[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12108

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Diseases in deer/rabbit meat?
From: Shannon Hully

2a. Re: Feeding Amounts
From: girlndocs

3a. Oil
From: tobi1035
3b. Re: Oil
From: briargarden07
3c. Re: Oil
From: Andrea

4.1. Re: newbie
From: Andrea

5a. Chewing bones
From: qsgirl916
5b. Re: Chewing bones
From: Andrea

6a. Re: Should a Pit Bull be fed a Raw Diet?
From: Jen S

7a. Re: scared newbie
From: nlhp4
7b. Re: scared newbie
From: sarahfalkner
7c. Re: scared newbie
From: delcaste

8a. Re: Success!
From: Mona

9.1. Re: Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
From: Doguefan@aol.com
9.2. Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
From: Andrea
9.3. Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
From: delcaste

10a. Re: scared newbie.....now not so scared
From: c.bednar

11a. Plant Material {previously - Re: Adding on to Supplement Question}
From: aliciamyan

12.1. Re: Salmon Oil
From: cr008k

13a. Day 3 raw feeding;
From: alexanderdewey
13b. Re: Day 3 raw feeding;
From: Laura Atkinson

14a. Re: Salmon oil questions and.....
From: tottime47

15a. Re: Dry Skin but Feeding Raw
From: temy1102

16. [raw feeding] How expired is expired
From: Brandi Bryant

17. mange...
From: LaUrA

Messages
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1a. Re: Diseases in deer/rabbit meat?
Posted by: "Shannon Hully" summerwolf@theherbalhotline.com bluehankw
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 9:56 am ((PDT))

Bill (or anyone else knowledgeable),

My husband's concern with feeding wildlife is the worry of diseases
such as Distemper, Rabies, etc. I'm not clear on whether such things
can be caught orally. I know that a healthy immune system can fight
off things that an unhealthy dog would catch, but wouldn't the stomach
acids generally break down any diseases they were consuming? Or have I
got that all wrong? Happens from time to time. ;-)

Shannon H.

> My dogs catch rabbits and squirrels from time to time and eat them
> on the spot. My cats catch and eat little cirtters almost daily. I
> don't worry about it.

> > If so, how long do I need to
> > keep these kinds of meat frozen before I feed them?
>
> If you are concerned about it, a few weeks should be ok. Dogs have
> such acidic stomach juices, I really don't worry about anything that
> goes in the mouth.
>
> > Is there
> > any part
> > of wild animals that I should avoid feeding?
>
> Not that I can think of right now.
>
> Bill Carnes

Messages in this topic (4)
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2a. Re: Feeding Amounts
Posted by: "girlndocs" girlndocs@hotmail.com girlndocs
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 9:57 am ((PDT))

Hi Loraine,

> I too would like to hear sample menues, say for a week, that you
> would feed a pup. Sometimes it is all so simple and easy that I
> think I must be missing something <grin>.

This is what Zoe, my 80ish-lb Lab mix, has eaten the past week.

Yesterday, a small fryer chicken half. I'd cut a lot of the meat off
of this to dice up for my cats (who are weaning to raw), and what
remained was bonier than I liked, so I also added a small slab of
something boneless from my "miscellaneous bag" -- I think it was beef
round.

The day before that, boneless turkey breast tenderloins. I got these
from my ad on Freecycle.

The day before that, the first half of said frying chicken and a wee
chunk of pork kidney (which I found at my local Korean market).

The day before that, a whole mackerel (same as the kidney -- nice
because they come *completely* whole).

The day before that, a turkey drumstick and a little beef heart(Korean
market again).

The day before that, a quarter of a bigger chicken.

Um, I can't remember the day before that. ^.^ Hee.

Kristin
***
www.blackdogzoe.blogspot.com
http://www.etsy.com/shop.php?user_id=5036662

Messages in this topic (13)
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3a. Oil
Posted by: "tobi1035" tobi1035@yahoo.com tobi1035
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 9:57 am ((PDT))

Chris O. why not Cod liver oil? Where do I find fish body oil?
Thanks, Susan

Messages in this topic (5)
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3b. Re: Oil
Posted by: "briargarden07" briargarden07@yahoo.com briargarden07
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 10:50 am ((PDT))

I've always supplemented w/ Cod Liver Oil. It is high in the fat
soluble vitamins A & D, so I do not feed it on a daily basis. But those
vitamins are needed in the diet, and cod liver oil is a good addition
to the diet in moderation. My dogs tolerate it much better than salmon
oil, and never understood why its got such a bad rap!

Noelle M.

Messages in this topic (5)
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3c. Re: Oil
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:19 am ((PDT))

A good raw diet already supplies enough vit A and D, so when you give
CLO you can unintentionally oversupplement those vitamins. Vit A
doesn't get excreted when in excess, it builds up in the body and can
build up to toxic levels. IMO, if you are adding oil for O3 purposes
it is best to give something that doesn't have the extras.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "briargarden07" <briargarden07@...>
wrote:
>
> I've always supplemented w/ Cod Liver Oil. It is high in the fat
> soluble vitamins A & D, so I do not feed it on a daily basis. But
> those vitamins are needed in the diet, and cod liver oil is a good
> addition to the diet in moderation. My dogs tolerate it much better
> than salmon oil, and never understood why its got such a bad rap!

Messages in this topic (5)
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4.1. Re: newbie
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 10:49 am ((PDT))

Some dogs do, my GSP definitely does, especially if he ate a large meal
the day before. If breakfast was something she usually eats she was
probably just not hungry, not to worry. Some dogs can get a little
bored with poultry, maybe it is time to start introducing pork?

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "nrskay" <kay.mardesich@...> wrote:

> Do they do that at times, fast a meal on their own? I have been only
> feeding chicken and turkey ground meat. She is a little thin due to
> hating k***l in the past 4 years. Her stools are fine, she hasn't
> vomited or choked on any bones.

Messages in this topic (52)
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5a. Chewing bones
Posted by: "qsgirl916" qsgirl916@yahoo.com qsgirl916
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 10:50 am ((PDT))

Now that I've got Fern attempting to eat the chicken, I'm noticing that
the real stumbling block seems to be chewing the larger pieces of
chicken. It's like she doesn't know what to do with them.

I don't think I should cut things up smaller b/c that's part of the
point of feeding raw, right? But she seems to eat the smaller pieces
that get separated from the main large piece(s) and that's it.

Ideas? Suggestions?

Thanks,
Sarah and Fern

PS: Corgi (named Bailey) still eating like a machine - he loves the
diet!

Messages in this topic (2)
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5b. Re: Chewing bones
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:21 am ((PDT))

The larger parts can be a little daunting at first to some dogs. Are
you still ribboning the meat on the big parts? Getting easy to grab
strips might help her out. How big is the food when Fern starts to get
confused?

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "qsgirl916" <qsgirl916@...> wrote:
>
> Now that I've got Fern attempting to eat the chicken, I'm noticing
> that the real stumbling block seems to be chewing the larger pieces
> of chicken. It's like she doesn't know what to do with them.

Messages in this topic (2)
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6a. Re: Should a Pit Bull be fed a Raw Diet?
Posted by: "Jen S" jennilist@gmail.com bowiegirl1979
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 10:51 am ((PDT))

> Tell your dad that raw is good gor Pits.

And that Pits are just like any other dog. They are not more
aggressive than any other breed. My 3 year old pittie boy has been
rawfed for a year and a half and he's a big baby.

Jen

--
The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are
treated. -Mahatma Gandhi

Messages in this topic (12)
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7a. Re: scared newbie
Posted by: "nlhp4" nlhp4@yahoo.com nlhp4
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:20 am ((PDT))

Hi Carmie,
Don't worry too much about being a bit aprehensive with the bones. I
was VERY scared starting Titan, my lab/rot mix, on a raw diet when he
was seven months old (he's 13 months now). So scared that I kept
putting him on the diet, then taking him off and giving him k***le
again. Now, he won't even smell k***le. Here's what I can tell you...

>Does anyone smash or break up the bones before giving to there dogs?
I thought of this too when I started out, expecially since Titan was
a gulper and didn't chew. I never did get to smashing or breaking up
the bones, my greatest fear was that I would miss a piece or a small
piece would splinter wrong and hurt them worse than if they just ate
the bone themselves.

>How do I know if my dogs are chewing the bones enough to not cause
damage?
Really, you don't. My experience, the dogs' body will let them know
what's not right. Titan, my gulper, ate a whole chicken leg (good
size one) when I first started feeding him raw. It took his body
about 10 minutes to reject it and he regurgitated the whole thing
onto my carpet, and about 5 more minutes before he was feeling up to
eating it again, this time with a bit of help from me to ensure he
ate it properly. He took a bit of work before he could eat a bone
without help because he didn't like to chew, but each time he did it
wrong he either regurgitated or had bone in his stool so I knew he
was being a pig again and not chewing.

Best advice...let them tell you. Believe it or not, even the dumbest
dog can figure this raw feeding thing out after a few mistakes. My
two dogs tell me what is going on most of the time, of course I am
the one cleaning icky stuff out of the carpet but that's my burden
for knowing my dogs are better off being raw fed.

-Sibyl

Messages in this topic (13)
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7b. Re: scared newbie
Posted by: "sarahfalkner" Sarah.Falkner@gmail.com sarahfalkner
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 12:00 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "c.bednar" <itsagilitytime@...> wrote:
>
> Hello all, I posted the scared about bones question and I appreciate
> the advice and support of this group. However the frenchie and the
> great dane that choked have got me scared again.

Hi Carmie,

I just want to offer a little reassurance--it's important to remember that most people post
questions and problems to a list like this either because they're new and have questions,
or they're having a problem--so it would be very easy and totally understandable to get
nervous reading message after message detailing various problems with poop, vomit,
choking, even a seizure... but, these are really exceptions to the norm, not the norm.
Most people out there are not having a problem, and therefore not posting...

I'm sure a lot of the very experienced people on this list who generally do the responses to
newbie questions and problems can all chime in with their experiences of years feeding
raw without any problems and with many benefits gained; if you join the Raw Meaty Bones
group, in their member files they have been collecting testimonials from people who've
been rawfeeding dogs, cats and ferrets, worth reading to remind yourself that most
people/animals have few if any problems with raw feeding and receive many, many
benefits.

As for myself, years ago when I didn't know about raw feeding, I had a k*bble-fed cat who
got a white blood cell cancer; my vet at the time said he wouldn't last a month and wanted
to euthanize him then and there. I went to a different vet who promoted raw food (a
different model than this list supports) and homeopathy, and the cat made a nearly
miraculous turnaround, and lived a year of quality before having a downturn (if only I'd
known about raw years before...) I've since then had 2 cats who since they came to me 3
years ago were raw fed according to that first raw model I'd been told about, that
incorporated some veg and grain; then, I switched to RMB this past summer and I have to
say, since I was already feeding a version of raw before, I hadn't expected there to be too
much of a difference, but the cats are even more fabulous before: even silkier coats, and
while they were always energetic, they're even more so, and yet more loving and cuddlier
when at rest. Due to their silky, slinky appearance and graceful, witty antics, people
(presumably only familiar with k*bble-fed cats) often remark that the cats seem less like
domestic cats and more like ocelots or some exotic species. But they're just rawfed Felis
silvestris catus, v. brooklyn alleyus...

Once or twice Ivan vomited some clear yellowish stomach acid in the morning when he
was very ready for breakfast but breakfast wasn't ready for him, but to no ill effect--that's
pretty minor and has been the only less than lovely result of the new diet (unless you also
count a certain squeamish houseguest once stepping on a half-eaten fish head in her bare
feet)

All the best,

Sarah
under supervision by felidae Henry and Ivan, and mustelidae Quercus and Ilex

Messages in this topic (13)
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7c. Re: scared newbie
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:29 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "c.bednar" <itsagilitytime@...>
wrote:
>
> Hello all, I posted the scared about bones question and I appreciate
> the advice and support of this group. However the frenchie and the
> great dane that choked have got me scared again. Does anyone smash or
> break up the bones before giving to there dogs? How do I know if my
> dogs are chewing the bones enough to not cause damage? Thanks to all
> that reply. Carmie

Carmie, I have one big gulper, a pug, and also thought of smashing her
food. She has fainted while eating her kibble so I know it's not the
raw food that makes her choke/faint. She inhales her food. But if you
smash the bones before giving it to them, you are making it easier for
them to inhale their food. Better for them to work at ripping and
tearing. I followed the advice on this list (very anxiously) and fed
her a large amount, about as big as her muzzle/head. She has to work at
ripping that food off of a bone.

Silvina

Messages in this topic (13)
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8a. Re: Success!
Posted by: "Mona" mona@ptd.net deliriousmom
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:20 am ((PDT))

You feed guinea pigs? I never heard of those being sold for food, only as
pets. Where does one go to purchase small animals meant for food?

Mona

From: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com [mailto:rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Shannon Hully
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 11:36 AM
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [rawfeeding] Success!

> I think that's part of why the books make it so hard. WHO would
pay
> good money for a book whose entire message is "Get a chicken. Feed
> it."?

***I nearly spat my drink all over my keyboard reading that! ROFL

Well, having no friends who feed raw I had to crow on here, hehe. :-)

My Grey had his first bone that wasn't chicken this morning (from a
hunk of pork roast) and he had a grand old time working on that.
Didn't finish it but seeing as it was his first bone that actually
took *work* I wasn't surprised by that. He just loved it! You could
see the look of: "Oh yes, *THIS* is what I've been wanting!" on his
face.

Now, the "success" part of this (hence the subject name) comes from
what Chris said: >and whatever the cat doesn't eat.

He is allowed to clean up after the cats are done, when I give him
the go-ahead(took a bit of work for that but we got the idea down,
hehe). He happily slurps up any liver and blood, and after the first
look of horror at me offering him a foot, the feet are now on his
menu. He's eaten a chick and half of a guinea pig. He even figured
out that rat tails is good eatin'. But his one hold-out has been
quail chicks (3 weeks old). He'd rush over, sniff them, and then
turn his nose away. I'd hold them out to him... same thing. (He
would, however, eat the legs that my cats seem to feel are beneath
them).

Last night I had the brainstorm of giving him one frozen as I was
grabbing out two for the cats' breakfast for today.

He took one sniff at it and happily trotted to his blanket, laid
down, and proceeded to eat the whole thing!! (He got loads of praise
for that one!)

So, for whatever reason, quail smell bad warmed up but fully edible
frozen. :-D

Shannon H. and Darwin, who's found a way to enjoy all types of meat
he's encountered so far.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (15)
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9.1. Re: Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
Posted by: "Doguefan@aol.com" Doguefan@aol.com knoxkennels
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:20 am ((PDT))

Hi Andrea.? Shiner is 11 weeks and about 7 lbs.? She is very tiny little thing.? At fiest she struggled with any sort of raw.? I am very aware of feeding "big Pieces" as I have mastiffs that will try and swallow EVERYTHING!? They cut 6 way cut goats and such plus big hunks of meat.
In the last week, she acts ravenous now!? I thought, great!? So just in the last week she has started finishing a whole breast...bone and all, and it took her a nice long while.? In addition I would throw in a few pieces of beef cheek meat.? Yesterday morning was like any other.? They all eat in their crates.? The big dogs were munching away and so was Shiner, however, She must have picked up the whole thing and tried to swallow.? She has tried chunks too big before, and just did the normal vomit and try again.? This time I believe it was too awkward and frenchies has short little pallets and tracheas anyway; maybe have had gotten down and she could not get it up. She ended up CHOKING(yes, she was choking)because the stress on the soft tissue closed down on her wind pipe.? My Dad as an ER doc see's so many choking cases and was very knowledgable of exactly what happened.? He of course tells me I am nuts to be feeding raw...at least to such a little dog he adds.? He has seen the way my big dogs eat without a hitch.?
It is posted on here all the time that chicken breats are a great way to go for little puppies.? I am so very careful with what I feed.? I also tried the heimlich(which I know how to do) but this thing was not budging which why she could not get it up herself.? Thank goodness her little muscles were able to push it down into her stomach finally, but there was so much damage done to her throat.? I watched this poor little dog gasp and gurgle in my arms.? My fingers are chewed from trying to help her.? She was asperating and panicked, and thank goodness she is okay.? I think it is mainly because she LOVES her food and she attempted the impossible.? Right now she is getting organic baby food until she goes to the bathroom and I know she is okay.

Chelsea

-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea <poketmouse45@yahoo.com>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 7:52 am
Subject: [rawfeeding] Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)

I'm so glad that Shiner is all better! I know it was a very scary
situation, but before you swear off a species appropriate diet, let's
try and figure out what happened in the first place. How big is Shiner
and how big was the chicken breast she choked on? Was it cut up or
whole?

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Doguefan@... wrote:

> "Shiner" , is doing great this morning, aside form the fact that I
> just can't bring myself to feed her raw again.? I thought a chicken
> breast was the easiest of things to eat.? Needless to say I am
> soooo scared.

________________________________________________________________________
Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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9.2. Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:57 am ((PDT))

Gosh, that sounds awful. I'm sure she'll pass the bone ok, poor little
thing just got really overzealous with the chicken breast, I guess.
Maybe the little frenchie thinks she's a mastiff? (=

I recall that when Chris O brought home her BC pup she would cut open
small chickens/game hens so they were kind of flattened out in order to
make the small food more complicated and difficult to eat for the pup.
Maybe a butterflied whole game hen would be good for Shiner?

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Doguefan@... wrote:
>
> Hi Andrea.? Shiner is 11 weeks and about 7 lbs.? She is very tiny
little thing.? At fiest she struggled with any sort of raw.? I am very
aware of feeding "big Pieces" as I have mastiffs that will try and
swallow EVERYTHING!? They cut 6 way cut goats and such plus big hunks
of meat.

Messages in this topic (30)
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9.3. Shiner doing better! (was Re: 911-PLEASE HELP)
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:30 pm ((PDT))

Thank goodness her little muscles were able to push it down into her
stomach finally, but there was so much damage done to her throat.? I
watched this poor little dog gasp and gurgle in my arms.? My fingers
are chewed from trying to help her.? She was asperating and panicked,
and thank goodness she is okay.? I think it is mainly because she LOVES
her food and she attempted the impossible.? Right now she is getting
organic baby food until she goes to the bathroom and I know >

I am so happy your Shiner is doing so much better. How scary for you to
watch. I agree with you and would keep him on baby foods so her little
throat heals. Like I said before, I have gulpers and something that has
helped slow down the eating so they work at eating is to get a big
piece of meat (at least as big as their muzzle/head) and ribbon it in
small, well, ribbons. It was suggested by Sandee. Maybe she can go into
more detail.

Silvina

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10a. Re: scared newbie.....now not so scared
Posted by: "c.bednar" itsagilitytime@aol.com c.bednar
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 11:57 am ((PDT))

Thank you, Thank you! I thank everyone who replied to my fear. I think
I get it now. "Dogs don't chew like we do" Okay..breath, big pieces and
let dogs be dogs. Thank you again, this site is great, Carmie

Messages in this topic (13)
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11a. Plant Material {previously - Re: Adding on to Supplement Question}
Posted by: "aliciamyan" alicia_larson@msn.com aliciamyan
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:30 pm ((PDT))

> Dogs are carnivores. They have no nutritional need for any plant
> material at all.
>
> I recommend that you not worry about it. If they want to eat
grass,
> let them. They have no nutritional need for any plant material at
> all.

Bill, Could have used you at the pet store today. I went in to pick
up cod liver oil for my dogs. The guy behind the counter was talking
about the benefits of the oil. It had just arrived and he was
creating conversation while he opened the box and he asked what I
feed...as I am not quite a week into feeding raw, I really didn't
want to go there until I have more experience. I told him "I feed
raw." He mentioned a brand they carry - the ground variety with "the
perfect balance of nutrition". I said I purchase human food for my
raw. Of course, his brand is better than human quality (free range,
no hormones, additives, etc.) I asked if it had fruits/veg. and he
said yes - "dogs must have some in their diets". He said you'll find
very small amounts of nuts and seeds in wolf/wild dog poo. My
counter was of course they'll eat nuts and berries when they can't
find meat...it's survival mode that drives them to meat alternatives
in the wild. He again said they need more than meat for a balanced
diet...I said "like grass?" and he said yes. I paid and left. I
guess I have that covered - 4+ acres covered in the green stuff!
Funny, I've never seen the dogs grazing with the horses and cows
before, condsidering it is a dietary requirement for them. Every now
and again, they might munch a few blades of fresh grass, but they
prefer the recylced grass found in the manure pile. Being new at
this and a bit nervous, I probably didn't come off as confident as
I'd like. Hopefully the oil will last long enough for me to read
more and see more positive results so I'll be ready if the topic re-
surfaces when I go back.

Thanks for the wealth of information this group provides!
Alicia

Messages in this topic (11)
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12.1. Re: Salmon Oil
Posted by: "cr008k" crakoczy@gmail.com cr008k
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:32 pm ((PDT))

For those who don't feed salmon oil, how much fish/ what percentage of
the diet is composed of fish? Is feeding whole fish a realistic way
of providing the same nutrients (esp w/ molly's itchiness)
Christy

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Andrea" <poketmouse45@...> wrote:
>
> > 1. Do I feed salmon oil every day, once a week or what?
>
> I try to feed once a day
>
> > 2. How many mgs. or capsules do I feed at a time (per body weight)?
>
> When I look for fish oil I try to get 1000mg capsules that contain at
> least 180mg EPA and 120mg DHA each. Geiger gets a maintenance dose -
> 1000mg per 20lb of dog. Tycho gets a theraputic dose - 1000mg per
> 10lb of dog.
>
> > 3. For those of you who use the salmon oil capsules, do you
> > actually feed the capsules or do you squirt the contents on the
> > meat?
>
> It probably depends on the dog, but mine eat the capsules like they
> are treats. The fish oil has helped Tycho tremendously with his
> itchy skin, not to mention he lost all trace of "doggy smell." Now
> if I could only keep him from laying down in every puddle he sees I
> would never have to bathe him.
>
> Andrea
>

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13a. Day 3 raw feeding;
Posted by: "alexanderdewey" alexanderdewey@yahoo.com alexanderdewey
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:51 pm ((PDT))

Gigi has been eating Raw for 3 days. She still seems to enjoy it
very much. So far, I've only given her chicken. Here's how her
poop and stuff has been.

Day 1. Big slimey poop - looked like passed the whole quarter
chicken all chewed up.

Day 2. Threw up most of the quarter chicken about 10 minutes after
she ate. Most of it looked well chewed, but there was some bone
that hadn't been chewed up enough. She slurped everything back up
and re-chewed the boney parts. Later in the afternoon, when she
pooped, she made just a few small hard pieces. Late at night, she
was looking hungry, so I gave her a drumstick.

Day 3. She left the tip of the drumstick bone in a puddle of
stomach bile. I fed her a quarter chicken a little later. Walked
her a couple of times but again, she has only made very little hard
poops. Not much volume.

I've read a lot here about how feeding raw reduces the amount of
poop, but seriously, where is all this chicken going?

Also, she's used to eating 3 times a day - and always being hungry.
But since I'm trying to give her 'big pieces' to encourage chewing,
I'm basically putting down a whole days worth of food for her to eat
in one sitting, so for the first time in her life, I'm seeing her
look satisfied and 'full'. This is great! But then at night she
looks hungry again. If I've already given her the recommended amount
of food for the day, should I feed her again? It's REALLY HARD not
to feed this hungry looking dog...

Other than that, just gonna stick with chicken quarters for a few
weeks maybe throwing in an organ here or there. I consider these
past 3 days a success, so just gonna keep taking it slow.

Alex Dewey

Messages in this topic (2)
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13b. Re: Day 3 raw feeding;
Posted by: "Laura Atkinson" llatkinson@gmail.com lauraatkinson2002
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 3:01 pm ((PDT))

The chicken is being digested and utilized by the dog. What you're not
seeing is the waste of all of the filler and undigestible grains and other
crap that you're used to having to scoop up! Isn't it wonderful?

On 10/2/07, alexanderdewey <alexanderdewey@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I've read a lot here about how feeding raw reduces the amount of
> poop, but seriously, where is all this chicken going?

--
Laura A
Kaos Siberians http://www.kaossiberians.com
Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so.
Bertrand Russell

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
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14a. Re: Salmon oil questions and.....
Posted by: "tottime47" tottime@aol.com tottime47
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 1:54 pm ((PDT))

Hi Laura,

We can see you're not a big reader, lol.

Your wish is Giselle's command. She post either
a link to a page for newbies or post it over and over
again, sometimes several times a day, lol........

It is a wonderful page and should help you alot if you take the time
to read it..........

Oh Look! Here it is again! I sure hope Giselle doesn't mind me
sending it on....

Link; http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/141374

Hope this helps.....

Carol, Charkee & Moli

> "lauraanimal1" <lauraanimal1@> wrote:

> > > Also I think Chris O and Gisell(sp?) need to get together and
> write
> > down a raw fed language book/page for the newbies.
> *****

Messages in this topic (9)
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15a. Re: Dry Skin but Feeding Raw
Posted by: "temy1102" ahn.tammy@gmail.com temy1102
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 2:16 pm ((PDT))

My dog Grover gets dandruffy/dry skin after every bath. I use
incredibly gentle all-natural (and expensive!!) shampoo and
room-temperature water and ONLY bathe when absolutely necessary (after
the beach, after visiting a mudhole, or when I really really just want
to), but it still happens. I don't brush as much as I should, so
maybe that's why. Also, I know some people bathe too often with water
that's much too hot, and I've been told that many dog's follicles get
irritated with the rough way we owners often scrub at them. So maybe
the fault doesn't lie with the diet, maybe it's just grooming techniques.

Oh yea, and Grover's coat is gorgeous the rest of the time, like brand
new patent leather. So I'm pretty sure she'd be better off never
getting baths, but I for some reason really enjoy bathing dogs, so too
bad for her.

-Tammy & Grover

Messages in this topic (6)
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16. [raw feeding] How expired is expired
Posted by: "Brandi Bryant" bbryant573@gmail.com bbryant573
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 2:43 pm ((PDT))

Well, my freecycle ad worked - I have response from someone that has
meat from '05 and '06 - of course I know '06 would be alright...but
from '05??? Can dogs handle that kinda stuff?

--
Brandi
Bartlesville, Ok
www.obediencetrainingclubofbartlesville.com

Messages in this topic (1)
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17. mange...
Posted by: "LaUrA" laurasue17@hotmail.com angel_2_u_23
Date: Tue Oct 2, 2007 2:45 pm ((PDT))

*** Mod Note: please no monster sig lines--this sig trimmed for you ***

So I am questioning things and I am unsure of myself now...(both of our dogs are raw fed dogs)...please tell me otherwise...about a month ago Zoey (8 month old pit mix) was diagnosed with Demodex mange. The vet gave the Ivamectin or something. I gave it to her like I was supposed to and it still hasn't gone away. I think Snoopy has it now. All I know is that they both itch like crazy. I thought they were supposed to be healthier being on a raw diet? Seems like we are about to run into the vicious cycle of visiting the vet again. Any suggestions? They are both really itchy. Both of them have little bald spots. It's not fleas. You know, it just really bothers me when my babys are sick or not feeling well, know what I mean? We go for another skin scrape in about an hour tonight. I know she still has the mange, the bald spots aren't going away and she is still itching like crazy. All the remedies I look up online seems like mmmm...poisons to put on or in them. That doesn't go along with the "natural" raw diet. (Although the Ivermectin probably doesn't either...) I don't know. I am just at loss and don't know anyone else personally, aside from groups that raw feeds.

Laura
Proud Mommy to Miss Samantha (10 years old going on 16! LOL!!) and step mom to Heather -17, Nikki - 14 and Michelle - 9 - the most beautiful girls in the world!!!!!
Mom to furbabies: Snoopy (male - neutered - 13 month old - pit mix - 60lbs.) and Zoey (female - spayed - 8 month old - pit mix - approx. 50lbs.)

Messages in this topic (1)
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