[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11769

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
From: babyboyfila1

2a. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: Laurie Swanson
2b. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: costrowski75
2c. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: arnereil
2d. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: mwood8402
2e. Re: New to group: be gentle
From: Andrea

3a. Re: Hello everyone- update on a Newbie
From: Patrice Quinn

4a. Re: Are you in Arizona?
From: Patrice Quinn
4b. Re: Are you in Arizona?
From: Andrea

5a. My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: Tracy
5b. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: seaneboyee
5c. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: shane clays
5d. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
From: Andrea

6a. Re: Why does a dog throw up bits of bone?
From: costrowski75
6b. Re: Why does a dog throw up bits of bone?
From: Susanne MacLeod

7. Venison and goopy poo
From: chickendido2006

8a. Bone in butts & loins... help!
From: Terri Leist
8b. Re: Bone in butts & loins... help!
From: Andrea

9a. Hi
From: Lee Schlesinger
9b. Re: Hi
From: mwood8402
9c. Re: Hi
From: Sandee Lee

10a. Re: Thanks, Chris O.
From: taytotblade

11. Non bone eating dog
From: mob1043

12. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
From: cbdjmac@aol.com

13. Info with Pancreatitis
From: raffiangel2

Messages
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1a. Re: Hello everyone...update on a newbie
Posted by: "babyboyfila1" babyboyfila1@yahoo.com babyboyfila1
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 10:27 am ((PDT))

>
Why do you feel the need to add these things anyway? Just curious.
>
> -Melissa W
>
To be perfectly honest...I don't know.. (scratching my head and
looking like I am thinking)
Dawn

Messages in this topic (3)
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2a. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 10:44 am ((PDT))

Hi Arne,

Yes, soup bones are often available at stores, but you really don't
want them. My dog and many others have chipped or broken and removed
teeth from not knowing better--those dense cow, bison, buffalo bones
are too hard for dogs' teeth.

For dental hygiene, the best thing is a hunk of animal with meat,
cartilage, and bone. The bigger and more awkward, the better. That
way, they have to sink their teeth in and work at ripping, tearing,
gnawing, scraping...

So, I'd say just go for it! :-) If you want to start really simply,
go get a few half or whole chickens and feed them (preferably
the "unenhanced" kind, to minimize any potential digestive problems).

Raw doesn't mix with kibble very well (digestively), but if you need
to start slow, go ahead--do what you need to do. A better
alternative would be to switch to feeding a very simple and easy raw
diet for a couple weeks and then if you really don't like it, you can
always go back (of course, not what we'd encourage here, though!).
But that might be a way to keep from being overwhelmed. And you will
probably see how great it is and then we can help you work out any
kinks, add variety, etc.

What do you think?

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
> First question for now is, i would like to get her a bone to chew
on, as she
> has some plaque on her cannines...

Messages in this topic (6)
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2b. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 10:45 am ((PDT))

"arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
i would like to get her a bone to chew on, as she
> has some plaque on her cannines...
>
> Are soup bones available at stores? Or do you just ask the butcher
at stop
> and shop for a bone for your dog.
>
> I want to get into this slowly, so don't want a ton of
information... just,
> how do I get a couple of bones for her to start....
*****
You can go slowly if you must to but that doesn't mean you should go
slowly unwisely. Soup bones are unwise. They are dense weight-
bearing cow bones and they can break teeth and cause constipation or
other digestive distress. You'd likely wind up with a fat dog with
busted teeth and a bad tummy, which would not be making progress.

If you want to feed healthy bones, feed bones that carry adequate
meat (like, a lot) and are consumable at least to some degree. If
you want to feed healthy meaty bones (because you want to do it right
and responsibly) then you need to knock the kibble out of the
picture. At the very least do not feed kibble and edible meaty bones
remotely close to each other.

Here's how you do it with without a ton of information--
1. ditch the kibble
2. buy a chicken
3. feed it

Also, I am mixing kibble and green beans.... and going to get some
EVO
> kibble and start adding raw over time.
*****
I recommend you skip the green beans. Dry dogfood by definition must
be almost 50% carbohydrate simply to produce the extrusion that is
baked into kibble. Since your dog has NO nutritional need for ANY
carbohydrate, adding even more (via green beans) is counterproductive
and unhealthy.

Feed less, feed a healthy diet, come to terms with your "ease into
it" mind set. I'm not sure at all what you hope to gain from it.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (6)
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2c. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "arnereil" arnereil@cox.net uncle_nevil
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:07 pm ((PDT))

Just to be sure I got this right, I should go buy a chicken breast
(remember, I'm starting slow) and just toss it to Gretta?

I know you are just giving an opinion, but I want to be sure I got this
straight...

Also, if beef, what cheap cut might I look for.?

I just lost my spouse, who did ALL the shopping for 23 years, so am not only
new to raw, but new to shopping....
.
Arne

Messages in this topic (6)
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2d. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "mwood8402" mwood8402@hotmail.com mwood8402
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:01 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
>
> Just to be sure I got this right, I should go buy a chicken breast
> (remember, I'm starting slow) and just toss it to Gretta?
*********
Sure! Rib in breast is what I started with. If your dog has a
sensitive tummy like mine, you may want to remove the skin at first.
You can also buy whole chickens and hack them up into meal sized
portions and feed. What size is your dog?

> I just lost my spouse, who did ALL the shopping for 23 years, so am
not only
> new to raw, but new to shopping....
**********
I'm sorry about your loss. Raw feeding is actually really easy. I
know you'll get the hang of it.

-Melissa W

Messages in this topic (6)
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2e. Re: New to group: be gentle
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:11 pm ((PDT))

Sure, bone in chicken breast would be a good starter, but you can go
one better (and cheaper) by getting a whole chicken and cutting it into
quarters. They also sell cut up whole chickens (called fryers if
memory serves) if you aren't up for cutting the chicken apart just
yet. Whichever you choose will work fine. Just feed through the
chicken for a couple of weeks before moving on to another meat source.

You could start with beef, but I rarely find it at reasonable prices
(trying to keep $1/lb or below). Any large meaty roast would work.
It's more difficult to find beef with edible bone as well, beef neck
and beef ribs are the only ones I can think of offhand and they usually
are lacking in the meat area. But you can feed the bony meals with a
side of meaty meat if you want. Oh, and beef heart is usually a good,
inexpensive meaty meat as well.

What kind of dog is Gretta? The smaller the dog, the less likely
she'll be able to power through the beef bones. Chicken bones are soft
enough for even the smallest of dogs.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "arnereil" <arnereil@...> wrote:
>
> Just to be sure I got this right, I should go buy a chicken breast
> (remember, I'm starting slow) and just toss it to Gretta?

Messages in this topic (6)
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3a. Re: Hello everyone- update on a Newbie
Posted by: "Patrice Quinn" patrice@patricequinn.com patrice_quinn
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 10:45 am ((PDT))

May I concur? For the last eight months I put myself through a time and
work intensive bi-weekly process of cooking a large quantity of meat,
giblets, liver (10%), grinding it all up, then adding cooked rice and
veggies and finely ground eggshells. What a pain!! Since the first day
putting our three on raw life has become SO much easier and more natural and
our dogs enjoy eating like it's a new form of recreation! Patrice

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Messages in this topic (2)
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4a. Re: Are you in Arizona?
Posted by: "Patrice Quinn" patrice@patricequinn.com patrice_quinn
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 10:48 am ((PDT))

Wow, humidity as far inland as Fresno? Would it be o.k. for me to feed my
three frozen chicken parts? What breed is Geiger (I can see him laying his
head on the frozen food--cute). Have a good weekend, Patrice

-------Original Message-------

From: Andrea
Date: 7/6/2007 9:51:17 AM
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [rawfeeding] Re: Are you in Arizona?

I'm in the Central Valley of California, Fresno to be specific. There
aren't many raw feeders in the area, and a lot of those still feed the
vomit style ground stuff, but I'm slowly working on those in my co-op
to order more than just backs and necks.

I don't think we've gotten to 110 yet, but it has been humid as all get
out, which is unusual. I was starting to get concerned that Geiger
wasn't eating as much until my bf reminded me that he didn't eat as
much last summer either. He is more likely to eat when I feed him
frozen during these hot days, but sometimes he just likes to put his
head on the frozen food.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "patrice_quinn" <patrice@...> wrote:

> *****Wondered if you live near me as we got to 121 Fahreneheit
> yesterday. Needless to say, the dogs stay inside right now except
> for trips to their outdoor enclosure to relieve themselves and chase
> the occasional lizard (never caught). Patrice
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (7)
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4b. Re: Are you in Arizona?
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:14 pm ((PDT))

Most dogs do fine with frozen food, though some don't like it as much.
You need to be careful with small breed dogs because the cold food can
drop their body temps too low. Geiger is a German Shorthaired Pointer
mix, about 65lbs. My sister has a Chi that would get too chilled with
even semi-frozen foods.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Patrice Quinn" <patrice@...> wrote:
>
> Wow, humidity as far inland as Fresno? Would it be o.k. for me to
feed my
> three frozen chicken parts? What breed is Geiger (I can see him
laying his
> head on the frozen food--cute). Have a good weekend, Patrice

Messages in this topic (7)
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5a. My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "Tracy" tracy.ramey@sbcglobal.net veganmomma1
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 11:00 am ((PDT))

My one year old lab ALWAYS seems hungry. She weighs about 65lbs, so I
give her a pound to a pound 1/2 a day. Actually, I think she's getting
more than that. This is our 2nd week of raw, so we're still on chicken
mainly. She gets little bits of beef just so I can slowly introduce
that to her. She's not too active, so I don't think I'm under feeding
her, but I don't know. She eats her food very quickly, even if it's
half a chicken frozen solid. When she's done, she wanders around the
kitchen checking out the counter top (and there's never any food there)
or begging for food I'm eating, or trying to steal the food my mini
schnauzer is eating (which never happens because the mini is a bit of a
tough little punk). I feed her twice a day. Would it maybe be better to
feed her once so she can get more food at one sitting? I try not to
give in and give her more food, but she literally will not sit down.
She justs keeps looking for more. She's going to put me in the poor
house at this rate! Any advice would be wonderful. Thanks!

Tracy

Messages in this topic (4)
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5b. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "seaneboyee" seaneboyee@yahoo.com seaneboyee
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:09 pm ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: PLEASE SIGN YOUR MESSAGES.***

How active is your dog? You may be underfeeding due to high activity
levels. I'm on my third week of raw and initially my 17-month old
would lick the bowl clean in under a minute probably thinking because
it was so new. He then started slowing down and enjoys it more than
inhales it. You may want to do a gorge/fast as many others are doing
and see how much he will eat in one sitting and adjust it from there.
All of the labs that I know eat a lot in general and are very active.

Messages in this topic (4)
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5c. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "shane clays" shane_clays@yahoo.com shane_clays
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:10 pm ((PDT))

Its a lab..... my advice it to ingnore her. Make sure you are not overfeeding. Keep an eye on how she looks (ribs, layer of fat etc) and keep her looking healthy but lean. I have 100+ pound male lab that will eat as much as I will give him. After a huge meal, he will act like he has not eaten for days. Its what labs do. He ate a 3.5 pound chicken, then finished off another half a chicken my other dog did not finish, then was begging 10 minutes later...... if it really bothers you, train her to lay in one area of the house while you are eating/cooking etc so she is not under your feet or in your lap while you cook/eat.

Remember, your the boss. You decide when, where and how much.... even when they are giving you that super cute starving Labrador, please feed me look.....

Shane C.
Phx, AZ

Tracy <tracy.ramey@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
My one year old lab ALWAYS seems hungry. She justs keeps looking for more. She's going to put me in the poor
house at this rate! Any advice would be wonderful. Thanks!

Tracy

---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (4)
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5d. Re: My lab is eating me out of house and home!
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:03 pm ((PDT))

Absolutely feed her once a day instead of two. In fact, it would
probably help to feed her once every other day so she can actually
get full. For now give a whole chicken and let her have at it.
She'll probably eat the whole thing with no problem. Once you go on
to pork and she's ok with it, give her a whole pork shoulder. Once
she learns what it feels like to be full, it is likely she won't be
so frantic about finding food. I know lots of people think their dog
will eat until they burst, but you never know until you try, right?
Worst case scenario, she eats too much and tosses a little back up in
a half hour or so. (Geiger did this once, I just put the extras in a
baggie and he ate it the next day.)

Really, offering her larger meals will undoubtedly help her. If all
else fails, let her wander around and search for the food she ain't
gonna get.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tracy" <tracy.ramey@...> wrote:
>
> My one year old lab ALWAYS seems hungry.

Messages in this topic (4)
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6a. Re: Why does a dog throw up bits of bone?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 11:46 am ((PDT))

Yasuko herron <sunshine_annamaria@...> wrote:
I was understanding that vomiting bone is because he/she did not chew
small enough and hoking bones out so that he/she can re-chew
again,but it happens with too much bone too?
*****
There are usually several reasons for any behavior. Our goal is to
find out which reason is most appropriate for the circumstance.

If the vomiting promptly follows the eating, it's likely that some
part of the meal was not properly processed through the mouth, yes;
in which case the bones might not have been small enough. Mostly
though I'd say bones that are "too big" are gagged up as they are
trying to go down, not after they're actually swallowed down into the
belly.

What Suz describes sounds more like--to me--a digestive system that
did all the work it could chemically do on a meal but did not do
enough. This is not necessarily related to bone size, since some
mighty large bones have gone down, stayed down and digested
completely. It might be related to bone density though.

I was undertsanding that too much bone means chalky crumbly
poop,but did not think about it connects to vomiting.
*****
Chalky, crumbly poops indicate DIGESTED bone if the amount digested
was calcium in excess of what the dog needed. That's too much
dietary bone. Bone bit vomiting is about too much UNDIGESTED bone.

If the dog's system cannot move the bone along through the digestion
process, then the dog's natural inclination (it's not even a thought
process but rather an automatic physiological response) is to get rid
of the bone bits the other way.

> Other thing I learnt here for vomiting is that vomiting yellow
bile is for humgry tummy.
*****
Again, there is almost always more than one reason for a given
behavior.

Vomit that is only yellow bile are often an indication that digestive
juices were evoked but not employed. We see this when a dog
accustomed to eating at a certain time is not fed when it expects to
be fed. We are also apt to see this if a dog does not get the snack
or meal or treat or leftovers it has been anticipating.

Vomit that is both yellow bile and undigested bone bits is a result
of the bile being generated in an attempt to fully digest the bone
but not being used, for some reason or another. Yellow bile and
undigested bone can also be a sign of unfulfilled food anticipation
plus an indigestible object, both of which serve to irritant the
stomach tissue (think maybe about a finger with a festering splinter
that you pour alcohol on!).

> Anyway,vomiting occur when dogs are hungry or too much bone or
when fed too densed bone?
*****
It's not simply hunger that initiates yellow bile vomiting. It's
hunger produced by expectation and then denied fulfillment. A phrase
often used in the US that might explain this response is "all dressed
up and nowhere to go".

Anything irritating is ejected. Bile, bone bits, grass, pebbles--
doesn't matter: up it all comes. That's what vomiting is about.

> > Is it possible that if or when the food did not agree to
dogs,do they vomit?
*****
Well, that's it entirely. The only thing to determine is WHY did the
bone not agree with the dog? And that is often a hard question to
answer.

> How do you tell difference between food really do not agree with
dogs and need to pull out the protin from feeding plan and just need
to get used to the new protin?
*****
Good question. I don't think you can know, right away; you have to
try out different proteins and try out different way to present the
protein that you think maybe are causing problems. However, and I
may be wrong here, I think most vomiting episodes are not about
allergy or food sensitivity but are caused by actual physical
irritation--too cold, too hot, too strange, feels funny, tastes
funny, etc.

> I think if dog needs to get use to new protin,it will be with
diarrhea/with soft poop and eventually firm up the poop,but if the
food did not agree with dogs,then what happen? Vomiting?Diarrhea?Both?
*****
I think you are right about the loose stool; but the term "food does
not agree" is too broad to be useful. It's OBVIOUS the food doesn't
agree with the dog, our job as responsible and caring raw feeders is
to figure what exactly it is that is disagreeable.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (8)
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6b. Re: Why does a dog throw up bits of bone?
Posted by: "Susanne MacLeod" suzmacleod@rogers.com skull25ca
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:59 pm ((PDT))

US that might explain this response is "all dressed
> up and nowhere to go".
****Chris...thanks for the afternoon laugh!
Suz

Messages in this topic (8)
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7. Venison and goopy poo
Posted by: "chickendido2006" chickendido@hotmail.com chickendido2006
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:10 pm ((PDT))

I fed my 2 Yorkies venison for the first time yesterday. I'm still
pretty new at this and so far they tolerated chicken and beef with no
problems. A friend of my husband goes hunting all the time and was kind
enough to bring us some. At first my dogs just sniffed it but
eventually ate it. My puppy especially liked it and I'm afraid she ate
too much! Neither dog pooped yesterday (my older one still hasn't) and
the puppy finally went this morning, but she had to strain really hard
to get it out, but most of it got stuck to her rear end. When I cleaned
her up I noticed that the poop was very sticky, thick and goopy like.
And now her little anus is all irritated and red. What went wrong and
what should I do next as I still have venison meat left that I wanted
to give them today! I would guess the meat to bone ratio was 90/10 at
both feedings. Another question, the longer they've been on raw the
less their poops get. They only poop once or twice a day now, my older
one sometimes even goes 2 days without it. Is that normal? They don't
seem bothered by it. Could anybody please help me?

Thanks
Nadia

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8a. Bone in butts & loins... help!
Posted by: "Terri Leist" qahri@sbcglobal.net qahri
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:16 pm ((PDT))

When you get a pork butt or shoulder, or whatever they always have the bone in. Well, I think these are the "wreck" bones & I have noticed that 1 of my labs teeth are starting to wear down & she's only 2years old. The pork stuff is usually what I get for 99c or so, & that is a financially important part of the girls' diet. Do you guys cut those out before you feed them??? Do you let them have them & take it away after a certain time??

For the sake of my girls teeth, let me know please.

Oh on another note, kind of; I get free beef rib bones, those are NOT wreck bones right??

Terri & the Raw Fed-"Muttly Crew" Kadin & Lilly:
Learn how: www.rawfeddogs.net

www.rawfed.com

www.rawmeatybones.com

Over exposure to the SON; actually PREVENTS burning!!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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8b. Re: Bone in butts & loins... help!
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:00 pm ((PDT))

If it is bone covered in a healthy amount of meat I wouldn't consider
them "wreck" bones. Pork bones are usually completely edible for a
lab. Are her molar type teeth wearing down or is it the front set?
If it is the front teeth I would suspect some other culprit (like
tennis balls). My mom's lab has bad allergies and has been chewing
himself pretty much his entire life (except for the few months I was
able to raw feed him). His front teeth are really worn down from all
of the chewing.

For my pups I leave the bone in and they consume all of it with no
problem. If they strip the meat off and leave the bare bone to gnaw
on I let them have it for a day or so before it goes in the trash.

Are the rib bones single barenekkid bones? If they are I would pass
on them. If it is a slab of ribs they would be fine.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Terri Leist <qahri@...> wrote:
>
> When you get a pork butt or shoulder, or whatever they always have
> the bone in. Well, I think these are the "wreck" bones & I have
> noticed that 1 of my labs teeth are starting to wear down & she's
> only 2years old.

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9a. Hi
Posted by: "Lee Schlesinger" ienjoybeingagirl@cox.net kokapellis
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:16 pm ((PDT))

I enjoy reading the emails. I have started my dog on a home cooking diet. I went to a class that told me how to cook food for my dogs. I give her ground chicken, which includes the skin and bones, ground lamb, eggs including the shells, 1/2 c. ground vegetables, ( which I heard I need to cook from now on) safflower oil, and Ezekiel bread, which is flourless, and garlic, sometimes parsley, and ginger and pumpkin. I do not cook any of the meat. I pour some boiling water on the food to warm it and give her a few kibbles ( per my vets idea to get more vitamins). I also give her raw lamb bones from the butcher and sometimes marrow bones, if they are out of the lamb bones. I put a vitamin in the food 1 for the 7 day or so supply. A dog vitamin.

I have a 15 pound min. poodle. She eats everything. But loves this food more of course than the kibble.

I am NOT at a stage where I just want to feed her a BARF sort of diet. Does anyone else follow this in-between sort of method I am doing?

I want to get the Dr. Pitcairn book to use some of his recipes that I heard about in the Whole Dog Journal as well.

Your feedback will be appreciated.!

Lee and Mystique (the gorgeous black poodle, lol)

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9b. Re: Hi
Posted by: "mwood8402" mwood8402@hotmail.com mwood8402
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:00 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Lee Schlesinger"
<ienjoybeingagirl@...> wrote:
I give her ground chicken, which includes the skin and bones, ground
lamb, eggs including the shells, 1/2 c. ground vegetables, ( which I
heard I need to cook from now on) safflower oil, and Ezekiel bread,
which is flourless, and garlic, sometimes parsley, and ginger and
pumpkin. I do not cook any of the meat. I pour some boiling water on
the food to warm it and give her a few kibbles ( per my vets idea to
get more vitamins). I also give her raw lamb bones from the butcher
and sometimes marrow bones, if they are out of the lamb bones. I put
a vitamin in the food 1 for the 7 day or so supply. A dog vitamin.
**************
Wow, that's a lot of work! I used to home cook too, until I realized
how unnecessary it all was. Everything your dog needs is in raw
meat, bone, and organs. All that other stuff, she really doesn't
need it. Not cooking required. What type of marrow bones are you
feeding? Many of those types of bones can damage the teeth. It
would be better for your dog to eat a hunk of meat with some edible
bones and cartilage.

Kibble is pretty much crap, I would ditch it ASAP. You are already
giving a doggie vitamin, which you also don't really need to do, by
the way. So there is no sense in feeding kibble for the vitamins
that it doesn't really contain anyway.

> I have a 15 pound min. poodle. She eats everything. But loves this
food more of course than the kibble.
**************
Smart dog! :-) >

> I am NOT at a stage where I just want to feed her a BARF sort of
diet.
**************
I don't do BARF either. The people on this list feed prey model raw -
a lot of meat, some bone and some organs. What's holding you back?
There is a ton of info in the archives that you can read. The people
on this list are extremely helpful and would be happy to address your
concerns.

-Melissa W

Messages in this topic (24)
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9c. Re: Hi
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:32 pm ((PDT))

Hi Lee,

I don't understand what the point is of going to a lot of needless work,
cooking inappropriate foods that are not beneficial to your pet when you
could just hand her a chicken and be done with it. Easy, nutritious, full
of the vitamins and minerals she requires, satisfying her needs and cleaning
her teeth and gums without resorting to marrow bones will result in tooth
damage.

She is a carnivore and as such *requires* raw meat, bones and organs. Dogs
have no need for carbohydrates...even the dog food manufactures and vets
(including Pitcairn) recognize that fact but continue to push their horrible
diets. So dump the veggies, bread, safflower oil, parsley, ginger and
pumpkin and just hand her a nice chunk of chicken or lamb. No grinding
necessary.

I agree about not feeding BARF...Yuck!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Lee Schlesinger" <ienjoybeingagirl@cox.net>

> I enjoy reading the emails. I have started my dog on a home cooking diet.
I went to a class that told me how to cook food for my dogs. I give her
ground chicken, which includes the skin and bones, ground lamb, eggs
including the shells, 1/2 c. ground vegetables, ( which I heard I need to
cook from now on) safflower oil, and Ezekiel bread, which is flourless, and
garlic, sometimes parsley, and ginger and pumpkin. I do not cook any of the
meat. I pour some boiling water on the food to warm it and give her a few
kibbles ( per my vets idea to get more vitamins). I also give her raw lamb
bones from the butcher and sometimes marrow bones, if they are out of the
lamb bones. I put a vitamin in the food 1 for the 7 day or so supply. A dog
vitamin.
>
> I have a 15 pound min. poodle. She eats everything. But loves this food
more of course than the kibble.
>
> I am NOT at a stage where I just want to feed her a BARF sort of diet.
Does anyone else follow this in-between sort of method I am doing?

Messages in this topic (24)
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10a. Re: Thanks, Chris O.
Posted by: "taytotblade" michael@elegant-software.com taytotblade
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 12:18 pm ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: WE MODS LOVE YOU BACK BUT PLEASE TRIM YOUR MESSAGES.***

I am new to raw feeding and just started on the 1st. My dog had a lot of diarrhea for about
3 months and there were many issues... My vet did not suggest RAW but was going to
keep her on Metronadizole or digestive enzymes.... It looked bleak.

I finally tried raw venizon patties at a pet store--WITH MUCH SKEPTICISM-- but, it really
was my last hope. Within a few days there was a lot of improvement: increased appetite,
less stools and no diarrhea. Of course, the prefab raw
is costing me 12$/day and I can only afford that for now (as sort of the cost of medicine). I
subscribed to this group and I feel more more comfortable about feeding raw (where I
don't have to buy those prefab raw patties). Today my pup got her first chicken back and
had no problem with it. I hope to phase out the patties and be putting together her meals
on my own soon.

Anyway: you all who answer questions on the list are doing such a great service. Thank
you so much.

I feel optimistic that my (working) dog will thrive on this diet and I will keep reading the
posts on this list for ideas and suggestions.

THANK YOU! You are an incredible and needed resource.

Michael

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mary" <dobesrcool@...> wrote:
>
> I also totality agree with you these people are a wonderful grp.don't know what we
would do w/o them.
>
> Mary H
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Laurie
> To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 5:07 AM
> Subject: [rawfeeding] Re: Thanks, Chris O.
>
>
> I couldn't agree more!!
>
> Laurie
>
> >
> > Just want to say THANK YOU, Chris and the rest of you veterans of raw
> > feeding, you are an invaluable resource for all of us who are just
> learning
> > the ropes. It must get tedious at times to deal with the same
> questions
> > over and over yet you and others who have been over this for years
> give your
> > time and patience so that countless others may have the chance to get
> it
> > right for the benefit of our beloved companions. And you're funny
> too!
> > Thanks again, Patrice Quinn
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Messages in this topic (6)
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11. Non bone eating dog
Posted by: "mob1043" ynotbeastar@marykay.com mob1043
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:00 pm ((PDT))

My bichon is a non bone eater-is this strange, I think so. I am not
sure what can I do to make it more appealing. Maybe I should add some
of that bbq sauce and beer on it -lol

Michele

Messages in this topic (1)
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12. Question...seeking second opinion <G>
Posted by: "cbdjmac@aol.com" cbdjmac@aol.com gr24k
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:15 pm ((PDT))

Hi gang,
I have a question...I'm kind of seeking a second opinion before I toss out
forty pounds of Chicken necks! I have chicken necks that were given to me and
they smell a tad off...or a little stinky. The case was frozen and the person
who gave them to me had thawed them overnight and the bottom ones got a
little warm I guess before she was going to use them...the top was however still
cold. I rescued them from before they were thrown out and then began to
think...do I want to give my dogs some chicken necks that smell stinky? How about
it...do you think they would be safe or bad.

Carole with 40 pounds of stinky chicken and it kills me to toss but will if
need be <g>

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (1)
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13. Info with Pancreatitis
Posted by: "raffiangel2" snazgal@aol.com raffiangel2
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2007 1:29 pm ((PDT))

I have a great friend who has an adorable Westy...who has
Pancreatitis...I've tried discussing raw with her as a help, but she's
flat out not interested.
Knowing third party testimonials are better then one on one, could you
help me out here and tell how raw has helped/cured/ and necessary for a
dog with pancreatitis??
I'm having a ball watching my 2 goldens love their raw...and having
even more fun getting on my bandwagon when people mention how gorgeous
my dogs are and what do I feed them lol...I do my 10 minutes and
usually get at least a 50% conversion...I love it...thanks to you all I
have answers to all their silly reasons why not to switch.
Phyllis

Messages in this topic (1)
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