[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12268
There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1a. Re: New to raw - made mistakes - need help
From: Cindy Wells
1b. Re: New to raw - made mistakes - need help
From: Giselle
2a. Organic or Non Organic
From: Ivette Casiano
2b. Re: Organic or Non Organic
From: carnesbill
2c. Re: Organic or Non Organic
From: jennifer_hell
2d. Re: Organic or Non Organic
From: MORGAN LEWIS
2e. Re: Organic or Non Organic
From: Greta Hill
2f. Re: Organic or Non Organic
From: cmhausrath
3a. High BUN and raw meat?
From: Dawn Ruhl
3b. High BUN and raw meat?
From: carnesbill
3c. Re: High BUN and raw meat?
From: Sandee Lee
3d. Re: High BUN and raw meat?
From: Doguefan@aol.com
4a. Re: Newbie with questions-
From: Laurie Davis
4b. Re: Newbie with questions-
From: Laurie Davis
5a. Re: weight gain and rawfeeding
From: blue eyed
6a. Feeding frozen meat
From: blue eyed
6b. Re: Feeding frozen meat
From: MORGAN LEWIS
7a. Re: oh, I forgot.....
From: Laurie Davis
8a. rabbit meat
From: lrosem3
9a. Re: Feeding frozen meat/gulping
From: Laurie Swanson
10a. How many times a day do you think adults dogs should eat?
From: Kathy Roop
10b. Re: How many times a day do you think adults dogs should eat?
From: Giselle
11a. Re: deer chest carcus
From: Maria
12a. Re: first time feeding a puppy Raw
From: barrettsmadison
12b. Re: first time feeding a puppy Raw
From: Giselle
Messages
________________________________________________________________________
1a. Re: New to raw - made mistakes - need help
Posted by: "Cindy Wells" cwells5@charter.net cwnsc
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:45 am ((PST))
I wanted to thank everyone for their suggestions. I opted for the
pumpkin and it worked great. Sam continues on skinned chicken.
Introduction of beef caused loose stools again. Is this normal and
somethig his digestive system needs to acclimate too or should I mix a
small amount of beef with the chicken.
Thanks
Cindy
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "cwnsc" <cwells5@...> wrote:
>
> Hi!
>
> My 3 yr old GR has been on raw 8 days. 1st day was chicken but
> introduced variety of foods daily during the week and gave him liver
> Wednesday. I realize my mistake and both us are paying the
> consequences. I saw other posts of giving only chicken the 1st 2
> weeks and not introduce organs for 2 months. Any idea how long it
will
> take his tummy to settle down. The diarrhea is bad. He has had
only
> chicken the last 4 days with no skin and fat removed.
>
> Thanks
> Cindy
>
Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________
1b. Re: New to raw - made mistakes - need help
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 6:49 pm ((PST))
Hi, Cindy!
YQW! ^_^
Some dogs have an easier time switching to raw than others. *shrug* Who
knows why, individual differences, but thats just one of the reasons why
prey model raw is best. "Tweaking" the protein variety, amount of fat,
organs, and 'other' bits as you progress is easy, and can be done for each
dog on an 'as needed' basis, whenever necessary.
If Sam has trouble adjusting to beef, just continue with chicken until he
tells you that he is acclimated - trim less fat, less skin, until his stools
are good. What kind of beef are you using? You may want to add some other
protein than beef next, turkey, pork, rabbit, etc. But whatever protein you
add next, just start with bits of it added to his chicken meal, and
gradually increase that amount while you decrease the chicken amount. GO
SLOW, you will have the rest of his long life to add variety and feed raw. ;
)
Loose stool is NOT necessarily bad - Kibble produces the SAME stools, time
after time, because it never varies, and has additives to artificially
tighten poops. Raw fed dog's stools vary with what they are fed. What goes
in directly affects and reflects what comes out. Its not wrong or bad for
the dog, just different.
Adding pumpkin is NOT generally an accepted solution on this list. It can
tighten poops, but again, its like putting additives into Kibble, an
artificial way to tighten poops. Adjusting the amount you feed at a meal,
the bone, the fat, the skin, and introducing new proteins incrementally is a
much better plan. And, using Slippery Elm Bark Powder will not tighten loose
poops. It WILL soothe any irritation or digestive upset a dog has when
introduced to new proteins, and reckless feeding. Every dog is different, it
takes as long as it takes.
Did you check the labels on the chicken you've bought for salt solutions or
enhancements?
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey
On Nov 11, 2007 11:13 AM, Cindy Wells <cwells5@charter.net> wrote:
> I wanted to thank everyone for their suggestions. I opted for the
> pumpkin and it worked great. Sam continues on skinned chicken.
> Introduction of beef caused loose stools again. Is this normal and
> something his digestive system needs to acclimate too or should I mix a
> small amount of beef with the chicken.
>
> Thanks
> Cindy
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Messages in this topic (11)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
2a. Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "Ivette Casiano" ivettecasiano@yahoo.com ivettecasiano
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:45 am ((PST))
<<Are others feeding organic only? Thoughts? Comments?
Ellen & Bailey>>
I really wish I could but we live in South FL and things are eye poppingly expensive here. You can't get organic chicken for anything less than $4.00 lb. and It's packaged and in the supermarket so who knows. I just can't afford it.
Ivette Casiano
"Live for today, plan for tomorrow"
__________________________________________________
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Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
2b. Re: Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:51 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "elkilpat" <elkilpat@...> wrote:
>
> Antibiotics, growth hormones, meat by-products are all added
> to the feed given to chickens, beef, pork as well as other
> mass raised animals.
As far as chickens go, that is absoulutely wrong. It is illegal to
feed growth hormones or any other hormones to chickens for human
consumption. Antibiotics are given when there is an outbreak of
something in the chicken house and no other time. It is way too
expensive to give "just in case". It is illegal to advertise your
chickens as "hormone free" as that implies that your chickens are
different from all the others and that just isn't so. They are ALL
hormone free and steriod free.
Beef cattle are raised most of their life in pastures and are grass
fed. Often the grass is supplemented with hey in the winter because
of a shortage of grass in the pasture. They are treated for worms
and other parasites once a year. They are not given hormones or
antibiotics (unless sick) or steriods while living at the farm. I
don't know what they are given in the feed lot but they spend a
small fraction of their lives in feed lots.
> Some so called organic producers do not follow the
> true "organic" way of raising their animals, so it can
> be difficult to know what you are getting no matter what.
Thats true. Something like 98% of them. The USDA has rules as to
what is necessary to call something "organic". It's not difficult
to find those rules. They are pretty broad.
> Luckily I have a chicken producer nearby who does feed organic
> (medication free) and I can get a good and inexpensive supply of
> chicken backs, feet, liver, hearts, turkey necks.
You can stop at most any chicken producer in the US and get exactly
the same thing. Most producers won't deal with the pubilc. They
only deal with the slauter houses because the small volume just
isn't worth the time and effort. Volume producers won't even have
chicken parts around. They deal in whole chicken by the tractor-
trailer load.
> I
> don't worry about it for us humans cause we don't eat the bones...
> Are others feeding organic only? Thoughts? Comments?
You don't worry about those chemicals leaching from the bone into
the meat in the cooking process?
Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm
Feeding Raw since October 2002
"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale
Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
2c. Re: Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "jennifer_hell" jenniferhell@web.de jennifer_hell
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:43 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "carnesbill" <carnesw@...> wrote:
>
I
> don't know what they are given in the feed lot but they spend a
> small fraction of their lives in feed lots.
They are grain fed during those last months, destroying all the nice
work grass feeding had done before (raising the Omega-6 level, for
example).
I know you don't care on how chicken are kept on chicken farms, so I
won't get into that. However, there's some good info out there on the
preferability of chicken raised and fed in a more natural way.
Jennifer
Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
2d. Re: Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "MORGAN LEWIS" shadowland22000@yahoo.com shadowland22000
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:50 pm ((PST))
INTERESTING!!
I have a package of Chicken thighs in front of me and I quote:
"No Artificial Ingrediants, Minimally processed, No added hormones, No added Steroids, up to 12% chicken broth. Morgan Band "Pilgrims Pride. On the back of the package it does state Federal Regulations prohibit the use of artificial stimulents or hormones in Poultry. Morgan
carnesbill <carnesw@bellsouth.net> wrote:
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "elkilpat" <elkilpat@...> wrote:
>
> Antibiotics, growth hormones, meat by-products are all added
> to the feed given to chickens, beef, pork as well as other
> mass raised animals.
As far as chickens go, that is absoulutely wrong. It is illegal to
feed growth hormones or any other hormones to chickens for human
consumption. Antibiotics are given when there is an outbreak of
something in the chicken house and no other time. It is way too
expensive to give "just in case". It is illegal to advertise your
chickens as "hormone free" as that implies that your chickens are
different from all the others and that just isn't so. They are ALL
hormone free and steriod free.
Beef cattle are raised most of their life in pastures and are grass
fed. Often the grass is supplemented with hey in the winter because
of a shortage of grass in the pasture. They are treated for worms
and other parasites once a year. They are not given hormones or
antibiotics (unless sick) or steriods while living at the farm. I
don't know what they are given in the feed lot but they spend a
small fraction of their lives in feed lots.
> Some so called organic producers do not follow the
> true "organic" way of raising their animals, so it can
> be difficult to know what you are getting no matter what.
Thats true. Something like 98% of them. The USDA has rules as to
what is necessary to call something "organic". It's not difficult
to find those rules. They are pretty broad.
> Luckily I have a chicken producer nearby who does feed organic
> (medication free) and I can get a good and inexpensive supply of
> chicken backs, feet, liver, hearts, turkey necks.
You can stop at most any chicken producer in the US and get exactly
the same thing. Most producers won't deal with the pubilc. They
only deal with the slauter houses because the small volume just
isn't worth the time and effort. Volume producers won't even have
chicken parts around. They deal in whole chicken by the tractor-
trailer load.
> I
> don't worry about it for us humans cause we don't eat the bones...
> Are others feeding organic only? Thoughts? Comments?
You don't worry about those chemicals leaching from the bone into
the meat in the cooking process?
Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm
Feeding Raw since October 2002
"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale
Morgan and His Angels
Precious, OFA
Princess, CGC, TDI, GSDCA Health Award
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
2e. Re: Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "Greta Hill" GretaHill@aol.com sunstate23
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:16 pm ((PST))
Hold on there - it says Minimally Processed AND has 12% chicken broth
in it? That's very misleading. I better double check all the fine print
on the labels.
Thanks for the heads up.
Greta
<<I have a package of Chicken thighs in front of me and I quote:
"No Artificial Ingrediants, Minimally processed, No added hormones, No
added Steroids, up to 12% chicken broth. Morgan Band "Pilgrims Pride.
On the back of the package it does state Federal Regulations prohibit
the use of artificial stimulents or hormones in Poultry. Morgan>>
Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
2f. Re: Organic or Non Organic
Posted by: "cmhausrath" cmhausrath@yahoo.com cmhausrath
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:54 pm ((PST))
"Greta Hill" <GretaHill@...> wrote:
> Hold on there - it says Minimally Processed AND has 12% chicken broth
> in it? That's very misleading.
I've seen this before as well -- and the "minimally processed" is in
bigger type than the "enhanced with up to xx% of a solution ..." bit.
So read EVERYTHING on the label before you bring it home!
-- sandy & griffin
Messages in this topic (8)
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________________________________________________________________________
3a. High BUN and raw meat?
Posted by: "Dawn Ruhl" Dawnofthedanes@mac.com dawnofthedanes
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:51 am ((PST))
OKAY.... took two darn days to finally get this together. Tried sending it 2 different ways,
then I was told to not put the entire article up because it was too long... <G>
so here is only the impertinent info needed for the dog in question...
Higher packed cell volume (hematocrit) in all raw diet fed groups (range of 51.0 ± 6.6–
53.5 ± 5.6 %) versus cereal-based kibble (47.6 ± 6.1%).
Higher blood urea nitrogen (BUN) in all raw diet fed groups (range of 18.8 ± 6.9–22.0 ±
8.7 mg/dL) versus cereal-based kibble (15.5 ± 4.7 mg/dL).
Higher serum creatinine in the Volhard raw diet group only (1.20 ± 0.34 mg/dL) versus
cereal-based kibble (1.07 ± 0.28 mg/dL).
The link doesn't work to the site from my Mac, so if anyone is interested in the whole
article, please feel free to email me privately and I will send it to you.
at dawnofthedanes@mac.com
Dawn
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Dawn Ruhl <Dawnofthedanes@...> wrote:
>
>
> Feeding a raw diet can raise some different levels when doing blood
> work.
> Feeding raw will obviously make the levels more like a wolves' or a
> coyote's.
> I obviously have major CRS because I am half asleep, and it is late....
> so I can't remember the difference right now. Can't remember if it is
> the BUN or the creatine levels. Will check tomorrow.... promise!
> Raw meat protein is a lot less than people think... ground beef is only
> 25%... which is even safe for a Giant Breed Puppy, and the levels are to
> be kept low for them.
>
> For kidney problems.... Nettle leaf and seed extract has managed to save
> a few dogs from the commercial dog food poisoning that occurred earlier
> this past year.
>
>
> ~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~
>
> High BUN and raw meat?
> Posted by: "rosey031801" rosey031801@... rosey031801
> Fri Nov 9, 2007 4:17 pm (PST)
>
> I have a client that started feeding her 12 year old standard poodle
> raw a while back. She is doing great! She had her spleen removed 5
> years ago. She now has a high BUN. Of course the vet says the meat is
> too high of protien and she should eat his KD canned food. Do any of
> you have some experience with this. I would like to see some info from
> the experts (you). If it was my dog I wouldn't buy it, but she thinks
> she is doing what she has to do. Any advice other than the obvious?
> Cheryl
>
> ~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~
>
>
> Be Blessed,
> ~;*;~ Dawn ~;*;~
> I prefer to live my life as if there is a God, and die to find out there
> isn't, than live my life as if there isn't, and die to find out there
> is.
> http://www.dawnofthedanes.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Messages in this topic (7)
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3b. High BUN and raw meat?
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:42 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Dawn Ruhl" <Dawnofthedanes@...>
wrote:
>
> OKAY.... took two darn days to finally get this together. Tried
sending it 2 different ways,
> then I was told to not put the entire article up because it was
too long... <G>
> so here is only the impertinent info needed for the dog in
question...
Thats interesting because the couple of times the vet got the levels
on my raw fed dogs, he said there was nothing unusual about the
levels. I particularly asked him about BUN etc and both times he
said they were in the normal range.
Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm
Feeding Raw since October 2002
"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale
Messages in this topic (7)
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3c. Re: High BUN and raw meat?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 4:08 pm ((PST))
Here is the study.....
http://www.antechdiagnostics.com/clients/antechNews/2003/jun03_02.htm
The first part of that article is so full of misinformation, it's not funny.
Then this statement in the raw food study section...
"While a more detailed analysis has yet to be completed, these results
indicate that dogs fed raw meats (natural carnivores) have higher red blood
cell and blood urea nitrogen levels than dogs fed cereal-based food
(obligate omnivores)."
HUH???????? Since when does a dog change from carnivore to omnivore based
on diet? What a bunch of nonsense.
I really think most elevation in BUN is due to not fasting, stress,
dehydration, etc. I've never had any abnormal values and I know that many
on this list have not.
It's interesting the study was based on dogs who ate BARF (whatever that
is?), Volhard (hardly an appropriate raw diet and is full of grains) and
"other types of custom or commercial raw diets". Not much consistency, eh?
Sandee & the Dane Gang
From: "carnesbill" <carnesw@bellsouth.net>
Thats interesting because the couple of times the vet got the levels
on my raw fed dogs, he said there was nothing unusual about the
levels. I particularly asked him about BUN etc and both times he
said they were in the normal range.
Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
3d. Re: High BUN and raw meat?
Posted by: "Doguefan@aol.com" Doguefan@aol.com knoxkennels
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:17 pm ((PST))
another interesting note-I just had a prenatal work up done on my french mastiff female that has now been bred.? She did not take her last season and I did everything under the sun-she was on thyroid(had a low/normal)she was bred surgically and given antibiotics from the start to cover any infection.? Nothing...
This time(now I have a great male who I was able to use at will, becase I owne him)she has been raw fed since the last season; and her blood results were GREAT!? Her thyroid looks good and all other levels to.? She bred naturally for three days, and she is in her third week and showing signs that she miught be pg! (Really pink nipples, and a swollen vuvla-as well as some clear discharge).
It figures, in general if you leave nature well enough alone, things will happen as they should.? Took me a while, but I am getting it now!? Ha Ha Ha!
Chelsea and 4 very spoiled Dogues(especially Rolex who had to put up with two females in season at the same time and never missed a meal so he still looked awsome at his show!)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 4:09 pm
Subject: Re: [rawfeeding] Re:High BUN and raw meat?
Here is the study.....
http://www.antechdiagnostics.com/clients/antechNews/2003/jun03_02.htm
The first part of that article is so full of misinformation, it's not funny.
Then this statement in the raw food study section...
"While a more detailed analysis has yet to be completed, these results
indicate that dogs fed raw meats (natural carnivores) have higher red blood
cell and blood urea nitrogen levels than dogs fed cereal-based food
(obligate omnivores)."
HUH???????? Since when does a dog change from carnivore to omnivore based
on diet? What a bunch of nonsense.
I really think most elevation in BUN is due to not fasting, stress,
dehydration, etc. I've never had any abnormal values and I know that many
on this list have not.
It's interesting the study was based on dogs who ate BARF (whatever that
is?), Volhard (hardly an appropriate raw diet and is full of grains) and
"other types of custom or commercial raw diets". Not much consistency, eh?
Sandee & the Dane Gang
From: "carnesbill" <carnesw@bellsouth.net>
Thats interesting because the couple of times the vet got the levels
on my raw fed dogs, he said there was nothing unusual about the
levels. I particularly asked him about BUN etc and both times he
said they were in the normal range.
________________________________________________________________________
Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Messages in this topic (7)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
4a. Re: Newbie with questions-
Posted by: "Laurie Davis" lauried0001@yahoo.com lauried0001
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:43 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...>
wrote:
>
> > Laurie, this is misinformation, has been since the get-go. I
don't
> know where this baloney starts but it ends here: we have JUST (and
I
> mean within the last few days) discussed how whole raw eggs sort
> themselves out quite nicely without any intervention from us. I
> recommend you browse the archives, starting with the very recent
past.
>
> These will get you started:
> 142003 Re: [rawfeeding] the myth about egg yolks
> 142002 Re: the myth about egg yolks
> 141967 Re: New raw feeder
> 131257 Re: Hello and Questions
> 130543 Re: [rawfeeding] Re: EGGS?
> 130486 Re: [rawfeeding] Re: New to Raw - Info Overload /
EGGS?
> Chris O
>
Thanks Chris- Separating eggs was just one more step that I could
definitely do without!! Sorry I didn't see those posts before-
Thanks again-
Laurie
Messages in this topic (12)
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4b. Re: Newbie with questions-
Posted by: "Laurie Davis" lauried0001@yahoo.com lauried0001
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:43 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Bumble1994@... wrote:
>
>
>> You can help a cat find out that bones are good by hammering them so
the
> tasty insides are there to temp them.
>
>
Very good- I am already hammering them to break them up to go through
my grinder- more time saving (not that I mind the effort, but did I
mention that in addition to the 4 furbabies, I have 5 nonfurbabies as
well?!? Busy, busy!!)
I think the next batch I make I will try to leave more of the bone
intact- I was so scared they might choke on one, but now I feel
encouraged!
Thanks!
Laurie
Messages in this topic (12)
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5a. Re: weight gain and rawfeeding
Posted by: "blue eyed" eyed_blue@yahoo.co.uk eyed_blue
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:43 am ((PST))
There is a book somewhere, that tells you somewhere in it the sums you need to work out how much weight your pup should put on each week but to be honest I cant remember which book it was in!! It could well be Doglopedia (wouldnt follow the feeding advice in this one anyway) or Lonsdales Work Wonders if thats any help. However, I do remember that I worked it out for my pup and sometimes he was spot on, sometimes less on, sometimes none on, sometimes more, so wouldnt worry about it anyway, he has never ate the right amount as far as his percentages go either.
I think the best way to go is to forget what breed your dog is aswell as numbers and just go by the condition he is in, ie feel but not see the ribs and see a waist...basically, know your dog. Also if he is eating a lot but getting chubby and pooping a lot, it may well be he just LIKES food, but may not necessarily NEED it. I found at one point that my pup put on a good bit of weight but then never put any on months! Not textbook but nothing wrong with him either. He is now twelve months and still darting around the place!!! Just an adolecent dog thats all, once they are old enough to give plenty excercise, you will soon see a difference in concentration etc. When he has been on raw for a while and has more variety you may well see that certain foods can affect them differently whether behaviour wise or other.
Just take it as it comes with him,
hope this helps some,
Natalie
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Messages in this topic (4)
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6a. Feeding frozen meat
Posted by: "blue eyed" eyed_blue@yahoo.co.uk eyed_blue
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:43 am ((PST))
I feed frozen meat and bones fairly often and it hasnt caused any problems so far. Feeding heart when frozen seems to stop my dog trying to swallow it whole (due to texture).
Natalie
---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (4)
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6b. Re: Feeding frozen meat
Posted by: "MORGAN LEWIS" shadowland22000@yahoo.com shadowland22000
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:50 pm ((PST))
I feed mine frozen at times, doesn't seem to be any problem, although I have heard of problems feeding ice in summer. Morgan
blue eyed <eyed_blue@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: I feed frozen meat and bones fairly often and it hasnt caused any problems so far. Feeding heart when frozen seems to stop my dog trying to swallow it whole (due to texture).
Natalie
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Morgan and His Angels
Precious, OFA
Princess, CGC, TDI, GSDCA Health Award
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
7a. Re: oh, I forgot.....
Posted by: "Laurie Davis" lauried0001@yahoo.com lauried0001
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:44 am ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "sarahfalkner" <Sarah.Falkner@...>
wrote:
>
>
Are your ferrets caged or free ranging?
They sleep in their cage at night, and I let 'em run around the house
during the day (they tend to wake my hubby at night if they are
loose, and I do fear for their safety!!)
> I know Yassy told you about Raw Cat, which is great--do you know
about the group Raw
> Paws?
I just Joined Raw Paws- it seems like I might get a lot of good
info on that list, not just about rawfeeding.
We don't go out of our way to feed insects, but we take them
> outside so they can catch them.
Ours love to catch and kill the crickets that mistakenly find their
way into the house!!!
>
> Have fun, I hope you're soon seeing entertaining sights like two
ferrets playing tug of war
> over a chicken drumstick and war-dancing the whole time.
Too funny- it would at least give my Bengal a break (she gets
somewhat bothered by Lanie and Shadow- she growls at 'em like a
wildcat!!)
>
>Laurie
Messages in this topic (12)
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8a. rabbit meat
Posted by: "lrosem3" lrosem3@yahoo.com lrosem3
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:50 pm ((PST))
just got another shipment of rabbits in,,,got them from snrabbits...nice people, decent
prices. dogs love it. glad we found out about them....Lynn
Messages in this topic (6)
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9a. Re: Feeding frozen meat/gulping
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:50 pm ((PST))
Hi Kae,
Who really knows whether dogs enjoy frozen meat or not--I imagine
it's not the most pleasant thing in the world to gnaw on a frozen
hunk, but I can't really know. I don't think it's ideal as far as
digestion goes (affects necessary bacteria, etc.), but sometimes we
need to make compromises. And it seems to be working/helping you for
now. I would just encourage you to try gradually feeding stuff less
and less frozen if your dog seems to be learning to slow down. You
may eventually find you don't need to feed frozen anymore.
You can also feed bigger, if you haven't tried. You could give him a
half or whole chicken and remove it when he's had what you want him
to have, and feed the remainder later.
And, I'm sure you know, dogs don't chew like us, so they do tend
to "wolf" to some degree, no matter what! :-)
Good luck,
Laurie
Messages in this topic (4)
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10a. How many times a day do you think adults dogs should eat?
Posted by: "Kathy Roop" naps2003@yahoo.com naps2003
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:17 pm ((PST))
It seems like our adult dogs are gaining weight, do you think I should cut the adult down to one feeding and keep the pups on two?
Thanks,
Kathy
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Messages in this topic (2)
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10b. Re: How many times a day do you think adults dogs should eat?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 7:23 pm ((PST))
Hi, Kathy!
Sounds like a great plan!
You might want to make the one meals for the adults a little bigger after a
few days also.
How old are the pups?
Tc
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey
On Nov 11, 2007 8:14 PM, Kathy Roop <naps2003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> It seems like our adult dogs are gaining weight, do you think I should
> cut the adult down to one feeding and keep the pups on two?
>
> Thanks,
> Kathy
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Messages in this topic (2)
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11a. Re: deer chest carcus
Posted by: "Maria" plava_93@yahoo.com plava_93
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 6:04 pm ((PST))
--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:
> Maria, when you relate how many ribs you feed per slab, it would be
> good to include how big your dogs are. Best to let us know, so that
we can plan accordingly.
> Chris O
Sorry about that, my dogs are 32, 50 and 66lbs. I feed them each a
pound, which is 3 or 4 ribs.
Maria
Messages in this topic (8)
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12a. Re: first time feeding a puppy Raw
Posted by: "barrettsmadison" barrettsark@verizon.net barrettsmadison
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 6:04 pm ((PST))
Well after feeding my puppy The lamb neck last night he got loose
stools again today. I have heard that lamb can do that. What else
can I get my hands on that will help him eat slower?
Thank You
Jessica
---
In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Giselle <megan.giselle@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, Jessica!
> Feed the way you would for any dog, but scaled down
for a
> pup.
> In case you are new to this list, here are links to some websites and an
> archived message to help you get your feeding plan organized;
>
> http://www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html
>
> http://www.rawlearning.com/supplementmyths.html
>
> http://www.rawfed.com/myths/index.html
>
> http://rawfeddogs.net/Recipes
>
> http://rawfeddogs.net/FAQlist
>
> *http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/141374 *
>
> *post # 141374*
> As I'm sure you'll remember, Newf pups grow fast! But they mature
slowly.
> Be sure to offer larger and larger parts as he gets bigger, so that the
> meals are challenging for him and so that you don't have gulping issues.
>
> BTW, singleton pups can have behavioral issues as they grow due to
the fact
> of not having sibs to learn body language and relationship give and
take. It
> would be great to get him together regularly with some buds his age
if you
> know someone else who has pups or asap as he grows, and do some
research on
> Singleton Puppy Syndrome. Maybe the breeder of your female or the
owner of
> the stud dog could help out?
>
> TC and let us know how you both get on!
> Giselle
> with Bea in New Jersey
>
> On Nov 10, 2007 9:44 PM, barrettsmadison <barrettsark@...> wrote:
>
> > Hi there I have been feeding my Newfoundland raw for about a
year now
> > but she has a 6 1/2 week old puppy who I'm really just learning how to
> > feed. She only had one puppy.
> > <snip>
> > I just feel like I really don't know enough about this and I'm
> > worried. If any one can help that would be great.
> >
> > How much food?
> > How often?
> > What are good meats to start puppies on?
> > What should I not give him?
> > Thank You
> > Jessica
> >
> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Messages in this topic (4)
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12b. Re: first time feeding a puppy Raw
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:18 pm ((PST))
Hi, Jessica!
Start by feeding whole chickens, feed a 1/4 or a 1/2 at
each meal. Three times a day, right? Trim just the visible fat.
Toss in the gizzard and heart with the bony 1/4s, and increase the portions
to 1/2s or whole chickens as the pup grows.
You can add bits of the chicken liver to a meal, but only if the pup's poops
are not too loose, and only tiny bits.
Add bits of one new protein such as turkey, pork, lamb, to the chicken after
a few weeks on the chicken. Increase the new protein, decrease the chicken
and feed just one new protein for a week or two before adding a new one.
Rule of thumb; Feed PLENTY of meatymeat (muscle, skin, fat, connective
tissue) about 80% - a little EDIBLE bone (not all bone is edible, ex. beef
bones and leg bones of large critters) about 10% - a little organ (5% liver,
5% 'other', such as kidney, spleen, sweetbreads) about 10%.
Bone is good, but a little goes a long way - new-to-raw pups and dogs
sometimes need softer, more easy to digest bones, such as chicken, to start
with.
Big parts are best for pups and dogs to give them dental, mental, physical,
emotional enjoyment and slow them down. Increase the size of the parts as
the pup grows.
Loose , even runny poops are not necessarily wrong, or bad, or a sign that
the pup is sick or having a bad response to what's been fed. Raw is new to
the pup, and he needs time to adjust. Also, raw is more varied than kibble,
and has no artificial additives to tighten poops, what goes in directly
reflects what comes out. You may just be seeing the lack of artificial
ingredients, and the pup needs time to acclimate.
*http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/141374 *
*post # 141374*
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey
On Nov 11, 2007 8:43 PM, barrettsmadison <barrettsark@verizon.net> wrote:
> Well after feeding my puppy The lamb neck last night he got loose
> stools again today. I have heard that lamb can do that. What else
> can I get my hands on that will help him eat slower?
> Thank You
> Jessica
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Messages in this topic (4)
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posted by Feed Pets Raw Food @ 8:18 PM
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