[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12034

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Pork intolerance?
From: cresco299
1b. Re: Pork intolerance?
From: Morledzep@aol.com
1c. Re: Pork intolerance?
From: Yasuko herron
1d. Re: Pork intolerance?
From: costrowski75
1e. Re: Pork intolerance?
From: Giselle

2a. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
From: Morledzep@aol.com
2b. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
From: Sonja
2c. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
From: Laurie Swanson
2d. Time for a trip to the vet?
From: Ivette Casiano

3a. Sheep? and re-intro
From: lauraanimal1
3b. Re: Sheep? and re-intro
From: Giselle
3c. Re: Sheep? and re-intro
From: cypressbunny

4a. Re: eating 4 day old buried meaty bone?
From: Tracy Meal
4b. Re: eating 4 day old buried meaty bone?
From: woofwoofgrrl

5a. Long-haired Lap Dogs
From: Renate
5b. Re: Long-haired Lap Dogs
From: pelle567

6a. goat changed to lamb
From: Terri Leist
6b. Re: goat changed to lamb
From: cypressbunny

7a. Re: goats?
From: Laurie Swanson

8a. Re: breed specific
From: Dina

9a. Re: Swallowing big bones whole?!
From: Laurie Swanson

10a. anal sacs?
From: johkemp
10b. Re: anal sacs?
From: heather pavelin

11a. Re: My senior dog has been on raw a week
From: delcaste

12.1. Re: new member
From: johkemp

Messages
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1a. Pork intolerance?
Posted by: "cresco299" gentry.jeffrey@yahoo.com cresco299
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:16 pm ((PDT))

I've been feeding raw for almost 3 months now and my girls get a
slightly varied diet of Beef, Pork, Chicken and offal. 4 Days a week
they get chicken, 1 day beef, 1 day pork and 1 day offal. I accepted
the fact that at the beginning, meat farts are the norm and they did
subsided within a week of starting raw. But Bailey (7 yr old aussie
shep/blue healer) continues to release these silent but deadly gases
after every pork feeding. My other dog doesn't seem to have this
problem.

Is it possible she is having problems with pork? Or do I need to
consider feeding her pork more often to allow the "good stomach bugs"
to grow.

Jeff and Bailey

Messages in this topic (5)
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1b. Re: Pork intolerance?
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:35 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/13/2007 1:16:24 PM Pacific Standard Time,
gentry.jeffrey@yahoo.com writes:

Is it possible she is having problems with pork? Or do I need to
consider feeding her pork more often to allow the "good stomach bugs"
to grow.

Jeff,

After some 4 or 5 years of raw feeding all of my dogs still have stinkbutt
after fatty meals. Pork and Lamb are the worst offenders.. and duck comes in a
close third. But goat seems to cause little or no harmful odors.

Catherine R.

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

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Messages in this topic (5)
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1c. Re: Pork intolerance?
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:22 pm ((PDT))

>After some 4 or 5 years of raw feeding all of my dogs still have stinkbutt after fatty meals.

Hi. Palette too! She has bad one after Beef,but she seems quite self concious and,she goes to bathroom and do fart and come back to us human with dragging smell.

It is wiered... My husband and I goes " she went to bathroom,so,maybe come back with stink" and sure enough she did.

yassy

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Messages in this topic (5)
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1d. Re: Pork intolerance?
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:06 pm ((PDT))

"cresco299" <gentry.jeffrey@...> wrote:
>
> I've been feeding raw for almost 3 months now and my girls get a
> slightly varied diet of Beef, Pork, Chicken and offal. 4 Days a
week
> they get chicken, 1 day beef, 1 day pork and 1 day offal.
*****
After three months you can start backing off on the chicken. Four
days a week is a lot of chicken. I recommend you mix it up more.

But Bailey (7 yr old aussie
> shep/blue healer) continues to release these silent but deadly gases
> after every pork feeding.
*****
Personally I think farts are generally overrated as issues to worry
about.

Is it possible she is having problems with pork?
*****
If there were "problems" you'd be seeing distress. Unless Bailey
suffers from his gas, or suffers in addition to his gas, I'd say your
best bet would be to keep on keeping on, on the assumption that time
will resolve this. Should you really want to intervene, you can try
leaner pork or smaller meals or feeding a pork/other meat combo meal.

My dogs have not had, to date, significant digestive issues
correspond with gas, belches or grumbly stomach; the few times there
WERE digestive problems--bloat, pancreatitis, "upset stomach"--the
plumbing was dead silent. Nothing moved up or down or back or
forth. Dead in the water. I prefer to know things are happening.

When my husband complains about doggie fumes I gently remind him that
he who is without sin may cast the first stone.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (5)
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1e. Re: Pork intolerance?
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:15 pm ((PDT))

YUP. You want to worry when there are no bowel sounds! Noisy bellies
are happy bellies, imo.

Talk about casting stones, who out there *never* get the SBDs, or
complete blowouts - from eating, oh, Mexican. or BBQ?

^_^

TC
G

> My dogs have not had, to date, significant digestive issues
> correspond with gas, belches or grumbly stomach; the few times there
> WERE digestive problems--bloat, pancreatitis, "upset stomach"--the
> plumbing was dead silent. Nothing moved up or down or back or
> forth. Dead in the water. I prefer to know things are happening.
>
> When my husband complains about doggie fumes I gently remind him that
> he who is without sin may cast the first stone.
> Chris O
>

Messages in this topic (5)
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2a. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:17 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 9/12/2007 2:31:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,
ladyver@sbcglobal.net writes:

I fed her two turkey necks (one AM one PM) to clear it up but it had a
minimal effect. Can I give her only turkey necks for a few days in a row? I thought
it would be way too much bone....

Sonja,

digestion takes time.. if you feed turkey necks until her poop is firm or
hard, you're asking for constipation, because there will still be more bone in
her system.

When my dogs have loose stools that continue for more than a day or two, i
fast them for one day, feed them a moderatly bony meal the next day and
something slightly less bony the day after that. Usually by then their poops are back
to normal.

IF you do something like this and her poop doesn't get better, or gets
runnier, then it's time for a trip to the vet. At least that's how it works at my
house.

Catherine R.

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

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Messages in this topic (11)
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2b. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
Posted by: "Sonja" ladyver@sbcglobal.net lonepalm77
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:59 pm ((PDT))

Catherine,

That's great advice...thank you. I will follow it. I didn't feed this morning so I won't feed again tonight.

Sonja

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Messages in this topic (11)
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2c. Re: Time for a trip to the vet?
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:11 pm ((PDT))

Sonja,

I don't think a lack of organs would be related to diarrhea. I was
thinking if you HAD fed organs it might have contributed to it, but
guess that's not it!

Is she still having diarrhea today? How bad is it? Do you think she
might've been stressed by the big day on Sat. and/or the interaction
with the other dog?

Have you ever used classical homeopathy? Sounds like there might be
other issues, too (the violent itchies), and all of it would probably
benefit.

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Sonja" <ladyver@...> wrote:
>
> Laurie,
>
> Kodie hasn't had organs for quite some time (could that be the
problem?), she had a violent reaction to chicken liver a few months
ago (chicken allergies are my guess). She itched 'til she bled.

Messages in this topic (11)
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2d. Time for a trip to the vet?
Posted by: "Ivette Casiano" ivettecasiano@yahoo.com ivettecasiano
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:38 pm ((PDT))

Sonja, could she have gotten into something outside, or something you fed her was very, very ripe, could you have fed her too much liver, too much fat, a bad piece of meat? Why aren't you giving her bone? Isn't not giving her bone going in the opposite direction?

Ivette Casiano
"Live for today, plan for tomorrow"

---------------------------------
Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.

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Messages in this topic (11)
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3a. Sheep? and re-intro
Posted by: "lauraanimal1" lauraanimal1@yahoo.com lauraanimal1
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:20 pm ((PDT))

Sorry guys its been a while since I been on here for many reasons
and I forgot that I prolly needed to reintoduce myself. My name is
Laura and I have a Rotti that "was" on raw, but everytime we went to
her "boyfriends" house for her to play tye 1st thing she did was eat
his kibble. I was tried everything and she would act like it wasnt
even her. Well I had to move and she refused to eat the raw after I
had to have her "boyfriends" mom take care of her for a few days, I
gave her normal raw food for her to eat, but she didnt feed it to
her....anyway I was in the process of moving and Ishta refused to
eat for almost a week only wanting kibble so i gave in, ( I know I
know VERY VERY BAD MOMMY!!!!!). Now I am moved, settled in and am
finding places to get lots of raw. And thjis time she wants on it!!!
yeahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!! anyway I asked earlier about the buthcer and
the wild game, but what about sheep? I have never heard of that one
being feed, I know the hide wouldnt be a good thing unless it has
been shaved???? but what about the rest of the meat? i mean it seems
like she should be able to eat it, I mean think of the comment wolf
in sheeps clothing...... can anyone give me any advice?
TIA...
Laura & Ishta

Messages in this topic (3)
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3b. Re: Sheep? and re-intro
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:02 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Laura
Welcome back!
Not sure what you are asking here.
Do you mean, is it OK to feed sheep? Yes.
Did you mean, is it OK to feed whole sheep? Yes.
I think the 'usual' way whole sheep or goat is sold is a 'six-way'
cut. Pretty large parts, I would guess.
I'm not sure, but I think that those that are slaughtered are sheared
first, so the skin would be intact, but have no wool, but I may be wrong.
Btw, you've never fed lamb? Its pretty pricey in the grocery store,
but I get breast of lamb or ribs sometimes when they're on sale. And
occasionally I can get lamb necks.
Lamb is just juvenile sheep.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Sorry guys its been a while since I been on here for many reasons
> and I forgot that I prolly needed to reintroduce myself. My name is
> Laura and I have a Rotti that "was" on raw,
<snip>
Anyway I asked earlier about the butcher and
> the wild game, but what about sheep? I have never heard of that one
> being fed, I know the hide wouldn't be a good thing unless it has
> been shaved???? But what about the rest of the meat?
<snip>
.. can anyone give me any advice?
> TIA...
> Laura & Ishta
>

Messages in this topic (3)
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3c. Re: Sheep? and re-intro
Posted by: "cypressbunny" cypressbunny@yahoo.com cypressbunny
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:32 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "lauraanimal1" <lauraanimal1@...>
wrote:
>
> I know the hide wouldnt be a good thing unless it has
> been shaved???? but what about the rest of the meat?

*** It would be unusual to buy mutton with the skin on--more often it
would be skinned first. I agree that I wouldn't feed hide with a lot
of wool on it. If it was sheared first that would be ok. Other than
that the whole sheep is edible for a rottie.

--Carrie

Messages in this topic (3)
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4a. Re: eating 4 day old buried meaty bone?
Posted by: "Tracy Meal" hiddenpoetinme1@yahoo.com hiddenpoetinme1
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:20 pm ((PDT))

Hi there,

I have been feeding raw for 2 months now and my 2 rotties will bury what they cannot finish at mealtimes. They will dig it up and consume it with no problems a couple days later.

I find the practice disgusting and try to stay far enough away so I do not have to smell it. I also let them wash their mouths with hose water after feeding so their breath does not smell like carrion. ;-)

Tracy

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (6)
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4b. Re: eating 4 day old buried meaty bone?
Posted by: "woofwoofgrrl" cmc4lists1@gastrounit.com woofwoofgrrl
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:43 pm ((PDT))

At least they don't roll on it! My 1 year old LHW likes to bury his
food, and my 12 yo Border Collie likes to find it, dig it up, *roll on
it*, and then eat it.

The puppy is hysterical when he's hiding stuff - he hasn't learned to be
particularly discrete so there are times when he's burying something in
full view of the other dogs. As soon as he's left one of the other
dogs will go dig it up and eat it. He just stands there looking as if
he's thinking "Well Golly! How did they find it so quickly? I know I
did a good job burying it!" LOL!!

The only adverse affects the dogs have encountered from burying food is
an increase in bath frequency - directly corresponding to each dogs
individual tendency to roll on stinky food! Their stomachs have been
otherwise unaffected.

Christine

Tracy Meal wrote:
>
>
> Hi there,
>
> I have been feeding raw for 2 months now and my 2 rotties will bury what
> they cannot finish at mealtimes. They will dig it up and consume it with
> no problems a couple days later.
>
> I find the practice disgusting and try to stay far enough away so I do
> not have to smell it. I also let them wash their mouths with hose water
> after feeding so their breath does not smell like carrion. ;-)
>
> Tracy
>

Messages in this topic (6)
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5a. Long-haired Lap Dogs
Posted by: "Renate" renate.tideswell@gmail.com tideswell_renate
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:21 pm ((PDT))

I'm not sure how to word this question because I don't want to upset anyone,
so I think I'll just apologize in advance and ask outright. I have 2 shih
tzus that sleep with me and a poodle-border collie and at the moment 2
foster shih tzus. I am really drawn to the whole raw feeding thing, but
with long-haired lap-dogs, how messy are they going to be? I'm not the best
housekeeper, but I have to draw the line at sleeping with bloody-covered,
fatty, smelly doggies. Will they need bathing every day? Anyone here in
the same situation?

--
Renate
'The more I learn about men, the more I love my Shih Tzu'

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Messages in this topic (2)
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5b. Re: Long-haired Lap Dogs
Posted by: "pelle567" krjoyner@firstam.com pelle567
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:10 pm ((PDT))

I have a pekingese and I just wipe him down with a baby wipe...he
smells absolutely lovely.

Katie

Messages in this topic (2)
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6a. goat changed to lamb
Posted by: "Terri Leist" qahri@sbcglobal.net qahri
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:10 pm ((PDT))

ok, now that I know goat is good; the owner of a butcher shop said I could get a ewe instead. He said it would be $50 for the ewe, & $50 to process it. I don't know how much it will weigh, but I'll find out tomorrow.

My question is. How do I ask it to be cut? I have a small square freezer, so it can't be 4 long legs or anything. He said I could ask for other parts too. So what do I tell the man when I call him tomorrow?

Kadin eats around 1.5lbs & Lilly eats around 1lb. Do I ask him to cut the body parts into those weights? Do I ask him to cut each leg into 4 sections? Are lamb legs too hard to chew, when Kadins teeth are already worn down (heard yesterday that can be from tennis balls, it IS in a perfect round shape, it starts behind her canines as REAL short, then get longer like a ball- even her canines are worn too.

Anyway, I know the ribs can be slabs?? But what organs & what do I tell the guy so I can get it into my freezer??

Thanks for any help I'll wait until I get replies to call him so that I can make sense & not sound like a goof ball!

Thanks from me & K & L thank you too, they are going to love this, at least I HOPE!!

Terri & the Raw Fed-"Muttly Crew" Kadin & Lilly:
Learn how: www.rawfeddogs.net

www.rawfed.com

www.rawmeatybones.com

Over exposure to the SON; actually PREVENTS burning!!

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Messages in this topic (2)
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6b. Re: goat changed to lamb
Posted by: "cypressbunny" cypressbunny@yahoo.com cypressbunny
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:30 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Terri Leist <qahri@...> wrote:
>
> I don't know how much it will weigh, but I'll find out tomorrow.

*** Most adult ewes weigh a minimum of 80 lbs, so that sounds like a
good price to me.

> My question is. How do I ask it to be cut?

*** If it were me, I'd ask for the whole carcass to be cut into 1-2
lb bone-in roasts. Ask for the feet, and the head if you want it.
Also ask for the tripe, lungs, heart, spleen, liver, kidneys, and
pancreas if he knows where it is. Intestines optional.

> Do I ask him to cut each leg into 4 sections?

*** Probably 3 sections: shank, foreshank, and foot (with hoof).

Are lamb legs too hard to chew, when Kadins teeth are already worn
down (heard yesterday that can be from tennis balls

*** Unless this is a monster ewe, the bones aren't too hard to chew.
The damage you describe does sound like tennis ball damage--dogs
hold the ball behind the canines and chew--many thousands of
repetitions is like chewing sandpaper and does wear teeth
excessively.

> what do I tell the guy so I can get it into my freezer??

*** The only parts that don't stack nicely are the ribs, but if he
cuts them into 1 or 2 pound slabs they'll store fine.

--Carrie

Messages in this topic (2)
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7a. Re: goats?
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:33 pm ((PDT))

IME, it's great--MUCH leaner than lamb, my 20 lb. Boston loves it, and
he eats the shoulder and rib bones and most of the leg bone (maybe not
all of the long part). I get skin-on, bone-in hunks (probably from a 6-
way cut) in Seattle at the Asian markets for 2.69/lb. to 3.29/lb. The
more expensive store's sign says it's from Australia, not sure about
the others.

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Terri Leist <qahri@...> wrote:
>
> How ok, is goat??
>

Messages in this topic (6)
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8a. Re: breed specific
Posted by: "Dina" dotdog99@comcast.net dmmelendez
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:35 pm ((PDT))

>
> I guess that means that a raw diet doesn't help with all alergies.
Is that right? I've got a dog
> who sems to have just about every inhaled allergy you can imagine,
and I'd hoped that raw
> would help with that.
>
> Libby
>

Depends, how long have you been feeding and do you vaccinate and/or use
HW and flea/tick preventatives?

Dina
PA

Messages in this topic (15)
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9a. Re: Swallowing big bones whole?!
Posted by: "Laurie Swanson" laurie@mckinneyphoto.com las_lala
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:35 pm ((PDT))

Hi Karlene,

How big are your dogs? Those are small pieces for anything but tiny
dogs. Can be choking hazards, but sounds like it went down ok. It
should digest fine. You may see fragments in his poop, or it's
possible he'll vomit some back up, but that can happen in newbie dogs
regardless of what size the piece is that's fed. Their digestion
sometimes has to get up to speed. And many dogs don't have any
problems. He may also slow down when he gets used to this new food.
They are usually quite excited to be getting real food and this can
lead to gulping bigger pieces than they might later down the road.
Yep, the solution is to feed bigger, so he'll have to work at it and
think about what he's doing. How big depends on how big he is. If
you fed him a pound, is he about 30-50 lbs.? If that's the case, I'd
probably not go any smaller than a quarter of a chicken (in one
hunk). If you want to slow him down even more, go even bigger and
let him eat half or whatever, and save the other half for the next
meal. It will be more naturally dismantled and he'll have to work
and think even more.

Laurie

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "mrskheath" <mrskheath@...> wrote:
> He used his teeth on some of it, but then he
> swallowed the 'leg' part of the bone whole from what i could see,
> maybe he semi-broke the bone once at the very most (hard to tell).
Is
> that okay?

Messages in this topic (2)
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10a. anal sacs?
Posted by: "johkemp" johkemp@yahoo.com.au johkemp
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:24 pm ((PDT))

Does anyone's raw fed dog have these problems?

I was wondering whether the more natural diet has effects on anal
sacs. Do dogs not eating and therefore not pooping mush have any
problems? My dogs have never had these problems but my sister's crap
fed dog does. Their vet recommended adding bran to the dogs food to
prevent it :(

Jo

Messages in this topic (2)
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10b. Re: anal sacs?
Posted by: "heather pavelin" hpav061378@yahoo.com hpav061378
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:38 pm ((PDT))

My greyhound had this problem when he was being fed kibble and always had mushy poops. He started leaking them all over my house YUCK!!! Took to vet and they were very very full every 2-3 weeks or so. Since switching to raw his butt does not stink anymore and we have not had any more problems. We have been feeding for 3 weeks now and normally he should have had to be emptied by now. So yay for us! good luck Heather

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Messages in this topic (2)
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11a. Re: My senior dog has been on raw a week
Posted by: "delcaste" delcaste@yahoo.com delcaste
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:40 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Giselle" <megan.giselle@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, Silvina!
> COOL! ; )
> http://www.netlingo.com/lookup.cfm?term=KEWL
> TC
> Giselle

Oh my. I liked the link you sent me :)
B4N

Silvina

Messages in this topic (5)
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12.1. Re: new member
Posted by: "johkemp" johkemp@yahoo.com.au johkemp
Date: Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:06 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Dorit Pittman" <dorit.pittman@...>
wrote:
>
> WHere do you get chicken feet?
>
>
I get them at our local ethnic grocer - they sell offal (chicken
giblets, liver and hearts, lamb hearts, liver, kidneys etc) and goat
too!! All packaged, it's great. Try an asian or middle easterm
supermarket.

Jo

Messages in this topic (76)
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