[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12071

There are 10 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Feeding Heads
From: Giselle
1b. Re: Feeding Heads
From: T Smith
1c. Re: Feeding Heads
From: Jennie P. Stone-Gillihan
1d. Re: Feeding Heads
From: Scott Baker
1e. Re: Feeding Heads
From: Laurie Swanson

2a. Re: Raw & Stools (poop)
From: Giselle

3.1. Re: I've had enough - quitting raw- swiffer
From: woofwoofgrrl

4a. Re: Aust. shep. new in nashville
From: sthumming

5.1. Re: I've had enough - quitting raw
From: Vickie

6a. Re: Raw & Stools (poop) + Seattle sources
From: Laurie Swanson

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: Feeding Heads
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 12:38 am ((PDT))

Heh Heh
Chris can hardly get us to take our OT stuff to raw chat now,
she'll be trying to figure out how to send 'death rays' thru'
cyberspace if there were an 'oldie' raw feeding list and a 'newbie'
raw feeding list to mod.

Ya wanna drive her crazy, or what? ; )

'Sides, I think this list works just fine. Other than when ya'lls
start talking 'bout feedin' whole critter heads, and scaring the noobs
off, I mean. ^_^
G

****

Hi, Trina!
Yes, you can feed duck. Any critter is fair game.

Duck can be a bit, ah, bony, 'Specially wild duck. And fatty, too.

Whether to feed with or without the feathers is a Q you must ask your
dogs. And the A may be different for each one. And change without notice.

Qs, we aren't scared of no stinkin' Qs!! Bring 'em on!!! ; )

Uh, you may want to just start with something easy, like chicken, and
go on from there.

The best laid plans of mice and men being set adrift by a dog's likes
and dislikes, ya know??

Better to have left yourself some options early on, than find out your
dogs won't touch something you have a freezer full of.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> I have duck hunter friends. can they eat duck?
> Do I pluck their feathers off first?
> I am sorry to send SO many questions but I won't do this without
having it
> planned out and food set up & organized.
> Thank you for your patience. Perhaps my questions will help others too?
> I think a beginners list would just have us asking the same
questions, you
> know?
> Trina

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________

1b. Re: Feeding Heads
Posted by: "T Smith" coldbeach@gmail.com lhasaspots
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:15 am ((PDT))

Because i have hunter friends, there may be some foods easier to get than
others. i am finding organic at least 5$ a lb. I am looking at at least 20
lbs per day for all my dogs (maybe MORE!).....Yeah, the head topic musta hit
me at the wrong time (like right when i joined... eee gads!) *faint*
I currently have a freezer of chicken breast boneless but i should be
feeding bone in? & really thought the free range organic was best, right?
Wrong? Am i confused again? It's late and i am too tired to type correctly
anyway!

What's wrong with the fat content?
How much fat content is recommended? Not recommended? bad? good?

My dogs will like what they get! hehe well, between 9 of them eventually,
SOMEONE will eat what's in the freezer....

*shuddering at the idea of a cow head in my yard* ~ with my luck it would
MOO at me! *faint*
OK, i have emailed 2 organic free range feeding chicken farms to see what
they have to offer to start with, if anything at all....
Is the store brand really not a good idea?
What exactly do I look for when buying it....errr.... let me rephrase:
exactly what do i send my husband to buy at he store in the meat dept (I
despise shopping!!)

Costco? Anyone shop there? they have bulk meats? We have a Costco card &
mum shops there!

Help! :-)
Trina
AGAIN

On 9/25/07, Giselle <megan.giselle@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Heh Heh
> Chris can hardly get us to take our OT stuff to raw chat now,
> she'll be trying to figure out how to send 'death rays' thru'
> cyberspace if there were an 'oldie' raw feeding list and a 'newbie'
> raw feeding list to mod.
>
> Ya wanna drive her crazy, or what? ; )
>
> 'Sides, I think this list works just fine. Other than when ya'lls
> start talking 'bout feedin' whole critter heads, and scaring the noobs
> off, I mean. ^_^
> G
>
> <<snipped>>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________

1c. Re: Feeding Heads
Posted by: "Jennie P. Stone-Gillihan" jstone3@bellsouth.net jenniep369
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:16 am ((PDT))

Trina,

You do NOT have to feed anything you are not comfortable with!!! I wouldn't
feed a cow's or deer head, either! And we've been rawfeeding for nearly 3
years!! I get the majority of my dogs' food from the grocery store -
chicken, pork, beef, goat, rabbit, sardines, mackerel, tilapia - all from
the regular grocery. Just be sure you throw in that organ meat! To the
people who feed the "whole, undressed, ungutted" animal - more power to you!
Wish I could do it, but I just can't go there.

So get your family into this and go for it. Just try ONE protein source for
a week or two to see if the furkids tolerate it with no upset, then try
another one for a couple of weeks, and so on. It's easier to eliminate an
"offending meat" that way (one that gives diarrhea, baaaad gas, etc.) and go
easy on the organs and eggs until you see how much they can eat at one
sitting w/o upsets.

Please don't let these posts about feeding whole animals and heads, etc. put
you off raw. You do what you can do and keep your animals healthy! Try it
and see how it goes - you CAN do this! And your babies will love you for
it!!

Cheers,

Jennie

Jennie, Ron, Scooter, Cleo & Suri

At the Bridge - Mollie 1990 - 2003

Newnan, GA Representative

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________

1d. Re: Feeding Heads
Posted by: "Scott Baker" scottsbaker@gmail.com scottpsbaker
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:16 am ((PDT))

Thanks all. I live out in the country, so really, the only neighbours i have
to worry about, are the foxes, coyotes and skunks lol

It is cooling down now, so maybe I'll do just that, save the heads for the
no fly season :) Thanks all

--
Scott

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________

1e. Re: Feeding Heads
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 6:10 am ((PDT))

Sure, they can eat duck, but I've just never found it to be worth
it. If you can get it cheap or free, that's great. Be careful about
too much fat in the beginning, though. Some people pluck the
feathers and some let the dogs do it. Your newbie dogs may or may
not understand what to do with a whole duck. You will probably need
to help them out at first by plucking at least part of the duck and
cutting into it and/or cutting it into parts and divvying it up.
Hopefully others who've actually fed this type of item will respond,
too.

No problem about the questions--I was just joking about the
beginners/advanced lists, but I just meant that if we had that, we
wouldn't scare newbies away talking about feeding heads! :-)

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:
>
> I have duck hunter friends. can they eat duck?
> Do I pluck their feathers off first?

Messages in this topic (23)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Re: Raw & Stools (poop)
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 1:17 am ((PDT))

Hi, Trina!
The thing to remember is that this is a high volume list.

Many new-to-raw people post every day. The preponderance of posts you
will see are people having problems, for one reason or another or
needing support and real solid information to be able to the right thing.

Some come from other types of "raw feeding", looking for solutions to
problems they had before coming to this list, or having done a lot of
dipping into OMG! websites out there in cyberspace - and pick up a lot
of bizarre misinformation along the way.

Most newbies that get it right the first time, I suspect, just quietly
lurk, or fade away, satisfied 'customers'.

"Thanks a lot for the help, my dogs are doing great!" posts tend not
to get a lot of responses, and drop quickly off the radar.

Most dogs who don't have digestive health problems will not get
anything more than some loose or sloppy stools.
One thing to remember is, that people tend to say "OMG, my dog has
diarrhea!!!" when what they really have is soft or runny poops.
True diarrhea is caused by illness, chronic health problems or
disease, not raw food.

Most people who post about getting 'good poops' from raw, again, don't
get a lot of responses, and the posts sink to oblivion quickly. But
there are many. Some people just take the changes in stride, and don't
feel the need to post about poops at all. : )

Often, we will see posts like "Third day on raw and no poops!!" or "My
dog is constipated after four days feeding raw!!"

When what is really happening, is that the raw is so nutrient dense
and bioavailable, and the dog's system is so deprived of optimal
nutrition, that the dog's body is USING most of everything that is
being fed him. What comes out, after a few days, is very small,
compared to kibble poops. And, the dog's elimination habits are
changed forever - he poops less frequently, and when he does, the
poops are tiny.

If you are obsessed, like the dog food corps, with getting dogs to
poop the same results every time, you may spend a lot of time
'tweaking' the diet so that the dog's output never changes. When
really, it should change with what is being fed. What goes in should
affect what comes out.
Meatymeat meal? Softer, maybe runny poops for a day. Bony meal, or
feed a 'chew toy' like a pig trotter? Harder, whitish, maybe crumbly
poops for a day. Feed a meal of heart? Very dark, softer poops.
Its all good - and very OK.

My Bea has a cast iron digestive system, nothing I've ever fed seems
to upset her. She eats pretty much anything I give her. I fed her a
whole bison tongue last week. Two days later, she got a whole
mackerel. A couple days after that, she got a lobe of kidney with a
dollop of ground raw tripe. Does her poop vary? Yup. Is she sick, does
she have diarrhea? Nope.

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> How bad is the poop from raw?
> In other words: The change over is supposed to be immediate. How
long do
> they deal with diarrhea?
> If there's an introducing of a new meat, am I going to have to deal with
> these issues?
> I am talking about 3 Great Danes & a Dalmatian to start with....The
idea of
> cleaning up runny poop all over my house is certainly not a positive
for a
> food change....
> Trina--
> Chip (deaf Dalmatian)
> Casper (deaf Great Dane)
> Whisper (deaf Great Dane)
> Louie (hearing Great Dane)
> Joey (deaf & blind Lhasa Apso)
> Amy (disabled Lhasa Apso)
> Cassandra (disabled Lhasa Apso)
> Mr Paris (Lhasa Apso)
> Chloe (deaf & blind Spaniel mix)

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3.1. Re: I've had enough - quitting raw- swiffer
Posted by: "woofwoofgrrl" cmc4lists1@gastrounit.com woofwoofgrrl
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:59 am ((PDT))

Please stop propagating urban legends....
http://www.snopes.com/critters/crusader/swiffer.asp
Check your facts - not everything on the web is true. :)
Christine
> here, that raw is not the problem.? I have also heard the story about
> Swiffer.? Don't quote me but I believe they said it had similar
> ingredients to antifreeze.? Many of your typical household cleaners are
> not safe for human or pet consumption and in small doses over time the

Messages in this topic (28)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4a. Re: Aust. shep. new in nashville
Posted by: "sthumming" humming@comcast.net sthumming
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 5:18 am ((PDT))

Giselle,
Yes, she is young. The breeder had already weaned them. We are spending a lot of time with
her. This chicken back: I cut the hen up myself so it had plenty of meat on it. I am not sure if
it's okay to give her back the same dirty dragged-through-the-grass thing; I kept it in the
fridge but???? I think of my former elkhound, whose squirrel carcasses could sit in the
backyard many days. So it must be okay, right?
Thanks for the advice,
Stephanie, with Maddy the beautiful Australian shepherd

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Giselle" <megan.giselle@...> wrote:
>
> Chicken backs by themselves are really too bony with not enough meat
> on them. I'd ditch it, and get something meatier.
>
> For a baby pup, and she's pretty young yet to be already gone from her
> family group, you want to be sure that her diet has plenty of meat,
> and just a little easily edible bone. Why not get a few Game Hens, and
> cut them into quarters?

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5.1. Re: I've had enough - quitting raw
Posted by: "Vickie" dals4creekside@comcast.net vivkie
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 5:18 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Vickie,
>
> Not only does a raw diet not cause cancer, it is the first thing
recommended
> if/when a dog does have cancer.
> Cancer feeds on carbohydrates....a cancer sparing diet includes good
quality
> protein, good fat, no carbs. Raw!
>

Sandee, YES thats exactly right. When one of mine got cancer, She got
totally raw, no carbs. Cancer FEEDS on carbs.

the other Vickie

Messages in this topic (28)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6a. Re: Raw & Stools (poop) + Seattle sources
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Tue Sep 25, 2007 6:11 am ((PDT))

Trina,

I'm a vegetarian, too, so I share your concerns about the meat
industry. I just try to do the best I can in this imperfect world.

I also happen to live in Seattle--what island are you on? There is a
local buying group with access to some humanely-raised/grass-fed
meats here:

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/wazzuor_barf/.

I can
also share other ideas/sources if you write to me privately.

You might have to relax a bit about the poop in the beginning. Some
dogs have no problems, but there is a learning curve, and if you have
multiple dogs with health issues, you may not have "perfect" poops
all the time. In fact, kibble/canned has crap fillers/bulkers to
artificially regulate the stool so it's consistent, of a certain
size, etc. Since the prey model diet varies more and does not have
these additives, the poop will vary. If you take our tips, you will
minimize the risk of loose stool and probably won't have any actual,
uncontrollable diarrhea (I've never had to clean up any accidents,
just the occasional butt-check/wipe after going outside.).

I think you and your dogs will be happy when you make the switch!

Laurie

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

All information on this list represents personal opinion only. By staying on this list, you agree to never hold anyone from this list or associated with this list liable for any information posted through this list. You agree to take personal responsibility for your learning, and for personal responsibility for what you feed yourself, your family, and your dogs, cats, ferrets, or any other animal that lives under your care. If you don't agree, please unsubscribe immediately.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

<*> Your email settings:
Digest Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join

(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
mailto:rawfeeding-normal@yahoogroups.com
mailto:rawfeeding-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
rawfeeding-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------------------------------------------------------