Re: [rawfeeding] Well the first meal was weird . . .

I didn't let him. I got worried. He seemed to be choking when he threw it
back up. I hosed him down and brought him inside to calm down, then gave
him some smaller pieces. I'll try again tomorrow and keep everyone posted.
Thanks.

Carol

On 6/16/07, Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote:
>
> Carol,
>
> He'll figure it out....I doubt he needs any help with this. Did he eat it
> again?????
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
> From: "Carol Santangelo" <carol.santangelo@gmail.com>
> Tonight was the first night I gave Bruno a chicken quarter. He
> > licked it for a while then walked away. So I pulled the skin off and
> then
> > we started chewing....and chewing....and chewing.... He had a bit of
> > trouble breaking any of it off to swallow. He eventually did swallow
> some
> > of it down but then he threw it back up. I realize he threw up because
> the
> > piece was too big. How should I handle this in the future? Hack it up
> with
> > a meat cleaver or something? Thanks for any help.
>
>
>
> All information on this list represents personal opinion only. By staying
> on this list, you agree to never hold anyone from this list or associated
> with this list liable for any information posted through this list. You
> agree to take personal responsibility for your learning, and for personal
> responsibility for what you feed yourself, your family, and your dogs, cats,
> ferrets, or any other animal that lives under your care. If you don't
> agree, please unsubscribe immediately.
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[rawfeeding] Re: Fish Oil

maloufgeorge@... wrote:
>
> I am currently feeding Diamond large breed puppy kibble along with a
raw leg quarter to my 3 month old fila pup a day.Also giving 2 Eggs
every other day with some milk. What do you guys think about this diet?
*****
Not much. What sort of response would you expect from a website
committed to feeding a raw, species appropriate diet?

Ditch the kibble, ditch the milk.
Feed through raw whole chickens.
The eggs are fine.

Chris O
Please change the subject line when you change topics.

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[rawfeeding] Re: Confused on feeding Turkey & Pork

"clittleidiot" <karen@...> wrote:
>
> I'm really sorry, this is all new to me and I haven't even started
> feeding my dogs raw.
*****
Sorry for what? For not knowing? For not knowing that some day
you'd want to know? Pfft. Don't be silly.

I'm seeing a specialist
> next week to help me make a raw meal diet plan for my dogs.
*****
This would be a grevious error. You do not need a diet specialist; if
you want to know how to best feed your domestic wolves you should
look to what Mother Nature has been doing quite successfully for a
million years or so. The basics: 10% consumable bone; 10% internal
organs of which half can be liver; 80% meat, including fat,
connective tissue and skin as well as flesh. All raw, nothing
cooked, fermented, or processed.

That's it.

No veggies, no fruit, no grains, no dairy, no vitamins or minerals or
micro- or phyto-nutrients.

> Is it okay to feed Turkey and Pork. I've been told all my life
not
> to ever feed dogs turkey or pork. Something about an enzyme in
> turkey is deadly and that pork is too high in sodium. Or am I
> totally wrong.
*****
You may right that you were told these things; but these things are
totally wrong.

Turkey has tryptophan, so do all meats; it is an essential amino
acid. We hear about all sorts of terrible post-Thanksgiving turkey
upsets not because turkey is a bad meat but because people overfeed
their unprepared dogs and/or feed large amounts of cooked fat and
bones. Raw turkey is not only fine, it can be a staple resource.

Pork can also be fed as a staple protein source. It is easily
digested, generally affordable, and available year round. Naturally
occurring sodium ought not be a problem for any dog. Here, from the
USDA Nutrient Database, is a comparison of pork to beef:

http://grande.nal.usda.gov/NDL/index.html
Pork, composite of retail cuts, raw, sodium
100g - 55mg
One pound - 249mg

Beef, arm chuck roast, raw, sodium
100g - 57mg
One pound - 259mg

As you can see, not particularly a problem.

And do you feed normally chicken with the occasion
> pork, beef, rabbit etc.. and organs.
*****
I personally feed pork, beef, rabbit, etc. with the occasional
chicken!

Chicken is not a special food, other than being available and
reasonably priced and easy to find (sounds very much like pork). If
circumstances require that you rely heavily on chicken, do so; it
does not otherwise deserve top billing.

I'm trying to figure this all
> out, so I understand everything next week at my appointment.
*****
I doubt you will, in that short a time. I recommend you don't even
try...only thing I see as important is to cancel the meeting with the
nutritionist.

> One other thing, I've been reading that alot of dogs get the runs
> when stitched over, is this normal,
*****
It is not uncommon if too much food is fed, or too much fat. It is
not standard procedure though.

cause my sister is getting
> married in a week and I'm traveling with my dogs for 9 hours in the
> car, and I'm thinking I might wait to change their diet until we
get
> back,
*****
I think you should. I generally reccomend people just get on with
feeding raw, but I don't see focus time in your life at the moment
and that alone can cause menu mistakes you don't need right now.
Perhaps while you are away you can log some browse time on the
rawfeeding message archives; also here are some links you might like:
http://rawfed.com
http://rawfeddogs.net
http://rawlearning.com

Chris O

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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Fish Oil

Ditch the milk and the kibble, add in other protein sources, lots of meat
and some organs and it will be perfect!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: <maloufgeorge@yahoo.com>
>
> I am currently feeding Diamond large breed puppy kibble along with a raw
leg quarter to my 3 month old fila pup a day.Also giving 2 Eggs every other
day with some milk. What do you guys think about this diet?

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Re: [rawfeeding] Bones & Broken Teeth

Your vet told you to feed cooked bones????? Do you suppose she meant for
you to just cook the meat? I can't imagine a vet recommending cooked bones.

Oh well....to answer a couple of your questions....

Bones fed as part of a raw diet should not wear down teeth. They should be
consumable and fairly soft. Think of whole chickens, turkey, rabbit, pork
roasts and ribs, fish, lamb...stay away from the "marrow", "soup" or
"recreational" bones...the hard meatless bones that only serve to break and
wear down teeth.

Ditch the BARF patties...awful food...YUCK!!!! Seriously, anything other
than meat, bones and organs is not necessary, wasted money, potentially
harmful...and you don't want to feed ground. Buy this girl a chicken,

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "jimhelminski" <jhelminski@comcast.net>

I am new to the Raw method. I want to feed my dog bones and a vet told
me NEVER to feed raw because a of salmonella, and other bacteria. Her
reply to feeding bones was to cook them first. Unfortunately, I
followed that advice and my Aussie flattened the tips of her lower fags
thanks to the hardness of the cooked bones. I have since learned.
However, I have not been giving her Raw Meaty Bones yet (I have only
been doing the Raw for a week) because of the fear I may cause more
damage to her teeth.

A few questions:

Ø Will raw bones wear her teeth further?

Ø If I do feed bones what type of bones are best to feed with
already compromise teeth on a 3 yr old Aussie? Which should I stay away
from?

Ø I presently am feeding BARF patties. Is this a good way to
start into raw feeding?

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Re: [rawfeeding] Hi. New. First meal fed tonight.Salmon questions.

Star,

Holding the food isn't the solution...feed larger. But, just so you know,
it is not normal nor necessary for dogs to chew their food. As long as it
fits down their throat, that's all that matters.

However, I still would feed larger and meatier. Wings are small enough to
be a choking hazard and are far too bony. Get a few whole chickens and
quarter them.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Star" <akjstarh@yahoo.com>

the vet I saw before we went on vacation told me that the reason my 11 yr
old Sheltie was
in bad shape is that I had been essentially killing her with kindness,
thinking I was doing
well feeding Nutro Lamb and Rice. Tonight I fed them each two raw chicken
wings, double
jointed. Outside in the yard to protect base carpeting. WOW! They loved it
but I about had
a heartattack when my near 3 year old Sheltie crunched his quickly in a few
places and
swallowed it whole! I will hold it for him ext time, per the suggestions I
have read to
encourage him to chew. I am reading through the list of foods and plan to
visit butcher
tomorrow.

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Re: [rawfeeding] Confused on feeding Turkey & Pork

Karen,

You do *not* need a specialist to make a raw meal diet plan for your dogs.
We can do that for you in about 2 seconds free of charge! It's really
simple...they require meat and lots of it, a little edible bone and some
organs. Period! No supplements, no additives, no mixing, measuring,
grinding. It is so easy, a child could do it.

Look at the normal prey of a carnivore and feed accordingly. Chicken is a
good place to begin but should not be the major portion of the diet.
Concentrate on red meat. Pork and turkey are fine to feed.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "clittleidiot" <karen@utahlabrescue.com>

I'm really sorry, this is all new to me and I haven't even started
feeding my dogs raw. I'm reading everything I can, and have been
reading all the post on this site all day. I'm seeing a specialist
next week to help me make a raw meal diet plan for my dogs. I will
feel so much better after going, cause I have too many questions, and
with my dogs being agility and fly ball dogs, they are extrememly
active, besides going on hikes daily. But anyways, back to my real
question.
Is it okay to feed Turkey and Pork. I've been told all my life not
to ever feed dogs turkey or pork. Something about an enzyme in
turkey is deadly and that pork is too high in sodium. Or am I
totally wrong. And do you feed normally chicken with the occasion
pork, beef, rabbit etc.. and organs.

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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Fish Oil

++++Mod note: please make sure all emails are signed +++++++

I am currently feeding Diamond large breed puppy kibble along with a raw leg quarter to my 3 month old fila pup a day.Also giving 2 Eggs every other day with some milk. What do you guys think about this diet?
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

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[rawfeeding] Re: Major chewing out

Cindy Marabito <doggirl1@...> wrote:
>
> I would just love to see that study. I wonder if they've done any
> recent studies on Science Diet? Boy, don't even get me going. Cindy
*****
SD has written its own book on pet nutrition and where reality didn't
suit their financial needs, they rewrote reality. Or at the very
least applied some remarkably creative interpretation to it.

If having a vet get on your case about diet doesn't fully tork you,
think about freakin' SD reps getting on your case about diet! They
pull out this nutrition book and point to proof positive that dogs
are omnivores (length of intestines I think is their defining moment)
which of course justifies for all time how they make their product.
SD has also produced a multipage document that systematically
dismantles the "BARF myth".

Science Diet's gotcha covered.
Chris O

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[rawfeeding] Re: Question about fish oil caps

"Dr. Holly Priestley" <hpriestley5@...> wrote:
>
> The fish oil must be body oil from deep, cold water fish. Can anyone
> suggest a brand? I've looked at the new Bayer Omega pills and have a
> $5 off coupon for it. I do not eat fish and am a vegetarian so the
> request is even more difficult for me.
*****
You're making this harder than it is. Fish body oil by definition
comes from cold marine fish--salmon, herring, mackerel, menhaden,
anchovy. You want either a softgel or liquid, you want as few "other
ingredients" as possible. You want to see a minimum combined total of
DHA and EPA of 300mg per 1000mg (or less) oil. You do not want Omega
6s in it, nor Omega 9s. You do not want a soy-based carrier oil.

Omega 3 pills are not likely to meet the minimum dosage
recommendations. Stick to liquid or liquid capsules.

I'm sure the brand he gets from Whole Foods is fine; knowing Whole
Foods though I'm sure you can find a product of similar or higher
quality elsewhere for the same or less money.

Here is a website that can help you weed out the substandard products:
<http://www.oceansalive.org/eat.cfm?subnav=fishoil&sort=Company>

Additionally you should consider browsing the list archives; fish body
oil has been discussed over and over again. Certainly within the last
month there has been significant coverage.
<http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join>

just wondering what
> other people use.
*****
I use liquid SO from Timberwolf Organics, and I use 1000mg SO softgel
caps from Walmart (Rexall brand), and I use 1000mg FBO caps, also
Rexall brand from Walmart.
Chris O

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[rawfeeding] Re: Cocker wont eat raw

Hi Marguerite,

I have a small dog, under 10 lbs. He'd always been fed
canned by hand.
When we started raw, he didn't know what it was.

I sat down on the floor with sizzors and meat and cut tiny
chunks off for him, once (I got him interested by cutting them off and
having him go fetch them) Once in his mouth he decided he loved it and
would eat them.

Next I went to holding the meat and cutting a tiny strip of it and
letting him pull the strip off the larger piece of meat...

Finally he decided that chicken was great and now eats most chicken
parts on his own with no problem. It's a very soft meat that can be
torn apart with your hands.

I have found out that each time I introduce a new meat, we have to go
through the same learning experience! He just seems to not understand
that all raw meats are good, good, good, untl mom shows him, lol.

He has never been a chewer and still has the same soft toys after 9 yrs.
Never tore any of them up......

I did take him into the vets for a checkup. We discussed this and the
vet and I both concluded that he does have weak jaw strength. It will
take a while to naturally build them up. In the meantime, I just cut
ribbons of meat, still attached, once he is used to eating that meat
and let him try on his own, sometimes he finishes and sometimes he
comes for help, lol.

Only if he's really tried and tried on his own will
I help him now and he's caught on to that too and will chew & chew
before bringing it to me and barking for help.........

Carol & Charkee ( The weak jawed Peke, you wouldn't know it when he
tear into chicken)

--- In rsawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Marguerite <semitruestory@...>
wrote:

My Golden and Yorkie are doing well, but my cocker wont eat
chicken or pork, unless I hand feed it to her cut up in small pieces.

She just looks at it like she doesnt know what to do with it.
> She sees the others eating it and even gets all excited when I
> am preparing. When I was handfeeding it to her, I tried getting her
to pull on a bigger piece. Nope.

> Marguerite

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[rawfeeding] Pork spleen

From the public market I picket up pork spleen . Is there much
nourishment in it??? Also got chicken feet. My husband wont me to trim
the nail, before feeding .I don't think so,but ,i promised to ask you .
Barb

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[rawfeeding] Re: Feeding bloat dog

"Katrina" <outrageousshadowfilas@...> wrote:
>> Bottom line....there is no real answer to preventing bloat. The
deep chested breeds are prone to this horror and perhaps it is in
family lines.
>
> Do feed several small meals through out the day!!
*****
If there is no real answer to preventing bloat, why the
recommendation to feed several small meals throughout the day? There
is no logic to your recommendation. If YOU want to feed several small
meals a day for YOUR peace of mind, that's one thing. To recommend
the practice as a useful tool to prevent bloat is just blowing
smoke.

Most of what we do to prevent bloat is for our own superstitious
selves; what we might be doing is looking at genetics and vaccine
abuse but it's easier to do otherwise.

Just as you feel better when you eat 5-6 small meals, your body
processes your food better, you burn more calories, and generally
avoid that horribly feeling that you need to be taken via wheelbarrow
to the nearest sofa to recuperate. ha ha ha
*****
Ha ha ha, we are not talking about human health here, we are
discussing dogs. There is no evidence that eating multiple small
meals is beneficial to a dog and certainly there is significant
evidence that their digestive systems are fulling capable of
processing not only large meals but also large, infrequent meals.

Your references to human digestion are absurd.
Chris O

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Re: [rawfeeding] Fish oil Capsule

Hi,Anna.

>I remember you being so worried about feeding raw, I'm glad you decided the switch was >the right thing to do!

Well,I guess I must have made quite impression to you then in this list if you remember how I was..

Well,first of all, my dog Palette is my first dog ever I ever have in my life.

So, my first culture shock being ..dog eat just 2 times a day or even 1 times a day while we human eat 3 meals.

And then, I used to the idea of kibble being dog food and, I read about raw feeding in magazine and I thought "Hmm, make sense to feed meat with no preservative etc" I admit I thought veggie is must feed stuff because the way I see veggies from human eye is like veggie have nutritious value too. I did not buy idea of giving my dog bunch of unnnecessary vitamin or supplements though.

After reading magazine about waht rawfeeding is, and what to feed,how you feed,how much you feed,and I read anatomy stuff talking about difference between teeth of dog and teeth of human and difference of intestine in dog and human etc.That made more sense about why what I think has nutrition value is not what dog get benefit from eating them. I read a lot about it.Those also helped me understand why dog does not get sick from eating raw and why cooked bones are no no and raw bones are good .Very interesting too.

Basically, those knowledge helped me a lot more to understand .

Personally, I am not type of jumping in to new stuff right away,I am more like know ahead and know the basic first and go type.

So, while I understanding the concept of rawfeeding and how it works, I spent about a month reading posts and asking questions about what I did not understand.

I think I drove some people crazy I think:-> Sorry..

As a first timer,I needed to know the standing point and wanted to have the assurence because all responsibility of nutrition is on me for palette,so,I think I was part nervous as well.

After a month, I think it was like old story but,there are still lots to learn here.I think people here are great. I appreciate you all.

But I also think that it really helped me alot to know not only about diet detail but also knowing what to do if your dog gets runny stool or diarrhea or vomitting etc.. before start the diet change.

My husband's co-worker got interested in the topic about vaccine and this way of feeding so, maybe,his hound dog will have better life like palette too.

yassy

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[rawfeeding] How to feed steaks?

I bought my pup a pork steak or meat of some kind. It was only meat no
bone. I fed it to her whole and she barely chewed it. Actually I think
she had trouble eating it by chewing so she just gobbled it up.

Should we cut the boneless meat in chunks to facilitate better
digestion or ease of chewing?

I understand the chewing is important and when the meat comes in a hunk
with bone is seems easier for them to eat slow.

The brings another question. What do you do when you have a big pork
roast? Do you give it to them and let them eat some and take it away? I
took away my pups bone once and since then she kind of worries that I
will take it away.

Any help would be appreciated. You are all so kind and give great
advice. Thanks so much.

Pauline

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Re: [rawfeeding] Question about fish oil caps

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: PLEASE TRIM YOUR MESSAGES.***

ArcticPure sells a DHA pills I take that are from arctic fish only. They are high in omega-3 and the only ones she wants me to use for the same reason, it is purer in the arctic waters. You can google a source, I don't remember where on the internet we picked up ours, but we get cases at a time. We also have a greyhound that it using it besides myself.
Kathleen

"Dr. Holly Priestley" <hpriestley5@comcast.net> wrote:
Please forgive the cross posting.

I have been advised, by the latest internalist, to start Rufus (5-yo
male greyhound) on fish oil. Rufus has PLN and last Sept had
pancreatitis so we are really careful of the fats and oils he takes.

The fish oil must be body oil from deep, cold water fish. Can anyone
suggest a brand? I've looked at the new Bayer Omega pills and have a
$5 off coupon for it. I do not eat fish and am a vegetarian so the
request is even more difficult for me.

The internalist promised that he would e-mail me the brand that he
personally uses from Whole Foods - but that e-mail has not arrived
yet and I will have to call and ask next week -- just wondering what
other people use.

Thanks
Holly

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[rawfeeding] Re: Hi...I'm New Too

"marguerite foster" <margueritfoster@...> wrote:

> Are there diet considerations that apply to mature to senior dogs
to
> help with and prevent joint inflamation and pain (and just plain
> arthritis)? I take glucosamine and anti-oxidents which help
> me...what about that for dogs?
*****
Your dogs are not seniors except in the mind of the dogfood
industry. It is to their advantage (and to vets, often) to call them
old so that they can get special "old" care. You should be feeding
them a species appropriate diet, same as always. You can feed less
bone (most people can feed less bone, period), and the dietary bone
they do get can be easier if that seems to help them maintain good
condition, if they need help. I would not recommend making changes
unless/until you see cause.

What prevents joint inflammation is a good diet in a healthy
lifestyle, and genetics. Probably a seven year old dog should not do
high jumps (although my UD golden finished his title at seven years
with nary a hitch in his gitalong); probably some dogs should never
do high jumps. I think a menu that includes naturally occuring
glucosamine from cartilage is basic, but supplemental glucosamine is
not. I do not see the need for supplemental antioxidants, if you do,
feed them.

I've pretty much decided that, as long as supplements do not impact
the effectiveness of a good raw diet OR act suppressively on disease,
whatever supps one wants to feed is just not my concern. So use
whatever you feel, after appropriate research, is necessary.

They are off topic for the rawfeeding list anyway, by and large.
Certainly medical care (traditional or alternative) would be better
discussed on RawChat or DogHealth.

> Finally, the age old question: my dogs eat grass. Not quite
grazing,
> but significant amounts. I know that wolves do not eat stomach
> contents, so what does this behavior indicate nutritionally?
*****
Who knows.
If you are feeding a good raw diet and they choose to eat grass to
add what's missing (assuming something is, which would almost
certainly be a premature conclusion), then they are effectively
dealing with the deficit and you should be pleased that they are.
You don't need to take grass-eating as a personal affront. You may
or may not be doing something "wrong" but the dogs are taking care
it. Done and done.

> don't gag or vomit when they eat it and I'm inclined to just let
> them be, except I worry about leptosporosis.
*****
Why? Where is this grass they eat? In an flooded cow pasture or a
swamp or other low-lying areas likely to accumulate urine? Or in
your yard? What wild animals visit your yard? Standing water is
more usually implicated in lepto than grass, no?

>I promise I'll trim from now on.
*****
Your post is fine. You included no old post since your message was
new; lengthy old posts are what need to be trimmed from one's reply.
New messages should be as long as they need to be to say what one
needs to say.
Chris O

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[rawfeeding] Re: Dark Red tongue/Laurie

Thanks Laurie........

I called the vet about this and someone said that as long as the gums
were pink it was fine. She is probably hot...it has been hot here.

Don't know........I wish the vets were more inclined to feed raw, then
we would have more research and understanding into the health of a raw
fed dog!

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Re: [rawfeeding] Whiting

Hi,Michael. Did you ask Fish counter guy if you can get whole fish??

When I went to grocery store and saw headless gutless fish,I asked him about it.

He said if I call Wednesday moring from 9am to 12pm asking for store manager and talk to him about it,then,he could reserve the fish as whole. That store I went was Giant.

So,why not asking your fish guy if he could reserve fish as it is (whole) for you?

If I were you,I will feed headless gutless fish too.I have read somewhere head has Vitamin A and some other good nutrition (I do not know about guts),but it is not like you must have head to feed fish I think. so,when you find head attached fish,you could feed as is and if not, headless maybe fine. That is how i understand because rawfeeding is not set in stone rule stuff and all nutrition is over the time thing so...

Good luck!

yassy
============
>I finally found some fish today, but they had the heads and guts removed.

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[rawfeeding] Re: yucky smell after organ meats

Please change the subject line when you change the topic, and please
remember to trim from your post the old stuff that is no longer
relevant. Thanks.

Marguerite <semitruestory@...> wrote:
>
> Speaking of liver.....I have been only doing this a week and got
some liver
> and froze it in ice trays and thought I would try some tomorrow.
Are the
> ice tray sized liver pieces too large for a 7 #'er? How much
should I give
> each dog for the first time? (78#, 25 # and 7 #). The 78#'er has
been a
> kittke constipated so I think now is the time to introduce liver?
Thanks
> for your help.

*****
Give the little dog a nickel-size piece, give the 25# dog a quarter-
size piece and give the big dog two quarter-size pieces. Since this
is their first go at liver, make it an easy one.

If the big dog is constipated, don't try to "fix" it one one grand
gesture. Back off some on the bones (probably you are feeding too
much bone) and give him a bit of liver in each meal. If you get
carried away, he'll go directly from constipated to loose stool with
no stopping in between.
Chris O

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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: where do you feed your dogs-esp. more than one dog

Hi. I have just one dog,but I feed inside the kitchen. What I do is spread the Vynile shower curtain on kitchen floor and put the Xpen staight to devide living room and kitchen area,and then,I put food in bowl like organ or Egg something slimy/runny and let my dog sit and wait.

I place the bowl and she start eating when I say "ok".

I used to use vyline table cloth but when I washed,it got tore a bit.So,I came up to shower curtain idea.It IS maybe expensive than towel but she gets more room to place meat around (70"x72" I think),and meat juice will not soak in because water proof and it is durable and I can wash zillions of times.So, I decided to use one as her mat. My husband was making face when I got this idea and explained it to him,but it does work for me and my dog at least.I know many people use towel though.

I wipe this shower curtain with 50%water 50% vinegar after she finish licking the curtain and walk out from the place.

I wash this curtain every week.

yassy

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[rawfeeding] New to Raw Feeding and have questions

Hello everyone!
I switched my two German Shepherds cold turkey to raw food. I have been feeding chicken
leg quarters to start out. The one shepherd seems to be doing alright, but the other one
has really bad gas the kind that burns your nose and you have to open all the windows in
the house or you would pass out. Her stools are like little rocks and then the next time
very soft and runny. Is this normal?
Thank you
Angie

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Re: [rawfeeding] Re: Fish oil Capsule

Hi,Laurie. Thanks. After giving her Fish oil Capsole with meal,her poop got little softer.Well,it has shape,solid first come and very end of the poop is wet and soft.

So,I do not want to introduce new meat kinds to her now her being that poop,so,I think I will keep her on Turkey some more days.

I now don't have to snip the tip off of the Fish oil Capsole but,she still does this try to bite capsule with front teeth and work like mice. It is her thing maybe but it really strange!

yassy
===========
>That's cute, Yassy. I'm so glad things are going well!

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Re: [rawfeeding] Question about fish oil caps

Carlson or Nordic Naturals are the best so I have heard. I found Carlson at
a local health food store.
Marguerite

<:
>
> Please forgive the cross posting.
>
> I have been advised, by the latest internalist, to start Rufus (5-yo
> male greyhound) on fish oil. Rufus has PLN and last Sept had
> pancreatitis so we are really careful of the fats and oils he takes.
>
> The fish oil must be body oil from deep, cold water fish. Can anyone
> suggest a brand? I've looked at the new Bayer Omega pills and have a
> $5 off coupon for it. I do not eat fish and am a vegetarian so the
> request is even more difficult for me.
>
> The internalist promised that he would e-mail me the brand that he
> personally uses from Whole Foods - but that e-mail has not arrived
> yet and I will have to call and ask next week -- just wondering what
> other people use.
>
> Thanks
> Holly
>
>
>

--
Marguerite
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Marley- GR, Lucy-Cocker,
Liza-Yorkie,SmellyCat-PersianPolydactyl
Punkin- Pacific Parrotlet

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[rawfeeding] Re: Hi...I'm New Too

Welcome, Marguerite, I'm sure you'll learn a lot from this group.

> The feeding guidelines I've been using choose foods based on
> TCM 5 element theory. Is anyone else familiar with this technique?
> It does not contradict prey model raw feeding, but limits certain
> foods that would cause imbalances.

Unfortunately, I don't know anything about this theory, what kind of foods would it
restrict? I've heard that some theories require a restriction on red meat or a certain organ
etc. I would shy away from anything that required feeding too far from what a wolf would
eat in nature (i.e. - no red meats). Let us know what kind of restrictions you would have
and we'll tell you what we think. (=

> I do worry about fleas and ticks and there are some who believe that
> adding garlic, brewers yeast and lecithin create an inhospitible
> environment in the blood that deters insects. How do folks in
> the "raw community" ;-) feel about that? Are there suggested
> alternatives?

For fleas, ticks, and the like, the goal is just to get the dog as healthy as possible so they
can fend them off themselves. Honestly, I didn't believe it much when I started raw
feeding, I kept thinking just because my dog is healthy doesn't mean a flea won't land on
him. Sure the flea might land on him, but parasites would rather have an unhealthy host.
A few months ago, I had a friend stay with us who had a ki**lefed dog. That dog was
always covered in fleas, but mine was fine. I would find one flea here and there, but it
never became a problem. In the event that fleas do become a problem, I opt for using
food grade DE on them.

> I take glucosamine and anti-oxidents which help me...what about that for dogs?

Glucosamine is in cartilage, so every time you feed a part with joints, you are giving
glucosamine. Some people add in extra pig's feet or chicken feet for good measure.

> Finally, the age old question: my dogs eat grass. Not quite grazing,
> but significant amounts. I know that wolves do not eat stomach
> contents, so what does this behavior indicate nutritionally?

This is a tough one. I don't think anyone can give a definitive answer. Mine only graze
when they have an upset stomach. That being said, when we go to visit my parents they
always partake in the grass. Maybe you and my parents just have yummy grass.

Andrea

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Re: [rawfeeding] liver

Can someone tell me how much liver is appropriate for introducing to
> liver??
>

My dogs have had chicken for a week , now getting pork. They weigh 7#, 25#
> and 78#. I froze some chicken livers in ice trays. Can I give them
> frozen ?
>

Thanks.

>
>

--
Marguerite
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Marley- GR, Lucy-Cocker,
Liza-Yorkie,SmellyCat-PersianPolydactyl
Punkin- Pacific Parrotlet

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[rawfeeding] Cocker wont eat raw

for some reason this didnt go thru so I will post it again.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Marguerite <semitruestory@gmail.com>
Date: Jun 15, 2007 10:55 PM
Subject: Cocker wont eat raw
To: rawfeeding@yahoogrops.com

I have had my dogs on raw for over a week and have been reading here for
over a month. My Golden and Yorkie are doing well, but my cocker wont eat
chicken or pork, unless I hand feed it to her cut up in small pieces. I
have tried breast with bone in, thighs, quarters and pork chops. She just
licks it. I have tried it at room temperature, grilled a little with
parmesean. What should I try now? I have been leaving k***le down for her
but today I took it up and she didnt have anything for 24 hrs. Still wouldnt
eat it. She just looks at it like she doesnt know what to do with it.
She sees the others eating it and even gets all excited when I
am preparing. When I was handfeeding it to her, I tried getting her to
pull on a bigger piece. Nope. She is 4 yrs old and doesnt have dental
problems , is not overweight. She does have some flea allergies and ear
infections at times. She is the main one I wanted to switch to raw. I'm
getting discouraged. I appreciate any help anyone can offer.
Marguerite

--
Marguerite
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Marley- GR, Lucy-Cocker,
Liza-Yorkie,SmellyCat-PersianPolydactyl
Punkin- Pacific Parrotlet

--

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[rawfeeding] Re: liver

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Caren OConnor <cavkist@...> wrote:
>
> Rabia -
> Ah, liver. One must be careful about doling out too much organ
meat. I've found that to be a certainty for dark, loose stools if
given in excess.
> With my rawfed crew, I'm acutely aware of their poos, which tell
me if I'm out of balance with 80/10/10. Guess that's 'cause I'm
still learning at this. Too bad I'm having to learn with dogs who
carry as much hair on their rears as I have on my head. Luv 'em but
what was I thinking????
> Caren
>
>CAren,
What do you mean with 80/10/10 ????
> Tammy (new to all of this...
>
> ---------------------------------
> Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from
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> Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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[rawfeeding] Re: do chipmunks count? from Newbie

Lynne wrote:

> Today, instead of chipmunk, my pup was served a young rabbit. Guess this throws my intake-control into the trash-heap, but my dog has eaten weird stuff from day one: bamboo, dog poop, weeds of all sorts. I think he's been trying to make up for something his body craved that wasn't in k***e. Now he's happy as can be. We'll see how his stomach handles all that fur. Can hardly be worse than bamboo, though. Bamboo poop is a sight to behold. And long-lasting, lol.

One of these days . . . I swear I'm going to build a poop page. It'll be
structured like a FAQ, so you can click on a category and it'll take you to a
couple of photos with captions, and try to answer some of the questions
posted here like . . .

Can I feed an entire meal of liver?
My dog ate 200 fish oil capsules . . .
He has mucousy stool . . .
How do you know you're feeding too much bone?
My dog ate bamboo . . .

Lora
Evanston, IL

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[rawfeeding] Re: Major chewing out

1a. Re: I just got a major chewing out my my vet

I would just love to see that study. I wonder if they've done any
recent studies on Science Diet? Boy, don't even get me going. Cindy

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Re: [rawfeeding] Digest Number 11665 - DIner vs. Snarfer

I am a newbie here, but I think the answer to your diner vs. snarfer is simpler than you might think. I feed mine in their crates. It's a simple clean up too. Just wipe out the crate when they are done with a clorox wipe.

As a fringe benefit, they always LOVE going into their crates!

Barri

5a. Re: where do you feed your dogs-esp. more than one dog
Posted by: "marguerite foster" margueritfoster@snet.net emmasarkangel
Date: Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:41 am ((PDT))

> > I am very new to raw feeding-about two weeks. I attempted to
search archives to see if there was any discussion on location to
feed.

Barri, Cpl. Seven & Recruit Frodo

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Cpl. "T" guarding The Bridge with Cpls. Brown Dog & Race

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[rawfeeding] Update on our one month progress on a raw diet

Hello everyone. This post is sort of long but it's because we are so happy with the results we are seeing with our dogs. We have two English Bulldogs, a female and male, and they weigh 56 and 58 pounds, in that order. We have had them on a raw diet for approximately one month and the changes we have noticed have been remarkable. Their coats are so much softer. It reminds us of puppy fur. It is much more luxurious to the touch. We want to pet and rub and massage them even more now and somehow they don't object to it at all. It amounts to extra attention and what dog doesn't like that? We've also noticed that they are much happier and more playful. They play tug-of-war with each other, something they didn't do in the past. They appear to have a lot more energy. They used to sleep all the time and we thought that's what bulldogs do. Five minutes of activity and it was nap time. Now, they want to go for walkies. Our male has hip dysplasia. It was always painful for him to go
for a walk. He would walk very slowly and deliberately. After a short distance, maybe 50 yards or so, we come back home and it's time for a nap. We really don't know, nor can we appreciate the amount of pain he was in just to do that small amount of activity. He also had a cyst on his inner thigh that would grow and the vet would have to drain it almost monthly. After a short romp in the doggie pool or chasing a few soap bubbles in the backyard, he was in pain and limping for a day. Our hearts went out to him, but you have to allow him to be a dog and do doggie stuff, right? We didn't feel we were being cruel but we still felt responsible for his pain. Well, no more of that. Now, he walks better and faster. The cyst has disappeared completely. Needless to say, we are so pleased thus far and we are very grateful to learn about this diet. And we thank all of you who post here because we are learning so much good information from all of you. We are continuing to read and
absorb and learn more every day and we just wanted to express our joy with the amazing results we've experienced. We apologize if you have to convert our "yards" to meters and "pounds" to kilograms. All of you out there please have an excellent day.

Bill (Sue's husband), Florida, USA

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[rawfeeding] liver

Rabia -
Ah, liver. One must be careful about doling out too much organ meat. I've found that to be a certainty for dark, loose stools if given in excess.
With my rawfed crew, I'm acutely aware of their poos, which tell me if I'm out of balance with 80/10/10. Guess that's 'cause I'm still learning at this. Too bad I'm having to learn with dogs who carry as much hair on their rears as I have on my head. Luv 'em but what was I thinking????
Caren

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[rawfeeding] Question about fish oil caps

Please forgive the cross posting.

I have been advised, by the latest internalist, to start Rufus (5-yo
male greyhound) on fish oil. Rufus has PLN and last Sept had
pancreatitis so we are really careful of the fats and oils he takes.

The fish oil must be body oil from deep, cold water fish. Can anyone
suggest a brand? I've looked at the new Bayer Omega pills and have a
$5 off coupon for it. I do not eat fish and am a vegetarian so the
request is even more difficult for me.

The internalist promised that he would e-mail me the brand that he
personally uses from Whole Foods - but that e-mail has not arrived
yet and I will have to call and ask next week -- just wondering what
other people use.

Thanks
Holly

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Re: [rawfeeding] Feeding bloat dog

Concerning bloat....

Having worked with vets I have to note that there is nothing that has been proven to work to prevent bloat. The latest line of thought is that it might have some genetic markers and be in certain breed lines.

The basis for not feeding large meals is that the dog will not distend their stomach abnormally and thus prevent bloat. I can say for a fact that this is a misnomer as I am blessed to stay at home and feed my dogs 3 - 4 meals a day depending on weather. I woke up one morning to find my precious boy had bloated 15 minutes before I woke and had already died.

I feed elevated bowls, tons of fresh clean water, no exercise 2 hours after feeding, 3-4 meals a day etc....

Bottom line....there is no real answer to preventing bloat. The deep chested breeds are prone to this horror and perhaps it is in family lines.

Do feed several small meals through out the day!! Just as you feel better when you eat 5-6 small meals, your body processes your food better, you burn more calories, and generally avoid that horribly feeling that you need to be taken via wheelbarrow to the nearest sofa to recuperate. ha ha ha

Just please know that it isn't a cure, nor preventative. Just good feeding practice if practical for your lifestyle.

Katrina Waldrip
Outrageous Shadow Filas
www.outrageousshadowfilas.com
All we need can be found in a person, His name is Jesus.

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