[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12122

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Size Appropriate Meaty Bones for Large Dogs
From: Anna Labriola

2. Re: newbie need advice on starting
From: Michael Moore

3a. Re: poo'n'bones
From: Yasuko herron
3b. Re: poo'n'bones
From: carnesbill

4a. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
From: alexanderdewey
4b. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
From: costrowski75
4c. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
From: costrowski75

5a. Re: Need direction for Newbies
From: carnesbill

6a. Re: Smoked Turkey as treats??
From: Yasuko herron
6b. Re: Smoked Turkey as treats??
From: carnesbill

7a. Re: newbie need advise on starting
From: carnesbill

8a. Re: photos for comparison
From: Giselle
8b. Re: photos for comparison
From: Roseann

9a. Re: Predator behavior
From: michael@brooksweb.org

10a. Enhanced meat
From: iumadness64
10b. Re: Enhanced meat
From: beaulah_2001us

11a. Re: first day success and chicken feet
From: caroline gebbie

12a. Re: Newbie here with a question
From: jennifer_hell

13a. Re: Feeding Toy breeds
From: caroline gebbie

14. wanting a new puppy
From: beaulah_2001us

15. Is This Natuutal? (MEREDITH)
From: Meredith

16. Time Limit? (MEREDITH)
From: Meredith

17a. Re: Pork neck whole?
From: Cdandp2@aol.com

18. my visit to the vet
From: esmolensky

19. internal organs for dalmatians
From: bel_the

Messages
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1a. Re: Size Appropriate Meaty Bones for Large Dogs
Posted by: "Anna Labriola" taggartgalt@yahoo.com taggartgalt
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:56 pm ((PDT))

You know, I think I'm sick. :o) I'm a freakin' vegetarian, but I not
only have pics of the first meal on his first turkey, but a picture of
the somewhat demolished back the turkey after his first day at it.
LOL. I'm tellin' you, I'm sick.

Anna and Khan(27 weeks)

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Anna, how cute! Hope you have lots of pictures! :))
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
I'm currently feeding my 55 pound doberman
> puppy a whole turkey. I scored a 17ish pound turkey for 85 cents a
> pound, with innards and neck. That's my idea of a big
> meal!!! You should see him: eat, work on the turkey, then snore on
> his bed. Like Thanksgiving....
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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2. Re: newbie need advice on starting
Posted by: "Michael Moore" m-tak@sbcglobal.net annemoore2000
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:56 pm ((PDT))

>>I would like some tips on feeding my 12 pound 8 month old shetland sheepdog a raw diet what do you recommend I start with? chicken? I have read som article on raw feeding and I am a little worried about the detox phase I really dont want runny poo everywhere is their away to avoid it? should I mix raw with kibble at first or should I just switch her cold chicken different sites tell you different things so now I am just confused HELP!!!! thank you<<

Jessica -- sometimes we read so much that we confuse ourselves. Take a deep breath. We're here to help. Chicken is a good starting point because it's readily available and inexpensive, but it's not "magical." You may start with bone-in breasts or simply buy a whole chicken and cut it into serving size portions. Stay with chicken for a couple of weeks or so. Or, you can start with pork or beef or venison.
Yes, just switch "cold chicken." Ditch the kibble, get it out of your house. I advise you *not* to mix kibble with raw; that might be a recipe for digestive issues.
"De-tox" is over-rated, IMO. I have switched about a dozen dogs to raw over the years, and I have yet to see de-tox. Doesn't mean it doesn't perhaps exist, but I doubt that even "most" dogs experience it. If loose stools are a concern, you may remove the skin from the chicken while your dog's system adjusts to raw. You *will* still see looser stools from time-to-time, depending on what you're feeding that day(s). It's truly nothing to worry over. What comes out equals what goes in, for the most part. Stools will not be as consistent as on kibble, because kibble contains stool firmers. You will see less stool . . . dramatically less, as a matter of fact!
Good luck -- ask lots of questions... this is a great group with lots of experience!

-- Anne Moore (M-Tak PWC and one goofy GSD rescue and a silly Golden rescue) in NW Ohio

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Messages in this topic (1)
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3a. Re: poo'n'bones
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:57 pm ((PDT))

>Casper pooped out yellowish runny & pieces of bone today. Like half a 3"leg bone (I could >identify them)Is his stomach acids just not quite up to par yet?

Hi,trina. what bone did you feed? When I started rawfeeding(wow,already been 5 months now..),my dog used to have undigested bone now and then,but as she gets adjusted,I tended not to find the bone piece anymore. If you were just started the rawfeeding,it maybe when yourdog trying to adjust to theprotin you been feeding. don't worry,nothing wrong with it.

For yellow runny part...maybe little too much fat in meal maybe?? Try skin off a bit and if you see the same reaction still, try combo meal with what your dog already be doing ok with.That may help.OR,are you feeding too much to handle for dog?? Too much food gets loose/diarrhea too.

yassy

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Messages in this topic (3)
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3b. Re: poo'n'bones
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:59 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:
>
> Is his stomach acids just not quite up to par yet?

That would be my guess. Bone fragments are not unusual in newly
switched dogs poop or vomit. This will diminish over time. It's been
years since I have seen bone in my dog's poop.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (3)
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4a. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
Posted by: "alexanderdewey" alexanderdewey@yahoo.com alexanderdewey
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:57 pm ((PDT))

> I mean, you can feed pork or
> not feed pork, it's okay by me but worms after feeding pork is
> probably in the Myths files on Rawfed.com.
>

So, your opinion is that it's okay?? I'm new and would like to know
about the potential risks too. Thanks,

Alex Dewey

Messages in this topic (12)
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4b. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 10:06 pm ((PDT))

"Jamie Dolan" <jamiedolan@...> wrote:
> This famer keeps the bigs in large open barns, but they are fenced
> off, so the pigs can not get out of the barn. So while they could
> have perhaps found a thing or two to eat other than there food a
mouse
> perhaps, they were mainly eating organic feeds.
*****
I'd say you have scored. You wrote the pig you got was frozen. Do
you know how long? My guess is whatever freezing it got is plenty.

> Now, I am getting another hog later this month / early next month.
> Thoses hogs will have been free roaming "pastured" and have spend
> there lives outside, althought in a fenced in area.
*****
Well, regardless of parasite load (or not), these pigs will offer
some pretty sound nutrition. It's not easy to find free range pork.

> I wonder how much I have to worry, does Trich cause a lot of
problems
> for healthy dogs?
*****
I don't know enough of the gory details to be of much help. Perhaps
others can offer up some answers.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (12)
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4c. Re: Fresh Pork? Safe?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 10:18 pm ((PDT))

"alexanderdewey" <alexanderdewey@...> wrote:
> So, your opinion is that it's okay?? I'm new and would like to
know
> about the potential risks too.
*****
No question that IMO pork rocks.
It's a cheap, available, multi-purpose red meat. You bet it's okay.

The only thing I am personally concerned about is the quality of care
privately raised pigs might get. What has transformed the pork
industry is better control over living quarters and feed. High
sanitation levels are maintained. The result is no trich, the numero
uno issue with the "old pork.

Privately raised pig will almost always offer higher quality
nutrition but depending on hygiene perhaps a greater concern for
parasites. A farmer who adheres to strict hygiene standards will
most likely produce a "clean" pig. A farmer who still considers his
pigs his garbage disposals may produce less healthy animals.

Certainly the pork we get in supermarkets is fine to feed to our dogs.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (12)
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5a. Re: Need direction for Newbies
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:58 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Brenda & Karl Miller"
<Brendajo_Miller@...> wrote:
>
> We're totally new to raw feeding; want/need to start today. Where
can I
> find how much to feed my two 2-year-old dachshunds, and the ratio
of
> meat/bone/organs. So much info to wade through; a point in the
right
> direction will be very appreciated.
> Brenda & Karl
>
Get the book "Work Wonders" by Tom Lonsdale. You may download the
book for $9.95 from http://www.ebookmall.com/ebooks-authors/tom-
lonsdale-ebooks.htm or order hard copy either at

http://www.dogwise.com or at http://www.amazon.com (cheaper).

A few informative web sites are:
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm (My web page)
http://rawfeddogs.net/

--- be sure and check the recipes page.
http://www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html
http://www.rawfed.com/myths/index.html

Don't worry about ratio's. Feed mostly meat, some bone, and some
organs. For now feed mostly meat and some bone and forget organs
for the first month or two until your dog adjusts to digesting real
food.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (3)
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6a. Re: Smoked Turkey as treats??
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:58 pm ((PDT))

>I have been offered a lot of fresh smoked turkey breasts. Is this ok to
>feed to my Pug?

Hi,Virginia.Are there any chances you have label of the meat package? You maybe can look at it and if you found too much salt or too much sugar or too much additive or preservative like BHT,coloring, I would not feed it personally.

But since small part of diet;treats..maybe ok??? Hmm,. I donno how others would think.

I do not feed anything with coloring,too much sugar,too much salt,preservative etc..I been getting my dog off for 5 months now from those stuff including treats (no soft doggy treats or no dentastix or no biscuit you can buy at grocerystore) ,andwhen my neighbor gave doggy treats aftersuch break from preservative stuff,my dog got me wake up 2 in the morning and did quite bad diarrhea experience. You may want to consider that may happen if you too were cutting off commercial made treats like me.Each dog is different so,yours may do ok,but not mine.

yassy

ps; Only thing we give to palette with salt flavored is thumb nail sized piece of crab(steamed) when we do crab night.But it is rare thing,so she gets excited when smell crab.It has salt taste bit but not as salty as curred ham and I compromise that bit.

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Messages in this topic (4)
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6b. Re: Smoked Turkey as treats??
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 10:00 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Virginia Snider" <vsnider@...>
wrote:
>
> I have been offered a lot of fresh smoked turkey breasts. Is
> this ok to feed to my Pug?

Sure, feed them. I think most of us feed leftovers to our dogs. I
feed leftover meat 3 or 4 nights a week. What's the difference?

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (4)
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7a. Re: newbie need advise on starting
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 9:59 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "firedestroyer2001"
<firedestroyer2001@...> wrote:

> I have read som article on raw feeding and I am a
> little worried about the detox phase I really dont want runny poo
> everywhere is their away to avoid it?

Detox is a myth. What is commonly called detox is merely the dog's
digestive system adjusting to digesting meat and bones. I have helped
switch many dogs and I recommend feeding nothing but chicken backs for
the first week. For a dog the size of yours, one back or less in the
morning and one or less in the evening. The second week you can add
meatier pieces of chicken like quarters or breasts. Alternate them
with backs for a week.

> should I mix raw with kibble at
> first or should I just switch her cold chicken

Just switch cold chicken.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (4)
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8a. Re: photos for comparison
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 10:03 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Roseann!
Hmmm, I Googled wolf scat in Google Images and got a lot
of pics;
http://images.google.com/images?q=wolf+scat&ndsp=18&svnum=10&um=1&hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&start=0&sa=N
http://tinyurl.com/2ofgv9
http://www.flickr.com/photos/henkimaa/138098719/
http://www.heinphoto.com/trips/20060808-isle_royale/D2A_10477-Isle%20Royale-Day%20Four-8-10-06.htm
http://tinyurl.com/2egbf7

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/wolves/sign.asp

See, you're not crazy, there's people out there that make careers
based on wolf scat!
http://www.isleroyalewolf.org/overview/overview/wolf%20scat.html
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Interesting since today I had hopes of looking up photos of wolf
> 'droppings' to compare them to my Great Dane's poop. I'm becoming a
> student of poop! Wonder if I'll ever be able to consider myself a
> professor...
> Roseann
>

Messages in this topic (24)
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8b. Re: photos for comparison
Posted by: "Roseann" rgabrys@wyan.org gaiabreeze
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 1:41 am ((PDT))

Giselle wrote:
>
>
> Hi, Roseann!
> Hmmm, I Googled wolf scat in Google Images and got a lot
> of pics;

Thanks so much! Some of it really does look a lot like what Mecka is
making <g>. Since starting to eat raw, this is the first time in the 6
months that my 2yr old Great Dane has lived with me that she has formed
and solid poop. It's quite amazing.
Roseann

Messages in this topic (24)
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9a. Re: Predator behavior
Posted by: "michael@brooksweb.org" michael@brooksweb.org newyawkyanx
Date: Thu Oct 4, 2007 10:20 pm ((PDT))

Hey now I have seen some VISCIOUS kumquats in my day, so careful on this advice...
-michael

On Thu, 04 Oct 2007 17:28:47 -0000, Andrea wrote
> My dogs have the prey drive of a kumquat even though they are fed raw.

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Messages in this topic (10)
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10a. Enhanced meat
Posted by: "iumadness64" iumadness64@yahoo.com iumadness64
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 1:41 am ((PDT))

It seems that all the different meat in the grocery store says it is
enhanced with a certain percentage of saline solution...except the
chicken. Is this normal and acceptable? Today I found a pork
shoulder, pork ribs, and turkey...all enhanced with a saline solution.
If these are bad...where can I find these without it at a fair price?
I have talked with the butchers in the local area, and they tell me I
can't get the parts (scrap) due to USDA regulations. I live in
Lafayette, IN...if there is anyone in this area who has found good
places to go, I sure would appreciate the guidance.

Thanks,
Mark

Messages in this topic (2)
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10b. Re: Enhanced meat
Posted by: "beaulah_2001us" beaulah_2001us@yahoo.com beaulah_2001us
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

I wouldnt trust it but it seems that everything is going that way. I do
try to buy orgainic as that doesnt seem to have as much stuff added. I
just dont trust that it is just a simple saline solution. I think
though yesterday I saw chicken that had that in it. But honestly am not
possitive it was chicken. But seems that turkey is injected with
something of that affect to help keep it moist or something.

So you might try a health food store in your area. Maybe it will be
clear of all of that. I have not thought to ask at the counter if they
are injected with any saline solution when you buy it whole and fresh
at the meat counter.
Sandy

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "iumadness64" <iumadness64@...>
wrote:
>
> It seems that all the different meat in the grocery store says it is
> enhanced with a certain percentage of saline solution...except the
> chicken. Is this normal and acceptable? Today I found a pork
> shoulder, pork ribs, and turkey...all enhanced with a saline
solution.
> If these are bad...where can I find these without it at a fair
price?
> I have talked with the butchers in the local area, and they tell me I
> can't get the parts (scrap) due to USDA regulations. I live in
> Lafayette, IN...if there is anyone in this area who has found good
> places to go, I sure would appreciate the guidance.
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
>

Messages in this topic (2)
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11a. Re: first day success and chicken feet
Posted by: "caroline gebbie" caz320ml@yahoo.com caz320ml
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

Thanks Giselle

I think he is probably doing the normal doggie thing, it just looks a bit big to a newbie mum. He has a very large head for a boxer, will try the freezing idea though till I get more confident.

Caroline, Bonnie and Londo

Giselle <megan.giselle@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, Caroline!
If they're attached to the chicken, and he is still
trying to swallow them whole, you might want to chop them off before
you feed them and freeze several in a shallow container of ice. I give
these to my Newfy girl as chewies - I buy the feet separately.

If he is getting to the end of the leg and just doing the crunch -
swallow routine, thats normal dog 'chewing', ime and I wouldn't stress
over it.
TC
Giselle

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Messages in this topic (24)
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12a. Re: Newbie here with a question
Posted by: "jennifer_hell" jenniferhell@web.de jennifer_hell
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "jennifer_hell" <jenniferhell@...>
wrote:
>Here's what I will
> be able to get in the next couple of months:
> Chicken:
> carcasses, heart, stomach, liver
> Turkey:
> carcasses, necks
> Lamb:
> heart, liver, lungs, part of the stomach,ribs, spine.
I found a source for beef midriff (diaphragm). Hope I can get more
beef there. Would I introduce chicken and turkey first, then lamb,
then beef? Would that be okay? I'd start out with chicken and chicken
heart, then add turkey necks, then carcasse, then lamb, then beef?
Gosh, being a newbie is indeed nerve- wrecking!
Thanks for any input!
Jennifer with Mandy from Germany

Messages in this topic (7)
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13a. Re: Feeding Toy breeds
Posted by: "caroline gebbie" caz320ml@yahoo.com caz320ml
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

Hi Gail

I am from the UK, very new to this I have ordered meat from Landywoods http://www.landywoods.co.uk/ in the mean time I have been using prize choice from pets at home and others and chickens from local market.

I am in doncaster and the meat market has a lot of cuts that can be used last week I got 4 full pigs legs with masses of meat for £4 the lot. It almost seems a shame to give some of it to the dogs. I am still on chicken and chicken and tripe mince at the moment and all is going great.

Mail me for more details if you need them.

There is also a group called britbarf on yahoo, not as active as this one but may help for sources in your area.

Caroline, Bonnie Boxer, and Londo Boxer

Gail Edmond <windybond1@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
***MODERATOR'S NOTE: PLEASE TRIM YOUR MESSAGES.***

Just a query but are most of the people on this site from America or are there any from Great Britain, just curious no reason behind this except from were abouts they are getting the food from and is there any where here in UK that supply good quality food.

Gail

----- Original Message ----
From: costrowski75 <Chriso75@AOL.COM>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 4 October, 2007 4:36:59 AM
Subject: [rawfeeding] Re: Feeding Toy breeds

Gail Edmond <windybond1@ ...> wrote:
>
> Necks are supposed to be great tooth brushes
*****
Any bone that requires effort is a great tooth brush. Any meaty bone
is an even better tooth brush. Any meaty bone that gives the dog the
opportunity to literally sink its teeth into the meat is not only a
great tooth brush but also fine dental floss and a gum massage to boot.

Even for toy breeds there is a variety of meaty bones to choose from.
Chris O

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Messages in this topic (9)
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14. wanting a new puppy
Posted by: "beaulah_2001us" beaulah_2001us@yahoo.com beaulah_2001us
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

Well we are getting on with life after Mocha's passing. We thought about
a dog that was between 30-50 lbs. But I have fallen in love with the
boxer expressions and face. We both fell in love wiht the boxer part of
Mocha. We are beginning to look around and see what is available. Wow
are they expensive! I had no clue about just how spendy a pure bred was.
We would love to have a little girl boxer though or mix. I would love
another boxer/rott mix. That was a great personality with mocha.

But we will keep looking for the one that feels like a good fit in our
lives. Kind of hard to look with three cats in the house right now and
an adult kid who keeps letting the two older ones in knowing that they
will pee adn poop where ever they want. What a battle this has been.

Well we probably wont make a dog decision until this matter is cleared
up. Not fair to bring a new one home to that problem.

Sandy

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15. Is This Natuutal? (MEREDITH)
Posted by: "Meredith" mom2mytwinz@yahoo.com mom2mytwinz
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

I watched my 6 pounder (Toy Chi -Poo) eat raw chiken, she seemed to
have liked it, but I noticed she didn't really eat it, it was more so,
inspecting,smelling,and licking. Would it be better if I cut the raw
meat into pieces? Because she carries it everytwhere?

Meredith

Messages in this topic (1)
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16. Time Limit? (MEREDITH)
Posted by: "Meredith" mom2mytwinz@yahoo.com mom2mytwinz
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 4:05 am ((PDT))

How long should I wait for my toy dog to eat this chicken? Is there a
time Limit? Can she get salmonella poisoning afer an hour or 2, I
really have no clue.

Thanks in Advance!
Meredith

Messages in this topic (1)
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17a. Re: Pork neck whole?
Posted by: "Cdandp2@aol.com" Cdandp2@aol.com cdandp
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 5:37 am ((PDT))

Thanks so much, Chris. Very helpful info. I think I"m getting it regarding
the meat vs. bone balance. I typically give him an organ or boneless meal
after a mostly bone meal. He still gets those cement poops sometimes, but
it's getting better.

Regarding the website you sent, though. It brings me to a list of sites.
Which one would I select to find the pictures you referred to?

Thanks again for your help.

Carol

Re::You may want to check out _http://rawfeddogs.htt_
(http://rawfeddogs.com/) for some pork neck
views. First click on "recipes", then scroll down to "pork neck
bones". These photos may help you decide.

Some people do feed pork neck BONES but add meat to compensate for
the neck bone's dire meatlessness. And some offer the meatless
wonders at one meal and plain old meat at the next. If you choose to
feed them, consider that your dog will be ingesting a lot of bone so
a. follow up with lots of meaty meals and b. don't be surprised by
white rock poops or perhaps difficult poops.

Me, I just pass 'em up.
Chris O

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18. my visit to the vet
Posted by: "esmolensky" esmolensky@yahoo.com esmolensky
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 5:37 am ((PDT))

Just wanted to share my vet experience:
I went to my usual vet with no appt. because my dog was limping.
My vet was busy at the time and asked if I'd mind if one of his
colleagues could take a look, I said no problem. He has never asked me
what I feed. The other doctor started feeling my dog for sprains
and/or twists. She then asked my what I fed him. I told her he is on a
raw diet. As soon as I said that she started huffing and
puffing(literally)
to a point that she was breathing hard, I acually thought she was
going to have a heart attack in front of me. She steeped out of the
room to get a glass of water and came back giving me the whole shpiel
on a balanced diet, the extreme need for carbs and of course
salmonella bacterias. She said get a "good" puppy chow and cook the
meat and feed both. I told her I will do that just for fear that if I
didn't say that I'll probably kill her. Of course I'll never ever go
back to garbage food. I left the room and could not contain my
laughter. I'm still laughing.

E & Reagan

Messages in this topic (1)
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19. internal organs for dalmatians
Posted by: "bel_the" bel_the@yahoo.com bel_the
Date: Fri Oct 5, 2007 5:38 am ((PDT))

internal organs are high in purines and could cause kidney problems for
dalmatians. where can i get the "10" in the 80+10+10 meat, internal
organs and bone equation?

thank you.

Messages in this topic (1)
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