[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12243

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Canned Fish
From: Mary Anne Libcke
1b. Re: Canned Fish
From: Arlene Fell

2a. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
From: carnesbill
2b. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
From: Kathryn Chapman
2c. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
From: meg_helmes

3a. Re: challenges!
From: Yasuko herron

4a. Re: Mixed protein sources
From: ncrnrgrl

5a. Re: Anyone raise rabbits for feed?
From: Laura Wimpey
5b. Re: Anyone raise rabbits for feed?
From: Renate

6a. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
From: alexanderdewey
6b. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
From: cynthiashankman
6c. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
From: brutus_buckley
6d. Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
From: Margo Farnsworth

7a. Re: Green tripe and energy level
From: Yasuko herron

8.1. Re: still swallowing whole
From: delcaste
8.2. Re: still swallowing whole
From: ginny wilken
8.3. Re: still swallowing whole
From: delcaste
8.4. Re: still swallowing whole
From: connie

9a. Re: Pregnancy question again
From: diannem200400
9b. Re: Pregnancy question again
From: diannem200400
9c. Re: Pregnancy question again
From: diannem200400
9d. Re: Pregnancy question again
From: diannem200400

10a. Re: Starting a puppy on RAW
From: Gayle

11a. Re: Daily diet plan
From: K. Gordon Crawford

12a. Re: New Puppy Vomiting
From: April

Messages
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1a. Canned Fish
Posted by: "Mary Anne Libcke" Marylibcke@hotmail.com libckem
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 1:25 pm ((PST))

Hi, I am very new to raw feeding and have posted a few times. Thanks
for all the help. My 7 yr. border collie is giving me a hard time with
the new diet. Our 3 month old pit/lab mix will eat anything and
everything with no problem. We are at about a month or so to this and
he is very picky. He now will not eat chicken at all. Really no big
deal in the whole picture. He does eat pork, and beef if it is at room
temperature. His biggest favorite is canned fish. Either salmon or
mackeral with an egg in it. He will then eat pork ribs or lamb. My
question is the amount of fish he is eating. I tried fresh fish but
nope, won't eat it. It comes whole in the can so he is working a
little for it and it does have the bone. Is this too much for him? He
would eat it every day if possible.

Mary Anne
Bandit and Mousse

Messages in this topic (6)
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1b. Re: Canned Fish
Posted by: "Arlene Fell" abeautiful3@yahoo.com abeautiful3
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

Hi I found an interesting discussion in the archives 145606 that might answer your question it did for me.

Arlene

Mary Anne Libcke <Marylibcke@hotmail.com> wrote: Hi, I am very new to raw feeding and have posted a few times. Thanks
for all the help. My 7 yr. border collie is giving me a hard time with
the new diet. Our 3 month old pit/lab mix will eat anything and
everything with no problem. We are at about a month or so to this and
he is very picky. He now will not eat chicken at all. Really no big
deal in the whole picture. He does eat pork, and beef if it is at room
temperature. His biggest favorite is canned fish. Either salmon or
mackeral with an egg in it. He will then eat pork ribs or lamb. My
question is the amount of fish he is eating. I tried fresh fish but
nope, won't eat it. It comes whole in the can so he is working a
little for it and it does have the bone. Is this too much for him? He
would eat it every day if possible.

Mary Anne
Bandit and Mousse

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Messages in this topic (6)
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2a. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 1:25 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, ginny wilken <gwilken@...> wrote:
>
>
> On Nov 5, 2007, at 9:50 AM, carnesbill wrote:
>
> >
> > I would think any chemicals added to their food would be ADDED
> > chemicals. How else would you add them?
> >
>
>
> It's common to add meds to drinking water. Obviously, they use a
lot
> more than would be necessary, as one can't be sure how much
> a chick will drink.

It's not common to add chemicals to anything pertaining to chickens
in the US. My brother owns and runs a factory chicken farm. He
produces almost 5,000,000 chickens a year. I have asked him about
this. He says he will add some anitbiotics IF there is an outbreak
of something in a chicken house but that is rare. Doesn't even
happen once a year on his farm and he has 16 chicken houses.

The lifespan of these chickens is only about 8 weeks. No need to
worm because worm eggs would barely have enough time to hatch, let
alone grow into adult worms. Generally, the chickens don't live
long enough to get sick. It is illegal to give growth hormone or
steriods. These chickens are bred for fast growth and dont really
need them anyway.

If you spent an extra penny a chicken for meds on my brother's farm
it would cost around $50,000 in profit each year. Thats just not
acceptable.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (10)
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2b. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
Posted by: "Kathryn Chapman" paintedgoatfarm@yahoo.com paintedgoatfarm
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 2:19 pm ((PST))

I didn't see the original post, but I am reading here and would like to interject that although raising habits vary a lot. Many producers use a medicated feed for young chicks. The meds are for Coccidosis (I know I didn't spell that correctly). Some continue using a medicated feed others switch to a non medicated. When it comes to meats do not make a generalization as there are many variables. One person said lamb and goat are usually pasture fed. While this is sometimes true the reality is many use grain and "chow" to fatten animals up and unless it has a grassfed claim on the label one does not know.

Kathryn

Kathryn Chapman
Painted Goat Farm

BEWARE OF THE SHEEP!

"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to reform."
Mark Twain

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Messages in this topic (10)
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2c. Re: Medicated or Non Medicated?
Posted by: "meg_helmes" mhelmes@gmail.com meg_helmes
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:34 pm ((PST))

Not
> sure how one would vaccinate thousands of chicks, but not likely one
> at a time...
>
Do you guys watch "Dirty Jobs" on Discovery Channel? They have had
several episodes depicting different aspects of the poultry industry.
All of the chicks are individually vaccinating using a little machine
where they are pressed up against the edge, a button is pushed, and
the chick is injected, then dumped in a box, grab the next chick,
stick them in machine, push button, etc. They cruised through them
pretty quick.

Here is the YouTube video showing it - fast forward to about 7:00
minutes to see the inoculations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tmEO9xRqvo

~Meg

Messages in this topic (10)
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3a. Re: challenges!
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 1:25 pm ((PST))

>we do just fine on whiting and catfish.? I can get it almost whole so its better than an expensive salmon steak,

Hi,Maureen. Any fish is fine except you need caution on Northpacific area's salmon and Trout about salmon poisoning.

My grocery store's salmon is from Chile and,I hear that chile salmon is safe but it isfarm raised and color is added(you can read thefish label on this info when you buy),and while some deep freezing might kill parasite but I do not feed it to my dog.

I try buying anything labeled Wild more than Farm raised label.

I personally do not like the salmon is added color to make the fish meat look better...

When I feed salmon,it is from can (packed in water).

In our grocerystore,hard to find raw sardine/mackerral as well,so, to give omega 3 into diet,I give these fish now and then from cans.I know it is cooked but it gives omega3.I like to include omega3 rich fish in diet now and then.

I do not limit myself to get only whole fish and,I get any fish even fillet if those looks great or on sales.

but buy just small amount at first,and if your dog liked it,buy more.

Palette hates catfish,well,she likes rolling on it with delightful smile if I fed it,but it goesinto mouth and spitted out. So,I never buy catfish for that reason.

I have fed whiting,palette likes it.

>I do give fish tabs, I rotate from salmon to fish oil tabs to cod liver
oil tabs.?

Watch out for Cod liver oil tab you give.It gives Vitamin A and D and too much A cause toxic to dogs.

yassy

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Messages in this topic (8)
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4a. Re: Mixed protein sources
Posted by: "ncrnrgrl" jcraver1@nc.rr.com ncrnrgrl
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 1:27 pm ((PST))

Thanks to all of you for your responses.
I can't argue with the results I'm getting - my dogs look fabulous
and I can barely keep up with the 10 year old, never mind the puppy -
just nice to know I'm not doing something completely out of
the 'norm'.

Jen C.

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "merril Woolf" <merril@...> wrote:
>
>
> >
> > I was wondering if you "old hands" feed the same protein source
for a
> > period of time and then change? Or if it's all mixed? I'll go
ahead
> > and admit that I 've been mixing my protein all along - for
example -
> > my dogs had goat for breakfast today and I have pork trim and
necks
> > defrosting for tomorrow - I've been feeding this way all along -
is
> > this incorrect? Should I be sticking with one protein source for
a
> > time then switching?
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your responses.
> > Jen C.
> >
>
> I start my dogs as young pups on any and every protein source I can
find. I've never fed
> one type of anything.
> Every day they will have a variety of foods from every corner of
the food spectum.
>
> If your pup is doing great, just keep feeding variety of
critters. Nothing my dogs haven't
> tried and enjoyed.
>
> Merril
>

Messages in this topic (6)
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5a. Re: Anyone raise rabbits for feed?
Posted by: "Laura Wimpey" laura.wimpey@yahoo.com laura.wimpey
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 2:19 pm ((PST))

jaygaughan <jaygaughan@yahoo.com> wrote: >Or should I just buy them.
I can't speak from the feeding perspective but from the opposite side - raising rabbits. We did that for several years with "just a couple of cages" and doggone it was hard! Those little buggers did not do it like rabbits are stereotyped to do. It takes several females and bucks to find two that will do it and do it right. Kind of troublesome. Their gestation period is 31 days...so you'll want to think about timing and housing of the kits while they are growing.
Of course, someone'll no doubt jump on here and tout how easy it is...so not sure if that is helpful.
Laura W.

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5b. Re: Anyone raise rabbits for feed?
Posted by: "Renate" renate.tideswell@gmail.com tideswell_renate
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:34 pm ((PST))

Jay, it's a lot of work raising rabbits. I used to have a rabbitry with 60
does, about 1000 rabbits in total at any one time. Rabbits do not 'breed
like rabbits' In the winter, unless you live in the south, you'll have a
hard time getting any breeding at all unless you provide at least 15 hours
of daylight. In the south, the heat in the summer will prevent breeding.
And the does and bucks will need constant cooling down. Honestly, if you're
looking for a consistent supply of rabbit meat, you are probably better off
just buying it. If there is a rabbitry near you, you can probably buy culls
for very little money.

Just my opinion, of course.

Renate

On 11/5/07, jaygaughan <jaygaughan@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I'm wondering if it would be worth my while to put up a few rabbit
> cages up to raise rabbits to feed my Great Dane.
>
> Or should I just buy them.
>
> Thank you
>
> Jay
>
>
>

--
Renate
'The more I learn about men, the more I love my Shih Tzu'

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Messages in this topic (3)
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6a. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
Posted by: "alexanderdewey" alexanderdewey@yahoo.com alexanderdewey
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 2:19 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "cynthiashankman" <ShankMa4@...>
wrote:
Hope you don't mind my
> asking, but are you feeding her anything besides chicken quarters?
>
> Cindi
>

Hi Cindi, No I don't mind at all. I've been feeding Gigi a steady
diet of chicken quarters for just over a month. She has had (with
delight) some raw pork ribs, pigs feet (1 or 2), and cow feet
(again, 1 or 2) - but not for a couple of weeks now. I couldn't
imagine the grass eating being a residual effect of it.

Come to think of it, about a week ago (maybe around the same time
she started trying to eat grass) I gave her a tiny bit (1 or 2
little chunks) of raw beef - The package said "beef stew bone
in"... They were little chunks - not really appropriate for raw
feeding because of their small size. Actually, anyone know what
part of the cow "beef stew bone in" usually comes from? God, I hope
she hasn't had beef bone stuck in her this whole time. Wouldn't she
just throw it up (without eating grass) anyway?

Alex

Messages in this topic (6)
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6b. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
Posted by: "cynthiashankman" ShankMa4@aol.com cynthiashankman
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "alexanderdewey"
<alexanderdewey@...> wrote:
> Hi Cindi, No I don't mind at all. I've been feeding Gigi a steady
> diet of chicken quarters for just over a month.

I asked what you've been feeding b/c even though us newbies think we
are doing a great thing by feeding raw, apparently it is easy to get
this "wrong". "Wrong" BUT in the correct, and awesome ball park!!!

It is confusing when starting on raw because we seem to be focused on
BONES; raw meating bones; chewing bones; bones getting stuck;
digesting bones; bones in poop; bones bones bones! It gets even more
confusing because they recommend that we start out with chicken for 1
week....which has bones!!!

BUT GUESS WHAT ... (and for some reason this isn't very clear,
because you are the third person in a week who has done this (myself
included, I might add) ... guess what ... 80% of our dogs' meals are
WITHOUT BONE. That makes for a whole lot of boneless meals. The
ratio is 80% meat (as in meaty meat, no bone) 10% edibile bone, 10%
organs with 5% of that being liver. Now they (they = the experts!!!
and thank you all for being moderators!) will tell you that this is
should be fed over time. But when you are new, like us, apparently
it needs to be REALLY REALLY REALLY CLEAR ABOUT THE PERCENTAGES.
Otherwise, you, me, and the two other people this week, aren't
getting it. It also needs to be REALLY REALLY CLEAR, that after the
initial-chicken-introduction, meat without bone can be fed.

For some reason the message that 80% of the meals do not contain bone
is getting missed by beginners.

Apparently the dogs need red meat too! and lots of it to balance out
meals. Now I may get in trouble here for saying this, but I do give
my dog cut-up-in-little-pieces-raw-meat. I don't know, it got too
complicated to feed my one 30 lb. dog roasts, etc. I don't have
access to legs of lambs or cows. So for me, I feed cut-in-small-
pieces-raw-meat. Also because I need to weigh to see that I am
giving him the correct amounts.

Am I in trouble here for giving small pieces? My dog seems to be
doing okay. So I think your small pieces of beef were fine, just
leave the bone out next time.... cuz if she didn't realize the bone
was in, I suppose she could swallow without chewing. It doesn't
sound like she has a bone stuck in her at all.

But it does sound like she needs red meat, no bone meat, and organs.

Hope this helps.

If I have said anything that is very incorrect or would hurt
Alexander's dog in anyway, please correct my information. The rest
of it is "my humble opinion" as a newbie with one dog, figuring this
out all alone, while everyone else around me feeds ki$$le.

Cindi

Messages in this topic (6)
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6c. Re: Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
Posted by: "brutus_buckley" brutus_buckley@yahoo.com brutus_buckley
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

Hi Alex,

The reality is that no one really knows why dogs eat grass. Some
speculate they do it to make themselves vomit, some say it is tasty
and/or fun, some say it is to compensate for nutritional deficiencies.
All or none of these theories may be correct.

Since Gigi seems otherwise normal except for the desire to eat grass, I
would not fast her or worry about it. If you have been feeding nothing
but quarters since September 30th, I suggest introducing something new.
Maybe a little pork or beef or some organ meat. If you are going out of
town, it would be wise to hold off on new meats until you get back.
Perhaps Gigi is bored with her food and looking for some variety. (Yes,
I am speculating.) <g>

-Renee W.

Messages in this topic (6)
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6d. Grass Eating -- MINE TOO!!
Posted by: "Margo Farnsworth" mfarnsworth@mfgraffix.com mfarnsworth06759
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:36 pm ((PST))

Hi Alex,

Dempsey seems to have gotten over his fixation on the grass for the time
being - yay!

I'm wondering if you could offer Gigi some wheatgrass (sold as pet grass at
Petco/Petsmart type stores)?

I was also wondering if anyone else grew this for their dogs? I've seen
kits to grow it at home. I make a "glop" for my dogs that they get every
few days that contains liver, squash (they love it), carrots and whatever
other safe veggie matter I have around. I thought perhaps adding some
wheatgrass might be satisfying for them?

I found some Ahi tuna fillets in the back of the freezer, the dogs had a
serious treat tonight! Mmmm.... Fish-cicles :)

Margo, Dempsey & Wasabi.

Messages in this topic (6)
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7a. Re: Green tripe and energy level
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 2:19 pm ((PST))

> lots of owners notice a certain amount of frantic energy goes away when the carbs of ki**le are gone.

Hi.I think my dog got calmer mostly andmore black and white on energy level; when she play,she plays hard,when sherelax,she naps or sleeps,laydown quietly on her fav place.On and off is so clear.

But I noticed that when I feed Green Tripes,she is more energetic.I feed 2 times a week for tripe.

Do you all experiences this??

yassy

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8.1. Re: still swallowing whole
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 2:19 pm ((PST))

Hi Connie. I'm writing you offline because I really don't know where
to put this. Yesterday my pit got in a fight with one of the pugs and
almost killed him. I have to get rid of the pit and wonder if you
knew of anybody that would take care of him or direct me to someone
or someplace that would take him. He's about 10 mos old (I found him
when he was 2 to 2 1/2) and a beauty. He's probably a mix of red nose
with ? It's tearing me up to give him up but I can't deal with a
fight again. This little pup is so strong all I could do was fall on
top of him and try to hold him down so he couldn't keep tearing at
Chunkie. You should see my hands; I used one of them as a breakstick,
ha, ha :(

Back to my gulper: My mother had offered to grind all her food and
feed as hamburger. That might be a good idea and give her RMBs every
other day or every couple of days. Is this what you do with your
gulper? I am terrified everytime I feed her. Yesterday she had a goat
leg and did fine. I guess she gorged so today I gave her a little
kidney and a very few pieces of chicken (hand fed). The other pug got
a cornish hen and he ate til I think he was going to pass out and he
got the same meal as Violeta today. Tomorrow they'll get more big
food. So that's my past two days for ya ;)

Silvina

Messages in this topic (27)
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8.2. Re: still swallowing whole
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 3:02 pm ((PST))

On Nov 5, 2007, at 2:17 PM, delcaste wrote:

> Hi Connie. I'm writing you offline because I really don't know where
> to put this. Yesterday my pit got in a fight with one of the pugs and
> almost killed him. I have to get rid of the pit and wonder if you
> knew of anybody that would take care of him or direct me to someone
> or someplace that would take him.

Since this is already here apparently by mistake, let me offer that
you pittie can be helped to understand his place in your family and
can be trusted, once you teach him. Please go to this list, join, and
then ask the list leader. This is not homeopathy this time, but a
wonderful training protocol which gets to the bottom of what dogs are
thinking and how we can show them what we want from them. Honestly,
he wants to be good, he just doesn't have a clear idea of his place,
both in the family and in your heart. Please give him a chance!

SATZ_Main@yahoogroups.com

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

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Messages in this topic (27)
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8.3. Re: still swallowing whole
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:34 pm ((PST))

Yes, I'm having all sorts of trouble with her. Yesterday I gave her a
goat leg and she ate alright but I'm terrified to see her keel over.
Today she had some hand fed kidney with very little chicken. I like
your idea of spreading it out; it worked fine with the other pug. I'll
keep you guys posted.

Silvina

>
> You sure are having trouble w/this girl! When you cut it up, are you
> cutting it small enough, then? What about, when you're feeding cut
up
> chunks, you sort of spread it out all over a towel, so she isn't
> scarfing out of a bowl?
>
> Just another idea to add to your tool box!
>
> Good luck. I know that must be very stressful. Take care.
>
> Interesting that you're finding thick fat on goat--I've never had
that
> w/the goat I've gotten.

Messages in this topic (27)
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8.4. Re: still swallowing whole
Posted by: "connie" justbullies@hotmail.com bullienut
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:42 pm ((PST))

Tomorrow they'll get more big
> food. So that's my past two days for ya ;)
>
> Silvina

Hey, Sounds like you have your hands full..wow! As far as the pit goes
and fighting that is OT so I will send you an email. With my gulper the
only edibly bones he gets is chicken and rabbit..about 3-4 days a week.
And he has to get them large. The rest is ground, cut in strips or
chunks big enough to swallow. I don`t feed ground unless I find it on a
really good sale. I give him beef ribs 2-3 times a week..but all he can
really do is gum them up. When I take it away a couple hours later its
totally slobbery, slimy and a few puncture holes in the little bit of
meat there is on it. My other bulldogs don`t have that problem with
much of anything like he does. They can strip a beef rib in about an
hour. Still alot slower than most dogs. I at least feel he is getting
the benefit of a great diet..and he loves it. He will eat
anything..lol..I also like the bully sticks as they give the work out I
think they miss out on. And I don`t feel like I have to supervise
while chewing them. It was a challenge in the beginning but I just kept
experimenting until we came to a happy medium. I will email you.
~connie~
and a bunch of bullies
www.justbullies.com

Messages in this topic (27)
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9a. Re: Pregnancy question again
Posted by: "diannem200400" diannem200400@yahoo.com diannem200400
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Tina Berry" <k9baron@...> wrote:
feed 100% venison, if that's what she likes, I'd let her just
> eat that if you have it available. I've also fed mine 100% heart at
times -
> not a bad thing either - Chris - is their anything lacking in a
heart/liver
> diet?? would it hurt for a month to only feed her that if that's what
> she'll eat - I'm thinking heart is very nutritious.

Thanks for the advice, Tina! I tried pork tongue last night and she
wolfed it down. So now we have beef heart, organ meats, venison, and
pork tongue that she will eat. I'm feeling better about the variety.
Do I need to worry because she won't eat hardly any bone?

Dianne M.

Messages in this topic (14)
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9b. Re: Pregnancy question again
Posted by: "diannem200400" diannem200400@yahoo.com diannem200400
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...>
wrote:
>
> "diannem200400" <diannem200400@> wrote:
> >> She will eat all the liver she can get.

how much are you letting her eat?

She is getting about a pound of liver and anywhere from a pound to 2
pounds of kidney per week.

> Lamb is not a mild meat! I don't know where you got that, but you
> may be limiting her unnecessarily. Chicken, rabbit, white fish:
mild
> flesh. Try lamb.

Off to see the Meat Dude....thanks, Cris!!

Dianne M.

Messages in this topic (14)
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9c. Re: Pregnancy question again
Posted by: "diannem200400" diannem200400@yahoo.com diannem200400
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sandee Lee" <rlee@...> wrote:
>
> Dianne,
>
> Many dogs love lamb but detest rabbit! :(
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang

Sandee, I am going to try lamb for sure. I blew the budget on some
lovely whole rabbits, and none of my guys will touch the darn things.
Sheesh, go figure.

Dianne M.

Messages in this topic (14)
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9d. Re: Pregnancy question again
Posted by: "diannem200400" diannem200400@yahoo.com diannem200400
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Doguefan@... wrote:

Ruby would only eat it if it was cut up and she would not touch chicken
from start to finish!? However she never did have pups, we think she
reabsorbed them.? I wish you all the luck with your pretty girl!

Chelsea: I will also try cutting up her meats. Thanks for the tip.
I'm sorry to learn about Ruby. E-mail me privately if you get a chance.

Dianne M.

Messages in this topic (14)
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10a. Re: Starting a puppy on RAW
Posted by: "Gayle" gayle@gayleturner.net gayle28607
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:35 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "charlesmdodson" <charlesmdodson@...> wrote:
Like I said, he is 10 weeks old and he is 18 lbs. He is
> a red doberman male and will probably weigh 85-90 lbs when grown.

My pup started on raw at 11 weeks, and is a French Brittany, so only going to be about 40 lbs
full grown. Like one of the previous posters, I smashed the first chicken quarter with a
hammer a little, and also pulled a couple ribbons of flesh out a little so he could get an easy
start. This may or may not have been necessary.

My bet is that with a dobie this large he is going to do really well, and enjoy the tooth/jaw
exercise!

Gayle and Chakotay

Messages in this topic (4)
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11a. Re: Daily diet plan
Posted by: "K. Gordon Crawford" kgcrawford@gmail.com kgcrawfordesq
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:36 pm ((PST))

Thoughts on the proposed diet? Too much or too little bone? Enough variety?

On 11/5/07, K. Gordon Crawford <kgcrawford@gmail.com> wrote:
> After 8 months of rawfeeding, things are going great, except that my
> 16 month old bullmastiff seems a little portly at 120 lbs.
>
> What does the collective think of the following diet for bone meat
> organ ratio (I think I've been relying on too much whole chicken as
> daily meals):
>
> 1.5 lbs portion from whole chicken or turkey (giblets included) +
> either 1 lb beef heart, pork shoulder, or whole tilapia 5 x per week,
> 1lb beef kidney 1x per week, 1lb beef liver 1x per week
>
> fish oil caplets daily
>
> thanks for your input
>
> --
> K. Gordon Crawford
>

--
K. Gordon Crawford

Messages in this topic (4)
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12a. Re: New Puppy Vomiting
Posted by: "April" akakeck@hotmail.com akapitrescue
Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:43 pm ((PST))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "nkjvcjs" <nefreed@...> wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have any suggestion of what we can do to get water into
> her, or to make her feel better until she can get to the vet?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nicole, Eileen (my mom)
> and Tallulah-Belle (the puppy)

I would suggest sub-Q fluids and hold off on food. Depending when her
last meal was the food may be overloading her system! Very bland diet
if compelled to feed, boiled chicken breast, or as someone else
suggested, chicken breast submerged in broth or water. If she is as
severely dehydrated as it sounds, the fluids are going to help more
than food (at 1st anyway). In my experience, if the organs have begun
to "shut down" due to lack of food/water, food may actually cause
more
damage. I would not have fed her until I could get her in to a vet to
make sure!
April
>

Messages in this topic (5)
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