[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11770

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
From: costrowski75
1b. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
From: kaebruney
1c. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
From: Penny (Nickles) Parker
1d. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
From: costrowski75

2a. Re: introduction & Qs - variety, & hardness of bone
From: Sandee Lee

3a. Re: Hello everyone- update on a Newbie
From: geraldinebutterfield

4a. Re: Venison and goopy poo
From: Tina Berry

5a. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: John and Jeni Blackmon
5b. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: Tracy

6a. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
From: Giselle
6b. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
From: mwood8402

7a. Re: Bone in butts & loins... help!
From: Giselle

8a. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
From: okbabylady
8b. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
From: Laura Atkinson
8c. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
From: Tina Berry

9a. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: Nathalie Poulin
9b. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: arnereil
9c. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: arnereil
9d. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: costrowski75
9e. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: arnereil
9f. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: Laurie Swanson

10. Re: Arthritic dog..appetite
From: a.flynn@optusnet.com.au

11a. Re: Veggies... Eggs... Omega3 's... Vitamin E
From: Tina Berry

12a. Re: Non bone eating dog
From: Giselle

13a. Re: Hi
From: Giselle

Messages
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1a. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:48 pm ((PDT))

cbdjmac@... wrote:
I have chicken necks that were given to me and
> they smell a tad off...or a little stinky.
*****
Far as stinky goes, the chicken necks should be fine to feed.

Far as body parts go, chicken necks are a pretty lame excuse. Unless
you are feeding these to a cat (or--with that many pounds--a LOT of
cats) there's little value to them. Too bony, too small for
interactive, dentally beneficial eating.

Since I doubt you can return them and probably you don't want to throw
away useful if not especially appropriate food, feed through them as
quickly as possible and don't reorder.

While you are feeding through the aromatic pounds, we can help you find
more challenging body parts to feed.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (5)
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1b. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
Posted by: "kaebruney" kaebruney@yahoo.com kaebruney
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 2:02 pm ((PDT))

great clarification Chris!

I always though chicken necks were a good option.

Kae

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...> wrote:

> *****
> Far as stinky goes, the chicken necks should be fine to feed.
>
> Far as body parts go, chicken necks are a pretty lame excuse. Ueorder.
>
> While you are feeding through the aromatic pounds, we can help you find
> more challenging body parts to feed.
> Chris O
>

Messages in this topic (5)
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1c. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
Posted by: "Penny (Nickles) Parker" loverladymaggiemae@yahoo.com loverladymaggiemae
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 2:37 pm ((PDT))

" a little stinky " is how many dogs prefer it! I don't think a steady
diet of chicken necks is just right, but I certainly would integrate it
with other more meaty meals. Great find!
Penny & The Menagerie

>

Messages in this topic (5)
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1d. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:39 pm ((PDT))

"kaebruney" <kaebruney@...> wrote:
>
> I always though chicken necks were a good option.
*****
A chicken neck for any but the smallest carnivore is simply an
ingredient. Those who recommend chicken necks for RMBs see them as
means to an end (getting edible bone into the diet) but apparently
ignore the notion that the form of the food is as important as the
nutrition the food offers. A complicated, engrossing body part (RMB
or otherwise) is valuable in its own right. It nourishes, it
provides dietary calcium, it offers all the stuff I go on about:
physical, dental and mental exercise, and good clean fun.

A diet reliant on chicken necks for bone must also offer "rec" bones
because let's face it, chicken necks don't interact much with most
dogs; and such a diet also has to provide extra meat because, well,
let's face it, chicken necks offer very little but bone.

Feeding a whole chicken (or feeding through a whole chicken) offers
some meaty bones and some bony meat and some easy parts and some more
cumbersome parts and even useful organs. Not everything is a cinch,
not everything is daunting. When the dog is done with the chicken,
however many minutes or days that takes, much more has been eaten
than X number of necks. With less effort for the human.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (5)
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2a. Re: introduction & Qs - variety, & hardness of bone
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:51 pm ((PDT))

Hi Lisa,

It sounds like you have a really nice variety, especially in the organ
dept!! :)) Since you have pork, lamb and elk available, I would tend to
feed some nice meaty meals from those critters!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Lisa S." <acbrio@shaw.ca>

. Next order, I'm including lamb kidney, pork spleen,
> veal sweetbreads (pancreas and thymus gland) and ground wild herring.
> He already eats pork tongue, pork neck bones, salmon chunks, whole
> smelts and sardines, tripe (loves it), chicken backs & necks, turkey
> necks, beef organ mix, beef heart, elk tongue & liver, raw eggs with
> shell, oils (cold water fish oil, salmon oil, Arctic Vigor, cod liver
> oil). I only feed him a little of the cod liver oil once every week
> or two or so. I alternate the other oils, giving him oil several
> times a week.

Messages in this topic (2)
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3a. Re: Hello everyone- update on a Newbie
Posted by: "geraldinebutterfield" gbutterflied@comcast.net geraldinebutterfield
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:54 pm ((PDT))

Oh yes!! I cooked for awhile and that was a lot of work, even for a
small dog. And, she wasn't always so fond of it. My husband often
gave me a weird look when I cooked a roast for her and made salad
for him and me, lol! Anyway, she too began acting like it was a
new form of play. I bring out her towel and she immediately goes
into her best behavior and does every trick she knows, and even
makes some up. When she's finished she runs around like a crazy
little thing having a blast - sooo funny to watch. This was the
best thing I could have done for her and me. I do wish more people
would have an open mind to it. My vet hates the idea that she isn't
living solely on kibble.

geraldine

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Patrice Quinn" <patrice@...>
wrote:
>
>
>
> May I concur? For the last eight months I put myself through a
time and
> work intensive bi-weekly process of cooking a large quantity of
meat,
>> our dogs enjoy eating like it's a new form of recreation! Patrice
>

Messages in this topic (3)
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4a. Re: Venison and goopy poo
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:55 pm ((PDT))

"I noticed that the poop was very sticky, thick and goopy like. "

Mine eat 100% venison usually, and if they haven't had it for awhile, that's
what happens. It's very rich compared to beef and chicken.

Tina Berry
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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5a. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "John and Jeni Blackmon" jonjeni777@sbcglobal.net jeniavidiva
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:59 pm ((PDT))

Tracy,
You can give her some rawmeatybones for recreation to kill some time, and keep her busy, like ribs (the whole rack, not cut up) and pigs feet, that will also give her nutrition, and she might calm down a bit too. She is still young, and growing a bit, so she might need a little more, and at 65 pounds, 2 pounds of food a day is about 3% of her diet, and that's right. But giving it to her when you want her to eat is best, and a good training tip, so keep that up, if you want to change to once a day that is up to you. But make her eat when you want her too. And if she is still hungry, it is probably because this is still new to her, and she is lovin it! And she really really wants more of it! Who wouldn't?! She should however have a period of quiet time after she eats just to let her food settle, so she has time to get full kind of. I crate mine for a half hour, weather they eat it all or not, they still stay there for the full half hour, if I don't they rough house
and then the food comes up and they have to eat all over again, a gross factor, and it's ok, but gross just the same.
So, it's best to let them digest, and relax after they eat. And it gives them time to get full, so maybe the pigs feet would help some, it takes time to eat and gives them lay down and chew some time.:) And that is in addition to whatever else I am feeding, because the pigs feet and ribs usually don't have much meat on them, it's for the bone and chewy time for me:)
Give it a try, and remember, you don't have to mix in too much other meat so soon, with the beef and stuff, you can stay on chicken for another week or two, it's cheap, and has your bones, and organs too when you buy them whole, so your set with all the good stuff. I said pigs feet and ribs, because pork for my dogs seemed to not upset the stomach and was also another cheap meat. And my girl great dane needs to chew on something 24/7, so I have stuff always on hand:)
Jeni

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Messages in this topic (6)
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5b. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "Tracy" tracy.ramey@sbcglobal.net veganmomma1
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 2:39 pm ((PDT))

She's not too active. She has degenerative joint disease in one of her
elbows, so I don't really let her over do it. I am thinking it's a good
idea to let her eat until she's full, I'm just concerned about her
gaining weight, which wouldn't help her joint problems at all. She's
kinda looking a bit on the heavy side as it is. And my other dog only
wants to eat every other day! I think they're confused! Shouldn't the
little one be wanting to eat more often than the big one? Anyway,
thanks for all the advice. I'll let her pig out tonight and see how
that goes.

Tracy

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "seaneboyee" <seaneboyee@...> wrote:

> How active is your dog? You may be underfeeding due to high activity
> levels. I'm on my third week of raw and initially my 17-month old
> would lick the bowl clean in under a minute probably thinking because
> it was so new. He then started slowing down and enjoys it more than
> inhales it. You may want to do a gorge/fast as many others are doing
> and see how much he will eat in one sitting and adjust it from there.
> All of the labs that I know eat a lot in general and are very active.
>

Messages in this topic (6)
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6a. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:12 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Dawn!
I fed home cooked, too, on my way to proper raw feeding.
Give up the kibble, get it out of the house!
STOP cooking!
Give ALL the dogs some tough love, and lots of meat, bones 'n organs!
You'll be SO glad you did!
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Why do you feel the need to add these things anyway? Just curious.
> >
> > -Melissa W
> >
> To be perfectly honest...I don't know.. (scratching my head and
> looking like I am thinking)
> Dawn
>

Messages in this topic (5)
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6b. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
Posted by: "mwood8402" mwood8402@hotmail.com mwood8402
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 4:29 pm ((PDT))

Lol! Then you probably shouldn't be adding them then. :-)

-Melissa W

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "babyboyfila1" <babyboyfila1@...> wrote:
> To be perfectly honest...I don't know.. (scratching my head and
> looking like I am thinking)
> Dawn

Messages in this topic (5)
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7a. Re: Bone in butts & loins... help!
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:26 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Terry!
ANY beef bones are harder than pork bones. These indeed can be 'wreck'
bones you are warned about. Some people let their dogs eat the softer
ends, but I take them up when my dog has the meat stripped off.
I would suspect the beef rib bones of causing wear before the pork
bones. But, depending on your dog's size and the health of her teeth,
the large jointed pork bones could be considered 'wreck' bones, too.
Does your dog consume all of both types of bones?
I would let the dog strip the rib bones, then trade them for a nice
bit of meat and toss 'em out! Keep an eye on her when you give her the
pork bones, and trade for a yummy treat when she gets all the soft
gristle and ends off, and before starting on the harder center part of
the bone, if you think you should.
Not all meals have to have bones in them. The general guideline is 80%
meat (everything thats not bone or organ), 10% bone, 10% organ.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> When you get a pork butt or shoulder, or whatever they always have
the bone in. Well, I think these are the "wreck" bones & I have
noticed that 1 of my labs teeth are starting to wear down & she's only
2 years old. The pork stuff is usually what I get for 99c or so, &
that is a financially important part of the girls' diet. Do you guys
cut those out before you feed them??? Do you let them have them &
take it away after a certain time??
>
> For the sake of my girls teeth, let me know please.
>
> Oh on another note, kind of; I get free beef rib bones, those are
NOT wreck bones right??

> Terri & the Raw Fed-"Muttly Crew" Kadin & Lilly:
> Learn how: www.rawfeddogs.net

www.rawfed.com

www.rawmeatybones.com

> Over exposure to the SON; actually PREVENTS burning!!

Messages in this topic (3)
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8a. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
Posted by: "okbabylady" camie@babylady.com okbabylady
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:36 pm ((PDT))

No one has advice on how to feed young pups raw?

Camie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "okbabylady" <camie@...> wrote:
>
> I have seven 4wk lab puppies and mom is not letting them nurse at
all...
> we started them on raw last week, giving them as a group about 2lbs of
> bone in chicken (quarters, thighs or breasts) once a day. They easily
> get that down to the bone. I'm wondering if I should increase them to
> more meals a day and how much should they get total? and should I make
> any attempt to separate them so they each get a certain amount? They
> eat like I would expect a pack to eat and it certainly seems like
> everyone is getting their portion, the smallest pup is oddly enough
> the most aggressive eater lol (and here I was worried about her)
>
> btw anyone interested in a raw fed, non-vaxed lab mix puppy? :D I'm
> willing to travel great distances to make sure they get into good homes.
>
> Thanks!
> Camie
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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8b. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
Posted by: "Laura Atkinson" llatkinson@gmail.com lauraatkinson2002
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:47 pm ((PDT))

check the archives, wean to raw should brring up a wealth of
previously shared info.

On 7/6/07, okbabylady <camie@babylady.com> wrote:
> No one has advice on how to feed young pups raw?
>
> Camie
>
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "okbabylady" <camie@...> wrote:
> >
> > I have seven 4wk lab puppies and mom is not letting them nurse at
> all...

--
Laura A
Kaos Siberians http://www.saveourdogs.net
"Is that soap they're brainwashing you with environmentally safe?"

Messages in this topic (4)
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8c. Re: Amount to feed 4wk puppies?
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:50 pm ((PDT))

"No one has advice on how to feed young pups raw?"

I can't remember how much I fed; I starte mine out on goats milk and ground
beef heart 3xdaily. 5-10% of their current body weight is what I went by
(some go by 2% of adult weight, but who knows how big they'll be full grown)
and if they start getting too roly poly, cut back. Too fat puppies is hard
on them too. You want them just right.

--
Tina Berry
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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9a. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "Nathalie Poulin" poulin_nathalie@yahoo.ca poulin_nathalie
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:36 pm ((PDT))

Buy one whole chicken.
Feed it to your dog.
It should last 2 or 3 meals (depending).

Nathalie

--- arnereil <arnereil@cox.net> wrote:

> Just to be sure I got this right, I should go buy a
> chicken breast
> (remember, I'm starting slow) and just toss it to
> Gretta?
>
> I know you are just giving an opinion, but I want to
> be sure I got this
> straight...
>
> Also, if beef, what cheap cut might I look for.?
>
> I just lost my spouse, who did ALL the shopping for
> 23 years, so am not only
> new to raw, but new to shopping....
> .
> Arne
>
>
>

____________________________________________________
Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now at
http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com.

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9b. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "arnereil" arnereil@cox.net uncle_nevil
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:50 pm ((PDT))

Gretta should be under 50#, but at last weigh in, 61#. ONLY 10 pounds, but
20% over ideal.

no waist, and have to search for her ribs......

I'm surprised about chicken.. I've always avoided chicken bones, but those
were cooked.

Is there a cheap cut of beef I can give her in small amounts?..... Again,
have not shopped for a long time, so not sure what is out there.. I used to
think beef was beef, now I find there are a dozen different cuts, if not
more...

I ask, because I'd be more comfortable with beef with a bone, than with raw
chicken with lots of bones. That's me, not the dog.. I'm sure she would love
raw chicken.
.
Arne
.
> Sure! Rib in breast is what I started with. If your dog has a
> sensitive tummy like mine, you may want to remove the skin at first.
> You can also buy whole chickens and hack them up into meal sized
> portions and feed. What size is your dog?
>

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9c. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "arnereil" arnereil@cox.net uncle_nevil
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:50 pm ((PDT))

Gretta is a rotti/Sheppard mix from the dog pound.. probably 10-15#
overweight.

I just have this "chicken bone getting stuck in her throat" image.
.
Arne
.

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9d. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 4:23 pm ((PDT))

"arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
>
> Gretta should be under 50#, but at last weigh in, 61#. ONLY 10
pounds, but
> 20% over ideal.
*****
With the right food, even though her exercise is limited, these ten
pounds oughta come off quick enough.

> I'm surprised about chicken.. I've always avoided chicken bones,
but those
> were cooked.
*****
Standard commercial chicken are slaughtered at 6 or so weeks; their
bones are flexible, the marrow is mostly blood, everything digests
quickly and easily (assuming of course the dog is not sensitive to
chicken protein). You should continue to avoid cooked chicken bones;
raw chicken bones are completely utterly a whole nother thing. And
if THEY aren't benign enough for your comfort level, consider Cornish
game hens, which are ordinary chickens slaughtered even younger.

> Is there a cheap cut of beef I can give her in small amounts?.....
*****
Chuck roast, brisket (not corned, just unprocessed raw meat), rump
roast--these should be reasonable although not likely rock bottom
cheap. For safey's sake, you should plan to feed whole whacks of
roast or to cut the meat up small. In between is where stupid eating
decisions can be made by dogs whose opinions of their ability greatly
exceed their physical limitation.

Also entirely doable are pork roasts; boneless or bone-in. Generally
cheaper than beef, easily digestible; just potentially fattier so if
you buy cheap you'll get more fat than if you pay for someone having
removed the fat before packaging. Pork is a standard for many raw
feeders.

I used to
> think beef was beef, now I find there are a dozen different cuts,
if not
> more...
*****
Nope, a beef is just a beef, a cow is still a cow.... What you want
is no bone, all meat. Or meaty bone you can trim the bone out of in
order to feed just the meat. (Beef bones are for all intents and
purposes inedible; the really big and dense ones are often implicated
in tooth damage.)

> I ask, because I'd be more comfortable with beef with a bone, than
with raw
> chicken with lots of bones.
*****
Yes, it is you and you've got it backwards. Beef bones are not
generally edible and they really do cause tooth damage. Furthermore,
a sliced and sawed beef bone can be like offering your dog a stiletto
for dinner. Sharp, hard edges--narrow (especially those found in
chuck or other steak cuts), perfect maybe for sword swallowers but
not for your girl.

You can always smash dem chicken bones to diffuse their danger as you
perceive it. You don't need to but if it helps you get real food
into her, I say why the heck not.
Chris O

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9e. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "arnereil" arnereil@cox.net uncle_nevil
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 4:28 pm ((PDT))

I'll give it a try.... should be one happy doggie..
.
Arne
.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nathalie Poulin" <poulin_nathalie@yahoo.ca>
To: <rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 6:17 PM
Subject: Re: [rawfeeding] Re: New to group: be gentle

> Buy one whole chicken.
> Feed it to your dog.
> It should last 2 or 3 meals (depending).
>
>
> Nathalie

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9f. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 4:29 pm ((PDT))

Most of us were afraid to feed bones, but you'll be amazed what she
can do! She's designed for it!

You can get away with some boneless meals, but they do need bone and
it helps firm up the stool. If you really can't try hunks of bone
right now, you could source some ground w/bone. There are pet stores
and butchers who carry whole ground chickens or other meats. They
sometimes have more bone added in to reduce their costs and add
filler, but you could mix that in with some boneless meats.

Any cut of any meat is fine (except those with small pieces of cut
bone can be choking hazards, like a t-bone--remove the bone before
feeding those). Just go get whatever's on sale! Check the flyers,
go to cheap markets, ethnic markets, etc. You might want to remove
excess fat and skin in the beginning while her digestive system gets
up to speed.

Keep asking questions!

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
I'd be more comfortable with beef with a bone, than with raw
> chicken with lots of bones. That's me, not the dog.. I'm sure she
would love
> raw chicken.
>

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10. Re: Arthritic dog..appetite
Posted by: "a.flynn@optusnet.com.au" a.flynn@optusnet.com.au flynn_nn
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:36 pm ((PDT))

Hello,

Thanks ginny and Tommo for your reply. I had no idea that vaccines were also implicated in ligament problems. Also I had not known of the thyroid issues link to ligament brittleness as well. I will look into that more. So much to learn.

Interesting too that you say your dog had a constant appetite. My lab x was always, always hungry and since being on the raw diet little over a week she has settled a lot and seems content and satisfied with her feed...mostly chicken backs and turkey neck, alternated with meaty lamb bones as well. The volume she is eating now is less than her previous junk pet food diet and for the first few days she was always barking for more, but now has completely stopped that.

The extra time chewing and also getting the nutrients Nature intended at every meal at long last makes the difference.

You are so right that just the obvious enjoyment they get from their food is worth feeding raw.

Your story of your dog getting around fine with bad hips at 12, is very encouraging. Thank you.

I will definately keep at it and will post an update on how she goes. The improvements in her mouth hygeine and appetite control are already amazing.

Cheers, Ann.

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11a. Re: Veggies... Eggs... Omega3 's... Vitamin E
Posted by: "Tina Berry" k9baron@gmail.com k9antje
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:37 pm ((PDT))

"I feed salmon oil or fish body oil. I supplement it because I sometimes
must rely too heavily on feedlot livestock and factory chicken both of which
provide excessive Omega 6 at the expense of Omega 3.
> Anyone add brewer's yeast or garlic for insects?
*****
Brewer's yeast would be inappropriate but people have reported a reduction
in fleas from using garlic. At the very least, garlic fed in proper doses is
not likely to harm a dog, brewer's yeast might."

We supplement fish oil and a daily egg. I had also heard that brewers yeast
also caused yeast in dogs, ears, and wherever else they get yeasty. Garlic
in small doses maybe for fleas, but we've never had a flea problem so we
don't use any preventatives of any kind.
--
Tina Berry
Kriegshund German Shepherds
Working Lines ~ Naturally Reared
www.kriegshundgsds.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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12a. Re: Non bone eating dog
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:42 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Michele!
Adult dogs that have been kibble fed, or home cooked fed (read soft,
or easily swallowed without the need to crunch) their entire lives
often "don't get" that the bone in their meal is for chewing.
This is especially true, ime, with smaller dogs who don't have a
strong "I have to chew" drive.
Your dog should have some bone, about 10% is all that is needed. Does
she chew up the gristly ends of the bones at all?
What kinds of bones is she getting?
Offering Game hens, whose bones are much softer than older chicken
bones, might help her realize they are for chewing up. Small whole
fish can provide easily consumed bone, too. Rabbit & quail as meals,
and chicken feet as chew toys can all be offered as sources of
smaller, more easily crunched up bones.
HTH
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> My bichon is a non bone eater-is this strange, I think so. I am not
> sure what can I do to make it more appealing. Maybe I should add some
> of that bbq sauce and beer on it -lol
>
> Michele
>

Messages in this topic (2)
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13a. Re: Hi
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 3:50 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Lee!
DITTO for what Melissa said!!!!
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Lee Schlesinger"
> <ienjoybeingagirl@> wrote:
> I give her ground chicken, which includes the skin and bones, ground
> lamb, eggs including the shells, 1/2 c. ground vegetables, ( which I
> heard I need to cook from now on) safflower oil, and Ezekiel bread,
> which is flourless, and garlic, sometimes parsley, and ginger and
> pumpkin. I do not cook any of the meat. I pour some boiling water on
> the food to warm it and give her a few kibbles ( per my vets idea to
> get more vitamins). I also give her raw lamb bones from the butcher
> and sometimes marrow bones, if they are out of the lamb bones. I put
> a vitamin in the food 1 for the 7 day or so supply. A dog vitamin.
> **************
> Wow, that's a lot of work! I used to home cook too, until I realized
> how unnecessary it all was. Everything your dog needs is in raw
> meat, bone, and organs. All that other stuff, she really doesn't
> need it. Not cooking required. What type of marrow bones are you
> feeding? Many of those types of bones can damage the teeth. It
> would be better for your dog to eat a hunk of meat with some edible
> bones and cartilage.
>
> Kibble is pretty much crap, I would ditch it ASAP. You are already
> giving a doggie vitamin, which you also don't really need to do, by
> the way. So there is no sense in feeding kibble for the vitamins
> that it doesn't really contain anyway.
>
> > I have a 15 pound min. poodle. She eats everything. But loves this
> food more of course than the kibble.
> **************
> Smart dog! :-) >
>
> > I am NOT at a stage where I just want to feed her a BARF sort of
> diet.
> **************
> I don't do BARF either. The people on this list feed prey model raw -
> a lot of meat, some bone and some organs. What's holding you back?
> There is a ton of info in the archives that you can read. The people
> on this list are extremely helpful and would be happy to address your
> concerns.
>
> -Melissa W
>

Messages in this topic (25)
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