[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12352

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1.1. Re: New to Raw
From: dijac9999

2a. Re: Starting a cat on raw
From: sltahoek9s
2b. Re: Starting a cat on raw
From: Bumble1994@aol.com

3a. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
From: Denise Strother
3b. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
From: Denise Strother
3c. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
From: mozookpr
3d. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
From: recyclerat@aol.com
3e. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
From: Giselle

4a. Re: Anyone feeding DDB a RAW Diet?
From: Penny

5a. Re: Dog with persistent diarrhea
From: marlena_adema
5b. Re: Dog with persistent diarrhea
From: Giselle

6a. Re: tips for cats (was new to rawfeeding)
From: mozookpr

7a. Refusal of Emu Liver & Vitamin A Content
From: Susan Fortune
7b. Re: Refusal of Emu Liver & Vitamin A Content
From: Sandee Lee

8a. turkey liver vitamin A
From: outcats4@aol.com
8b. Re: turkey liver vitamin A
From: Casey Post
8c. Re: turkey liver vitamin A
From: carnesbill

9a. Re: afraid to feed turkey necks
From: Susan Fortune
9b. afraid to feed turkey necks
From: Cheryl Younesi

10a. Re: List: Confused: BARF, Grains, RAW?
From: T Smith

11a. Re: New Rawfeeder - Hi
From: Bumble1994@aol.com

12.1. Re: Turkey necks
From: Sai Simonson

13a. Re: Fish and Game
From: vanevery0

14. Bottom round
From: Sai Simonson

15.1. Salmon oil
From: Sai Simonson

Messages
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1.1. Re: New to Raw
Posted by: "dijac9999" jacobs_diane@hotmail.com dijac9999
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:03 pm ((PST))

Thank you very much to everyone that gave me suggestions!! And I
apologize for the late reply.
Yes, she is fed one quarter, twice a day. Skin & fat removed, approx
1LB per meal. I really dont know if anything is added to the chicken I
purchase. The label just says chicken, no other ingredients. I will
triple check when I get home. The reason I tried the mackerel is
because I used to add it to her kibble, so my thought process was that
her body already knew how to digest.
I'll try doing the chicken backs for her morning meal for a few weeks
and see if that helps.
And thank you for letting me know i do have the correct process for
adding new proteins, and yes, I will wait until she is firm to try.
Thank you again!
Martini's mom.

Messages in this topic (61)
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2a. Re: Starting a cat on raw
Posted by: "sltahoek9s" crazy4k9@aol.com sltahoek9s
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:03 pm ((PST))

how would you start a 13 year old, healthy cat? We forget he is 13
because of how good he looks, but he tends to be a wolf-hound when it
comes to kibble and I would like to start him on raw and make him chew
a little bit.
>
My best advice to you would be to join the yahoo group rawcat and
also to read over the website www.rawfedcats.org . I'm just getting
my own three cats started on raw. So far the youngest is hooked, the
middle one is interested, but unsure and my eldest (8 years old and
huge kibble junkie) will have nothing to do with the smallest iota of
anything resembling raw.

If your guy is a kibble junkie and has been for 13 years, it may be a
little tricky getting him going. The website is really informative
for beginners. Good luck and hope to see you over at rawcat.

Tammy C

Messages in this topic (12)
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2b. Re: Starting a cat on raw
Posted by: "Bumble1994@aol.com" Bumble1994@aol.com bumble1994
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 3:46 pm ((PST))

In a message dated 12/6/2007 5:03:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, Jessica
MacMillan writes:

Now, my next question is - how would you start a 13 year old, healthy cat?
We forget he is 13 because of how good he looks, but he tends to be a
wolf-hound when it comes to kibble and I would like to start him on raw and make him
chew a little bit.

****
Hi, Jess,

Some cats greet raw like it was the best thing ever (mine did), but from
what I hear, most do not. Mine were used to canned food, and I mixed minced raw
with that, gradually increasing the amount and size of the raw and decreasing
the canned. Some kibble hounds have to be transitioned to canned first, but
this can be as much of a project as transitioning to raw, for some cats--so
I'd start with raw. :) It's just that it's harder to mix bits of raw with
kibble and have it seem somewhat like what they are used to eating.

Another factor that may have come into play: my cats were used to eating
morning and night, no kibble left out. You can't starve a cat into eating raw,
like you can a dog, because he is at risk of a serious liver ailment if you
do that. But you can stop leaving kibble out for them so that when it comes
time to eat, they are HUNGRY cats.

Here's a website with lots of good information:

_http://www.rawfedcats.org/practicleguide.htm_

(http://www.rawfedcats.org/practicleguide.htm)

Lynda

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Messages in this topic (12)
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3a. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
Posted by: "Denise Strother" denisestrother@yahoo.com denisestrother
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:03 pm ((PST))

Hi Kelly,
It takes some dogs longer to get the hang of it than others. But,
don't worry, he will. I foster dogs and do quite a few Chi's and I
own a 9yr old female Chi who weighs 4.5 lbs. I recently fostered a
year old male who weighed 2.2 lbs when I picked him up. He also had
an overbite so bad you could see all of his front teeth from canine
to canine with his mouth shut. Your dog will get stronger jaw
muscles and learn to hold the food still with his feet, if you let
him. The chewing you're talking about will clean his back teeth. You
can take a pair of kitchen shears and make cuts in the skin to help
him. A leg is just fine. You will see way less poop in rawfed dogs
and they usually don't drink as much water either, because of the
moisture in the meat. There is less poop because raw is more
digestible than kibble. Don't give him the pumpkin, there is nothing
to be concerned about from what you're writing. Hang in there, he'll
get the hang of it and so will you. So far it looks like you're
doing this correctly. Just put the can of pumkin down and back away
from it.:) My Sweetie is very healthy and nobody can believe she is
9. She eats everything my Pitbull does, just smaller. Denise

Today will be day three since I have started my male 1 year old 3.3
> pound Chihuahua on raw. Day 1 I offered him a whole chicken
wing.
> He chewed up the bone and all of the third section and then I
ended
> up pulling the meat off the rest and he ate the bone in the second
> section. (I know, from reading older posts I guess this
> is "babying".) Last night I offered a chicken quarter. He was
> gnawing with his back teeth on the skin of it but I dont' think he
> ever got much off of it (skin). I flipped it over so he could see
> the meaty parts but it's like he's trying to be all dainty about
it.
> Do I just let him poke around for a while then pick it up and try
> again the next day and just continue till he figures out he needs
to
> pin the dang thing down and rip it up? I don't have time in the
> morning to supervise a 30-60 min picky eating session so he'd be
> waiting a full 24 hours.
>
> Also, he's only pooped 1/4 of a TEASPOON since the chicken wing
> Tuesday night. I bought some pure pumpkin last night (no, not pie
> filling) to offer him tonight if he still hasn't pooped - he
hasn't
> even tried to poop since Wednesday morning.
>
> I'm offering the chicken quarter from last night that he never
really
> got much of again tonight. I ended up pulling the leg off of it
(the
> leg is bigger than his head).
>
> I'm open to suggestions/comments - anything :) My main concerns
are
> blockage/perf from the bones - I've read many of the old posts and
> the internet links on this as well. How long till he gets the
hang
> of this?
>
> Kelly Petska
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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3b. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
Posted by: "Denise Strother" denisestrother@yahoo.com denisestrother
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:05 pm ((PST))

Sorry mods, I typed my answer and got interrupted. When I came back I
thought I had trimmed the OP's post. Mea Culpa. Denise

Messages in this topic (7)
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3c. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
Posted by: "mozookpr" mozookpr@yahoo.com mozookpr
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 3:46 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Kelly" <kpetska@...> wrote:
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> Today will be day three since I have started my male 1 year old 3.3
> pound Chihuahua on raw. Day 1 I offered him a whole chicken wing.
> He chewed up the bone and all of the third section and then I ended
> up pulling the meat off the rest and he ate the bone in the second
> section. (I know, from reading older posts I guess this
> is "babying".) Last night I offered a chicken quarter.
>
>
I am new to raw, and my Pomeranian does the same thing....picks
rather daintily. He will gnaw on a wing or maybe some rib bones, but
the bones in a leg quarter seem to put him off. He is older than
your dog -- five -- and more set in his ways, I suspect, but he is
also larger, at 10.5 lbs.

I know that the rule of thumb is that bigger food is better, but a
whole leg quarter might be a wee bit much for a dog as tiny as yours
who is brand new to raw feeding. Why not consider buying a game hen
or two and quartering them? That way, you get a decent ratio of meat
to bone, in a size that might be a bit easier for your little guy to
handle, at least at first. I am considering doing this for Foxy, and
for my cats, too. My hope is that if I get them used to something
closer to whole prey in a small package, they will be more willing to
take on larger items later. I know game hens would be pricey for a
big dog, not to mention too small, but they seem perfect for a tiny
dog who only needs a few ounces of food a day.

Good news that he munched on a chicken wing, BTW...the instincts are
there, as you knew they would be! Bigger bones might just be a bit
much for him right now.

Wendy

Messages in this topic (7)
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3d. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
Posted by: "recyclerat@aol.com" recyclerat@aol.com syrusmommy
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:23 pm ((PST))

Hi Kelly,

i have no advise to offer - just wanted to let you know that i've been
going thru something similar with my chi (also a teeny one like yours) -- we've
been feeding raw for a few months, and he flat out refuses to eat raw chicken
- i have 3 small children, and he scavenges what they nibble on - so he
never has reached "primal hungry" -- so he just turns his nose up and refuses
it...
i've been dealing with mega issues with my rottie - so i put the lil guy
on the back burner for a while, and have just been feeding ground turkey with
egg shell sprinkled in.

your thread caught my eye - i am watching this topic VERY closely! i'm
ready to focus my attention to him, and get him going properly now that my rot
seems to be on the mend.

.heather.

I'm open to suggestions/I'm open to suggestions/<WBR>comments - anyt
blockage/perf from the bones - I've read many of the old posts and
the internet links on this as well. How long till he gets the hang
of this?

Kelly Petska

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Messages in this topic (7)
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3e. Re: Small Chihuahua Starting RAW
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:25 pm ((PST))

Hi, Kelly and Wendy!
The thing to remember is that the
recommendation is 80% meatymeat, 10% organ and 10% bone - if you are feeding
a 4 lb dog 5% of his estimated ideal adult body weight, that would be about
3.2 ounces a day - the 10% EDIBLE bone a dog this size would need would
amount to only approx. .32 oz a day! That would be just about what the
cartilage would be on a leg or breast, and thats very easy for a teensy dog
to chew!

You don't need to measure and weigh it all out. Some tiny, underweight,
growing or very active dogs need as much as 6% or more of their EIABW per
day. I'd give him a chicken breast quarter or half a Game Hen and let him
eat as much as he wants 2-3 times a day. Just pop the 'leftovers' back in
the fridge and offer them at the next meals until its gone.

Little dogs need the time to build up their endurance and jaw strength to be
able to really chow down without help. You might need to slash through the
skin and cut the meat into ribbons on the bone, or even open the ends up and
break off the cartilage so that he can get at it. Its not 'babying' if you
are helping him learn how to eat, and lessen the help as he gets stronger
and more capable to do it himself.

Very tiny dogs may need their food warmed for them, to prevent their core
body temp lowering too much or too fast and causing hypothermia - 'the
shivers'. This can be dangerous for them, so you can allow the meat to warm
to room temp on the counter, or just submerge it in a plastic bag in very
warm water.

Raw is so much more bioavailable that your dogs poops will be smaller and
less frequent. Your dog gets to use more of what he eats, so there is less
waste to poop out. If his poops are dry, whitish or crumbly, you're feeding
too much bone - meatymeat or organ meals will produce soft or even runny
stools, and thats normal.

Pumpkin isn't necessary, if he's gotten too much bone and is a bit
constipated, feed just meat the next meal, or add a drop of Fish Body or
Salmon oil to his next meal. You can feed the heart and gizzards that come
with the whole chickens, its good meat, but chop up the liver and freeze to
feed later, once hes gotten the hang of raw.

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com <rawfeeding%40yahoogroups.com>, "Kelly"
> <kpetska@...> wrote:
> >
> > Hello everyone,
> >
> > Today will be day three since I have started my male 1 year old 3.3
> > pound Chihuahua on raw. Day 1 I offered him a whole chicken wing.
> > He chewed up the bone and all of the third section and then I ended
> > up pulling the meat off the rest and he ate the bone in the second
> > section. (I know, from reading older posts I guess this
> > is "babying".) Last night I offered a chicken quarter.
> >
> >
> I am new to raw, and my Pomeranian does the same thing....picks
> rather daintily. He will gnaw on a wing or maybe some rib bones, but
> the bones in a leg quarter seem to put him off. He is older than
> your dog -- five -- and more set in his ways, I suspect, but he is
> also larger, at 10.5 lbs.
>
> <snip>.
>
> Good news that he munched on a chicken wing, BTW...the instincts are
> there, as you knew they would be! Bigger bones might just be a bit
> much for him right now.
>
> Wendy
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
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4a. Re: Anyone feeding DDB a RAW Diet?
Posted by: "Penny" redpenn2003@yahoo.com redpenn2003
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:21 pm ((PST))

Hello Erika.

I own Dogue de bordeaux and have been feeding the Raw Meaty Bones Diet. If I can help in any way, please feel free to contact me.

This list is a wonderful tool and I still learn new things about this wonderful and natural diet. People on this list have no hidden agendas. Many spend hours of their time to help educate others. I am thankful that I came across it years ago.

Penny Fusner
RED KNIGHTS BORDEAUX
Home of the Working Dogue

www.geocities.com/redknightsddb

Penny Fusner
RED KNIGHTS BORDEAUX - "The Working Dogue"
Home of UWP, Multi CH Red Dog Ridge Beaute' Rouge TT, CGC, WDI (2)
J&T North of the Mason Dixon CGC

http://www.geocities.com/redknightsddb

Pedigree indicates what the animal "should be"
Conformation indicates what the animal "appears to be"
But Performance indicates what the animal "actually is!"

~Author Unknown~

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (5)
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5a. Re: Dog with persistent diarrhea
Posted by: "marlena_adema" marlena_adema@yahoo.ca marlena_adema
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:21 pm ((PST))

Incase anyone searches the archives for this issue, I am updating it
with my results in the hopes it will help out someone else.

I fasted my dog for about 12-15 hours. During this time I did give
her low sodium broth. Then I began with chicken cleaned of fat and
skin. And I omitted the fish oil capsules. She didn't poop that day,
but the next it was much better. Still loose, but firming up, and we
got to sleep through the night! By the third day she was pretty much
back to normal.

Indeed, if she was still having trouble after another day or two, we
would've gone to the vet. But other than the diarrhea, she was in
fine spirits - so it seemed to me safe to give a bit of time to see if
she'd improve.

Thanks everyone who took the time to offer some advice.
Marlena

Messages in this topic (6)
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5b. Re: Dog with persistent diarrhea
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:31 pm ((PST))

Hi, Marlena!
Thanks for the update, its great to find out that a problem
has worked out!

Aren't you glad now that you didn't panic?

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

On Dec 6, 2007 5:09 PM, marlena_adema <marlena_adema@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> In case anyone searches the archives for this issue, I am updating it
> with my results in the hopes it will help out someone else.
>
> I fasted my dog for about 12-15 hours. During this time I did give
> her low sodium broth. Then I began with chicken cleaned of fat and
> skin. And I omitted the fish oil capsules. She didn't poop that day,
> but the next it was much better. Still loose, but firming up, and we
> got to sleep through the night! By the third day she was pretty much
> back to normal.
>
> Indeed, if she was still having trouble after another day or two, we
> would've gone to the vet. But other than the diarrhea, she was in
> fine spirits - so it seemed to me safe to give a bit of time to see if
> she'd improve.
>
> Thanks everyone who took the time to offer some advice.
> Marlena
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (6)
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6a. Re: tips for cats (was new to rawfeeding)
Posted by: "mozookpr" mozookpr@yahoo.com mozookpr
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:21 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tammy" <matreg@...> wrote:
>
> --- Thank you very much for the info, I will use your tips!
> and as I am on digest and am just now going through the posts,
> thanks to anyone else, in advance, who was kind enough to answer.
>
> Gina is following me around as if she's lovesick, lol.....and the
> cats, especially the younger one, are extremely interested in
little
> nibbles from Gina's meals....
>
I am in the process of switching my cats, too, and am introducing
them to raw just that way: with little scraps from my dogs' meals.
It is amazing what cats will try when they think they are getting
away with something.... ;)

Casey is right about keeping the catfood on hand, though. Cats
cannot be "tough-loved" into a new diet the way dogs can, as you have
learned. Ironically, if you have a fat cat, you must be even more
careful that she does not stop eating. If you are free-feeding
kibble, your first step is to stop that. Continue to offer raw and
see how they respond, but some cats even need a step between kibble
and real food. In that case, you would try offering canned mixed
with bits of raw for limited times each day. But with a cat,
continue to make sure they get *something* they will eat, each and
every day. I have been told it can take months to completely and
safely transition a cat to raw food. It depends on the cat, of
course. My two kittens could probably give up kibble today and be
fine, and oddly enough, right behind them is my soon-to-be 19-year-
old. Two of the others (one of whom is only 2) are much more
reluctant, and one will do no more than wander into the kitchen and
sniff the plates.

Not as easy as switching a dog, but I am in this for the long haul.
Keep me posted, it will be interesting to see how another new
rawfeeder is doing with cats.

Wendy and the kids

Messages in this topic (20)
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7a. Refusal of Emu Liver & Vitamin A Content
Posted by: "Susan Fortune" desperatelyseekingsusan@cox.net cactususan
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:21 pm ((PST))

My dogs loved the emu liver at the first offering, but progressively turned up their noses as I tried to 'finish the package.'

My wise, raw-feeding son said,
"They know what they need. Just go with them."

Now I see from previous posts that most livers have LOADS of vitamin A--way more than the dogs need. Smart pups!

Susan Fortune
Southern California

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Messages in this topic (2)
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7b. Re: Refusal of Emu Liver & Vitamin A Content
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 3:04 pm ((PST))

Liver has the *perfect* amount of Vitamin A when fed as part of a prey model
diet....approximately 5% of the overall diet should be liver. Doesn't have
to be balanced out every day, week or even month, but unless you are feeding
an abundance of liver, it's not more than they need! :)

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Susan Fortune" <desperatelyseekingsusan@cox.net>
>
> Now I see from previous posts that most livers have LOADS of vitamin
A--way more than the dogs need. Smart pups!

Messages in this topic (2)
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8a. turkey liver vitamin A
Posted by: "outcats4@aol.com" outcats4@aol.com barb5ducks
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:26 pm ((PST))

Wow, that was an eye opener as to how much vitamin A is in turkey liver. I
have a bunch of it, and have been giving it to my cat and dog - but Ive also
been cooking it lightly. I wonder if I could have caused any damage? They
have been eating about 2 turkey livers a week for the last month. thanks for
the heads up, do you think I should be concerned ??

barb

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Messages in this topic (3)
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8b. Re: turkey liver vitamin A
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:36 pm ((PST))

> They
> have been eating about 2 turkey livers a week for the last month.
> thanks for
> the heads up, do you think I should be concerned ??

Barb,

Nope!

Casey

Messages in this topic (3)
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8c. Re: turkey liver vitamin A
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 5:32 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, outcats4@... wrote:
>
> I wonder if I could have caused any damage? They
> have been eating about 2 turkey livers a week for the
> last month. thanks for
> the heads up, do you think I should be concerned ??

A dog has to eat A LOT, I mean A LOT of liver to OD on Vitamin A. You
are fine and so are your dogs.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (3)
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9a. Re: afraid to feed turkey necks
Posted by: "Susan Fortune" desperatelyseekingsusan@cox.net cactususan
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 2:43 pm ((PST))

Fear not. That's the first thing I fed my 13 year-old, 9# min-pin. I took it away after I thought he'd had his 1.5 ounce meal, and he got the rest for the next meal.

After two months on raw, his foul breath is sweet, and his formerly gray-brown-yellow teeth are appropriately white.

If you thought that your dog would try to gulp it, just hold one end while he chews.

I started raw because I didn't think that the min-pin could tolerate the anesthesia necessary to have his teeth cleaned...& I couldn't tolerate the $400 price! When he's had the dental cleaning previously, the tartar (from ki**le) begins to build up within a week.

For that $400, I bought a used freezer, filled it FULL of RAW stuff for my 4 dogs, and now they think I am a GODDESS! And I have $50 left!

Susan
Southern California

"Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle."

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9b. afraid to feed turkey necks
Posted by: "Cheryl Younesi" CYounesi@mac.com cyounesi
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:54 pm ((PST))

Barb,
Don't know how big your dog is, but mine, 3 lbs. and 6 lbs. love their
duck necks. I think duck necks would be about the same size as turkey
necks, not sure. But they don't have any problems eating them. They,
also, are not gulpers.
Cheryl

Messages in this topic (13)
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10a. Re: List: Confused: BARF, Grains, RAW?
Posted by: "T Smith" coldbeach@gmail.com lhasaspots
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 3:46 pm ((PST))

Let me help you understand why I use a filler on only one of my dogs.

My obese girl is disabled so exercise is out of the question. I do exercise
her legs a bit & she gets around but there's no way to get her to use
calories. She was born without proper joint formations. She's like a gumby
dog BUT she does get around & if she wanted to run, she'd hop like a bunny &
FAST but now she is 11 years old. She just had 11 teeth removed before we
went to raw & she had already lost many teeth before that. Once we get this
weight off with her current plan (fillers of green beans we discussed on the
list awhile ago & this was a general advice thing for her case only) then
she can get to a regular diet again. But for now I need to get the fat off
her fast because she is having a hard time to get around. Once the small
dog section of the park is done I am hoping I can force her to run a bit
more after she gets pain meds in her system.
It's a tough scenario, she's a good girl. I've had her since the day she
was born 10 days prematurely & she was an only child, should have died
according to all the vet tests....But here she is at 11!
If you have any other suggestions, feel free to let me know :-) I
appreciate all the advice I can get!

My other dogs eat ONLY Meat & Bones :-) the 80, 10, 10 theory. I've just
been reading more about the grains & thought I'd ask but I see now I AM
doing this right.
thank you.
Trina

On Dec 6, 2007 1:28 PM, Andrea <poketmouse45@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I think what you are seeing is newbies who don't trust the prey model
> just yet and feel like there is a need to add "something" other than
> just meat bones and organs. We say time and time again that those
> things aren't needed nor are they species appropriate. Some people
> just can't believe it is that simple. I have tried recently to be a
> little more gentle with my wording on the issue because I'm confident
> that eventually they'll figure out that all the grinding and such
> doesn't do a spot of good.
>
> Andrea
>
>

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Messages in this topic (12)
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11a. Re: New Rawfeeder - Hi
Posted by: "Bumble1994@aol.com" Bumble1994@aol.com bumble1994
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 3:46 pm ((PST))

In a message dated 12/6/2007 5:03:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, Laura
Bonavia writes:

Have been successful so far. If someone can comment
on whether they learn to enjoy it better after awhile.
I have a slow dainty eater. Started with the ground
but had learned to give whole parts. He gives me a
look now, is annoyed with the work he has to do and
then runs outside to wipe his face on the grass when
he is done. He likes the taste better just not the work.

****
Hi, Laura,

I can only speak from the perspective of my cats, but I don't think they'd
trade back to what they ate before. :)

One of them, after 8 months, still struggles with large chunks and bony
pieces. When she was starting out, I would have to hold the meat for her until
she could get her teeth placed just right on it, since munching with the front
of her mouth no longer worked. Sometimes she will pick up a piece and walk
around wailing, complaining about how hard it is to eat this. But if I make a
move toward her, she scoots back to her tablecloth and starts to work on it in
earnest. Yesterday morning she was fighting with a good sized piece of turkey
neck, and after she had settled into it, she suddenly gave out a loud growl
(no other cat in the room), which I took to be warning any and all that this
good thing was HERS.

Lynda

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (15)
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12.1. Re: Turkey necks
Posted by: "Sai Simonson" saiczarina@comcast.net keikokat
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:29 pm ((PST))

Barb,
I will add my 2 cents.
The days I can not get turkey necks (Winco runs out) there is sadness.
I must give steaks, turkey ? arms, etc. to compensate.

Sai

outcats4@aol.com wrote: Hi, I did a search on the list about turkey
necks, but couldnt find much
about not giving them. Im concerned about feeding them to my dog. Are they
safe ? He isnt a gulper, but there just seems to be so many bones in
them. Has
anyone had any problems with turkey necks?
Thanks for your help,
Barb

Messages in this topic (68)
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13a. Re: Fish and Game
Posted by: "vanevery0" bvanevery@gmail.com vanevery0
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:29 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "gbongi1" <gbongi1@...> wrote:
>
> Also about fish.
> I catch White and yellow perch, tog, blues, and striper.
> Can I feed my dog these items whole?

Know the pollution levels of the rivers / lakes you fish in.
Generally you can look these up at governmental fishing websites. If
you're seeing warnings like, "don't eat fish more than twice a week
from this lake," well as far as I'm concerned, don't eat it at all.
That goes for you too, not just your dog. Unless you think industrial
heavy metals are good for you.

Sometimes the warnings aren't for all fish, but for the bottom
feeders. The heavy metals are mostly at the bottom. Unfortunately,
it is a food chain, so if there's a lot of poisoned fish then I
suppose there could be poisoned game too. But I'm not really up on that.

I'm told that frogs are going to be just as poisoned as the fish, if
you're after bullfrogs. Amphibians and all that.

Cheers,
Brandon Van Every

Messages in this topic (6)
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14. Bottom round
Posted by: "Sai Simonson" saiczarina@comcast.net keikokat
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:54 pm ((PST))

Dog are becoming worshipful. When I open the door, they begin bowing
and wagging. What wonderful foods have you brought us???? I gave them
small slices of "steaks" after the morning eggs. WOW! Really?
When at the natural food store today I noticed that their bottom round
roasts were the same price as the stuff at Winco. Still spendy at
$2.99/lb but hey, free range and grass fed. So, there is more to slice
up in a few minutes. TG for the electric knife.

Sai

Messages in this topic (1)
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15.1. Salmon oil
Posted by: "Sai Simonson" saiczarina@comcast.net keikokat
Date: Thu Dec 6, 2007 4:55 pm ((PST))

Happy report! Grizzly slathered on the raw eggs for the Zois is a
winner. Will start removing the cheese next....Only 1/4 slice...won't
take long. Now the cat is more resistant. Gave a squirt into the mouth
and she was mad for some time. Put a little on her paw and that kept
her busy for an hour.
--
*~~ SaiCzarina*

Messages in this topic (49)
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