Feed Pets Raw Food: Oct 12, 2007

Friday, October 12, 2007

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12156

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Fwd: Message not approved: FEEDING SCHEDULE
From: Tina Berry

2a. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
From: Tina Berry
2b. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
From: katkellm
2c. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
From: angela sims
2d. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
From: katkellm

3a. Whole Pork Shoulder
From: thebestformyboys
3b. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
From: Sandee Lee
3c. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
From: katkellm
3d. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
From: costrowski75
3e. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
From: Morledzep@aol.com

4.1. Re: New Puppy
From: Bumble1994@aol.com

5a. a question on beef
From: kickrocks54
5b. Re: a question on beef
From: costrowski75
5c. Re: a question on beef
From: carnesbill

6. Finding rabbit
From: becca1066

7. A report..
From: Carol Dunster

8a. Re: Concerned about missing vitamins
From: trayc2244

9. Bella - Pregnant and not eating
From: Renate

10a. Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
From: kaebruney
10b. Re: Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
From: katkellm
10c. Re: Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
From: katkellm

11a. Re: Gathering Info.
From: Lynette

12. Here we go....
From: Jennifer

13.1. ADMIN/Re: New Puppy
From: costrowski75

14a. Re: Watery stools -but not diarrhoea HELP
From: carnesbill

Messages
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1a. Re: Fwd: Message not approved: FEEDING SCHEDULE
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:41 pm ((PDT))

"You don't have to feed gorge and fast method, you don't have to encourage
anyone else to do it, not everyone feeds that way, it's not a
requirement...but it is not extreme, it is not overkill, it is normal!"

I agree this is normal; if they ate 3 days worth of meals in one sitting,
they would be fine for 3 days digesting. I don't feed this way because it's
harder for me to keep track of what I fed them the last time; so I feed
everyone 1.5 - 2lbs daily and if they loose a little weight I feed more, and
vice versa.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

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Messages in this topic (6)
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2a. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:41 pm ((PDT))

"I just got 2 chickens cut in half. Is it ok to give the puppy a half? Man I
am nervous.... :-)They all have one ....."

Yes it's okay and if he doesn't eat it all put it in the frig for his next
meal.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (5)
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2b. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:02 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tina Berry" <k9baron@...> wrote:

> Yes it's okay and if he doesn't eat it all put it in the frig for
his next
> meal.

and since it is his first raw meal, don't let him overeat because
overeating can give a new to raw dog diarrhea. Remember to stick to
the 2% of his ideal adult weight meal size. KathyM

Messages in this topic (5)
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2c. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
Posted by: "angela sims" angela182548@yahoo.com angela182548
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:35 pm ((PDT))

Perfect timing guys , thanks ... she ate half and was ready to go outside... should I give it to her later on tonight? Lula & Charlie LOVED IT !! Thanks for guiding me through this!!

katkellm <katkellm@yahoo.com> wrote:
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tina Berry" <k9baron@...> wrote:

> Yes it's okay and if he doesn't eat it all put it in the frig for
his next
> meal.

and since it is his first raw meal, don't let him overeat because
overeating can give a new to raw dog diarrhea. Remember to stick to
the 2% of his ideal adult weight meal size. KathyM

---------------------------------
Building a website is a piece of cake.
Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (5)
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2d. Re: Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:53 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, angela sims <angela182548@...> wrote:
>
> Perfect timing guys , thanks ... she ate half and was ready to go
outside... should I give it to her later on tonight? Lula & Charlie
LOVED IT !! Thanks for guiding me through this!!

Hi Angela,
I would say, no, tomorrow is another day, and i wouldn't want to feed
a meal at bedtime to a newbie dog-i'm assuming its night now where you
are. I don't think i know how big she is going to get to be, so i
can't judge feeding amounts. Knowing that will help us give you an
idea about your tomorrow feedings. KathyM

Messages in this topic (5)
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3a. Whole Pork Shoulder
Posted by: "thebestformyboys" llb6984@comcast.net thebestformyboys
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:55 pm ((PDT))

I just bought an 11+lb pork shoulder for my 2 Goldens (80lbs each). I'm
on day 5 of feeding RMB (previously raw, but no bones, dogs have only
ever had beef, chicken and now turkey).
What do I do with this thing? It's huge! I don't want to split it.
Someone won't get a bone right? My dogs don't believe in sharing. How
am I going to feed it?

Thanks for your help!

Laurie Barnett
Port St. Lucie, FL
Golden Retriever brothers: Logan and Cooper (3 1/2 years young)

Messages in this topic (5)
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3b. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:00 pm ((PDT))

Laurie,

I usually buy 2, cut a hunk of meat off each to save for future meals...then
both dogs get a bone with a bunch of meat still attached.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "thebestformyboys" <llb6984@comcast.net>

Messages in this topic (5)
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3c. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:10 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "thebestformyboys" <llb6984@...> wrote:
> Someone won't get a bone right? My dogs don't believe in sharing. How
> am I going to feed it?

Hi Laurie,
I would cut the meat up into serving size hunks and feed. Leave some
meat on the bone for a great chew meal and put it in the freezer. Go
get another similar roast, feed through it, and when you get to the
bone wrapped in some meat, defrost the other one and feed em both-each
dog gets their own. KathyM

Messages in this topic (5)
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3d. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:43 pm ((PDT))

"thebestformyboys" <llb6984@...> wrote:
>
>
> I just bought an 11+lb pork shoulder for my 2 Goldens (80lbs each).
*****
Oy.
These two characters are quite young. How do they look in their 80
pounds each? That is high for goldens unless they quite large, as in
oversized. Are your youngsters lean machines or are you having to
watch their weight?

> How
> am I going to feed it?
*****
You give it to one dog, allow the dog to eat its fill; then give what's
left to the other dog. Yes, one dog will get the bone and one will
not. Oh well. Next time simply reverse the order. With raw feeding
there's almost always a next time to make amends in.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (5)
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3e. Re: Whole Pork Shoulder
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:34 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 10/12/2007 2:55:27 PM Pacific Standard Time,
llb6984@comcast.net writes:

I just bought an 11+lb pork shoulder for my 2 Goldens (80lbs each). I'm
on day 5 of feeding RMB (previously raw, but no bones, dogs have only
ever had beef, chicken and now turkey).

Laurie,

one pork shoulder roast feeds 4 or 5 dogs here.. i whack off hunks o meat and
the bone with a meal or more worth of meat goes to one of the dogs. Remember
that bone only needs to be 10% of the overall diet. there is absolutely no
need to have bone in every meal.

Whack off meal sized hunks o pork until all you're left with is a bone well
covered in meat. And then give that bone to one of the dogs and something else
to the other dog.

it's really very simple.. and sharp knives are a blessing.
Catherine R.

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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4.1. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Bumble1994@aol.com" Bumble1994@aol.com bumble1994
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:55 pm ((PDT))

Don't know about puppies, but I do have cats.

All raw meat has taurine in it--the most is in heart, which is most easily
found in gizzard/heart packages at my grocery, and I fed one of those chicken
hearts every day or two before I made connections with a guy at a farmer's
market who sells me beef heart for $2 a pound. A pound lasts a good while with
my 3 cats. I do feed salmon oil because I'm not springing for grass fed meat
and grain fed is short on the Omegas. Everything else they need is in the
various types of raw meat my cats eat--chicken, turkey, beef, pork, fish, frog
legs, and when they are lucky, rabbit and lamb. (And an occasional raw egg.)

With the bones, try bone-in chicken breasts or smash up some chicken neck
bones or small wing bones, so he finds there's something good inside. Think 80%
meaty meat with only 10% of the over-time food being bone, and 10% being
liver and some other organ (I've only found kidney--heart and gizzard are not
organs for this way of thinking, but meaty meat). Your older cat doesn't need
to have as much calcium as a kitten would, but he does need some bone.

Here's a web page with some good information:

_http://www.rawfedcats.org/practicleguide.htm_ (http://www.rawfedcat
s.org/practicleguide.htm)

Lynda

In a message dated 10/12/2007 3:07:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, "Jennifer"
writes:

I feed my 12-yr old cat that I adopted last year, raw food and his health as
greatly improved,
however, I give him several supplements, including taurine, salmon
oil, kelp, vit. e and b-complex. I can't get him to eat bones... he
eats AROUND the bone... any suggestions there?

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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5a. a question on beef
Posted by: "kickrocks54" kick_rocks54@hotmail.com kickrocks54
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:10 pm ((PDT))

hey everyone, im adam with my 4 mo pitbull "Rabbit". Rabbit has been
eating raw for a couple weeks and doing very well aside from the
occasional runny stool. A little rubbing at his muzzle, but i am
pretty sure that is due to his teeth coming in.

Mostly hes been eating chicken quarters, a little boneless chicken. I
want to get him going on beef, just kinda curious what kinds. i
bought a few racks of ribs for him, tho i dont think he can eat the
bones in them so it seems kind of pointless(aside from the fact he
loves to chew on them) to use that as a meal.

To get to the point, does anyone out there use beef for any of their
dogs bone intake? If so, what type of cuts. And also, would a chunk
of ribs be an appropriate meal?

One thing i just had to add was while searching the net for info on
this just a bit ago, i came across an article saying why raw was bad.
At the end the author sited some sorces. clamed a couple Dr.s had
some input and said that the additional studdies had been conducted
by Purina and Iams. Wow, people believe this stuff? lol

I also want to say thanks to all the people out there who know their
info and are willing to come on here and help people like me and the
other thousands of curious members. The reassurance is outstanding, i
remember being nervious and anxious starting out and the best advice
i ever found here was "RELAX, both you and your dog will be fine".
once again, thank you and appreciate any and all input everyone out
there has.

Adam + Rabbit

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5b. Re: a question on beef
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:57 pm ((PDT))

"kickrocks54" <kick_rocks54@...> wrote:
>> To get to the point, does anyone out there use beef for any of
their
> dogs bone intake? If so, what type of cuts. And also, would a chunk
> of ribs be an appropriate meal
*****
My guess is some dogs are capable of using ribs as edible bone, some
are able to use brisket bone, and some can crunch through oxtails
(and similarly necks) with a degree of success. Most dogs though
don't make much headway in most beef bones. Beef bones are not
generally regarded as dietary bone, no.

However, since there's nothing that says every bone presented as
edible must in fact be entirely eaten, often adequate dietary bone is
available from beef bones that are only nibbled at or gnawed on.

> One thing i just had to add was while searching the net for info
on
> this just a bit ago, i came across an article saying why raw was
bad.
> At the end the author sited some sorces. clamed a couple Dr.s had
> some input and said that the additional studdies had been conducted
> by Purina and Iams. Wow, people believe this stuff? lol
*****
Think of all the folks who thought the sun revolved around the
earth. There's a lot of pressure out there to believe this stuff.
Sad, no?
Chris O

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5c. Re: a question on beef
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:02 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "kickrocks54" <kick_rocks54@...>
wrote:
>
> Mostly hes been eating chicken quarters, a little
> boneless chicken. I
> want to get him going on beef, just kinda curious what kinds.

Adam, Don't get in too big a rush. There is plenty of time to get
to beef. Personally I don't feed beef bones to my two adult Great
Danes because of the density of the bones. Some people feed them
with no problems but I don't think it would be good to give them to
a newbie puppy.

I suggest you introduce turkey then pork on your way to beef. Beef
is kind of rich and can cause digestive problems in some dogs if
introduced too early in the raw diet.

> i
> bought a few racks of ribs for him, ...

A rack of pork ribs would be much easier for him. Bones are
softer. If he can't handle the pork ribs he certainly can't handle
beef ribs.

> To get to the point, does anyone out there use beef for any
> of their
> dogs bone intake?

I always feed boneless beef. Sometimes people give me old T-bones
and other cuts with bones but I cut the meat off the bones and give
them the meat.

> One thing i just had to add was while searching the net for
> info on
> this just a bit ago, i came across an article saying why raw
> was bad.

heh heh I've read a couple of articles that said that dogs can't
digest bones. If thats true, my dogs must have 500lbs of bones in
their tummies. :) :) :)

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

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6. Finding rabbit
Posted by: "becca1066" becca1066@yahoo.com becca1066
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:35 pm ((PDT))

I know there are several sources who ship, but your best bet is either
a query on the yahoo group "meatrabbits", or check the ARBA site for
breeders. Sometimes people raising little cute bunnies are horrified
at the idea of anyone eating them-but most people appreciate a chance
to get rid of culls (NOT bad rabbits, just not show quality or brood
quality)
I know a champion breeder who sells culls to raw feeders-just ask how
they're raised

and nutritionally, rabbit is one of the most nutritious meats you can
get-we got started feeding a little girl with a bad heart

becca

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7. A report..
Posted by: "Carol Dunster" cedunster@centurytel.net carwynst
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:54 pm ((PDT))

After giving my four Silkys raw hamburger, some liver and eggs for a
few days (that's what I had on hand), yesterday I bought some real
chicken with bones. So, today they all had a nice meaty chicken wing
(with some of the body meat on it). I feed them in their crates every
day anyway, so I fed them and went to do some chores.

When it was time for them to go out, a couple of hours later, all
signs of chicken were gone and all four dogs had obviously done just
fine with it! Good little terrors... erm terriers!

I don't expect any problems at all moving them to raw. I also had the
great idea that whatever I give them, I'm going to put just a little
of out for the cats to check out. Someone ate some hamburger today...
not sure which cat, but I think Naomi, who looked very interested.
She's quite a hunter anyway.
~ Carol
_____________
Carol Dunster
cedunster@centurytel.net

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8a. Re: Concerned about missing vitamins
Posted by: "trayc2244" BreeZ119@catt.com trayc2244
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:54 pm ((PDT))

Thanks so everyone. I am always so worried that I am leaving out
important parts of the diet. Then when I read that book I started
freaking out. Thanks for confirming my original thoughts.

Tracy

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9. Bella - Pregnant and not eating
Posted by: "Renate" renate.tideswell@gmail.com tideswell_renate
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:54 pm ((PDT))

Bella (shih tzu about 9lbs) was into raw and loving it about 2 weeks then
stopped eating. this was about 3 weeks into her pregnancy and I've read that
it's normal to have a loss of appetite at that point. I've tried to tempt
her back except the only raw she has actually eaten in the last couple of
days is one turkey heart. She ate some cooked turkey today (not much) and
just keeps rejecting raw chicken and pork. I have a really nice piece of
steak she might like. She'll eat a bit of kibble. Should I just give up
until she has the pups? Should I take her to the vet? They want her in to
take scans, but is that necessary?

I gave her the food this morning and she only had a tiny nibble. This
afternoon she wanted out again and ate a bunch of turkey leftovers but left
all the raw, but at least she ate. Should I just let her choose what she
eats for now? - I am just happy she ate something, anything..........

--
Renate
'The more I learn about men, the more I love my Shih Tzu'

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10a. Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
Posted by: "kaebruney" kaebruney@yahoo.com kaebruney
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 7:51 pm ((PDT))

Okay, I know it's nto the ideal, but i wanted to see how I could go
about supplementing the diet of my foster dog with raw.

She is a medium sized dog (less than 30lbs) who was found wandering
the streets 3 days before whelping. She threw NINE pups (all survived
and are doing well thus far) and has since become severely emaciated
(maybe 20-22lbs if not less). The vet she was taken to says she's
doing fine for now, but you can see her every rib, vertebrae and
joint. It's so pathetic.

The rescue group provided Evo Red Meat formula (42% protein) and some
S>D - Rx I.D canned food. Of course the vet is a non raw feeder..
hell, he fed her ProPlan puppy while in his care! *gag!* I'd really
like to help get her healthy by adding some nutritions tidbits to her
diet. But I also know that mixing raw and kibble aren't ideal.

So in the event that one DOES need to combine the two, which was is
best to do it? i.e - alternating days, feeding one in the morning
another at night.. or just mix it all together?

Also, I'd like to add some things to her diet to increase her milk,
help her rebuild (calcium and muscle) and of course to help richen the
milk for her pups. What would be good to give her? I'm thinking
yougurt and eggs for the calcium, fish oil supplements... but what else?

Anyone have suggestions for nursing a nursing bitch back to health? Or
for helping nourish puppies when the mother is severely skinny?

Thanks!

Kae

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10b. Re: Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:11 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "kaebruney" <kaebruney@...> wrote:
> So in the event that one DOES need to combine the two, which was is
> best to do it? i.e - alternating days, feeding one in the morning
> another at night.. or just mix it all together?

Hi Kae,
First, i want to tell you how really wonderful i think it is that you
have rescued this poor dog and opened up your home to her and her
puppies. You must be a very caring soul. What i am going to ask you
to considerer, however, is that there just is never an event where you
have to combine kibble and raw. There is absolutely never a situation
that can be improved upon by mixing the two. When you mix the two,
you are not making things better or healthier or more nutritious. You
are not going to speed up your girl's recovery. On the contrary, You
are actually blocking the health benefits of a raw diet. I know that
you love your new dog, and i know that you are willing to spend the
extra money on the supposedly better dog food, but you are being
pulled into the pet food company mentality that they have designed
something that is better for our beloved pets than a healthy raw diet.
Its just not true. Please, reconsider mixing the two. I have never
had a mother dog with puppies, let alone a malnourished one, but i can
tell you that you can trust a raw prey model diet to give your new dog
and puppies the best chance at a speedy and healthy recovery. KathyM

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10c. Re: Helping a nursing bitch: Is feeding raw with kibble a good idea?
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:06 pm ((PDT))

Hi Kae,
I just replied to your post and while i really meant what i said, as i
was letting my dogs out for last call, it dawned on me that you
probably weren't going to keep the mommy dog and that the shelter
people probably don't want you to feed raw. So, if me reply seemed
unthoughtful, i am sorry. I guess i don't think there is a good way
to mix them, and i would probably just go all raw for the reasons i
said, but i apologize for not recognizing the dilemma you face.
KathyM

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11a. Re: Gathering Info.
Posted by: "Lynette" lraefried@sbcglobal.net cherrysmomma
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 7:51 pm ((PDT))

I just wanted to thank all of you who have given me information. I will
start paying more attention to store adds, and check out craigs list and
the other(which I cant recall at the moment). Also, one of you
mentioned a Coop. I am not sure what a Coop is? And how do I look for
one? Is it as simple as searching the internet?

Lynette

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12. Here we go....
Posted by: "Jennifer" kali_moonwolf@yahoo.com kali_moonwolf
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:24 pm ((PDT))

Hi, this is Jennifer with Tikahni! I went to fiesta and found tons of
cheap and un-polluted meat! I have 3 packages of chicken backs, 2
packages of pork hocks, 1 of chicken necks (also for my cat), 1 package
of chx gizzards, 3 packages of tripe, 2 packages of chx feet and 2 lbs
of beef liver (they didn't have heart, have to get it somewhere
else)... and im trying to divide it up into bags per day. (I left the
leg quarters at the store, and I think all this may have too much bone
and not enough meat, since he is 7 wks old). Are there any opinions of
how I should ration it out: some tripe, some liver and some feet, or
etc? Also, I don't think I did the calculation right... if he will be
around 130lbs when grown, then I take 3% of his expected body weight,
and divide that into 3 meals per day (whew, my head is spinning), then
he hsould be eating almost 4lbs a day.... right? And occaisonally
salmon oil, raw eggs and juice! ;o) Thanks!
-Jennifer

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13.1. ADMIN/Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:31 pm ((PDT))

The rawfeeding list is not the place to discuss vaccines. The RawChat
list is. Please post all vaccine questions and answers to RawChat or
take them private.
Chris O
Moderation Team

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14a. Re: Watery stools -but not diarrhoea HELP
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:01 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mrskheath" <mrskheath@...> wrote:
>
> Yesterday she passed stools - I noticed that they were small stools -
> 3 or 4 'pieces' about 2 - 3 cm each, but were in a watery gloopy
> substance. Is this down to the switch to just 1 meal?

Who knows? I don't see it as a big deal. It's just one of those
things that happens sometimes. It may be the one meal. It may be
something else. Don't expect every poop to look alike. It's not
serious. Don't worry about it.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

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[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12155

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
From: mousegirls
1b. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
From: carnesbill

2a. Re: I am so confused...Please help
From: girlndocs

3a. Re: HELP...worried my shiz tzu issnt eating enough
From: Carol Dunster

4.1. Dog won't eat raw
From: alicia.fagan
4.2. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: Sandee Lee
4.3. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: Andrea
4.4. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: Howard Salob
4.5. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: alicia.fagan
4.6. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: alicia.fagan
4.7. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: Gail Edmond
4.8. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: alicia.fagan
4.9. Re: Dog won't eat raw
From: Howard Salob
4.10. ADMIN: Dog won't eat raw - making dog treats
From: pretty24355

5a. Re: Off topic post from a moderator-Help Needed
From: pretty24355

6.1. Re: New Puppy
From: Sandee Lee

7a. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
From: Garnaas, Carolyn (MED US)
7b. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
From: Bumble1994@aol.com

8a. Re: switching kitten to raw
From: Gail Edmond

9. Watery stools -but not diarrhoea HELP
From: mrskheath

10a. Re: PLS HELP ME FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH TO FEED AS A MEAL?
From: Tina Berry

11a. Re: How long will this last?
From: Yasuko herron

12a. Tikahni
From: Jennifer
12b. Re: Tikahni
From: Carol Dunster

13. Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
From: angela182548

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
Posted by: "mousegirls" mousegirls@gmail.com ladysown
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:08 pm ((PDT))

This is one of those things that it might make a difference where the
wal-mart is located.

haven't noticed enhanced chicken being an issue in wal-mart here in
southern Ontario.

annette

Messages in this topic (16)
________________________________________________________________________

1b. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:00 pm ((PDT))

I buy my quarters at Walmart. Sometimes they are enhanced and
sometimes they aren't. If they are enhanced it MUST say so on the
package. The two different kinds come from two different
distributors.

I don't really care. There is no real nutritional difference between
the two.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (16)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Re: I am so confused...Please help
Posted by: "girlndocs" girlndocs@hotmail.com girlndocs
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:08 pm ((PDT))

Hi Tracy,

> I was only asking because it stated for a sick dog (mange) that a dog
> needs to fast in order to get all the toxins out of the system.

I don't know about this "toxins" business. I don't know of any actual
evidence that bodies produce "toxins" which must be removed by any way
other than the body's already (generally excellent) mechanisms for
doing it.

In any case, a lack of calories puts an additional toll on a body when
it's dealing with illness -- food is fuel -- so my vote would be
instead of fasting to feed whatever's most nutritious, digestible and
appropriate for that particular body.

Kristin

Messages in this topic (24)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: HELP...worried my shiz tzu issnt eating enough
Posted by: "Carol Dunster" cedunster@centurytel.net carwynst
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:08 pm ((PDT))

If your new mother isn't eating enough calories to support herself and
her babies, I would consider upping the fat content of her food.
Perhaps you could give her more chicken skin and fat. Will she eat
more if you break it into more meals? How often are you feeding her?

If she feels well and the pups are full, plump and satisfied, then she
is likely fine and just needs to eat more. Now, her appetite should
pick up as she recovers from being pregnant, it's not uncommon for
them to be thin when they whelp (no matter what they eat) as they just
don't have a lot of room in their tummies with a litter in there too!
I had that problem with my Silkys.

A nursing mother probably does need more than twice the food as she
did before, esp. as the pups start to grow more. How many puppies does
she have?

Anyway, that's rather stream of consciousness questions and ideas...
:)

~ Carol
_____________
Carol Dunster
cedunster@centurytel.net

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4.1. Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "alicia.fagan" alicia.fagan@yahoo.com alicia.fagan
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:01 pm ((PDT))

Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
hour moving it to different locations around the house (me following
w/ disinfectant), then took it outside, let it sit on the deck for 20
mins, then finally buried it somewhere. Did not go back to it. Is an
extremely finicky eater anyway, but seems to only want cooked meat.
Any suggestions are welcome!

Alicia

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.2. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:21 pm ((PDT))

Alicia,

Get a nice meaty bone-in chicken breast, warm it up, "ribbon" it so there
are lots of nice starting places for her...you can even sprinkle Parmesan
cheese down into the cuts in the meat. Then put it and her on her towel.
If she tries to move it, put her back on the towel. It won't take long for
her to realize that is her place to eat. Don't let her carry it all over
the house.
If she doesn't eat, pick the food up, put it in the refrigerator and offer
it again at the next meal. Don't mess with it, don't fuss or worry.

And stop with those disinfectants! LOL Seriously, they are far more
harmful to not only your dog but yourself and family than any potential
bacteria could ever be. If you need to do any cleanup, soap and water or a
vinegar/water combination will do the job quite effectively.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@yahoo.com>

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.3. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:30 pm ((PDT))

Liver is often resisted by enthusiastic raw eaters, so I'm not
surprised she turned her nose up at it. The game hen is a much better
starting point I think. Your girl may just not get that the game hen
is food just yet. Try cutting into the meat, making ribbons that she
can get a hold of. You could also sprinkle something like parmesan
cheese into the crevices so she gets the idea to lick it and go from
there.

Don't let her trapse around the house with her food, if she takes it
off of her towel just put it back and tell her you want her to keep her
food in that spot. Don't give her any treats or other food, and don't
try all manner of bribes in the same meal.

So, to recap, this would be my plan of attack:
Ribbon the meat on a game hen breast (chicken would also be fine) and
warm the food in a bowl of hot water before serving. Give her 20
minutes to start eating (keeping her food on the towel) and if she
doesn't start eating (or at least licking) in the 20 minutes pick it up
and put it back in the fridge for next meal time.
Second feeding, warm the chicken in hot water and then sprinkle some
parmesan cheese on it and rub it in. Give her 20 minutes and pick up
if not eaten.
Third feeding, sear both sides of the chicken in a really hot pan and
serve to dog (after it cools a bit). Give her 20 minutes.

Most dogs just need a little push to know the meat is food. Don't fuss
over her or try to entice her to eat, just calmly wait and read a book
or something. She'll get the idea.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@...>
wrote:
>
> Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
> food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
> of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
> She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
> cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
> hour moving it to different locations around the house

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.4. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "Howard Salob" itiskismet1968@yahoo.com itiskismet1968
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:31 pm ((PDT))

Dear Alicia,

Try the green tripe. Have not met a dog who would not eat it.

Sincerely,

Howard

"alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@yahoo.com> wrote:
Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
hour moving it to different locations around the house (me following
w/ disinfectant), then took it outside, let it sit on the deck for 20
mins, then finally buried it somewhere. Did not go back to it. Is an
extremely finicky eater anyway, but seems to only want cooked meat.
Any suggestions are welcome!

Alicia

---------------------------------
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.5. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "alicia.fagan" alicia.fagan@yahoo.com alicia.fagan
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:31 pm ((PDT))

Moderator's Note:

Trim your posts!!!

********************************

Thanks so much, Andrea! Will give it a try.

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Andrea" <poketmouse45@...> wrote:
>
> Liver is often resisted by enthusiastic raw eaters, so I'm not
> surprised she turned her nose up at it. The game hen is a much better
> starting point I think. Your girl may just not get that the game hen
> is food just yet. Try cutting into the meat, making ribbons that she
> can get a hold of. You could also sprinkle something like parmesan
> cheese into the crevices so she gets the idea to lick it and go from
> there.
>
> Don't let her trapse around the house with her food, if she takes it
> off of her towel just put it back and tell her you want her to keep her
> food in that spot. Don't give her any treats or other food, and don't
> try all manner of bribes in the same meal.
>
> So, to recap, this would be my plan of attack:
> Ribbon the meat on a game hen breast (chicken would also be fine) and
> warm the food in a bowl of hot water before serving. Give her 20
> minutes to start eating (keeping her food on the towel) and if she
> doesn't start eating (or at least licking) in the 20 minutes pick it up
> and put it back in the fridge for next meal time.
> Second feeding, warm the chicken in hot water and then sprinkle some
> parmesan cheese on it and rub it in. Give her 20 minutes and pick up
> if not eaten.
> Third feeding, sear both sides of the chicken in a really hot pan and
> serve to dog (after it cools a bit). Give her 20 minutes.
>
> Most dogs just need a little push to know the meat is food. Don't fuss
> over her or try to entice her to eat, just calmly wait and read a book
> or something. She'll get the idea.
>
> Andrea
>
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
> > food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
> > of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
> > She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
> > cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
> > hour moving it to different locations around the house
>

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.6. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "alicia.fagan" alicia.fagan@yahoo.com alicia.fagan
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:31 pm ((PDT))

Moderator's Note:

Trim your posts!!

***************************
Hi Howard,
thanks for the suggestion! Where does one find that?

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Howard Salob <itiskismet1968@...>
wrote:
>
> Dear Alicia,
>
> Try the green tripe. Have not met a dog who would not eat it.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Howard
>
>
>
> "alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@...> wrote:
> Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is
resisting raw
> food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
> of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
> She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
> cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
> hour moving it to different locations around the house (me following
> w/ disinfectant), then took it outside, let it sit on the deck for 20
> mins, then finally buried it somewhere. Did not go back to it. Is an
> extremely finicky eater anyway, but seems to only want cooked meat.
> Any suggestions are welcome!
>
> Alicia
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s
user panel and lay it on us.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.7. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "Gail Edmond" windybond1@yahoo.co.uk windybond1
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:32 pm ((PDT))

Moderator's Note:

Trim your posts!!

*****************************

I have just bought soom dried green tripe to use as chew treats the dogs really love them does anyone know how to do this as they are quite expensive nearly £5.00 a bag. Thought if i knew how i would make some of my own.

Gail

----- Original Message ----
From: Howard Salob <itiskismet1968@yahoo.com>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, 12 October, 2007 9:27:07 PM
Subject: Re: [rawfeeding] Dog won't eat raw

Dear Alicia,

Try the green tripe. Have not met a dog who would not eat it.

Sincerely,

Howard

"alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@ yahoo.com> wrote:
Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
hour moving it to different locations around the house (me following
w/ disinfectant) , then took it outside, let it sit on the deck for 20
mins, then finally buried it somewhere. Did not go back to it. Is an
extremely finicky eater anyway, but seems to only want cooked meat.
Any suggestions are welcome!

Alicia

------------ --------- --------- ---
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

___________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Answers - Got a question? Someone out there knows the answer. Try it
now.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.8. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "alicia.fagan" alicia.fagan@yahoo.com alicia.fagan
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:32 pm ((PDT))

Moderator's Note:

Trim your posts!!

*****************************

Thanks, Sandee, will try your suggestion. Actually, it was white
vinegar i was using :) I agree w/ you about commercial stuff.
-A.

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Alicia,
>
> Get a nice meaty bone-in chicken breast, warm it up, "ribbon" it so
there
> are lots of nice starting places for her...you can even sprinkle
Parmesan
> cheese down into the cuts in the meat. Then put it and her on her
towel.
> If she tries to move it, put her back on the towel. It won't take
long for
> her to realize that is her place to eat. Don't let her carry it all
over
> the house.
> If she doesn't eat, pick the food up, put it in the refrigerator and
offer
> it again at the next meal. Don't mess with it, don't fuss or worry.
>
> And stop with those disinfectants! LOL Seriously, they are far more
> harmful to not only your dog but yourself and family than any potential
> bacteria could ever be. If you need to do any cleanup, soap and
water or a
> vinegar/water combination will do the job quite effectively.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
> From: "alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@...>
>
>
> Looking for advice...my nearly 3-yr-old Lhasa apso is resisting raw
> food. I've tried raw chicken livers. I've tried store-bought raw mix
> of chicken and veggies; that alone, then tried dressing it w/ honey.
> She went on hunger strike. Yesterday, i tried the drumstick from a
> cornish hen, placed it on a towel on the kitchen floor. She spent an
> hour moving it to different locations around the house (me following
> w/ disinfectant), then took it outside, let it sit on the deck for 20
> mins, then finally buried it somewhere. Did not go back to it. Is an
> extremely finicky eater anyway, but seems to only want cooked meat.
>

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.9. Re: Dog won't eat raw
Posted by: "Howard Salob" itiskismet1968@yahoo.com itiskismet1968
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:09 pm ((PDT))

"alicia.fagan" <alicia.fagan@yahoo.com> wrote: Dear Alicia,

There is a place by me and someone suggested it or I would not of found it. But you can try the net and look that way. There is a site www.greentripe.com that sells it but I suggest finding stuff locally. All it is is unbleached cow stomach.

Sincerely,

Howard

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Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________

4.10. ADMIN: Dog won't eat raw - making dog treats
Posted by: "pretty24355" blackdogshaven@hcinet.net pretty24355
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Hi all,

I accidentally let through moderation the post asking how to make dog
treats out of dried green tripe. This discussion is inappropriate for
the Raw Feeding list and must go private or to Raw Chat.

Thank you.
Karen
Moderator

Messages in this topic (46)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5a. Re: Off topic post from a moderator-Help Needed
Posted by: "pretty24355" blackdogshaven@hcinet.net pretty24355
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:08 pm ((PDT))

Hi Carol,

Donations can be sent directly to:

David Moore
3500 Williams Bridge Road
Toccoa GA 30577

I am sure any amount will be very much appreciated and certainly go to
good use.

Thanks so much,

Karen

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6.1. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:26 pm ((PDT))

Hi Jennifer,

Just to add to the great advice you've gotten so far...

I'd go over to the rawcat list for help in feeding your cat. I'm sure that
all of those supplements are not necessary and some could be harmful....for
instance kelp given to dogs can contribute to hypothyroidism...not certain
how it affects cats, but it's something to look into!!

You can feed your puppy on a blanket, towel, shower curtain,
tablecloth...anything you can quickly wipe off or throw in the wash every
once in a while. No need to get to crazy about mopping or disinfecting.
Just a spray of vinegar will clean up and disinfect quite nicely.

Oh, and here are a few puppy feeding messages from past discussions....
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/135757
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/135847
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/137170

Too bad that "breeder" is moving the puppies out so quickly, vaccinating too
young and worming them....talk about overwhelming that little immature
immune system. Yikes!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Jennifer" <kali_moonwolf@yahoo.com>

Ill be getting him at 7 weeks, and unfortunately
he'll have been fed on kibble most recently, and spent the last week
being wormed. What is the best way for switching a puppy to raw, and
are there any concerns in that area? I feed my 12-yr old cat that I
adopted last year, raw food and his health as greatly improved,
however, I give him several supplements, including taurine, salmon
oil, kelp, vit. e and b-complex. I can't get him to eat bones... he
eats AROUND the bone... any suggestions there? And finally, where do
you all feed your dogs? I live in a large 3-bedroom apt... Im trying
to save $ to take all the carpet out and roll out some wood-looking
linoleum, but it hasn't happenned yet.... do you all just mop the
kitchen every day? I remember juices stain concrete! ;o)

Messages in this topic (73)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

7a. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
Posted by: "Garnaas, Carolyn (MED US)" carolyn.garnaas@siemens.com carolyn.garnaas
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:08 pm ((PDT))

My dog would not go near liver, no way, nohow. And this was after four
year of searing it, using parmesan, using a bit of garlic powder, hiding
it in other meats, and trying all our other neat little tricks to get a
reluctant dog to eat.

Then I finally got my hands on some green tripe, and that was all it
took! I now puree the liver and mix it into the green tripe (not to a
soupy consistency - just one chicken liver mixed into a whole meal's
worth of tripe).

She scarfs it down and begs for more! And this is a dog who will still
on occasion babysit her raw dinner for up to three days running, before
tucking into it. Green tripe for everyone!!

Carolyn J. Garnaas and Molly Toy Poodle, Who Is Probably Dreaming of
Green Tripe Right This Minute.

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Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

7b. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
Posted by: "Bumble1994@aol.com" Bumble1994@aol.com bumble1994
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:38 pm ((PDT))

In that vein, one of my cats can be spurred to eat something she is whining
about not being able to cope with if I simply reach for it like I'm going to
take it away. :)

Lynda

In a message dated 10/12/2007 1:34:27 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, "Andrea"
writes:

Cats are different, and I'll puree it, mix it with canned tuna, sear
it, freeze it, stand on my head, whatever it takes to get the cat to
eat it. .

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

8a. Re: switching kitten to raw
Posted by: "Gail Edmond" windybond1@yahoo.co.uk windybond1
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:30 pm ((PDT))

I am not a vegeterian but eh what is the difference surely a rabbit is a rabbit.

Gail

----- Original Message ----
From: Kristen <kristengilkinsonrmt@rogers.com>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 11 October, 2007 11:34:54 AM
Subject: [rawfeeding] Re: switching kitten to raw

Thanks Lynda

I think I'll start with chicken and duck hearts with some neck after
reading your advice. I was wondering where you get frog legs?

I'm trying to find a rabbit breeder in the Toronto area (meat - not pet
rabbits) but I'm having trouble and I just can't spend $18 on a little
thing at the grocer ;-)

All the best,
Kristen

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Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

9. Watery stools -but not diarrhoea HELP
Posted by: "mrskheath" mrskheath@yahoo.co.uk mrskheath
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:32 pm ((PDT))

Hi, I have been feeding raw meat and bones for about 3 months. My male
sibe husky has 1lb of meat (usually a quarter of chicken or turkey
leg) whilst my girl (6 months) is on the same. Until recently she was
on 1lb -half a chicken quarter or drumstick- divided between 2 meals,
but recently I shifted her on to having the same as him - 1 meal.
Yesterday she passed stools - I noticed that they were small stools -
3 or 4 'pieces' about 2 - 3 cm each, but were in a watery gloopy
substance. Is this down to the switch to just 1 meal?

Would really appreciate some help and/or suggestions. Thanks

Karlene

Messages in this topic (1)
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10a. Re: PLS HELP ME FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH TO FEED AS A MEAL?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:33 pm ((PDT))

"Tonight I went to the butcher and got turkey necks, gizzards, and cows feet
...are cows feet ok? they are pretty cool lookin'... I was ready to get
turkey legs and whole chickens....."

I feed whole chickens all the time; well, before hunting season, now were on
100% venison, elk and antelope. My bunch weigh between 85-97lbs and get
approx. 2lbs per day - when I am running them a mile in the am and a mile in
the pm. Otherwise it's 1.5 lbs per day.

I'll splita 4lb chicken down the middle and everyone gets a half a chicken.
It doesn't have to be exact but as mentioned, 2-3% of adult weight daily,
80% meat, 10% bone and 10% organs.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (4)
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11a. Re: How long will this last?
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:33 pm ((PDT))

> it's all smooth sailing, with the occasional retest - just like with kids.

Thesedays,it is just like that to my palette too. Now and then,she tries to refuse food. So far, pheasant and pork liver.

She really devored when she wason first round but second round, she is not liking it much for some reason.

For pheasant(whole bird cut-up),I tend to cheer when she touch the meat with mouth or chew and encourage her to eat and she eats ok but not like devoring on her first experienced day...

For pork liver, I found out that if it were fed with Egg,she eats it without any fuss andso excited.

I am wondering since she knows I stashed goat or buffalo or beef etc things she like a lot,she try to test my patience now and then...

These couple of weeks,I go fo rwalk wit her little longer and little early in the morning like 7am,and go again at evening and we do two walks aday. I lowered bit fat content to see if it works any to help her loose bit weight.Amount of food is not changed much.

She lost 300g (about 1 lb) I think. I should not loose more than now or otherwise I become twig,but I am sure it helps my health too so,I go for walk daily.

Today,I fed her Elk and she was not too excited on her first round but ate in gusto this time around. I wonder what makes her eat it in gusto and what makes her feel not wanting to eat it...

I am sure walking before meal maybe helping her to feel hungry maybe but,it is wiered...

So far,I be strong and patient and she is eating ok,and i keep winning the patient match:-P

yassy

---------------------------------
Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
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12a. Tikahni
Posted by: "Jennifer" kali_moonwolf@yahoo.com kali_moonwolf
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:09 pm ((PDT))

Thanks for everyone's great reply and links! I've spent all day
searching and made some decisions!!! I am not going to vaccinate except
my required by law and have found 2 holistic vets in the Dallas area!
Im only feeding raw and making an immediate switch when I get him on
Sunday! I can't WAIT!!! I'll try feeding him on a giant beach towel I
have. Im only going to supplement with salmon oil and some garlic (I
know too much can cause anemia) and I do like to use juiced and
recombined veggies sometimes. I've never fed a raw fish before so I
plan on doing that on bath-day, at some point! I can't wait to watch
that! lol So, my final question, is what do you use for treats? I plan
on doing extensive training, and even dog-scotering (Im a member of
those groups too) although not for a while yet, and all the treats seem
to have grains in them. Wouldn't beef jerky be too salty? Guess I could
make my own... what do you all think? I've really appreciated all the
time everyone's taken to write in! Thanks so much!

Messages in this topic (2)
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12b. Re: Tikahni
Posted by: "Carol Dunster" cedunster@centurytel.net carwynst
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:18 pm ((PDT))

On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 21:42:41 -0000, you wrote:

>So, my final question, is what do you use for treats?

I know its cooked, but you can boil some liver 'til it's cooked, then
bake it slowly to dry it out and that makes great dog treats. If you
are into garlic, you can use a little on the liver (mostly for your
own nose!). For treats only feed tiny amounts at a time, it's the
taste that rewards, not the meal, and it shouldn't make much
difference to his healthy diet.
~ Carol
_____________
Carol Dunster
cedunster@centurytel.net

Messages in this topic (2)
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13. Is it ok to give puppy 7mos half chicken?
Posted by: "angela182548" angela182548@yahoo.com angela182548
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:38 pm ((PDT))

Moderator's Note:

Please sign your posts.

*******************************
Hi All,
I just got 2 chickens cut in half. Is it ok to give the puppy a half?
Man I am nervous.... :-)They all have one .....

Messages in this topic (1)
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[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12154

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
From: redshorty1959
1b. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
From: redshorty1959
1c. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
From: redshorty1959
1d. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
From: Jenny S
1e. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
From: redshorty1959

2.1. New Puppy
From: Jennifer
2.2. Re: New Puppy
From: Laura Atkinson
2.3. Re: New Puppy
From: Jennifer
2.4. Re: New Puppy
From: Andrea
2.5. Re: New Puppy
From: Tina Berry

3a. Re: Concerned about missing vitamins
From: thebestformyboys

4a. Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
From: krystal_brr
4b. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
From: costrowski75
4c. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
From: Casey Post

5a. Re: I am so confused...Please help
From: Geri
5b. Re: I am so confused...Please help
From: Sandee Lee

6a. dosage for small dogs?
From: Carol Garnaat
6b. Re: dosage for small dogs?
From: Olga
6c. Re: dosage for small dogs?
From: costrowski75

7a. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
From: Carol Dunster
7b. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
From: Nataly A

8a. Re: Venison?
From: jennifer_hell
8b. Re: Venison?
From: krystal_brr
8c. Re: Venison?
From: Tina Berry

9. HELP...worried my shiz tzu issnt eating enough
From: Jenny S

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
Posted by: "redshorty1959" kphhp@hotmail.com redshorty1959
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:34 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Andrea" <poketmouse45@...> wrote:
>
> My dogs keep themselves pretty clean on their own. At the beginning
>
EXCELLENT HELP thank you very much --I get it now :~)

kat

Messages in this topic (15)
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1b. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
Posted by: "redshorty1959" kphhp@hotmail.com redshorty1959
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:35 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:
>
> We use crates (When the other two arrive) for the Danes. Right now we
>

Wow! I really got a complete picture of how this is done, in all
sorts of 'whatever works for you' type fashion.

Thanx everyone!
kat

Messages in this topic (15)
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1c. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
Posted by: "redshorty1959" kphhp@hotmail.com redshorty1959
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:38 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Stephanie Sorensen
<steph.sorensen@...> wrote:
>

Good point about the dirt/mud on feet. I think I will be inclined to
have the wet towel on hand too, and wash the other "table cloth" ea
day... I didnt realize you only feed once a day. That helps with the
getting ready for work schedule.
Thanks a bunch!
Kat

Messages in this topic (15)
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1d. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
Posted by: "Jenny S" jenken69@shaw.ca jenken69
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:41 am ((PDT))

LoL on the cleanliness issue check my youtube doggy napkin..she keeps clean herself heehee...wetwipes help as well
Jenny S
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfMJXz3AvKI (doggy napkin)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L34YjdBCu8I( Fun in the pool) way to funny..

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (15)
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1e. Re: Dog/Household Cleanliness
Posted by: "redshorty1959" kphhp@hotmail.com redshorty1959
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:07 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:
>
> Of course my Danes & Dal have no hair issues. Just drooling
salmonella &
> meat parts all around the house after a good meal LOL!

Thank you thank you !

so much helpful information!
I love this place
kat

Messages in this topic (15)
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2.1. New Puppy
Posted by: "Jennifer" kali_moonwolf@yahoo.com kali_moonwolf
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:36 am ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: WELCOME, DON'T FORGET TO SIGN YOUR POSTS.***

Hi everyone! Im getting my first puppy this weekend, a giant alaskan
malamute! Im so excited and I live in the Dallas, TX area! I've fed
raw before to my brother's adult dog several years back, but I'm
nervous about a puppy and was hoping you all could help answer some
questions! First, I want to make sure (as mentioned in previous
posts) that I don't need to give him vitamins or supplements. I've
heard that puppies may need something special to help their eyesight
and extra's like salmon oil, vitamins b and c and something like
nupet (is that it's name?) I'm worried because especially with a
giant breed that doesn't fully mature for 3 years, I've heard that
you don't want bone development happening fast, but you DO want a
very special ratio of vitamins so that they develop WELL. Needless to
say Im concerned. Ill be getting him at 7 weeks, and unfortunately
he'll have been fed on kibble most recently, and spent the last week
being wormed. What is the best way for switching a puppy to raw, and
are there any concerns in that area? I feed my 12-yr old cat that I
adopted last year, raw food and his health as greatly improved,
however, I give him several supplements, including taurine, salmon
oil, kelp, vit. e and b-complex. I can't get him to eat bones... he
eats AROUND the bone... any suggestions there? And finally, where do
you all feed your dogs? I live in a large 3-bedroom apt... Im trying
to save $ to take all the carpet out and roll out some wood-looking
linoleum, but it hasn't happenned yet.... do you all just mop the
kitchen every day? I remember juices stain concrete! ;o) And my very
LAST question (sorry this is so long) is does anyone have info. on
vaccines? I know this isn't the place, but Im interested in only
doing the bare minumum (rabies) and the 3 things Im worried about,
are parvo/distemper, flea med and heartworm med. Thanks for
everyone's great advice! Im very excited and cant WAIT to start!

Messages in this topic (72)
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2.2. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Laura Atkinson" llatkinson@gmail.com lauraatkinson2002
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:50 am ((PDT))

Well, you've got a whole bunch of questions going on here <g>

First off...is there ANY way you can keep puppy with mom and littermates for
at least another week, preferably 2-3 weeks? I know you're dying to get the
little fluffball in your house, but those weeks from 8-10 weeks are so
critical to socialization and learning rules of dogs from Mom that I'd try
my best to leave him there a bit longer.

Puppies don't need anything other than meat, bones and organs. You don't
need to feed "extra" calcium, you don't need to add extra vitamins.
Everything they need to develop comes from meat, bones and organs. There's
an old wives tail in Siberians that adding vit c & e for the first year will
prevent the development of juvenile cataracts. I've filed that under "can't
hurt, might help" and when I remember, I give it to them. I've not had a
case of JC, but that could just be genetics, not the supplements.

You don't want a large/giant breed puppy to grow fast. By feeding the puppy
raw you'll be providing optimum nutrition for a natural rate of growth and
in time, the puppy will grow to its full, genetic potential.

You'll find that fleas and even mosquitos aren't really a problem in healthy
dogs. The parasites tend to go for the "easy" targets, not the healthy
ones. My neighbors have all sorts of problems with fleas, and we rarely see
a one.
--
Laura A
Kaos Siberians http://www.kaossiberians.com
Forget love...I'd rather fall in chocolate.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (72)
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2.3. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Jennifer" kali_moonwolf@yahoo.com kali_moonwolf
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:58 am ((PDT))

haha, yes, lots of questions, that's me! If the situation were
different I'd have no problem leaving the puppy there. Unfortunately,
while I like the breeders' dogs, she's alreayd seperated the mother
from litter, and the puppy's are all leaving this week, so mine left
there would be pretty much alone. She also pumps them full of
vaccines and de-worming stuff (and is confused about why they've all
had terible diarrhea and even lost one) that I'd rather not have him
get. So in the end, I'll be getting him this weekend. ;o) Thanks for
the info on the vitamins and food... i read some old archives, so I'm
going to go ahead and start him out immediately on raw. She's giving
me some kibble and I'll just throw it out. He probably already had
diarrhea anyway, so I can't see any other problems just going for it!
Thanks for the advice!
Signed- (forgot last time, sorry)
-Jennifer

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Laura Atkinson" <llatkinson@...>
wrote:
>
> Well, you've got a whole bunch of questions going on here <g>
>
> First off...is there ANY way you can keep puppy with mom and
littermates for
> at least another week, preferably 2-3 weeks? I know you're dying
to get the
> little fluffball in your house, but those weeks from 8-10 weeks are
so
> critical to socialization and learning rules of dogs from Mom that
I'd try
> my best to leave him there a bit longer.
>
> Puppies don't need anything other than meat, bones and organs. You
don't
> need to feed "extra" calcium, you don't need to add extra vitamins.
> Everything they need to develop comes from meat, bones and organs.
There's
> an old wives tail in Siberians that adding vit c & e for the first
year will
> prevent the development of juvenile cataracts. I've filed that
under "can't
> hurt, might help" and when I remember, I give it to them. I've not
had a
> case of JC, but that could just be genetics, not the supplements.
>
> You don't want a large/giant breed puppy to grow fast. By feeding
the puppy
> raw you'll be providing optimum nutrition for a natural rate of
growth and
> in time, the puppy will grow to its full, genetic potential.
>
> You'll find that fleas and even mosquitos aren't really a problem
in healthy
> dogs. The parasites tend to go for the "easy" targets, not the
healthy
> ones. My neighbors have all sorts of problems with fleas, and we
rarely see
> a one.
> --
> Laura A
> Kaos Siberians http://www.kaossiberians.com
> Forget love...I'd rather fall in chocolate.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Messages in this topic (72)
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2.4. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:09 am ((PDT))

> I want to make sure (as mentioned in previous posts) that I don't
> need to give him vitamins or supplements.

That's right. A good prey model diet will give the pup all the
nutrients that he needs at the right levels. Some of us give fish
oil as a supplement because grain fed meats have a lack of O3's as
opposed to grass fed meats.

> I've heard that you don't want bone development happening fast

Raw fed pups don't go through growth spurts like their ki**lefed
brothers would. No lanky akward pups, just steady growth. Because
they don't have big growth spurts raw fed large breed pups often are
smaller than other pups the same age. Raw fed pups will keep growing
long after the others have stopped, though. I thought my GSP stopped
growing at a year and a half, but I noticed a little while ago that
he is now taller than my mom's lab.

> What is the best way for switching a puppy to raw, and are there
> any concerns in that area?

Start right away. Puppies often don't take a lot of time to get
acclimated to the new diet. They also tend to tolerate variety
faster. The more things you can get your puppy to try at an early
age the less likely he'll be picky down the line, IMO. At first you
might notice some loose stools, just feed several small meals a day
and he shouldn't have many problems.

> I can't get him to eat bones... he eats AROUND the bone... any
> suggestions there?

My cats are rediculously picky, so I can relate. Cornish game hens
have really soft bones so that might help.

> And finally, where do you all feed your dogs?

Mine eat on their dog beds. Others use old towels, vinyl
tablecloths, crates. It's pretty easy to train a dog to keep their
food in one spot. If they try to take the food off their spot just
place it back and continue as necessary.

> my very LAST question (sorry this is so long) is does anyone have
> info. on vaccines?

Check out http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/jstsayno2vaccs/
It's a really helpful group. They can answer all of your questions
about vaccines and "preventatives"

Welcome to the group!

Andrea

Messages in this topic (72)
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2.5. Re: New Puppy
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:19 am ((PDT))

"my very LAST question (sorry this is so long) is does anyone have info. on
vaccines?"
I went vax free 2 years ago. My two 18 month old gsds have never had a
vaccine, chemical, kibble, etc. of any kind. No HW preventative, no flea
preventative. IMO vax free is the healthiest way to go. Vaccines have
their own risks as well as going vax free does too. I start socializing my
pups at weeks, starting in the front yard for a few minutes a day; at 8
weeks we are walking around the neighborhood; at 12 weeks we are going to
Petsmart for a few minutes in the potty yard, at 16 weeks they are going
everywhere. It's called natural immunity - just like us getting the chicken
pox in kindergarten and then never getting them again. But everyone has to
do what is comfortable for them and their dogs; my first gsds were vaxed,
lived to 12 and died of cancer which is why I started researching raw
feeding and vaccines. My two adults have had puppy shots and one rabies but
will never be vaxed again. My male has no indications of vaccine damage,
but the 4 yr old female wants to attack thunder, flashlights, and is just
bitchy in general. My 3 yr old male is balanced, even tempered, both are
great working dogs as are the pups.

My prev female after her first rabies shot became instantly over the top dog
aggressive within 2 weeks (one of the symptoms) and we could never her break
her of it in 12 years. So we avoided other dogs. Some dogs show no
indications of vaccine damage - so to each their own. Just my two cents.
And damage happens over generations.

--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (72)
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3a. Re: Concerned about missing vitamins
Posted by: "thebestformyboys" llb6984@comcast.net thebestformyboys
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:37 am ((PDT))

Tracy,

I'm really in no position to give advice as I am new to "prey model"
feeding (5 Days), but I'm going to tell you about my Goldens. I was
feeding raw for 2 1/2 years adding all that crap to their raw meat.
Although my dogs are in very good health and have beautiful coats,
their breath was discusting! Bad enough to gag you. One dog's teeth are
covered with brown tartar. Within 2 days of cutting out veggies, wheat
germ, wheat bran, kelp, etc. and giving them raw meaty bones!, the bad
breath is completely gone. I'm not kidding, my husband and I are
amazed! This "stuff" had to be sitting in their stomachs and
fermenting. I will not ever run another veggie through the food
processer! When I put their boneless meals in a bowl, I sit and stare
at it. I feel like I'm forgetting something! It is so easy! Don't make
this harder on yourself. I have my life back! No more room clearing
farts either! No more burping! I'll never go back to the "old way".
Spend your money on MEATY BONES!

Laurie Barnett
Port St. Lucie, FL
Golden Retriever Brothers: Logan and Cooper

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Tracy,
>
> I can see why you are confused. Put the book down! :))
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
> From: "trayc2244" <BreeZ119@...>
>
>
> Well, I have been reading Dr. Pitchairn's book Natual health for dogs
> and cats. I get mixed messages and I am getting confused.
>

Messages in this topic (10)
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________________________________________________________________________

4a. Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
Posted by: "krystal_brr" rkbarr@hughes.net krystal_brr
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:37 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:
>
> Since everyone who has shopped Walmart chicken reports of
enhancement,
> I fully expect the FW Walmart sells enhanced leg quarters as well.

Chris

I shop walmart and buy the bags of chicken leg quarters. I can't find
anything on the bag about being "enhanced", Do they have to tell us
that or are you saying that the chicken just is no matter what the bag
says?

Krystal

Messages in this topic (14)
________________________________________________________________________

4b. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:04 am ((PDT))

"krystal_brr" <rkbarr@...> wrote:
> I shop walmart and buy the bags of chicken leg quarters. I can't
find
> anything on the bag about being "enhanced", Do they have to tell us
> that or are you saying that the chicken just is no matter what the
bag
> says?
*****
Well.
Since my perspective on WM is to mistrust everything they do, say and
sell, it would be very easy for me to say the bags contain enhanced
chicken, and they probably are. However, Laura A commented that once
upon a time her WM sold unenhanced quarters, so perhaps there's still
hope.

Someone (if not the dysfunctional clerks) at WM has got to know.
This is where the advanced homework comes in. If it's important
enough for you to know, you may have to do the research. Find out
the buyer's name, ask that person. Go the the WM website and ask.
SOMEONE has to know.

As an aside, I am seeing chicken now with the "minimally processed"
label on it PLUS additional text elsewhere that identifies various
degrees of "enhancement". So clearly our bureaucratic friends who
make these decisions have determined that the enhancements can be
part of the minimal processing. Again, if such things matter, you
may have to do your own homework. Alas.
Chris

Messages in this topic (14)
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4c. Re: Walmart Chicken Quaters was - Gathering Info.
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:35 am ((PDT))

> I shop walmart and buy the bags of chicken leg quarters. I can't find
> anything on the bag about being "enhanced", Do they have to tell us
> that or are you saying that the chicken just is no matter what the bag
> says?

Krystal,

Look for the words "solution" or "broth" - those are giveaways on enhanced
meats. I recently came across one that declared it was "with added
flavor!" - the "flavor" was a salt/preservative grossosity that is something
I need to avoid for my crew.

Anything that isn't "retained water" is generally an enhancement these
days...if in doubt, read the nutritional facts on the back. If the sodium
content seems like it's high, you're probably holding enhanced meat.

Casey

Messages in this topic (14)
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5a. Re: I am so confused...Please help
Posted by: "Geri" auntigeri@aol.com gericolloton
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:39 am ((PDT))

I did not fast my 2 rescues. They are doing very well.

Geri

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "trayc2244" <BreeZ119@...> wrote:
>
Can someone let me
> know which would be better, starting raw asap, or fasting 2-7 days.
>
> Thanks,
> Tracy
>

Messages in this topic (23)
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5b. Re: I am so confused...Please help
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:46 am ((PDT))

They wouldn't....but Pitcairn is confused....he missed the class about dogs
not requiring carbohydrates! :)

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Carol Dunster" <cedunster@centurytel.net>

I would think chicken broth would be more appropriate and healthy than
vegetable broth. Don't know when a "wild" dog would eat either veggies
or fruit. Since you want to switch to a healthy, natural diet, why not
start out that way?

Messages in this topic (23)
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________________________________________________________________________

6a. dosage for small dogs?
Posted by: "Carol Garnaat" cgar88@ameritech.net sewnchine
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:40 am ((PDT))

Hello,
I've purchased, from a health store, a bottle of Salmon Oil 1000mg softgels.
The label lists EPA 160mg and DHA 240mg. Is this the correct amount of EPA
and DHA or should I look for other amounts?

I have 3 dogs. They weigh 8.5 lb, 12.5 lb, and 20 lb.

What is the correct dosage of Salmon oil for them?

Would the dosage be the same for Fish BODY oil also?

This list is so informative and supportive. Thank you for all your help!!
Carol in Michigan

Messages in this topic (3)
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6b. Re: dosage for small dogs?
Posted by: "Olga" olga.drozd@gmail.com olga_d
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:15 am ((PDT))

Hi there,

Typically the supplemental dosage of fish oil is 1 1000 mg capsule per
30 lbs of dog weight. I would probably give one to your 20 lb dog,
and split another between the smaller two. Alternatively, you can
give it to the smaller guys every other day.

Fish body oil is how people often describe fish/salmon oil. The word
"body" is added in there to differentiate it from Cod liver oil, which
is very different and I wouldn't give as a routine supplement.

Here is a link that may be helpful when choosing a supplement brand:
http://www.oceansalive.org/eat.cfm?subnav=fishoil

Hope that helps,
Olga

Messages in this topic (3)
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6c. Re: dosage for small dogs?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:16 am ((PDT))

Carol Garnaat" <cgar88@...> wrote:
> I've purchased, from a health store, a bottle of Salmon Oil 1000mg
softgels.
> The label lists EPA 160mg and DHA 240mg. Is this the correct
amount of EPA
> and DHA or should I look for other
*****
If the label says this is the DOSE, then find out how many softgels
are in the DOSE (ideally one, often two).

If that amount is per SOFTGEL, it's lovely.

If that amount is per DOSE, then that amount becomes less ideal as
the number of softgels per dose increase.

1 softgel per dose - 400mg per softgel and quite nice
2 softgels per dose - 200mg per softgel, not optimal
3 softgels per dose - 100mg per softgel and below recommended levels

>
> I have 3 dogs. They weigh 8.5 lb, 12.5 lb, and 20 lb.
>
> What is the correct dosage of Salmon oil for them?
*****
Depends on the strength of each softgel.
At 400mg per softgel, one softgel every other day should be fine for
an otherwise healthy dog. At 200mg per softgel one a day is okay.

At 100mg per softgel, two a day would be useful. If the per softgel
amount is as low as 100mg, feed through the stuff and buy a different
brand next time. If you look for a total of 300mg per softgel,
minimum, you'll be good to go.

> Would the dosage be the same for Fish BODY oil also?
*****
Yes, salmon oil is just a specific kind of fish body oil.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (3)
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7a. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
Posted by: "Carol Dunster" cedunster@centurytel.net carwynst
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:46 am ((PDT))

On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:23:25 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

> he would eat the wrapper it came in if he could, and suddenly he doesnt wanna touch it either.

Is it just one batch of liver that they don't want to eat? Maybe there
is something "odd" about it?
~ Carol
_____________
Carol Dunster
cedunster@centurytel.net

Messages in this topic (8)
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7b. Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction
Posted by: "Nataly A" rap_squad@yahoo.com rap_squad
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:08 am ((PDT))

hey carol,

no. he just stoped eating it all together.

Nat.

----- Original Message ----
From: Carol Dunster <cedunster@centurytel.net>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 1, 2000 10:57:54 AM
Subject: Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Liver refusal and a bit of introduction

On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:23:25 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

> he would eat the wrapper it came in if he could, and suddenly he doesnt wanna touch it either.

Is it just one batch of liver that they don't want to eat? Maybe there
is something "odd" about it?
~ Carol
____________ _
Carol Dunster
cedunster@centuryte l.net

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Messages in this topic (8)
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8a. Re: Venison?
Posted by: "jennifer_hell" jenniferhell@web.de jennifer_hell
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:47 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:

> I recommend you grab that vension (hopefully you'll get more than
> just ribs, what a disappointment that would be!) and introduce bits
> of flesh in the chicken meals you are now feeding. Gently and
> gradually increase the presence of vension so that by the time you
> think everyone's ready to move on, you will have built a fine bridge
> to the next step.
> Chris O
>

That sounds great! It's true, season will be over again here in a
couple of months. I don't know yet what I'll be getting, it's a new
source I found that has turkey and venison (both free range) so I just
asked for anything they don't sell to people. They'll call me and I
can come look what they have. =D I already got turkey legs in my
freezer. Woohoo!

Jennifer with Mandy from Germany

Messages in this topic (9)
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8b. Re: Venison?
Posted by: "krystal_brr" rkbarr@hughes.net krystal_brr
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:58 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tina Berry" <k9baron@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hey Krystal - where in MT are you? >
>

Tina,

I live between Missoula and Seeley Lake. My husband is out trying to
get a Mule Deer as we type. He couldn't of been happier when I
announced we were going raw. He can now kill more stuff:-)

Do you have friends who give you extra? I am trying to figure out how
to get more than he is allowed to shoot.

Krystal
>

Messages in this topic (9)
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8c. Re: Venison?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:39 am ((PDT))

"Do you have friends who give you extra? I am trying to figure out how to
get more than he is allowed to shoot."

I have 3 empty freezers right now; I have a butcher who gives me all his
scraps (about 100 lbs every 2 weeks during hunting season, sometimes more)
and last year I filled two freezers but ran out this summer. Friends and
family save me all their scraps and then 2 people at work are giving me
their last years meat when they get their first kill this year - so that
will be two freezer fulls instantly. I go thru 8lbs per day with 4 gsds; so
at the end of hunting season hopefully we will have all 3 freezers full and
possible a 4th.
--
Tina Berry - MT
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

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9. HELP...worried my shiz tzu issnt eating enough
Posted by: "Jenny S" jenken69@shaw.ca jenken69
Date: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:40 am ((PDT))

Hi Tila just gave birth last week im so worried she issnt eating enough, she seems skinny to me as i can feel her spine and ribs more than ever befor she is about 10 lbs normally...I think she has enough milk the as the pups are growing and not crying at all as if hungry but she dossent seem to have full teets ever ..she is prob eating 2 x what she was befor the pregancy ...she is fully raw meaty bone fed moastly chicken ..she dossent like pork and often wont eat beef she gets lots of organ some tuna..are there suplements i can give her or something ?
Jenny S
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfMJXz3AvKI (doggy napkin)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L34YjdBCu8I( Fun in the pool) way to funny..

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