Feed Pets Raw Food: [rawfeeding] Digest Number 12389

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: fasting question
From: costrowski75
1b. Re: fasting question
From: Sandee Lee

2a. Re: How much fish oil?
From: addicted 2 my pc
2b. Re: How much fish oil?
From: sdwhippets@aim.com

3a. throwing up deer meat
From: b3goldens
3b. Re: throwing up deer meat
From: Giselle

4a. Re: Ice storm opportunities
From: mozookpr
4b. ADMIN/Re: Ice storm opportunities
From: costrowski75

5a. Re: Chicken...a cannon butt proof meal? - Slippery Elm
From: laura.wimpey

6a. ready to throw the towel...
From: ma_petite_gazelle
6b. Re: ready to throw the towel...
From: Chia
6c. Re: ready to throw the towel...
From: Sonja

7. Yesterday he bacame a ...
From: helpshelteranimals

8. Looking for peoples experience
From: Sue Colvin

9a. Re: Finding meat
From: Lauren Funaiole

10a. Re: chicken liver
From: Kelly
10b. Re: chicken liver
From: Chia
10c. Re: chicken liver
From: K Carolyn Ramamurti

11a. Re: Looking for people's feeding experiences
From: Sai Simonson

12. {Raw Feeding} Question
From: Brandi Bryant

13. Re: Almost raw for humans
From: Sai Simonson

14a. pork shoulder
From: spricketysprock

15. Does anyone here co-op?
From: Carrie (Milton) Mularoni

16a. Re: A newbie here!
From: mozookpr

17. the best grinders.....
From: Michelle R

Messages
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1a. Re: fasting question
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:47 am ((PST))

"geraldinebutterfield" <gbutterflied@...> wrote:
>
> I understand fasting one day a month is good for dogs, it's also good
> for people. How old should the dog be before I start this routine?
*****
Far as I know, "fasting" is a philosophical construct that doesn't
apply to dogs. Your dog is capable of eating small meals every day and
it's capable of eating big meals few and far between. The days when a
dog doesn't eat (between those big meals) is not fasting, it's
just "not eating".

If you are not feeding big meals that warrant skipping meals before
and/or afterward, there is no reason to "fast" your dog. Meals should
determine skipped meals. No big meals? No need to skip one.

Fasting once a month isn't going to hurt your dog but there's sure no
reason for him to do it.

OTOH, skipping a meal to give an upset tummy time to settle isn't a bad
notion. And missing a meal because life just got too complicated at
dinnertime is also fine and dandy and sensible. There are in fact good
reasons to skip meals. Because "fasting is good for dogs" isn't one of
them.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (3)
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1b. Re: fasting question
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:49 am ((PST))

Nah.....no reason to fast unless you are feeding gorge meals, then you might
want to skip a day or feed light the next day.
Glad she's doing great! :)

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "geraldinebutterfield" <gbutterflied@comcast.net>

I understand fasting one day a month is good for dogs, it's also good
for people. How old should the dog be before I start this routine? Is
it ok to give her chicken or beef broth during this time or just water.
My little maltipoo is doing GREAT on RMB!!!

Messages in this topic (3)
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2a. Re: How much fish oil?
Posted by: "addicted 2 my pc" mmoy1191@tpg.com.au jmoylan1952
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:01 am ((PST))

good question hmmm i give my two large dogs one each day, mebe more needed not sure?
Jen
----- Original Message -----
From: blueberry5297
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 1:40 PM
Subject: [rawfeeding] How much fish oil?

+++Mod note: pls sign emails ++++

I'm nto sure if this is a silly question, but is there a general rule
of thumb for how many fish oil capsules should be given a day/week by
weight of the dog?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
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2b. Re: How much fish oil?
Posted by: "sdwhippets@aim.com" sdwhippets@aim.com krysprohandler
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:20 am ((PST))

I believe I asked this on a different list before and the answer I got
(not sure if this is true or not) is that the 'norm' is to give it once
and day and since it's an oil, anything that the body doesn't need, the
body will extract. I give them to my dogs (I have Whippets - about a
medium sized dog along with 2 small dogs - give the same amount to all)
once a day and they love them - ALL of them think they are treats and
will take them and eat them - you can hear them pop in their mouths :)
I'll have to double check the actual amount that is in the capsule but
I know it's the larger one :)

Krys

****I'm nto sure if this is a silly question, but is there a general
rule

of thumb for how many fish oil capsules should be given a day/week by

weight of the dog?****

-----Original Message-----
From: addicted 2 my pc <mmoy1191@tpg.com.au>
To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 11:57 am
Subject: Re: [rawfeeding] How much fish oil?

good question hmmm i give my two large dogs one each day, mebe more
needed not sure?

Jen

----- Original Message -----

From: blueberry5297

To: rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 1:40 PM

Subject: [rawfeeding] How much fish oil?

+++Mod note: pls sign emails ++++

I'm nto sure if this is a silly question, but is there a general rule

of thumb for how many fish oil capsules should be given a day/week by

weight of the dog?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Messages in this topic (3)
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3a. throwing up deer meat
Posted by: "b3goldens" b3goldens@nc.rr.com b3goldens
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:20 am ((PST))

Hi All,
I've been feeding raw for a few years but just recently trying to broaden my GR's exposure
to other meats. She eats mostly chicken, turkey and fish now so I am looking forward to
adding pork, beef, etc. I gave her some deer meat from a friends hunting leftovers and she
ate it up right away. Unfortunately, about 2 hours later she threw up about 3 different times
a pretty good amount (i.e. the whole meal).
In the past if she ever did throw up chicken (rarely) she would eat it back up. She does not
seem interested in doing it with the deer meat.
Should I try again tomorrow, wait a few days and try again, or is she telling me she's not
interested in the deer at all?
Can I feed her something else today?
Thanks for any advice!

Glenda

Messages in this topic (2)
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3b. Re: throwing up deer meat
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:33 am ((PST))

Hi, Glenda!
More than likely, its just a case of too much new food at
once.

I'd add a bit, maybe a couple small chunks, to her next regular meal. I'd
add it to a chicken or turkey meal. If that stays down, and has no digestive
repercussions, I'd add a few more chunks to the next meal. I'd continue on
this way, adding more of the venison, and less of the main meat, until its
reversed, and you are feeding all venison.

Was the venison mostly meat? If there were significant amounts of fat or
organs in the venison scraps, I'd try to eliminate some of the fat, or at
least sort it into smaller servings. Same with organs, divide it up into
smaller bits and feed sparingly, witha know well tolerated protein.

With this horking up of a new protein as your guide, I'd be cautious and
introduce pork and beef and any other new protein the same way, slowly and
gradually.

I'd fast her for the rest of today, maybe feed some ls/lf broth, and start
over again tomorrow.

HTH
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

On Dec 17, 2007 1:09 PM, b3goldens <b3goldens@nc.rr.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
> I've been feeding raw for a few years but just recently trying to broaden
> my GR's exposure
> to other meats. She eats mostly chicken, turkey and fish now so I am
> looking forward to
> adding pork, beef, etc. I gave her some deer meat from a friends hunting
> leftovers and she
> ate it up right away. Unfortunately, about 2 hours later she threw up
> about 3 different times
> a pretty good amount (i.e. the whole meal).
> <snip>
> Can I feed her something else today?
> Thanks for any advice!
>
> Glenda
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
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4a. Re: Ice storm opportunities
Posted by: "mozookpr" mozookpr@yahoo.com mozookpr
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:32 am ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Morledzep@... wrote:
>
> ***i don't understand this.. i would think in an ice storm folks
when folks
> lose electricity they would think to pull the food out of their
freezers and
> refrigerators and put it in boxes outside or in the garage to keep
it cold and
> keep it from spoiling.
>

I thought of that, too, but the fact is, not everyone has a garage,
and putting meat outside is a good way to attract possums, coyotes,
and stray dogs and cats. A hungry raccoon, especially, can open any
container that is not padlocked shut.

Nothing wrong with feeding these critters, but it does sort of defeat
the purpose of saving the meat.

Cheers,

Wendy

Messages in this topic (4)
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4b. ADMIN/Re: Ice storm opportunities
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:34 am ((PST))

This is meandering into foreign territory. Please take the topic to
RawChat or discuss ice storm repercussions privately.
Thanks.
Chris O
Mod Squad

Messages in this topic (4)
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5a. Re: Chicken...a cannon butt proof meal? - Slippery Elm
Posted by: "laura.wimpey" laura.wimpey@yahoo.com laura.wimpey
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:34 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...>
wrote:

> Bottom line? If you believe your dog is uncomfortable, by all
means
> use SEP.
> Chris O
>

This is right on with my perspective of SEP as well. It's more of an
emotional salve for you while also having the added benefit of
allowing your dog to be more comfortable while 'blowing out' a
digestive problem. Administering SEP during intial digestive upsets
with my kids (digestive upsets caused by my overzealous rawfeeding
newbieness) had a greater effect on me than it did on my dogs; I
think. Sure they appreciated having something to settle their
tummies but I was making myself feel like I was a bad owner for
making them uncomfortable when really all they were probably thinking
was "geez can't wait to poop and then I'll feel better" not "mom, you
are horrible for making me feel like this." Plus, when they have
more comfort they stop shooting beseeching looks your way.

Regards,

Laura W.

Messages in this topic (7)
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6a. ready to throw the towel...
Posted by: "ma_petite_gazelle" gaelle6@rogers.com ma_petite_gazelle
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:34 pm ((PST))

Dear all,

I have a almost 7 year old labrador retriever who has been suffering
from allergies since he's about 1. We did some testing back then and
the only thing that came back positive was baker yeast. He was put on
prednisone but then I decided to cut the drugs back and I changed his
food (wellness fish & potatoes) after a while and he did OK for a
couple of years. Had bouts of allergies (scratching, chewing, hot
spots) in the spring and the fall and doesn't do well in places with
carpets, so I have a feeling he also have environmental allergies
(pollen and dust mites would be my guess).
Anyhow...about 3 months ago I discovered Raw feeding and after much
learning I switched him to 100% raw one day. I started with chicken
for a few weeks, and he did very well and his hot spot healed and he
was not scratching anymore.

Since then, I have tried to introduce variety to his food: I tried
pork, beef, turkey, trout, sardines, duck. Each time I buy a little
bit of the new protein source and I mix it with some chicken and I try
for a few days or a week. I have never been able to feed other meats
(with chicken) for longer than a week without seeing bad reactions.
Most of the time, I start seeing symptoms after 2-3 days on the new
protein source (scratching, hot spot, sometimes red spots inside his ear).

So he's back to chicken, once more. He's doing fine on it, but I know
he just can't be on chicken only for the rest of his life. I don't
mind trying other proteins, I still have to try goat and salmon, for
example. But honestly, I'm loosing hope he'll do well on anything but
chicken.

Is there anything else I can do? Am I doing something wrong somehow?
I'm still new at this and I don't understand how he could possibly
react to all these things.

He's getting probiotics every day, BTW (away from his meal).

Thanks in advance for your help. I just don't know what else to do...

Messages in this topic (3)
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6b. Re: ready to throw the towel...
Posted by: "Chia" chia.m@shaw.ca cia22m
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:48 pm ((PST))

#### have you tried lamb?...others may pop in with more thoughts on her
reactions since I have been blessed with an 'iron' stomach dog... :-))

I also think you may want to contact a good homeopath on our sister list,
Classical Homeopathy for Pets. Perhaps, if you liaison with Magda, and
address the symptoms, you can come up with a plan that will ease her
discomfort. Find the root cause of what she endures.

Has she ever had medications, antibiotics, vaccines?.. All of these could
wreak havoc on her system as well but this would be what you could address
with a good homeopath.

Chia & Ricco

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6c. Re: ready to throw the towel...
Posted by: "Sonja" ladyver@sbcglobal.net lonepalm77
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:39 pm ((PST))

Sounds like you have my dog!!!! Stick with chicken if it works for you. It takes a LOT longer to feed variety with a dog that has "allergic" reactions than it does to a dog that doesn't have such problems. I used turkey for months and months because that's what worked. And the only organs I fed were the ones that came with the huge bird. If she had a bad reaction to a new protein, I'd have to wait a month for the resulting lesions to clear up, then I'd try again (with the dog being fed 100% turkey while we let things clear up). I was a bit concerned because her itching got worse with pork and duck, but after the third attempt of trying to introduce those proteins, we finally added it to the list and she's doing OK. She's still not 100%, but she's MUCH better than she was before raw. Now she can eat duck, pork, and turkey. No chicken or beef, though, she gets really bad reactions with those.

It was hard for me, but I ditched the probiotics with the blessing of this group....my dog was dependent on them when she was on kibble. A few weeks ago I thought I'd be smart and try to boost her immune system with the probiotics again (after ditching them 10 months ago or so). Guess what? We got a raging ear infection and more itchies.

I've also been using salmon oil....my dog is pretty sensitive to what's in it and she's only OK with the one that is made of salmon oil and rosemary extract.

I understand your frustration! But 100% diet of chicken is still better than a kibble diet....just keep trying with the variety occasionally and give your dog time to recover if there is a reaction.

I'm still new, so my advice not be 100% endorsed or solid, but it's been working fairly decent for me.

Good luck!
Sonja

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7. Yesterday he bacame a ...
Posted by: "helpshelteranimals" helpshelteranimals@yahoo.com helpshelteranimals
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:34 pm ((PST))

DOG! He tried chicken feel for the first time, threw them up about 10
minutes later, and ATE THEM! This is the very FIRST time since I have
had him at 10 months old that he has eaten something that has been ...
er ... 'expelled'!

Woo hoo!

I didn't think he was a real dog!

AG & Ruffian

Messages in this topic (1)
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8. Looking for peoples experience
Posted by: "Sue Colvin" s.colvin@AUCKLAND.AC.NZ goldpak3
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:53 pm ((PST))

20 years raw feeding and no problem. Oh, except once or twice with lamb
necks which one of the dogs chomped down on and then couldn't easily
extract one of his canines. Came to me for help and I just yanked it
off his tooth gave it back to him and he continued chomping away and
then swallowed. Bone obviously soft and no doubt a good flossing of
the teeth was had. Only happened once or twice, only with lamb necks,
and just the one dog. All dogs get lamb necks regularly.

Gave my dogs each a huge cow tongue, along with sheep heart, and pig
trotter for the meal last Sunday. Ate the heart - easy peasy, grabbed
the tongue and took outside for a good workout. Came back inside, got
the pig trotter, back outside and then one of the dogs put his trotter
down, rolled onto his back, kicked his legs in the air and seemed to
shout for joy 'hey this is the life man' and proceeded to do that for a
few minutes before nibbling for a bit on the trotter and then walking
away from it. The others followed suit - a few very satisfied dogs with
full bellies that night (and trotters to finish off another time). It
was a joy to see....

Sue C, NZ

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9a. Re: Finding meat
Posted by: "Lauren Funaiole" LFUNAIOL@SIMIVALLEY.ORG lfunaiol
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:38 pm ((PST))

Hi Sherrel,

I buy my meat at local grocery stores. One of them caters to an ethnic crowd and tends to have better prices and selection of organ meats. I do try to stay away from enhanced meats, but can't afford to buy grassfed/organic meats. I figure that what I am feeding is vastly better than kibble.

Most people start the raw diet by feeding chicken. This works well because the bones are very edible and help to keep the stools firm during the adjustment to raw. After they are doing well on chicken, you can add any other meat that is in abundant supply (for me it was pork). As they are comfortable with each new meat, add another variety that you want to feed. I found that ultimately, it works well to alternate red meats with chicken days. For example:
Monday: chicken
Tuesday: pork
Wednesday: chicken and pork kidney
Thursday: beef
Friday Chicken and liver
Saturday: lamb
Sunday: turkey
This kind of variety works well for me and my dogs.
Lauren Funaiole
>>> Sherrel Leininger meawolf50@yahoo.com> 12/16/2007 11:07 AM >> ( mailto:meawolf50@yahoo.com> )

Where do you get your meat?

When just starting to feed raw is there a certain secquence to start?
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10a. Re: chicken liver
Posted by: "Kelly" kpetska@mgmmirage.com kpet1218
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:38 pm ((PST))

> My aussie, goes so far as to not only refuse liver, but he wont eat
anything the liver has touched. :-)
>

I'm so glad this thread is going. I introduced chicken liver for the
first time last night. (We've been on raw 2 weeks tomorrow.) He was
happily enjoying his first try of pork neck and then I brought the
seared liver out... I held the pork neck in my hand and tried the "if
you eat this, you get that" but it didn't work. Then he wouldn't even
touch the pork neck because at some point it touched the raw liver that
I offered after he refused the seared liver. I put a teeny sliver of
liver on his portion this morning and he only ate half of what he would
normally eat...and of course the liver was still there.

So...tonight I will try mixing it with egg and parmesan or with the
garlic powder that others have suggested.

Thanks!
Kelly Petska
*3 lb male 1y/o Chihuahua*

Messages in this topic (19)
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10b. Re: chicken liver
Posted by: "Chia" chia.m@shaw.ca cia22m
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:45 pm ((PST))

I held the pork neck in my hand and tried the "if
you eat this, you get that" but it didn't work.

@@@@ and I say my dog is smart because that works... I suppose he is
actually 'gullible' and YOUR dog is the brainiac ! ;-))

Liver is an issue that for some dogs, resolves itself easily, for others you
almost have to take a university course to figure out how to get that slimy
stuff down their gullet.. ;-))

Then he wouldn't even
touch the pork neck because at some point it touched the raw liver that
I offered after he refused the seared liver. I put a teeny sliver of
liver on his portion this morning and he only ate half of what he would
normally eat...and of course the liver was still there.

@@@@ it may even take a case of NOTHING else EXCEPT the liver, hunger may
win out...this is tricky.. I guarantee you, in a few months time, ALL of
this manipulation and trauma will be a memory and you'll learn what works
best for your smart dog!

Chia & Ricco

( I've hear food processing it into a pulp ..yumm, liver smoothie...and
stuffing into cavities of body parts may work but if your dog wouldn't touch
the part of the pork neck that had liver odour on it..hmmm.... time will
tell...you'll figure it out! Keep being creative though!)

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10c. Re: chicken liver
Posted by: "K Carolyn Ramamurti" lilith23360@yahoo.com lilith23360
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:25 pm ((PST))

I struggled with organ meat for months (what worked somewet was "smoothies" made in the blender with a little cheese). One day when I took liver out of the freezer, I noticed the girls going NUTS over it. I tried feeding them each a little piece frozen, and hit the jackpot. They LOVE it now! Try slicing it thin and feeding it frozen.

Carolyn Ramamurti
Seattle

Chia <chia.m@shaw.ca> wrote:
I held the pork neck in my hand and tried the "if
you eat this, you get that" but it didn't work.

@@@@ and I say my dog is smart because that works... I suppose he is
actually 'gullible' and YOUR dog is the brainiac ! ;-))

Liver is an issue that for some dogs, resolves itself easily, for others you
almost have to take a university course to figure out how to get that slimy
stuff down their gullet.. ;-))

Chia & Ricco

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Messages in this topic (19)
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11a. Re: Looking for people's feeding experiences
Posted by: "Sai Simonson" saiczarina@comcast.net keikokat
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:38 pm ((PST))

I am very fortunate. My vets for the past ten years, in MN and now here
in OR are totally in favor of raw feeding. I think I already might have
mentioned this in a previous post but I am very blessed. Of course I
always search for holistic veterinarians.

Sai

================================================

I started raw when all that recall stuff was going on. I too was
worried
about the "horror stories" Unagainst the advise from everyone I
asked my vet.
Now his clinic is large 5 vets..and a very large client base. Told
him I
was worried about the dog food recalls he said I had a good to
reason to be
concerned. Then I dropped the bombshell that I was thinking of
going raw.
WELLL he stated that the "problems associated with raw are (insert
usually ones)
then he added a BIG HOWEVER we have a very large client base that
feeds raw
and I can honestly say that we have never seen any problems from
feeding
raw..in fact as a whole they have less health problems.. Then he
said if you
feel comfortable with it go for it..I did..

Cathie

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12. {Raw Feeding} Question
Posted by: "Brandi Bryant" bbryant573@gmail.com bbryant573
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:39 pm ((PST))

I'm having problems finding a variety of meats - beef here is very expensive
- I can't find anything beef wise for under $2.00/lb - pork, turkey and
chicken are they only really protein that I can get a hold of. I can get
lamb, duck if I want pay big bucks... my question is this.. how many have
your meats shipped into you from out of town or out of state? Do you have
success with it? I still have some googling to do about seeing if I can get
meat shipped to me from maybe Tulsa or Oklahoma City...

I read from another post about Green Tripe - I looked on the website that
Chris gave and wondered if I order from them will the meat be alright
shipped from California to Oklahoma?

Thank you!!!
--
Brandi
Bartlesville, Ok

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13. Re: Almost raw for humans
Posted by: "Sai Simonson" saiczarina@comcast.net keikokat
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:25 pm ((PST))

Went to Denny's for breakfast yesterday morning and requested my usual
very raw t-bone with easy over eggs. The waitress brought it but
lamented that she was sure it was not raw enough....(they know me, they
are in my almost backyard) Back she took it and I heard her shout out
"very rare!" to the cook. Back came a new T-bone....YES cold in the
center. I growled and thanked her.
Sai

Don't be silly. My comment was about humans eating fresh, natural
***RAW*** foods. It's always a good plan to berate your
detractors. Makes you look smart .... NOT!
Bill

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14a. pork shoulder
Posted by: "spricketysprock" jess.hamway@gmail.com spricketysprock
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:25 pm ((PST))

So... I'm finally feeding pork, despite (irrational) fears of trich.
It's just too cheap, and red, to pass up.

My dog didn't seem to love it when I first offered it, but now he's
eagerly munching away. My question is, is all that white stuff lining
the shoulder fat or skin or something else? It looks... strange.

Also, I didn't bother to freeze it first. Do you all usually freeze
pork before feeding?

Thanks,
Jess & Toby

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15. Does anyone here co-op?
Posted by: "Carrie (Milton) Mularoni" kitkatsmama@comcast.net kitkatsmama
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:25 pm ((PST))

I'm wondering if any of you have gotten together and co-oped on food?
I'm in Northern Oakland County, Michigan. I have a great resource
for a lot of meats, but the quantity is more that I can store. For
example, right now I'm sitting with 40 pounds of chicken backs and 60
pounds of cheek meat- 2 dogs, and a TINY freezer. Anyone interested?
I have one other person I'm splitting with right now, but I wondered
if anyone else would be interested...

Carrie
13 year old lab/gsh, Jager
2 year old yellow lab, Greta

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16a. Re: A newbie here!
Posted by: "mozookpr" mozookpr@yahoo.com mozookpr
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:26 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Carrin" <mntgrl_2000@...> wrote:
>
> My big fear/concern comes with bones since they are both gulpers, but
> I'm sure I can help them to learn to chew....and I might look into
> grinding if I have to.
>

Hi, Carrin.

I am also new to raw feeding, and I shared the same fear. As I was
teetering on the brink of a decision, one of my dogs got startled while
he was eating and almost inhaled a piece of kibble. Listening to him
hack was all it took for me to get out to the store and stock up on
chicken!

Your dogs will chew (in the manner of dogs, which is really less
chewing than ripping and tearing) when they *have to* to get a meal.
The first raw food I gave my Pomeranian was a chicken leg quarter. (He
is a fairly large Pom; there is big food, and there is just plain
overkill!) Of course, there was no way he was going to eat the whole
thing, but there was no way he was going to choke on it, either! <g>
I just let him eat what he wanted, and put the rest up for the next
day. I have since cut back to smaller portions -- a thigh or
drumstick, for example -- to encourage him to eat the bone, too, and
not just strip off the meat, but the quarters made *me* feel more at
ease as I got started.

Here is something that may help illustrate the importance of food
size. Consider the toys you get for your dogs. No little bitty balls,
right? Of course not, because they pose a choking hazard, just as toys
with tiny parts do to young children. Same with little food. Feed big
food, and your dogs will be fine. They seem to enjoy it more, too.
The most fun Foxy has had yet with a meal was a piece of turkey back
with breast meat that my Sheltie didn't finish. He chewed that back
down to a nub, with this glazed look of utter contentment in his eyes
(and this from a dog who was initially reluctant to eat bones!)

A final thought. I did once take away a little fragment of bone at the
end of Foxy's meal. It was the joint of a drumstick, about the size of
a marble. He was not eating anymore, just playing with it. Because of
the experience with his last kibble, I did not think it was something
he needed to have, so I threw it away. Unnecessary? Maybe. But I
would not give him a toy that size, and I didn't think he needed to
play with a bit of bone that size, either.

There is lots of good advice here. Trust the experienced raw feeders,
especially the "mod squad," and you will do just fine.

Wendy and the kids

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17. the best grinders.....
Posted by: "Michelle R" crested_dog8@yahoo.com crested_dog8
Date: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:26 pm ((PST))

LOL Well...all the talk about grinders lately, I just have to share this. I have cresteds.. several hairless and very toothless cresteds. I have one, I swear to goodness, if she has 4 teeth in her head, shes lucky. Tonite, I will have you folks know she took on a duck drumstick and finished the whole thing. I kept checking, because usually she leaves the bigger peices of bone because she hasnt been able to handle them. I guess it just took a while for her to figure it out, and/or build up her jaw strength to be able to do it, but she ate that whole leg...bone and all!!!!! My little toothless wolves!!!
:-)

Michelle Radcliff
Mengshi Chinese Cresteds
http://www.geocities.com/crested_dog8/mengshihome.html

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Feed Pets Raw Food

Monday, December 17, 2007

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12389

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