Feed Pets Raw Food: [rawfeeding] Digest Number 12234

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Patty Linden
1b. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Sandee Lee
1c. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Casey Post
1d. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Patty Linden
1e. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Patty Linden
1f. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Sandee Lee
1g. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Sandee Lee
1h. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Patty Linden
1i. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: ginny wilken
1j. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
From: Patty Linden

2a. Re: Puppy is still throwing up
From: connie

3a. Re: QUESTION ABOUT EGGS
From: Yasuko herron

4a. Re: Feeding the Senior Dog
From: Sandee Lee

5a. Re: How large is a gorge meal?
From: Yasuko herron
5b. Re: How large is a gorge meal?
From: shefy gupta

6a. Re: Our first day! Yay!
From: Yasuko herron
6b. Re: Our first day! Yay!
From: shefy gupta

7a. Re: Ok, no more talk about bloat, how about Mountain Oysters?
From: Yasuko herron
7b. Re: Ok, no more talk about bloat, how about Mountain Oysters?
From: shefy gupta

8. Deer Heads,Antlers
From: gusmyhairyboy

9. Is small hen OK to feed....?
From: shefy7

10a. Just started feeding raw
From: Heidi
10b. Re: Just started feeding raw
From: Sandee Lee
10c. Re: Just started feeding raw
From: Heidi

11. raw/calcium/phosphorus
From: beaulah_2001us

Messages
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1a. Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Patty Linden" pattykat3@yahoo.com pattykat3
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 12:34 pm ((PDT))

Hi--I started my pom (he is 13 lb.) on a raw fed diet about a month ago. Since I adopted my little guy 3 years ago, he has had 3 episodes in the hospital with pancreatitis. Two years ago, my vet switched him from his Science Diet kibble to Hills Rx duck formula, in the can--telling me that he was not able to process chicken, turkey, or beef protein. At the same time he prescribed an antibiotic (Metronitazol or Flagyl). The poor thing has been on that antibiotic for almost a year and a half now--I was told it would stop his diarrhea. Of course, I stopped the antibiotic when I started reading about raw food, etc. and began his new diet a month ago. When Mica started the raw food , I started him on chicken--and he seemed to do quite well after a while. His stools firmed up, were less in quantity, he seemed to feel better--everything I have read that was supposed to happen. Then, after about 2 weeks, I made the mistake of giving him some chicken liver--I think it was a
whole piece of liver (way too much, I'm sure). He immediately began having very runny, dark black stools. Following that, he seemed to loose his appetite for chicken--seemed very hungry, begged for food, but refused any chicken I gave him. I then began feeding him some large turkey necks--which he seemed to love chewing and working on for a long time. Following about a week of the turkey, he again stopped eating (I wouldn't feed him for a day, offer either turkey or chicken, and he wanted nothing to do with it), and along with very loose stools. Last week I offered him a big chunk of beef--no bones, just meat--thinking he was getting too much bone, not enough meat. That was followed by days of very runny, black diarrhea. Since then, I have (after another day of fasting), offered him a ground meatball (turkey) with a supplement called GI Support mixed in. The supplement contains (among other things) Slippery Elm Bark, acidophilus, alfalfa, pepsin, papain, bromelain.
I was wondering if anyone else has had similar problems trying to feed a dog whose pancreas may not be functioning completely normally--and also, if I am doing the right thing by giving him a probiotic, in an attempt to perhaps restore the flora in his digestive tract that the long period on an antibiotic probably upset.

Any suggestions (other than taking him back to the vet) anyone could give me would be very much appreciated.
:-) Patty

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Messages in this topic (10)
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1b. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 1:44 pm ((PDT))

Patty,

Did they ever discover what was causing the pancreatitis....diabetes, EPI,
etc? That might be something you want to look into so you can treat
whatever disease process is causing this.

Other than that, I would get him on a good pancreatic enzyme, feed small
meals, low fat until you get this under control. There's been a lot of talk
about feeding dogs with pancreatic issues. Maybe you can get some help from
these past discussions....
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/122181
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/122224
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/91117
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/60393
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/88618

And BTW, Flagyl is nasty stuff with a huge array of adverse reactions,
including diarrhea. I don't know why vets use this stuff! Ugh.....

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Patty Linden" <pattykat3@yahoo.com>

> I was wondering if anyone else has had similar problems trying to feed a
dog whose pancreas may not be functioning completely normally--and also, if
I am doing the right thing by giving him a probiotic, in an attempt to
perhaps restore the flora in his digestive tract that the long period on an
antibiotic probably upset.
>
> Any suggestions (other than taking him back to the vet) anyone could give
me would be very much appreciated.
> :-) Patty

Messages in this topic (10)
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1c. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Casey Post" mikken@neo.rr.com mikkeny
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:10 pm ((PDT))

> Did they ever discover what was causing the pancreatitis....diabetes, EPI,
> etc? That might be something you want to look into so you can treat
> whatever disease process is causing this.

Yeah, I have to ask how this diagnosis was made as well (for pancreatitis).
These episodes sound more like acute manifestations of a chronic condition
and one that needs to be diagnosed. Of course, there are all sorts of
possibilities - EPI, SIBO, etc. that leap to mind, but whatever it is, it
needs to be found and dealt with. If your vet isn't up for the task, find
one that is.

Casey

Messages in this topic (10)
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1d. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Patty Linden" pattykat3@yahoo.com pattykat3
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:59 pm ((PDT))

Sandee--Thank you so much for your response. I read all of the archived emails you included. Viokase seems to be a pancreatic enzyme many use. Prior to starting this diet, I read in several places about a pancreatic enzyme called "FloraZyme LP powder (recommended by Dr. DeHaan, a vet in Minnesota). I subsequently bought some, but had not used it yet. I wonder if this would be considered "prescription strength". It contains such enzymes as Protease, Amylase, Lipase, Cellulase (all preceeded by the word "Fungal"), Pancreas Concentrate, and 2 probiotics).

Regarding what caused his pancreatitis--all I know is that the vet told me he must have gotten into some fatty foods. When I first adopted him, he had been found wandering the streets, apparently had been attacked by some other animals, and had to have surgery to cut off dead flesh from him wounded rear. They thought he had been walking around for several days like that from the appearance of his wound. It was about a month after I took him home that his first attack of pancreatitis occurred.

I will put him on several small meals during the day along with the FloraZyme. I notice one person recommended using Mylanta for a gassy stomach. He has had a lot of gas, and I think has been uncomfortable with it--Do you think Mylanta is a good idea? And--I wonder how much?

Thank you again--this has been a worry for so long. I am so glad I have found a place to ask questions, for which I have not--up until now--found any answers.

:-) Patty

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote: Patty,

Did they ever discover what was causing the pancreatitis....diabetes, EPI,
etc? That might be something you want to look into so you can treat
whatever disease process is causing this.

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Messages in this topic (10)
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1e. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Patty Linden" pattykat3@yahoo.com pattykat3
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

Casey--Thank you for your reply. He was initially determined to have pancreatitis after having a complete blood panel that showed highly elevated pancreatic enzymes. An xray of his stomach also showed extreme irritation. Each of the other episodes also showed highly elevated pancreatic enzymes in his blood. This past winter, he showed a very high elevation of his liver enzymes, and my vet scheduled an ultrasound to check his liver for such a possibility as cancer. His ultrasound showed a very healthy liver. I was told that disturbances with the pancreas can effect the liver, and that could have been the explantion for the high liver enzymes. His last blood check (several months ago) was excellent. That is all I know for now. I guess I will just try giving him a pancreatic enzyme with his food, feed several small meals per day, and see if that helps. If not, I will try to find another vet.
:-) Patty

Casey Post <mikken@neo.rr.com> wrote:

> Did they ever discover what was causing the pancreatitis....diabetes, EPI,
> etc? That might be something you want to look into so you can treat
> whatever disease process is causing this.

Yeah, I have to ask how this diagnosis was made as well (for pancreatitis).
These episodes sound more like acute manifestations of a chronic condition
and one that needs to be diagnosed. Of course, there are all sorts of
possibilities - EPI, SIBO, etc. that leap to mind, but whatever it is, it
needs to be found and dealt with. If your vet isn't up for the task, find
one that is.

Casey

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Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

1f. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:16 pm ((PDT))

Patty,

One of the main adverse effects of Flagyl is liver damage!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Patty Linden" <pattykat3@yahoo.com>

> Casey--Thank you for your reply. He was initially determined to have
pancreatitis after having a complete blood panel that showed highly elevated
pancreatic enzymes. An xray of his stomach also showed extreme irritation.
Each of the other episodes also showed highly elevated pancreatic enzymes in
his blood. This past winter, he showed a very high elevation of his liver
enzymes, and my vet scheduled an ultrasound to check his liver for such a
possibility as cancer. His ultrasound showed a very healthy liver. I was
told that disturbances with the pancreas can effect the liver, and that
could have been the explantion for the high liver enzymes.

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

1g. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:41 pm ((PDT))

Patty,

I am not certain about that enzyme product. I doubt it is prescription
strength and sounds like it is mainly plant based, although it does contain
protease and a pancreas concentrate. It might be worth a try....if it
doesn't work, you can always get the Viokase.

Not sure about the Mylanta...I know that Karen has used it with her ill
dogs, which have been many as she adopts the sick and unwanted!! The gas
may subside with use of the enzymes. I really don't know.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Patty Linden" <pattykat3@yahoo.com>

> Sandee--Thank you so much for your response. I read all of the archived
emails you included. Viokase seems to be a pancreatic enzyme many use.
Prior to starting this diet, I read in several places about a pancreatic
enzyme called "FloraZyme LP powder (recommended by Dr. DeHaan, a vet in
Minnesota). I subsequently bought some, but had not used it yet. I wonder
if this would be considered "prescription strength". It contains such
enzymes as Protease, Amylase, Lipase, Cellulase (all preceeded by the word
"Fungal"), Pancreas Concentrate, and 2 probiotics).
>
> Regarding what caused his pancreatitis--all I know is that the vet told me
he must have gotten into some fatty foods. When I first adopted him, he had
been found wandering the streets, apparently had been attacked by some other
animals, and had to have surgery to cut off dead flesh from him wounded
rear. They thought he had been walking around for several days like that
from the appearance of his wound. It was about a month after I took him
home that his first attack of pancreatitis occurred.
>
> I will put him on several small meals during the day along with the
FloraZyme. I notice one person recommended using Mylanta for a gassy
stomach. He has had a lot of gas, and I think has been uncomfortable with
it--Do you think Mylanta is a good idea? And--I wonder how much?

Messages in this topic (10)
________________________________________________________________________

1h. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Patty Linden" pattykat3@yahoo.com pattykat3
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 4:39 pm ((PDT))

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote: Patty,

One of the main adverse effects of Flagyl is liver damage!
---------------------------------------------------

Unbelievable!! One of the reasons I am reluctant to go back to the vet.

Patty

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Patty Linden" <pattykat3@yahoo.com>

> Casey--Thank you for your reply. He was initially determined to have
pancreatitis after having a complete blood panel that showed highly elevated
pancreatic enzymes. An xray of his stomach also showed extreme irritation.
Each of the other episodes also showed highly elevated pancreatic enzymes in
his blood. This past winter, he showed a very high elevation of his liver
enzymes, and my vet scheduled an ultrasound to check his liver for such a
possibility as cancer. His ultrasound showed a very healthy liver. I was
told that disturbances with the pancreas can effect the liver, and that
could have been the explantion for the high liver enzymes.

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Messages in this topic (10)
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1i. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 5:17 pm ((PDT))

On Nov 3, 2007, at 2:26 PM, Patty Linden wrote:

>
> Regarding what caused his pancreatitis--all I know is that the vet
> told me he must have gotten into some fatty foods. When I first
> adopted him, he had been found wandering the streets, apparently
> had been attacked by some other animals, and had to have surgery to
> cut off dead flesh from him wounded rear. They thought he had been
> walking around for several days like that from the appearance of
> his wound. It was about a month after I took him home that his
> first attack of pancreatitis occurred.
>

Just curious if he had been given distemper or other vaccines during
his recovery period... Distemper in particular can mess up digestive
processes for life, and, IMO, is one of the primary causes of chronic
intolerance, chronic loose stools, frequent vomiting, etc.

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (10)
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1j. Re: Pancreatitis, diarrhea, antibiotic side effects
Posted by: "Patty Linden" pattykat3@yahoo.com pattykat3
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 5:20 pm ((PDT))

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote: Patty,

I am not certain about that enzyme product. I doubt it is prescription
strength and sounds like it is mainly plant based, although it does contain
protease and a pancreas concentrate. It might be worth a try....if it
doesn't work, you can always get the Viokase.
------------------------------------------------------
Sandee--thanks again.

Yes, it is mostly plant based. I noticed that Karen had recommended Biocase (from Revival Animal Health) as being the same strength as Viokase, and said it was excellent. I think I will order that over the Internet.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fatty food doesn't cause pancreatitis...it could aggravate an already
diseased pancreas. There are several disease processes plus some drugs,
toxins and vaccinations that are the root cause.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Mica did have several drugs (plus, of course anathesia) during and following his surgery. In addition, he had to have 6 teeth pulled on one side about a month after the surgery (periodontal disease), which also involved more anathesia and antibiotics. It was not too long after that that he had his first episode of pancreatitis.

---------------------------------------------------

Poor little guy...sounds
like he definitely had some rough times and is very fortunate to have found
you! :)

--------------------------------------------------
Yes, thanks, Sandee. And I am equally as lucky--he is such a sweet little dog.
:-) Patty

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Messages in this topic (10)
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2a. Re: Puppy is still throwing up
Posted by: "connie" justbullies@hotmail.com bullienut
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 1:37 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Alecia Hammack <akhwbj1@...> wrote:
I don't think we can give him a break because he acts like he is
starving now. We are so new to this and just
> need help. Thanks so much for responding.
>
> Alecia
Hi Alecia,
What exactly did the vet do for you in ICU? Any tests? xrays?
bloodwork? Is your dog doing the projectile throwing up where the
food just comes right back out..looking more just like food that went
in? Or is he doing the stomach heaving before the throwing up part?
There is a difference in HOW he is throwing up. There is a condition
where dogs have a (I believe humans can have it to) where the muscle
that closes and opens for food is showing a defect or injury. I
can`t remember what its called.But the food will come back up in a
projectile manner. Surgery is an option for this condition or try
keep your dog confined for 1 hour after eating or some of the things
that are an option. Have you used any chemicals on or in him in since
this all started? ie:flea/tick wormers ect.Long term effect things?
~connie~
and a bunch of bulldogs
www.justbullies.com

Messages in this topic (7)
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3a. Re: QUESTION ABOUT EGGS
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 1:37 pm ((PDT))

>I was> wondering how most of you feed eggs to your dogs

I feed Raw Egg 2 times a week.Usually on Fish meal day. It also comes with pork kidney and liver which she does not eat if fed as is.

so,her one of the meal is Fish,Egg andpork kidney and liver.

This way,she gubbles down the pork liver and kidney in a second while she strike on me not to eat it if it was without Egg.Probably pork organs smell stronger for her and not too appetising..To my nose,pork organs definitely has strong smell so,I imagine she smell more than me..

yassy

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4a. Re: Feeding the Senior Dog
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:40 pm ((PDT))

Hi Dinah,

While certain veggies can cause problems by suppressing thyroid function,
blocking calcium uptake, aggravating arthritis and yeast, probably a few
greens will not be harmful...as long as you are adding them to a diet that
contains enough meat and other necessary ingredients and not using them to
"reduce protein".

I'm not quite certain why vets are of the opinion that protein needs to be
decreased in older dogs or that adding carbohydrates will be beneficial.
They must not keep up on current studies or missed a few classes while in
college! :))

Merck (which is the Bible of veterinary medicine) states....
"The carbohydrates added to pet foods are mainly in the form of
polysaccharides (starch and cellulose), disaccharides (sucrose and lactose),
and monosaccharides (glucose and fructose). Carbohydrates are a less
expensive source of energy than fat or protein. In dogs, there appears to be
no dietary requirement for carbohydrate."

In other words, they are fed because they are cheap not because they have
any benefit...the pet food manufacturers agree!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Dinah" <dinah_kay@msn.com>

I
understand that veggies are part of the prey model, but could some one
let me know what is wrong with adding a few green veggies? Will it
cause any problems, or is it just wasteful to feed a few veggies on
the side while keeping up with everything else?

Messages in this topic (6)
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5a. Re: How large is a gorge meal?
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:59 pm ((PDT))

I don't feed gorge meal every time i feed but rather,once in amonth since i am trying to get her use to bigger portion of meal all at once with this second round.

Last Halloween day,I fed 5lb of Goat Leg,andI took it out when she ate roughly 1lb of it.
I traded her Beef Rib bone that I left meat for human,bone for her for that night' dinner,so,she had plenty of meat(15oz) and about half of Beef rib because she was stuffed:-P

Every time the door bell rang,she tries look at who was coming by running closer to pen panel but soon go back to goat meat as if worried it would dissapear if left it alone too long,it was funny. She ripped ripped with paw stay on meat and tried dragging it by grabbing bits of meat but due to weight,she was wabbly andmy husband and I were laughing loud.

I am not comfortable giving her chance to gnaw on leg bone so,I will take bone away if it ate close enough to naked bone someday.

this Goat leg wasprobably 2 times bigger than my dog's head.

It was real tiring meal for my dog and it was very amusing meal for us to watch.

Following days,she ate little less than usual.

yassy

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5b. Re: How large is a gorge meal?
Posted by: "shefy gupta" shefy7@yahoo.com shefy7
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:58 pm ((PDT))

wow, that is so funny yassy! snowy did the same thing when i gave him his first ham bone last week. very protective....

where did you ever find a goat leg two times the size of his head?!!?!

i would LOVE to give snowy something like that! i'm sure he would too..hehe..

thanks!
shefy and snowy

Yasuko herron <sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com> wrote:
I don't feed gorge meal every time i feed but rather,once in amonth since i am trying to get her use to bigger portion of meal all at once with this second round.

Last Halloween day,I fed 5lb of Goat Leg,andI took it out when she ate roughly 1lb of it.
I traded her Beef Rib bone that I left meat for human,bone for her for that night' dinner,so,she had plenty of meat(15oz) and about half of Beef rib because she was stuffed:-P

Every time the door bell rang,she tries look at who was coming by running closer to pen panel but soon go back to goat meat as if worried it would dissapear if left it alone too long,it was funny. She ripped ripped with paw stay on meat and tried dragging it by grabbing bits of meat but due to weight,she was wabbly andmy husband and I were laughing loud.

I am not comfortable giving her chance to gnaw on leg bone so,I will take bone away if it ate close enough to naked bone someday.

this Goat leg wasprobably 2 times bigger than my dog's head.

It was real tiring meal for my dog and it was very amusing meal for us to watch.

Following days,she ate little less than usual.

yassy

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6a. Re: Our first day! Yay!
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:59 pm ((PDT))

> The calculation I use is 30 (lbs) x .02 (which is 2%) x 16 ounces. With that calculation I get 9.6 ounces which I've been rounding up to 10 ounces/day for a 30 lb. dog.

I think that is correct. And it is ok to round up too. But 30lb isideal weight of your dog? You better use ideal weight to calculate and2% is guideline only so,you can up it or down it according to yourdogs appearence/activity etc.

>.8 oz seems reasonable for a 20 lb dog.

Well,if 20lb were ideal weight and if you use 2% intake,it comes out 6.4oz (0.4lb). and you can feed little less than half pound or feed half pound andsee how your dog does.

calculation-wise,you doing good.

yassy

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6b. Re: Our first day! Yay!
Posted by: "shefy gupta" shefy7@yahoo.com shefy7
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:58 pm ((PDT))

That seems right, I give Snowy 8oz/day and he's 20lbs. He's really energetic though. He goes to daycare all day like 2-3 times a week. I give him more snacks as well too though, like liver and tripe and stuff I don't even know the names of...

Shefy and Snowy

Yasuko herron <sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The calculation I use is 30 (lbs) x .02 (which is 2%) x 16 ounces. With that calculation I get 9.6 ounces which I've been rounding up to 10 ounces/day for a 30 lb. dog.

I think that is correct. And it is ok to round up too. But 30lb isideal weight of your dog? You better use ideal weight to calculate and2% is guideline only so,you can up it or down it according to yourdogs appearence/activity etc.

>.8 oz seems reasonable for a 20 lb dog.

Well,if 20lb were ideal weight and if you use 2% intake,it comes out 6.4oz (0.4lb). and you can feed little less than half pound or feed half pound andsee how your dog does.

calculation-wise,you doing good.

yassy

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7a. Re: Ok, no more talk about bloat, how about Mountain Oysters?
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 2:59 pm ((PDT))

>I added buffalo fries to normal meals for the boys and neither of them
had digestive upset

Hi,Andrea.Thank you for your reply. Next time when I needed to order buffalo,I try on that and see how she does.

yassy

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7b. Re: Ok, no more talk about bloat, how about Mountain Oysters?
Posted by: "shefy gupta" shefy7@yahoo.com shefy7
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:58 pm ((PDT))

What are buffalo fries?

Get used to dumb questions like this group, I'm a vegetarian :) Snowy's a super carnivore :)

Shefy and Snowy

Yasuko herron <sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I added buffalo fries to normal meals for the boys and neither of them
had digestive upset

Hi,Andrea.Thank you for your reply. Next time when I needed to order buffalo,I try on that and see how she does.

yassy

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Messages in this topic (26)
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8. Deer Heads,Antlers
Posted by: "gusmyhairyboy" gusmyhairyboy@charter.net gusmyhairyboy
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Suzie G. here

Does anyone here feed deer heads,antlers?

Messages in this topic (1)
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9. Is small hen OK to feed....?
Posted by: "shefy7" shefy7@yahoo.com shefy7
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

hi everyone :) Snowy is back to normal! His gums are looking better
than ever and his teeth are super white. I've been giving him lots of
ham bones,which are really good for cleaning teeth btw...

I've been looking around for places to buy good meat, meaning no
processing or preserving or chemicals. So far I've only gotten
nature's variety ham/turkey/lamb bones at a local pet store. I've
gotten some big chunks of meat from safeway, like turkey quarters and
pork shoulder boneless. i'm still searching for a good butcher near.

I saw little packages of what looked like a chicken at safeway today.
It said small gaming hen on there and 8% water or something (I'm
vegetarian remember so I haven't a clue about meat...) I'm wondering
if things like this are OK to feed as a meal? I think the total weight
was 1 pound for each hen. I know this is considered a gorge meal and
he only needs 1/2lb./day to maintain his weight. So I would skip a day
and then feed him again?

Snowy is 1.5 years old, 20 lbs. (want to keep him at this weight), and
full of energy!

Thanks for your help everyone! We're hopping on the raw bandwagon!

Shefy and Snowy

Messages in this topic (1)
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10a. Just started feeding raw
Posted by: "Heidi" dolphin_6876@yahoo.com dolphin_6876
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 3:58 pm ((PDT))

Hi. My name is Heidi and I just started feeding my dogs and cats raw
about a few days ago. I have four dogs, 3 lab mixes ands a 5 mo old
shih tzu puppy. 2 of my labs have taken very well to their new diet and
absolutely LOVE it! The puppy loves it too! As a matter of facxt, I
think he's eating too much of it. No problems with those three, but my
one lab mix won't eat the chicken raw. We switched from a cooked food
and kibble and she seems to be very picky about this new diet, unless
it's deer meat and I've used all I've had and am having trouble finding
more at a reasonable price. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how
to get her to eat her chicken raw and not cooked? Would it be bad to
slowly switch her from cooked to raw by decreasing the amount of time
it's cooked everyday?
Thanks in advance!
Heidi

Messages in this topic (6)
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10b. Re: Just started feeding raw
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 4:11 pm ((PDT))

Hi Heidi,

Silly dog...doesn't she know Labs are supposed to eat *everything*? :))

There are a few tricks you could try before resorting to cooking. Raw
chicken is quite bland so warming it (in a bag in warm water) and slicing
into it will bring out the odor. You can also sprinkle with parmesan cheese
and smash some down in the slices. Try that and see if she is more inclined
to eat it.

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Heidi" <dolphin_6876@yahoo.com>

my
one lab mix won't eat the chicken raw. We switched from a cooked food
and kibble and she seems to be very picky about this new diet, unless
it's deer meat and I've used all I've had and am having trouble finding
more at a reasonable price. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how
to get her to eat her chicken raw and not cooked? Would it be bad to
slowly switch her from cooked to raw by decreasing the amount of time
it's cooked everyday?

Messages in this topic (6)
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10c. Re: Just started feeding raw
Posted by: "Heidi" dolphin_6876@yahoo.com dolphin_6876
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 4:39 pm ((PDT))

Thanks...I'll try that in the morning:)
Heidi

Messages in this topic (6)
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11. raw/calcium/phosphorus
Posted by: "beaulah_2001us" beaulah_2001us@yahoo.com beaulah_2001us
Date: Sat Nov 3, 2007 5:21 pm ((PDT))

My holistic vet said she would keep our puppy on at least half canned
or kibble mixed with raw until she is 8 months old so that calcuim and
phosphorus levels are maintained and good bones are made.

Doesnt raw meaty bones do this on its own? If it doesnt is there
another way I can give her a good balance of these and know she is
getting all she needs of both of these minerals?

Sandy

Messages in this topic (1)
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Feed Pets Raw Food

Saturday, November 3, 2007

[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12234

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