[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11918

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Finding expired meats
From: Cris Milam

2a. Re: Lamb and Goat
From: Laurie Swanson
2b. Re: Lamb and Goat
From: Trish Chapman

3a. Nature's Variety Raw Food Diets
From: Garnaas, Carolyn (MED US)
3b. Re: Nature's Variety Raw Food Diets
From: Candee Brey

4a. Re: Ok, update from new Raw feeder
From: Andrea

5a. Re: freeze first?
From: Andrea

6a. Re: 25-35 # dogs
From: Andrea
6b. Re: 25-35 # dogs
From: woofwoofgrrl
6c. Re: 25-35 # dogs
From: merril Woolf

7a. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
From: Giselle
7b. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
From: mz_boomer2
7c. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
From: Giselle

8a. Re: Now what do I do????
From: Loretta Luja
8b. Re: Now what do I do????
From: Loretta Luja
8c. Re: Now what do I do????
From: ginny wilken
8d. Re: Now what do I do????
From: Loretta Luja

9a. Re: Ginny?
From: ginny wilken
9b. Re: Ginny?
From: John and Jeni Blackmon

10a. Re: Losing Weight & not feeling herself
From: Giselle

11. Re: new puppy and other questions
From: Michael Moore

12a. Processing Tripe
From: Dawn Ruhl

13.1. new to raw feeding
From: Mick
13.2. Re: new to raw feeding
From: John and Jeni Blackmon

14a. Re: vet says Yeay to rawfeeding
From: Ivette Casiano

Messages
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1a. Finding expired meats
Posted by: "Cris Milam" cmilam@comcast.net cris_milam
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:55 pm ((PDT))

Well, you can always consider "dumpster diving"! My son used to do it --
yes, I know it is weird..... He found that Wal-Mart had a crusher so that
was a bust. However, K-Mart would put their nice things on the side of the
dumpster. Apparently they knew that some people would come to pick them up.
IGA sometimes put things in the dumpster and sometimes left them on the
side. It might be worth a drive to the back of the store just to see what
their disposal methods are.

Personally, I was always afraid the "Dumpster Police" would come yell at me
so no free meat for me from that avenue.

Cris M

Messages in this topic (10)
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2a. Re: Lamb and Goat
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:58 pm ((PDT))

Hi Jim & Sara,

What do you have to choose from? I just bought 1/2 a lamb through the
local buying co-op and all the pieces I've fed so far have been fine,
except much fattier than what I see/buy in grocery stores. From the
store, I've mostly fed lamb shanks--my 20 lb. Boston works at getting
the meat off, eats the ball joint end, and I remove the rest of the
marrow/leg bone after that cuz I'm worried about him damaging a tooth
(but bigger dogs can probably eat the whole thing). As far as goat, I
buy big hunks at Asian markets (I think it's just a whole goat cut into
6 parts)--legs are my preference (meatier), but sometimes I get the
other ribby hunks.

I'm not sure exactly what pork rib "tips" are, but they sound small--
why are you feeding those, as opposed to bigger ribs? Are they in
slabs? Is your dog a careful eater (I'd be concerned about choking if
they are small bone fragments, especially if your dog is a gulper at
all.)?

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "rocketblasther" <jforbes05@...>
wrote:
>
> What are some good food choices from Lamb and Goat.

> Also, is bone gristle good for dogs? I've been feedind my GSD pork
rib
> tips and some time they have a lot of bone gristle in it.

Messages in this topic (3)
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2b. Re: Lamb and Goat
Posted by: "Trish Chapman" twotheark@verizon.net twotheark
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:07 pm ((PDT))

I have a question about lamb bones, too. I have been able to get an
assortment of lamb bones and organs for $1/lb. Smme of the bones aren't
label, some are labeled neck or shank. Am I correct in assuming that I can
feed all of it to my dogs? Someone recently said something about the legs
are weight bearing and shouldn't be fed, but I thought that only applied to
really big animals like cows, not little lambs. The dogs are 75-85 lb dogs.

Thanks,
Trish

Messages in this topic (3)
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3a. Nature's Variety Raw Food Diets
Posted by: "Garnaas, Carolyn (MED US)" carolyn.garnaas@siemens.com carolyn.garnaas
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:11 pm ((PDT))

It's great that you are going to a more natural form of feeding your
animals, just like Mother Nature intended. Congratulations! You won't
have to worry one bit about "preparing" raw food. You just find nice,
hopefully on sale, meaty raw bones upholstered in the plushest, juiciest
raw meat you can find, unwrap it, and hand it to the dog. That's all the
food prep that is needed. Dog does the rest.



Carolyn J. Garnaas

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Messages in this topic (3)
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3b. Re: Nature's Variety Raw Food Diets
Posted by: "Candee Brey" candee@netnet.net candeeloubrey
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:38 pm ((PDT))

I have fed it to my dogs when traveling and it seems to work for them.

Candee
On Aug 16, 2007, at 12:49 PM, tapremium2002 wrote:

> Hi all, I am new to the raw food idea for cats/dogs. I have been going
> towards more natural products and care for me and my horses.
>
> Has anyone tried Nature's Variety Raw Food Diets? How many medallions
> would a cat eat? I have no interest in preparing raw food, too gross
> for me so this looked like a good alternative.
>
> -Kimber T
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
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4a. Re: Ok, update from new Raw feeder
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:27 pm ((PDT))

Hi, your purchases look really good. Well, with the exception of the
tripe. If you bought it at a grocery store it has been cleaned and
sanitized into nutritional submission. Grocery stores aren't allowed
to sell the good stuff ever. Lots of us make this mistake at first,
so don't feel bad.

> I was cutting Sherman's food intake in three portions spread out
> over the day but I understand I dont need to do this at seven
> months of age?

It varies from pup to pup, but many pups do well with two meals a day
around six months of age and one a day around 9 months. As far as I
can tell, the reason you want to feed a puppy several times a day is
so they don't get runny stools. Anyone who knows different, please
please please let me know. My 4.5mo pup prefers to eat one meal a
day and his poos are fine, so I don't make him eat twice a day (I'd
gladly change if I need to).

> He is 7 months and 70 lbs (Doberman). I have been feeding
> him about 3 lbs of meat per day total. More or less?

How does he look? I fed my first puppy 2% of his ideal weight every
day for the first several months and ended up with a chunky pup.
With the newest addition, I go by his body and he looks much
healthier, but now I have no idea how much he eats a day (but I know
it's a lot).

Andrea

Messages in this topic (2)
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5a. Re: freeze first?
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:32 pm ((PDT))

Yes, you only need freeze "wild" meats to get rid of possible
parasites. Meat from the market not only wouldn't have parasites, but
it has more than likely already been frozen before it gets to the
market.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "ekayke" <ekayke@...> wrote:

> is it always necessary to freeze meet before feeding to dogs?

Messages in this topic (2)
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6a. Re: 25-35 # dogs
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:34 pm ((PDT))

Have you started yet? Go and buy some whole chickens and whack them
into quarters. Hand a quarter to each dog and see how it goes. You
want to start with about 3/4lb every day (so if you buy chickens that
weigh about 3 lbs then a quarter is just about perfect). Feed chicken
for at least a week and in the meantime find deals and sources for
pork, rabbit, beef, goat, etc. After the dogs have adjusted to
chicken, add one other protein to the party. Every week or so add
something new.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "severhaus" <sever@...> wrote:
>
> I sure could use some help with feeding 25- 35 # dogs.
> Linda
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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6b. Re: 25-35 # dogs
Posted by: "woofwoofgrrl" cmc4lists1@gastrounit.com woofwoofgrrl
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:57 pm ((PDT))

I have 3 - what would you like to know?
Christine

severhaus wrote:
>
>
> I sure could use some help with feeding 25- 35 # dogs.
> Linda
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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6c. Re: 25-35 # dogs
Posted by: "merril Woolf" merril@kentfieldwhippets.com whippetsrus2002
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:08 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "severhaus" <sever@...> wrote:
>
> I sure could use some help with feeding 25- 35 # dogs.
> Linda
>

Most of mine are in that range. How can I help you?
I feed a pack so I can probably give you some insight on the daily menu planning.

Merril

Messages in this topic (4)
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7a. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:48 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Pam!
Have you tried searing it quickly in a very hot pan in small
bits, cooling a little and tossing the bits to each of them in turn,
as special treats, before or in between mealtimes?

Doing the searing routine with garlic or anchovy paste or something
smelly and flavorful to 'disguise' the taste?

How about cutting liver into bits, then freezing or searing and then
coating with Salmon or Fish Body Oil?

Do they like stuffed Kongs or pupsickles (a yogurt or small plastic
container filled with ice and suspended bits of yummies in it - often
with a chew or bully stick stuck into it)? Add a bits of liver to what
you use to stuff a Kong, then freeze.

How about the 'tough love' mom's approach; "Eat the liver and *then*
you can have your dinner." ? Put the liver down, let them have
10-15-20 minutes to decide to eat it, or not. If not, no dinner,
treats or snacks until next meal, or until the liver is eaten.

What kind of liver have you fed? If chicken, try beef or pork.

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> We have been feeding raw for about 4 months now and I have a big
> question about ORGAN MEAT....liver in particular.
>
> My girl lab mix won't touch it with a 10 foot pole !! I have tried
> chopping it into tiny pieces and mixing it into ground meat...giving it
> whole, freezing it......all kinds of ways and she just picks through it
> and spits it out......chicken, beef, pork, lamb, ..EVERYTHING! UGH!
>
> 1) HOW can I get her nutrition level up according to diet if she
> won't touch organ meat? While keeping to the 80/10/10 rule (if at all
> loosely)?
>
> My boy lab mix is pretty good natured about it ....but still gives
> me the "look"...like awwww agaaain !! LOL
<snip>
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
> Pam, Christine & Halo

Messages in this topic (4)
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7b. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
Posted by: "mz_boomer2" mz_boomer2@yahoo.com mz_boomer2
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:58 pm ((PDT))

Hi Giselle !

I love your suggestions.....THANK YOU! ;)

I will give them a shot. Especially the pupsicles and frozen
yogurt.! hmmm never thought of the bullystick ..cool !

I have fed them beef liver and chicken. But I will start implementing
the searing asap and then refreezing right away.

Thanks again
Pam, Christine & Halo

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Giselle" <megan.giselle@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi, Pam!
>
<snip>

Doing the searing routine with garlic or anchovy paste or something
> smelly and flavorful to 'disguise' the taste?
>
> How about cutting liver into bits, then freezing or searing and then
> coating with Salmon or Fish Body Oil?
>
> Do they like stuffed Kongs or pupsickles (a yogurt or small plastic
> container filled with ice and suspended bits of yummies in it -
often
> with a chew or bully stick stuck into it)? Add a bits of liver to
what
> you use to stuff a Kong, then freeze.
>
> How about the 'tough love' mom's approach; "Eat the liver and *then*
> you can have your dinner." ? Put the liver down, let them have
> 10-15-20 minutes to decide to eat it, or not. If not, no dinner,
> treats or snacks until next meal, or until the liver is eaten.
>
> What kind of liver have you fed? If chicken, try beef or pork.
>
> TC
> Giselle
> with Bea in New Jersey
>
>
> > We have been feeding raw for about 4 months now and I have a
big
> > question about ORGAN MEAT....liver in particular.
> >
> > My girl lab mix won't touch it with a 10 foot pole !! > >
Thanks in advance...
> >
> > Pam, Christine & Halo
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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7c. Re: ??'s about organ meat and catfish?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:55 pm ((PDT))

YVW, Pam!
Ooops!

"Do they like stuffed Kongs or pupsickles (a yogurt or small plastic
> > container filled with ice and suspended bits of yummies in it -
> often
> > with a chew or bully stick stuck into it)? Add a bits of liver to
> what
> > you use to stuff a Kong, then freeze."

I *meant* use the EMPTY yogurt container, not one with yogurt in it!
; )

I also stick chicken feets into shallow plastic containers and freeze
with water to make pupsickles. You could use leftover broth, or table
scraps, too, if you feed them. *shrug*

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Hi Giselle !
>
> I love your suggestions.....THANK YOU! ;)
>
> I will give them a shot. Especially the pupsicles and frozen
> yogurt.! hmmm never thought of the bullystick ..cool !
>
> I have fed them beef liver and chicken. But I will start implementing
> the searing asap and then refreezing right away.
>
> Thanks again
> Pam, Christine & Halo

Messages in this topic (4)
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8a. Re: Now what do I do????
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:16 pm ((PDT))

Thanks Andrea,

I gave the adult a little liver snack this morning to see what
comes of it.

The reason I do feed both dogs the same is only because
they ate the exact same amount when on kibble, so I used
that as a guideline. Katie (14 month old) is thin and I can
count and easily feel every rib on that girl. She was almost
chunky until she hit 11 months and then thinned out. Maybe
normal for her but I do not want her to lose any weight.
Tiggie is a huge houndy-type dog that has a deformed front
leg (hit by a truck) and should stay thin to not aggravate his
mis aligned structure. So even though their weights are not
the same, it seems to me that they should have close to the
same percentage of food.

So now the dilemma. How to keep Tiggies poo moister without
letting him gain weight and also keep Katie's poo firmer without
letting her lose any weight (maybe even gain a pound)

They are now on: the back leg quarter one day and then the
front breast and wing the next, does that seem
too boney? I think it's about the right amount but how then
would I cut back on bone without making the pieces too
small for Tiggie?

Do 14 month old dogs need more than one feeding a day? Or
maybe it would be a good thing to try twice a day until she gets
accustomed to digesting bone better? (I know Tiggie will go through
the roof thinking she is getting more food than him.) Then I
still would end up feeding too small of a piece to be safe wouldn't
I?

Loretta

Messages in this topic (7)
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8b. Re: Now what do I do????
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:18 pm ((PDT))

Thanks Carol.

Funny that since I introduced raw meat to them, they
won't touch veggies or fruit. Maybe I can mix something
in a little ground beef. I have heard of pumkin being good
to use to get things through, but haven't tried it yet. So do
you think that whole chicken is too lean? I feed the skin.
Maybe he would do better with some fatty pork or something?
Does anyone add fat or oil?

Loretta

Carol wrote:
>
>
>
> Try some apple sauce. It's worked for my dog when he's had
> constipation. Just a couple of tablespoons has helped him. I also
> give some cooked carrots. Hey, you do what you gotta do to keep them
> happy. After that, I have to be sure that he gets plenty of fat in
> his meals as he tends to have problems w/too lean of cuts.
>
> Carol
>
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:rawfeeding%40yahoogroups.com>, Loretta Luja <luja@...> wrote:
> >
> > MODERATORS NOTE:SIGN YOUR MAILS!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > If you've been following my story (problems) You will see that
> > my young dog has runny stool and complains most of the night.
> > Now her older uncle didn't have a movement since sunday when
> > we came completely off of kibble and started on quarter chickens.
> >
> > He tried to have a bowel movement a while ago and came running
> > in the house SCREAMING. He dropped one extremely hard
> > poop that was already turning whitish on one end! So I guess
> > I have 2 dogs at each end of the spectrum.
> >
> > I am guessing that I should give him more meat and less bone,
> > but what to do in the mean time? Is there anything I should do
> > to get these hard as rock poops out so he doesn't scream in pain?
> > He is afraid to go outside now!
> >
> > My younger one had a sloppy but formed movement today but
> > still with obvious bone fragments. Is it normal to have fragments
> > all the time or should I expect her to get better at digesting as
> > time goes on.? (she did sleep most of the night- finally)
> >
> > Sorry for the "poop" questions but I don't know how else to
> > tell if the meat/bone is being tolerated. My husband must be
> > about ready to call the "men in white coats" for me!
> > One dog cries at night and gets diarrhea on the floor and
> > now the other one is running around screaming with rocks
> > coming out the other end!!
> >
> > What should I do?
> >
>
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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8c. Re: Now what do I do????
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:19 pm ((PDT))

On Aug 16, 2007, at 10:16 AM, Loretta Luja wrote:

>
> I am guessing that I should give him more meat and less bone,
> but what to do in the mean time? Is there anything I should do
> to get these hard as rock poops out so he doesn't scream in pain?
> He is afraid to go outside now!

Short-term, I'd syringe a tablespoonful of olive oil well up his butt
and stand back. Slightly longer-term, I'd feed him some slippery elm
powder in some milk or broth or whatever he'll drink. As a steady
diet, you've got it right: more meat. You might also try feeding him
some liver or oil right now to soften things, but I think he's just
compacted from not going and needs a blow out.

>
> My younger one had a sloppy but formed movement today but
> still with obvious bone fragments. Is it normal to have fragments
> all the time or should I expect her to get better at digesting as
> time goes on.? (she did sleep most of the night- finally)

This should settle down as time goes on, but even experienced dogs
can produce fragments, depending on how fast the food is going
through. Activity level, stress, or dehydration can all alter the
patterns a bit. Just keep on feeding what you've been advised and let
her stabilize.

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

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Messages in this topic (7)
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8d. Re: Now what do I do????
Posted by: "Loretta Luja" luja@comcast.net desertwilite
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:32 pm ((PDT))

Thanks Ginny.

He just ran outside after his meal and indeed had a blow out!
It looked soft and a bit runny, but it was a good size and
hopefully made him feel a lot better. Now I will need to figure
out if the compaction was a one time change over reaction
or if I will in general need to keep things meatier.

I think the worst is over for the younger one and I'll just watch
and not add anything to her diet until I'm sure she is happy.

Loretta

Messages in this topic (7)
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9a. Re: Ginny?
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:19 pm ((PDT))

On Aug 16, 2007, at 12:16 PM, Michael Moore wrote:

> Ginny -- would you mind if I e-mail you privately off list? I have
> a non rawfeeding question for you. Thanks for your consideration.

Of course you can! Please do, and you wouldn't be the first:)

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

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9b. Re: Ginny?
Posted by: "John and Jeni Blackmon" jonjeni777@sbcglobal.net jeniavidiva
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:57 pm ((PDT))

If you are talking to me, Jeni, then sure, go ahead.
Jeni

----- Original Message ----
From: Michael Moore <m-tak@sbcglobal.net>
To: raw list <rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 11:16:59 AM
Subject: [rawfeeding] Ginny?

Ginny -- would you mind if I e-mail you privately off list? I have a non rawfeeding question for you. Thanks for your consideration.

-- Anne Moore (M-Tak PWC and one goofy GSD rescue and a silly Golden rescue) in NW Ohio

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
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10a. Re: Losing Weight & not feeling herself
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:48 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Millie!
I'd make sure the chicken you are feeding isn't enhanced
nor injected with salt solution or flavorings/seasonings. Some dogs,
especially IBD/IBS dogs, don't tolerate these additives.

The amount of bone you are feeding with whole chickens should be
sufficient for your dog. Some IBD/IBS dogs need a bit more or less
bone than recommended for 'normal' dogs. You have to experiment, and
find the balance that works best for your dog. It probably won't be
the same all the time; IBS/IBD dogs sometimes need more or less bone
at different times.

She is still really new to raw, so don't despair.

Add Slippery Elm Bark Powder sprinkled on her meals, and mixed into
ground/chopped chicken in between meals, up to 4-6 times a day.
Slippery Elm Bark Powder will soothe the digestive system while your
dog is adjusting to raw, and you can feed as frequently as necessary
when introducing new proteins and organs, and whenever there is a
flare up due to environmental stress. I order loose SEBP from;
http://fiascofarm.com/herbs/supplements.htm

I mix 1 tsp SEBP per ounce of meat, and mix several days doses at a
time. I use one ounce meatballs as one dose.

I'd start with a fast day; offer plenty of fresh water, and a SEBP
meatball 4-6 times that day. Reintroduce meals the next day, offering
1/2 to 3/4 size meals the next few days, building up to 'regular'
portions. Your dog may do better on smaller, more frequent meals,
maybe 3-4 a day anyway. I'd dose before each meal, and in between
meals for several days, and taper off gradually. You might want to
trim visible fat for those days and also trim off most of the skin and
then trim less and less off each day. Don't worry about feeding
organs, but heart and gizzards are OK.

I'd stick with chicken for a week or more, until you are seeing
better, firmer stools. Then, I'd add a tiny bit (pinky fingernail
sized) of chicken liver to each meal for a week, before moving on to a
new protein.

Probiotics and digestive enzymes are different;
http://www.enzymestuff.com/probiotics.htm#2

I'd use a human grade digestive enzyme. Same for a probiotic, if you
continue to use them. Enzymes should be given with a meal, probiotics
should be given at the end, or in between meals. Your dog may need
either or both, but not necessarily forever. I'd get enteric coated
pills that need to be refrigerated to retain the freshness and
viability of the active ingredients.

Don't be too ready to move on to new proteins. IBD/IBS dogs need more
time to adjust to new meats. You might try turkey, pork (with the skin
and fat removed) or rabbit next. Always introduce organs while feeding
a well tolerated meat. A good way to introduce new proteins or organs
is to add just a small bite to a meal, gradually increasing the amount
of the new protein/organ each day.

Feed 2-3% of her IDEAL adult weight, but divide the daily amount into
3-5 daily meals. Adjust the amount fed per meal and the number of
meals fed per day as needed to increase her weight &/or adjust the
load on her digestive system.

I think you will soon get Sage's IBS/IBD under control, and she'll
then start to show the benefits of raw!

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Hey,
> I've been feeding raw since 7/7/07 to my 3.5yr old German/Belgium
> Mix with IBS issues. In the beginning she changed for the better on
> her runny poo to solid poo and not waking us up at night and can hold
> it all day. She can still hold it all day but she is losing weight
> and getting extremely bony, she is acting more lethargic too. She
> still eats every morning and evening and will still play ball outside
> but she has started having really bad gas again and the poo fluctuates
> to semi solid to a little runnier. I feed chicken ALL parts and at
> least 1lb. each meal(more meat than bone), she gets Gizzards every so
> often and I am trying to add Lamb and see how she reacts to that
> protein. She also gets a Probiotic Powder for Digestion. Should I be
> concerned on the weight loss? How do I get her to gain weight? Any
> thoughts would be great!
>
> Thanks,
> Millie & Sage
>

Messages in this topic (2)
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11. Re: new puppy and other questions
Posted by: "Michael Moore" m-tak@sbcglobal.net annemoore2000
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:56 pm ((PDT))

>>The puppy is 7 weeks old. I assumed I would need to grind,
or at least smash, but what I have read says no.<<

Audrey -- my Corgi puppies at 7 wks. could eat chicken parts, bone and all, nothing was ground. I started feeding (I started with chicken bone-in breasts, BTW) them at 5 wks. and kept offering pieces with bone-in until they got the hang of it, then went on to different chicken parts after that. No ned to grind, IMO.

>> One question I have is about organs. If I feed chopped up hens, some of the liver is still attached to the ribs. Since I read that you should only feed very, very small portions, is that OK. I feed a lot of chicken/game hens because they are cheaper, so the dogs may get liver every day.<<

I admit to being casual about organs. I feed them when they come attached to birds, and/or when I think about it. I'm lucky in that my crew can tolerate nice sized pieces of liver, kidney, spleen, whatever. I think in the amount you're talking, it should be fine.

I also order beef heart and try to feed some 3-4 times a week. How much is too much -- for the older dogs and the puppy. I think I have read that heart is very rich. <<

Personally, I think beef heart is a fine muscle meat (and reasonably priced!). You might start out with slightly smaller amounts for the puppy. When I've got lots of heart in the freezer, my adults might get it 4-5 times a week. My puppies have had beef heart 5-6 meals in a row.

>>I also read that when feeding a puppy it is much easier to introduce new foods. Some people fed quite a few new things the first week; others said to feed chicken for the first two weeks. What is right? <<

What is "right" is what works for you and for your dogs. I waited until the puppies were eating all the meat off the chicken bones (at about 6 wks. in the case of my litter), then started introducing "other" foods. By the time they were 8 weeks, they had had chicken, turkey, pork, venison (their favorite!), fish, elk, rabbit, lamb. They never had any issues with anything, and I'm glad I did introduce a sizeable variety early on.

<<I have tried to feed pork to the older dogs, but they always seem to get diarrhea. Do some dogs do this?<<

One of my Corgis gets diarrhea from a boneless pork meal. I give her some bone with it, and she seems to do better that way.

>>Also, when I get whole chickens I was skinning the body because I thought it was too much fat. I leave the skin on the legs and wings. It's a pain to do when I have a lot of them to cut up or halve. Should I be doing that, or leaving the skin on?<<

I never take any skin off unless the dog "tells" me I should. The same Corgi who gets diarrhea from boneless pork occasionally gets a really, really loose stool from chicken with lots of skin on. Sometimes (when I remember), I remove part of the skin from her chicken. My "I-can-eat-anything" garbage disposer Golden happily cleans up what I take off the Corgi's meal.

Good luck with the puppy. I show in conformation, agility, rally obedience, and play at herding and tracking from time to time. Hope your daughter has a blast with the pup in whatever venue she tries!!

-- Anne Moore (M-Tak PWC and one goofy GSD rescue and a silly Golden rescue) in NW Ohio

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Messages in this topic (1)
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12a. Processing Tripe
Posted by: "Dawn Ruhl" Dawnofthedanes@mac.com dawnofthedanes
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:57 pm ((PDT))

OK... you won't break the bank, but you WILL break your back. <G>
One stomach will take you about 5-6 hours to process, if you don't know
what you are doing, or have a small grinder.
I process hundreds of lbs of tripe, so I do know what I am talking
about here.....
To clean... cut off any intestines that are hanging. A little is good,
a lot is not. Hose off only the outside of the stomach.
Once that has a chance to dry, you will need a couple of sharp knives
or at
least 2 and a sharpening stone. Tripe dulls a knife very quickly!
It is MUCH easier if you have someone to help and at least hold the
tripe
to cut. It is almost as bad as cutting a car tire! Now, remove any large
clumps of digested grass... I leave the small stuff, and mix well
when done
so that the grass is distributed well within the ground tripe. Unless
you have
a dog who is allergic, then you might want to completely rinse out
the inside.

Now... I have a HUGE single phase grinder that won't fit in the back
of anyone's
mini van... If you don't have one of these $3500. babies, be
prepared to be grinding
for a very long time. A counter top grinder can grind it, but it will
have to be cut up
into very small pieces. Do not force the tripe.... and the thin
membrane along some
pieces can and will clog up and stop the grinder. Turn it off
immediately and take
apart the grinder and remove the membrane.
Good luck Frankie!
Let us know how you make out!

~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~~;*;~
Processing Tripe
Posted by: "doguenanny" Dixie4911@aol.com doguenanny
Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:06 pm (PST)

I was lucky enough today to meet someone who raises cattle and pigs,
and processes his own meat. He told me he would give me the cow
stomachs. I'm so excited about this. I will be able to feed tripe more
often to my dogs (I have 10 dogs) without breaking the bank!

My only problem is I don't know the first thing about processing
tripe. I feed green tripe, but it's already cleaned and cut or
ground. What do I do with it? What kind of cutting equipment will I
need for it? Can anyone tell me what I'll have to do? I don't even
know what it's going to look like; I imagine it's going to smell pretty
nasty. HELP! LOL

Frankie

Laus Deo!
~;*;~ Dawn ~;*;~
http://dawnofthedanes.com

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Messages in this topic (10)
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13.1. new to raw feeding
Posted by: "Mick" cowsinsin@yahoo.com cowsinsin
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:17 pm ((PDT))

I would like to start feeding my dogs raw food. Can anyone give me a list of foods to use?

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (45)
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13.2. Re: new to raw feeding
Posted by: "John and Jeni Blackmon" jonjeni777@sbcglobal.net jeniavidiva
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:33 pm ((PDT))

Mick,
This is a prey model site, so you should read the info you were sent when you signed up., do some research and get a couple of books. If you go online, you can see some menu selections, at www.rawmeatybones.com, and get Tom Lonsdales, book, Work Wonders, it will help you alot.
For starters, you want to stick with one source of meat for a few weeks, we usually recommend chicken. It's cheap and has everything you need, meat, bones, and organs, if you buy it whole. And you can do this for several weeks without any worries. Once you know this is working without any complications, you can change it up by adding in a different source of protien, like pork, beef, or lamb, emu, there are all kinds of meat you can use to give your animals some variety and a little spice of life. But to start, you should use just one source, and keep it simple, that's why it is always recommended to use chicken, you can get it everywhere, and it's cheap.:)
Goodluck, and do the reading, it's quick and simple. Use the menu sections, that is always fun.
Keep us posted, and welcome, remember to tell us what kind of animals you have, and how many, we love to know the details:)
Jeni
Owned, operated, and often tricked by my two sibblings, Zeus and Zena, great danes, and Daisy our little pomchi, who thinks she's a Rotty, and Lucky, the cat, he's just lucky he's not dinner!

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Messages in this topic (45)
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14a. Re: vet says Yeay to rawfeeding
Posted by: "Ivette Casiano" ivettecasiano@yahoo.com ivettecasiano
Date: Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:13 pm ((PDT))

<<...But, when used in the B*RF way of feeding it usually means mostly
inedible bones...>>

Giselle, I was the one that mentioned RMB in my original post of "vet says Yeay to rawfeeding" but I didn't meat the type of bones the B*RFers use. I actually meant raw meaty bones, meat and bones together. Sorry for the confusiong. I just meant meat with the bone IN.

Ivette Casiano
"Live for today, plan for tomorrow"

---------------------------------
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Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center.

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