatmeal, chicken, pork, all cooked in chicken broth, and pureed up.
He liked that for a few bites yesterday morning, but then not again.
I don't know if it's too gooey for him, because I can't figure out
how to make it not so gooey. I'm trying to dry it out in the oven
right now, maybe that will help. I don't want to call the vet for
food ideas yet, because I know what he'll say, try this can of SD
food with all the preservatives. Bernie will eat that, sure, but it's
not good for him.

So what do I do?? Help please?

Thank you so very much,
Marion

Messages in this topic (2)
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3b. Re: How do you feed a sick dog?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:13 pm ((PDT))

Part of the problem may be that you have tried everything...raw, cooked,
pureed, rice, oatmeal, pumpkin, etc.

If you are certain there are no serious medical issues, I'd fast them, maybe
use some slippery elm bark to sooth their intestines and start all over with
some nice easy to digest chicken breasts...raw of course...until they are
eating and digesting well.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Marion" <mbldesigns@yahoo.com>

Messages in this topic (2)
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4a. What to do about bone?
Posted by: "Purity" purity21_99@yahoo.com purity21_99
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 10:44 am ((PDT))

After breaking both upper fourth premolars, Riley had them removed 3
weeks ago.

We also found out how he broke them. We have a nectarine tree in our
backyard that was fenced off because the pits are toxic to dogs.
Riley is the type of dog that won't even go through a door unless
it's opened all the way and he has never ever gone under anything.
Well I came home early one day, went in the backyard, and there he
was under the tree. He had learned to crawl under the fence. He's a
freak about fruit. He absolutely loves it and now it's clear he'll do
anything to get to any fruit he can. And under that tree was a nice
little pile of nectarine pits that he had found and some were broken.
I'm pretty sure he broke his teeth chomping on the pits. We fixed the
fence so he couldn't get under it, so that's taken care of.

Anyways, back to my original question. Last night I gave him is first
raw chicken bone. He couldn't and wouldn't eat it. He seemed to have
depended too much on those back premolars. What should I do to make
sure he gets enough bone in his diet? Thanks in advance,

Rachel

Messages in this topic (2)
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4b. Re: What to do about bone?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:36 pm ((PDT))

I would maybe grind it for now until his back gums are healed up then try
again to see if he will use all his other teeth on the bones. I used to
have a butcher that would grind up a whole chicken if you asked.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
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5a. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
Posted by: "Purity" purity21_99@yahoo.com purity21_99
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 10:44 am ((PDT))

> My question is: She is ALWAYS running to the fridge and jumping in
on
> the bottom shelf where we keep all the meat for the pets. She is
> always trying to steal a bite when we open the door to the fridge.
She
> will even steal the other cats food when we are not looking. Her
belly
> will be big and she will STILL be looking for food
frantically...this
> has just started about a week ago, before then she would eat like
the
> rest and go on her way. Any suggestions of what it might be?

First off, it sounds like she's wormy. Kittens get big bellies when
they have worms. Not sure if there's a homeopathic remedy. Anyone?

Second, I have a 4 mo kitten right now that started off as a foster
when he was 6 weeks old. He's a voracious eater and it was about at
10 weeks that he went into this mode. Before he just ate like normal.
He acts like he's never been fed during mealtimes. When he was
younger he was eating every couple of hours. Now we're down to three
meals a day. He's just starting to calm down on his begging. There
was a time where he'd power his way into the other cats' bowls to get
more food. Kittens need a lot of food. Make sure to feed often. Hope
that helps.

Rachel

Messages in this topic (4)
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5b. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
Posted by: "Josephine Morningstar" josephine.morningstar@gmail.com jomorningstar
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:37 pm ((PDT))

for worms.. even the kitten we have.. we us lager beer.. it has more hops to
it and slower brewing time. not as much heat.. we also pick an irish blend
specifically we use guinness

dose is 1 tbls per 10 pounds of weight.

first time starting.. give two doses in first month.. 2 wks apart.

give once per month after that.

it also works great for heart worm.. evne if the animals were to test
positive.. it stops the reproduction cycle and they die out sooner.. they
can not live in the blood in animals fed the lager beer (dose is every 2
wks for 6 months then 1 per month after that.. wont harm the dog.. its
easier on them then the herbal cures even.

is study going on in Japan over the effect it has against the heartworm
also.. taking longer.. as they are not killing the dogs to see what the
effects are.. they are letting them live out their life.. interesting is
that those on conventional meds.. have since died..

On 9/6/07, Purity <purity21_99@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> First off, it sounds like she's wormy. Kittens get big bellies when
> they have worms. Not sure if there's a homeopathic remedy. Anyone?
>
>

--
Josephine MorningStar & Heather, Pyr, Mobility & MASD
Native American in Massachusetts

Never threaten anyone. It ruins the surprise.
www.apachecreations.com

Nobody can make you feel inferior without your permission. -Eleanor
Roosevelt-

http://assistancedogsofnorthamerica.org/
Copyright (c) 2007 Josephine Morningstar

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Messages in this topic (4)
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5c. Re: 7 1/2 month old kitten - ALWAYS HUNGRY! Big Belly
Posted by: "helpshelteranimals" helpshelteranimals@yahoo.com helpshelteranimals
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:53 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Purity" <purity21_99@...> wrote:

it sounds like she's wormy. Kittens get big bellies when
> they have worms.
*************
Should have specified...her belly is a little pudgy but when she eats
it gets BIG! When you look from the top, her belly buldges out!

Before he just ate like normal.
> He acts like he's never been fed during mealtimes.
*********************
Bless your heart for fosering! Thanks for letting me know!

Kittens need a lot of food. Make sure to feed often. Hope
> that helps.
> Rachel
***********
I feed 2 meals a day and several snacks too. That DID help a lot!
Thanks Miss Rachel!

AG & Ruffian & Sammi, the bottomless pit

Messages in this topic (4)
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6a. Re: Rawfeeding Small Dogs
Posted by: "Geri" auntigeri@aol.com gericolloton
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:37 pm ((PDT))

Hi Jeanne

I have a 2 year old chihuahua that weighs only 7 lbs and she can
handle any chicken bones -- including the leg. She absolutely loves
raw meat.

Geri

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Jeanne Faletti"
<jackienjeanne@...> wrote:
>
> > My name is Jeanne and I am new to this list and to rawfeeding.
I have been told by another Chi owner that she's been told that
their teeth are not strong enough to chew bones.
> Jeanne.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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7a. Re: chicken feet--gulping & glucosamine
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:40 pm ((PDT))

>Beef trachea is pure cartilage(glucosamine.) Another one you might want to try is beef
> gullet.

hi,Liz.Where did you get those? how big are they? I got moo-tube (treachea chew from Merricks in TX) recently and,my dog loved it so,was thinkingI may want to try fresh Treachea aswell,but is it big?

If it were,is it something i can wahack with clever?? if I had to feed whole andif it were just bones,then,I worry end up constipation so.. would you tell me how you feed too?

Are you feeding part of normal meal and make boneless meat added to it??

thank you

yassy

---------------------------------
Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

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Messages in this topic (5)
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8a. Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:53 pm ((PDT))

I am happy with my dogs diet. My only question is on bones for the
chewing and teeth cleaning factor only. I bought her "soup bones" to
chew on but she gnaws and gnaws [did I spell that right?] and I feel
like she is going to wear down her teeth, am I correct in thinking this
and should I be giving her a different kind of bone. They were just
labled "soup bones" in the meat department. Basically what kind of
bones can I give her to chew on to help keep her teeth clean and give
her the satisfaction of chewing on bones?

Thank you in advance.

Rhonda

Messages in this topic (9)
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8b. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:00 pm ((PDT))

Chewing satisfaction and tooth cleaning are both accomplished when eating
dinner! Nice complicated large meals that require some work are the
best...also meals with heavy skin such as pork will do wonders.

Soup bones and any other recreational bones merely serve to break/wear down
teeth.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Rhonda" <rhonda18@gmail.com>

Messages in this topic (9)
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8c. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:55 pm ((PDT))

*** Mod Note: please sign your posts! ***

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Chewing satisfaction and tooth cleaning are both accomplished when
eating
> dinner! Nice complicated large meals that require some work are the
> best...also meals with heavy skin such as pork will do wonders.
>
>

Messages in this topic (9)
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8d. Re: Bone question
Posted by: "Rhonda" rhonda18@gmail.com rhondabrabbin
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:56 pm ((PDT))

*** Mod Note: please trim and sign your posts! ***

So definitely bones are not good to give to just chew on because they
will wear down the teeth? She loves to chew on her bones for hours.
What is an alternative?
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Chewing satisfaction and tooth cleaning are both accomplished when
eating
> dinner! Nice complicated large meals that require some work are the
> best...also meals with heavy skin such as pork will do wonders.
>
> Soup bones and any other recreational bones merely serve to
break/wear down
> teeth.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
> From: "Rhonda" <rhonda18@...>
>
>
> I am happy with my dogs diet. My only question is on bones for the
> chewing and teeth cleaning factor only. I bought her "soup bones"
to
> chew on but she gnaws and gnaws [did I spell that right?] and I feel
> like she is going to wear down her teeth, am I correct in thinking
this

Messages in this topic (9)
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9. fatty ribs. . .
Posted by: "Bj" seawindbullies@yahoo.com seawindbullies
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 12:55 pm ((PDT))

hello,

I got some beef ribs for good price but noticed I got them that they
are VERY fatty. I'd say more fat than meat. Is this ok to feed? I've
heard too much fat would give the runs. I could try to cut some of it
off but then there would not be much left of the ribs. Wondering if it
would be better to just throw them out? Thanks.

Messages in this topic (1)
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10. diatomaceous earth
Posted by: "Joanne Bartling" hjbartling@comcast.net hjbartling
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:05 pm ((PDT))

Okay guys.....I've always used Frontline Plus then recently switched to
Advantix when we got our puppy and that's what the vet's office used. My one
beagle got sick 24 hours after applying Advantix. Not sure if it was
coincidental or not, but after that episode and all your warning posts, I
decided to do the DE method instead. It came today. But.....I'm not sure how
to use it. If I don't see fleas on my three dogs, do I still need to put it
on them? Do I spread it on my carpets and vacuum it up? I know I need to
avoid breathing it in. I guess I need to keep my dogs out of the rooms while
spreading it, so they don't breathe it in. You see.....I'm totally unsure
how to use it. I've also got nematodes on order that I plan to spray my yard
with, but most of my yard, where the dogs play is mostly full sun. I read
that the fleas shouldn't be a problem in the sunny areas, right? Any help
will be totally appreciated.

Joanne

http://www.pbase.com/hjbartling

http://hjbartling.dotphoto.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (1)
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11a. Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "wilsonfontaine" wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com wilsonfontaine
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:06 pm ((PDT))

Hi Everyone,

I had a painful experience with my Italian greyhound girl the other day I thought she was
going to die in my arms. She had a terrible seizure totally out of blue. I have been raw
feeding her for the past year and she has been very healthy, she is only 4 years old. I read on
the http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/ that raw feeding is not advised for
epileptic dogs. I'm a bit confused and was wondering if anyone had any thoughts or
experiences on this subject and any advise regarding the raw diet and dogs that are epileptic.

Thank you so much for any words of wisdom.

Wilson

Messages in this topic (2)
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11b. Re: Seizures and raw feeding-please help
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:17 pm ((PDT))

That's the first time I've heard that advice! Generally raw is the first
change recommended for a dog with seizures. You definitely want to avoid
carbohydrates and that would be pretty hard to do if you aren't feeding raw.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "wilsonfontaine" <wilsonfontaine@yahoo.com>
I had a painful experience with my Italian greyhound girl the other day I
thought she was
going to die in my arms. She had a terrible seizure totally out of blue. I
have been raw
feeding her for the past year and she has been very healthy, she is only 4
years old. I read on
the http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/ that raw feeding is not
advised for
epileptic dogs. I'm a bit confused and was wondering if anyone had any
thoughts or
experiences on this subject and any advise regarding the raw diet and dogs
that are epileptic.

Messages in this topic (2)
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12a. Color change in coat
Posted by: "Jeffrey Gentry" gentry.jeffrey@yahoo.com cresco299
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:55 pm ((PDT))

>Pat, who is a steel gray color, has developed several
(6-8)
>very dark, nearly black patches of fur. These are
about quarter
>sized. We just noticed them about a week ago. It is
too early to
>really say whether they are increasing. Is this just
a result of
i>mproved nutrition? I'd be interested to hear if
anyone else has had a
>similar experience. Thanks!

* You're certainly not alone on this one. My seven
year old aussie
shep/blue healer has always had a colorful coat, but
the past year and
half has been hard on her and she lost a lot of hair.
I'm going on 2
months of rawfeeding, and in past two weeks she has
started regrowing
her hair (lots of nice soft peach fuzz!). Here's the
kicker, the new
hair that is growing is radically different than her
previous coat
pattern. She's developed many black patches on her
legs, her snout hair
is coming in white (was black) and she got red popping
up from her
neck! I'm sure the way I'm describing her makes you
think of a circus
clown, but she truly looks astounding! I have 100%
faith that the
change in coloration and the regrowth of hair, stems
from a proper diet.

Jeff

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Messages in this topic (4)
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13. Louie is getting better....I think
Posted by: "mandajenwalker" walker1031@chartermi.net mandajenwalker
Date: Thu Sep 6, 2007 1:56 pm ((PDT))

Hi all,
I just thought I would write in and let ya know that Louie does in
fact have hypothyroidism....so the vet says.
I can't help but think I am seeing an improvement in his coat since
putting him on the raw diet. (If ya don't remember, he has completely
lost all the hair in his groin, legs belly and chest. He looks like
he is part Chinese Crested) I groomed him yesterday and he didn't
lose much hair at all even when I used the rubber curry brush. Just 2
weeks ago (before I started the raw) he was losing hair by the garbage
bag!
I haven't put him on the meds that she gave me yet. I don't know if
that is the right thing to do or not. I don't want the meds to
interfere with my observation of the raw diet.....is that the right
thing to do? Should I be giving him the meds to? Or is the raw diet
going to help with his problem? Just not sure.
Please let me know,
Thanks,
Mandy

Messages in this topic (1)
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