[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11865

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: next best thing
From: brutus_buckley

2a. Re: Not eating raw...
From: Jamie Dolan
2b. Re: Not eating raw...
From: Jamie Dolan

3a. Re: calcium/phosphorous ration
From: Sandee Lee

4a. Re: New to Raw: Is this diet okay?
From: Sandee Lee
4b. Re: New to Raw: Is this diet okay?
From: jennifer mcfaden

5a. Re: Gauge
From: pigasus718

6a. Re: new to this group
From: Sandee Lee
6b. Re: new to this group
From: jennifer mcfaden
6c. Re: new to this group
From: Sandee Lee
6d. Re: new to this group
From: Morledzep@aol.com
6e. Re: new to this group
From: costrowski75
6f. Re: new to this group
From: jennifer mcfaden

7a. Re: Feeding and spices
From: Morledzep@aol.com

8a. Freezer
From: Giselle
8b. Re: Freezer
From: Morledzep@aol.com
8c. Re: Freezer
From: Giselle

9a. Re: Newbie - just took the plunge
From: Giselle

10a. Re: I love my vet!
From: pet.wellness

11a. Re: Sources Found-DFW, Texas Area - South
From: pet.wellness

12a. My grass.......
From: Val Kilmer
12b. Re: My grass.......
From: Sonja

13a. Re: what to do while we're on holiday
From: Nathalie Poulin

14a. Re: Raw Feeding in OZ (was: offal variety - how necessary?)
From: Belinda Mitchell

15. Hare Today
From: sgubernatis

Messages
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1a. Re: next best thing
Posted by: "brutus_buckley" brutus_buckley@yahoo.com brutus_buckley
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:06 pm ((PDT))

I traveled with my 2 dogs for a week recently. I prepared all their
meals for the week and stuck them in Ziplocs. Then I stored them in a
cooler. Only had to add more ice one time. It was no hassle at all; the
dogs ate in their crates.

-Renee W.

Messages in this topic (11)
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2a. Re: Not eating raw...
Posted by: "Jamie Dolan" jamiedolan@gmail.com jamiedolan
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:15 pm ((PDT))

> I would bet the problem is that when they don't eat the food you have made
> up for them, they are offered kibble and canned, both of which are probably
> far more flavorful with all the enhancers, etc., and those carbs are
> addictive. I doubt it's the vegetables they like...most likely it was
> cooked chicken, which again is more flavorful than raw.

I wonder if lightly searing some of there food would be helpful. The
BARF mix does have some decent size chunks of bone in it, maybe up to
the size of a very small thimble. With the bones in it, I really
worry that it is not safe to cook it at all.

Jamie

Messages in this topic (5)
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2b. Re: Not eating raw...
Posted by: "Jamie Dolan" jamiedolan@gmail.com jamiedolan
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:43 pm ((PDT))

> Do your parents believe raw food is better? Or are they just humoring
> you? They have set things up such that it is very hard to succeed,
> unless the dogs actually prefer raw. If they believe in what you are
> doing, perhaps education will help. If not...that's a tough one.

I think it is some of both. I think I have shown them enough
information for them to believe that raw is better than cheap kibble /
canned food. My dogs defiantly prefer raw, especially akiva (akiva
would kill his dog friends for there raw food if I allowed him to).
It is so interesting that all dogs are not like this.

I think that my mom especially is still concerned about the safety of
bones in there food, even the ground ones a little bit. Her vet even
said raw food is fine!!! But she is still concerned. She kind of
freaks out when I give them whole bone in pieces of chicken. She
thinks it will cause them to perforate or cause a blockage. Which I
guess may be more likely with her dogs that mine, because they are not
eating raw all the time, so I don't think they have as strong of
digestive systems. But I don't think it is something she should
really be concerned about.

I think that she still views some of what I (we) believe is a bit
fanatical / extreme. (raw feeding, limited vax, natural flea & tick,
etc.) So I don't think she totally believes in all of it, although
they go along with most of it. They did use flea and tick - front
line once this year (I bathed there dogs and used a detergent to was
off as much of the frontline as possible).

I think another part of the problem may be that my mom seems to be
leaning towards eating less meat and more vegetarian. She has been
reading the omnivores dilemma. So I think she is starting to feel
more uneasy about meat, especially RMB. However something interesting
happened the other night, my aunt was visiting from out of town, she
has been a strict vegetarian for more than 20 years (no meat, no fish,
very limited dairy). My mom was talking about how she cooked some
rice, carrots, and a little bit of chicken for the dogs. I said
something to the effect that my dogs like raw meats far better than
any of the cooked junk. My aunt the vegetarian said "Of course that
is what they like raw meat best thats what they all eat in the wild".
I think my mom was a little surprised that my aunt the vegetarian was
so straight forward about stating raw meat is what dogs naturally eat.

So I think it is a combination of factors that make this situation difficult.

>Have you tried changing the formula? Perhaps they really prefer one
> kind of meat (duck, salmon, chicke...whatever!) By trying single
> foods, you may find some they really like.

I have tried changing the formula a little bit, but I have not tried a
lot of meats by themselves. That is a good idea, I think that is what
I need to do, and try some individual meats with them and try and
judge what they like best, then make there barf mix based on that
meat.

> Lightly searing the food might help, since they are more accustomed to
> cooked or commercial.

Do you think it is safe to lightly cook the meat, even if it has some
ground bone in it? Some of the ground bones pices are a bit on the
larger side.

> This must be pretty frustrating. Is it possible the dogs are picking
> that up, and reacting to it? Are your parents communicating to the
> dogs that the barf mix is bad?

It is possiable that the dogs are getting a bit stressed and confused.
They don't seem to have much trouble eating whatever I put in front
of them, only rarely do they refuse food from me that I give them.

> My dog prefers raw. The only food he is skeptical about is fish. Not
> only do I need to cut it into peices, but to get him to try it the
> first couple of times, I seared it, then got really excited and told
> him how GREAT it was. He looked at me like I must be outta my mind,
> but reluctantly ate it. I still need to cut it into chunks, but don't
> need to sear it.

Thats funny. I can give my little shih tzu's a whole frozen cat fish
and they will eat the entire thing in 45 minutes.

> If your dogs get the message that raw is GOOD...their taste buds will
> probably agree, sooner or later. If they pick up that it is BAD, or
> OPTIONAL...they may continue to refuse.

I wish they would just give them raw, and they either eat raw or they
don't eat. I also wish they would ditch all the "treats" Althouh I
have got them to switch to more meaty treats, I don't think most of
those commercial jerky treats and such are very good for them. I use
freeze dried for treats for my boys. (freeze dried meat). I feel it
is good for them and they love it!

I agree they need to project a more positive attitude about raw to the
dogs, I think they do get the idea that raw is somewhat optional
because of they don't eat it, they get something else.

> was NOT BEING PUNISHED, that hiking is FUN, that he WOULD NOT PERISH
> if he walked through a trickling stream, spent the night in the

Thats intresting, How did you end up getting him to like the water?
Akiva kind of hates water for some reason. He used to refuse to walk
outside if the ground (grass, driveway, dirt, anything) was wet at
all. He seems better about that now, but if I want him to swim, I
have to pick him up and put him in the water.

> forest, etc. (Now that I think about it...the poor guy was probably in
> so much culture shock...he probably would have eaten ANYTHING! Raw-
> scmaw...just protect him from things that make the leaves rustle along
> the trail...)

LOL.

Thanks for your help and suggestions

Jamie

Messages in this topic (5)
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3a. Re: calcium/phosphorous ration
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:26 pm ((PDT))

All the ratios are perfect when feeding according to the prey model which
means approximately 80% meat, 10% edible bone and 10% organs. It looks like
you are feeding quite high bone and you definitely do not want to supplement
with calcium. Start feeding some nice meaty meals to bring the bone content
down, dump the calcium supplement, yeast and kelp. They are not necessary
and can be harmful.

No need to chop their food...just feed it whole. And feed the egg raw! :)

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "swilken61" <powrfemme@aol.com>

For the dogs: I chop up chicken breast and legs into chunks, leaving
the bone of course. If their stool get to hard, I cut back on the
bone a bit. I am also giving them liver, gizzards, and hearts (I just
found turkey hearts). I keep the chunks bigger than bite size so they
will realy have to chew them, on Sundays they get an egg meal
(softboiled so that the whites are cooked but the yolks are soft, and
then they fast until Monday. I do the same with the lamb. If I feed a
chicken leg or a breast, can I assume the calcium/phosphorus ration
is okay?

One of my dogs is prone to UTIs and the other has pancreatitis, so I
remove some of the fat from her meals. I give berry balance three
times a week fot the UTI girl and digestive enzymes for the
pancreatitis girl. I also give them a multivitamin supplement and a
calcium supplement if it seems like they haven't had enough bone,
nutitional yeast on occaision, and some kelp.

Messages in this topic (2)
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4a. Re: New to Raw: Is this diet okay?
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:31 pm ((PDT))

Oh gosh, feeding raw is so simple, even a child could do it!! :))

Seriously, as carnivores the only requirement for your dogs is lots of meat,
a little bone and some organs. No need for recipes, grinding, mixing,
mashing, measuring! :) No veggies, fruit, NO flax or yogurt. Just buy a
chicken, hand to dogs. Add in new protein sources gradually. That's it!!!
Easy, huh????

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "cadence_nakashima" <cadence_nakashima@yahoo.ca>

I tried a diet I got from another raw feeding friend for one batch,
but before I went through the trouble of making it up again, (it
took over an hour for not even three days worth of food), I wanted
to make sure it was a complete diet.

8lbs of the dog meat mixture
1lb of carrot, spinach and alfafa grass
1lb of blueberries and apples
5oz of crushed flax seed
50z of yogurt
1 can of sardines

Messages in this topic (5)
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4b. Re: New to Raw: Is this diet okay?
Posted by: "jennifer mcfaden" cadet972@yahoo.com cadet972
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:10 pm ((PDT))

Sorry to jump in, I am new my self to raw feeding. I have play around with it for several months just not found the right amount for my pack or siberains. if hand the chicken to dog is easy why does one of my girl not like turkey wings when she like the necks, drum legs, and breast?? I have not try the chicken yet my husband scard they will choke on the bones. I have one who love rabbit if any knows some were in richmond va.

Jennifer

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote:
Oh gosh, feeding raw is so simple, even a child could do it!! :))

Seriously, as carnivores the only requirement for your dogs is lots of meat,
a little bone and some organs. No need for recipes, grinding, mixing,
mashing, measuring! :) No veggies, fruit, NO flax or yogurt. Just buy a
chicken, hand to dogs. Add in new protein sources gradually. That's it!!!
Easy, huh????

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "cadence_nakashima" <cadence_nakashima@yahoo.ca>

I tried a diet I got from another raw feeding friend for one batch,
but before I went through the trouble of making it up again, (it
took over an hour for not even three days worth of food), I wanted
to make sure it was a complete diet.

8lbs of the dog meat mixture
1lb of carrot, spinach and alfafa grass
1lb of blueberries and apples
5oz of crushed flax seed
50z of yogurt
1 can of sardines

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Messages in this topic (5)
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5a. Re: Gauge
Posted by: "pigasus718" pigasus718@yahoo.com pigasus718
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:40 pm ((PDT))

Hello Tracey,
My heart goes out to you for the loss of your little guy.
It doesn't take very long for them to become such an
important part of our life, does it?
I lost my rottie, Raquel, 1 1/2 yrs ago, two days after
Christmas. I thought I was going to die too. I still
mourn her to this day.
I pray your other babies come through this ok
also.
Take care of yourself and your "pack" and
know that my thoughts are with you.

Robyn

Messages in this topic (3)
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6a. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:42 pm ((PDT))

Hi Jennifer,

You want to feed lots of meat, a little edible bone and some organs, various
body parts and protein sources. That's it! Start out with feeding
approximately 2-3% of ideal adult weight per day.

I would feed through that prepared raw and not replenish your stock...just
go get a few whole chickens or turkey, divide into meal sized portions and
hand to dogs. Turkey necks are ok if you are feeding a lot of meat with
them...and if you know your dogs aren't gulpers! Prepared raw generally has
quite a high bone content so necks may not be the best to feed along with
it.

Venison and fish are great additional sources, as are pork, beef,
lamb...whatever you have available in your area. You might want to look at
Kevin's recipe page to get other ideas for appropriate foods....
http://www.RawFedDogs.net/

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Jennifer" <cadet972@yahoo.com>

I will be breeding siberians here soon. I have several adults that I am
trying to get on the raw diet. Here my question what a good base diet
for the pack. the weight run 62 lbs(sabastian, male); 50 lbs(bear,
male); 50 lbs(ice, female); 46 lbs(diamond, female); 45 lbs(arctic,
male); 43 lbs(lighting, female); 5 lbs(aurora, female pup 7 weeks).
Aurora and bear never had raw they are the new additions. I am feeding
turkey necks and preparied raw diet. I trying to find other appropiate
foods for them, they like deer & fish.

Messages in this topic (7)
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6b. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "jennifer mcfaden" cadet972@yahoo.com cadet972
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:11 pm ((PDT))

thanks sandee,

one question I try the turkey wings for our large girl and her kennel mate diamond (my two brood bitches) ice ate in about hour and half. diamond just lick at it could that been to large for her since she a petti 46lb girl. she handles the necks and drum leg fine. The only gulper I have is my alpha male arctic and that only after everyone done and starying at him and his food. almost like they are saying if you done want I take it,lol.

The wings were almost a pound each, lots of meat and skin on them.

Jennifer

Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote:
Hi Jennifer,

You want to feed lots of meat, a little edible bone and some organs, various
body parts and protein sources. That's it! Start out with feeding
approximately 2-3% of ideal adult weight per day.

I would feed through that prepared raw and not replenish your stock...just
go get a few whole chickens or turkey, divide into meal sized portions and
hand to dogs. Turkey necks are ok if you are feeding a lot of meat with
them...and if you know your dogs aren't gulpers! Prepared raw generally has
quite a high bone content so necks may not be the best to feed along with
it.

Venison and fish are great additional sources, as are pork, beef,
lamb...whatever you have available in your area. You might want to look at
Kevin's recipe page to get other ideas for appropriate foods....
http://www.RawFedDogs.net/

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "Jennifer" <cadet972@yahoo.com>

I will be breeding siberians here soon. I have several adults that I am
trying to get on the raw diet. Here my question what a good base diet
for the pack. the weight run 62 lbs(sabastian, male); 50 lbs(bear,
male); 50 lbs(ice, female); 46 lbs(diamond, female); 45 lbs(arctic,
male); 43 lbs(lighting, female); 5 lbs(aurora, female pup 7 weeks).
Aurora and bear never had raw they are the new additions. I am feeding
turkey necks and preparied raw diet. I trying to find other appropiate
foods for them, they like deer & fish.

---------------------------------
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Messages in this topic (7)
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6c. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:19 pm ((PDT))

Jennifer,

I don't know why she won't eat wings...could be the size or shape. I don't
really like feeding wings alone..they aren't meaty enough and have all those
weird bone angles! :) I do feed them when attached to a larger part of the
turkey tho. If you have a gulper, feed BIG!

BTW, if they haven't choked on turkey bones, they certainly shouldn't have
problems with chicken. Just feed large pieces so they aren't tempted to
swallow whole!

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "jennifer mcfaden" <cadet972@yahoo.com>
> one question I try the turkey wings for our large girl and her kennel
mate diamond (my two brood bitches) ice ate in about hour and half. diamond
just lick at it could that been to large for her since she a petti 46lb
girl. she handles the necks and drum leg fine. The only gulper I have is my
alpha male arctic and that only after everyone done and starying at him and
his food. almost like they are saying if you done want I take it,lol.

Messages in this topic (7)
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6d. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:21 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 7/31/2007 12:15:37 PM Pacific Standard Time,
cadet972@yahoo.com writes:

The wings were almost a pound each, lots of meat and skin on them.

Jennifer,

i hate to burst your bubble, but turkey wings are not nearly meaty enough..
you seriously want LOTS of meat, and just a tiny bit of bone, and some organs..

think turkey breasts and thighs, not wings and legs.. Pork picnic roasts,
shoulder butt roasts.. things that you have trouble finding the bones in..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (7)
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6e. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:47 pm ((PDT))

jennifer mcfaden <cadet972@...> wrote:
>> The wings were almost a pound each, lots of meat and skin on them.
*****
Turkey wings do not have lots of meat on them. They are bony,
regardless of how much they weigh. Wings (turkey, chicken, doesn't
matter) are best fed when added to a pile of meat, or when fed attached
to a bigger helping of the bird.

Chris O

Messages in this topic (7)
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6f. Re: new to this group
Posted by: "jennifer mcfaden" cadet972@yahoo.com cadet972
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

catherine,

I new and geting started, I feed more true meat once out of my mother home. she makes it hard when we get roast and simmilar meat for the pack she use them on us, for her dinner then we out of food for the pack. they get ground turkey and chicken. and fish when possible. I working with some hunt clubs to get fresh deer and other wild game.

Jennifer

Morledzep@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 7/31/2007 12:15:37 PM Pacific Standard Time,
cadet972@yahoo.com writes:

The wings were almost a pound each, lots of meat and skin on them.

Jennifer,

i hate to burst your bubble, but turkey wings are not nearly meaty enough..
you seriously want LOTS of meat, and just a tiny bit of bone, and some organs..

think turkey breasts and thighs, not wings and legs.. Pork picnic roasts,
shoulder butt roasts.. things that you have trouble finding the bones in..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (7)
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7a. Re: Feeding and spices
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:54 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 7/31/2007 3:04:50 AM Pacific Standard Time,
alliecaracleo@yahoo.com writes:

so cooked ok once in awhile?

Denise,

As a treat.. no big deal.. treats are treats.. treats should NOT be so much
as to fill the dog up or interfere with the dog eating a species appropriate
diet.

And freeze dried liver training treats are NOT a substitute for eating organs.

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (6)
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8a. Freezer
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:01 pm ((PDT))

Anyone near Ocean City, NJ? Just got a posting on the local Freecycle.
There's an upright freezer on offer, in use, so it works. They want a
response today.
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

Messages in this topic (11)
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8b. Re: Freezer
Posted by: "Morledzep@aol.com" Morledzep@aol.com morledzep
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:26 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 7/31/2007 12:02:23 PM Pacific Standard Time,
megan.giselle@gmail.com writes:

Anyone near Ocean City, NJ? Just got a posting on the local Freecycle.
There's an upright freezer on offer, in use, so it works. They want a
response today.

Giselle,

go get it.. you can never have too many freezers..

Catherine R.

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Messages in this topic (11)
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8c. Re: Freezer
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:37 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Catherine!
I already have a large side by side and a good sized
upright. and only one dog right now, tho' admittedly, she's not a
light weight! ; )
Two months or more of food including *treaty* stuff like chicken feets
doesn't even fill up the space!
TC
Giselle

> In a message dated 7/31/2007 12:02:23 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> megan.giselle@... writes:
>
> Anyone near Ocean City, NJ? Just got a posting on the local Freecycle.
> There's an upright freezer on offer, in use, so it works. They want a
> response today.
>
>
>
> Giselle,
>
> go get it.. you can never have too many freezers..
>
> Catherine R.

Messages in this topic (11)
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9a. Re: Newbie - just took the plunge
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:22 pm ((PDT))

Hi, Sue!
Welcome to the raw side!
*Stupid* Qs are the specialty du monde. ; )
But, there really are no stupid Qs, just scintillating answers!!!
Ask away!
TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> Good morning, all. I've been lurking for a week or two, reading
> messages from July and June. I think I understand. What's to
> understand? It's all so very simple.
<snip>
> Thanks so much for being there. Can't guarantee that I won't ask
> some stupid question in the future so be patient with me.
>
> I don't expect to wipe out cancer in my house but at least I know my
> dogs are not getting a bunch of additives.
>
> Sue Gubernatis
> Forest Hill Maryland
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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10a. Re: I love my vet!
Posted by: "pet.wellness" pet.wellness@yahoo.com pet.wellness
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:25 pm ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: SIGN YOUR MESSAGES. ***

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "millser25" <millser25@...> wrote:
>
> into thinking that I'm not a crazy hippie extremist.
> If anyone in the Portland Oregon area is looking for a vet that puts a
> lot of thought into the medicine he practices and is responsible with
> his client's money, I'd be happy to pass along his name and number.
>
> Erica, Oliver, Pedro, and Ronin.
>
***
Actually, I'm perfectly okay with people thinking I'm a hippie
extremist. It's in vogue again. :-))

There's a raw vets list. Feel free to add your vets information there
for other people in the Portland area.

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/RawVets/?yguid=315449790

Messages in this topic (2)
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11a. Re: Sources Found-DFW, Texas Area - South
Posted by: "pet.wellness" pet.wellness@yahoo.com pet.wellness
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:47 pm ((PDT))

That's a really good price. Ask her if she knows a rabbit meat grower
near Austin. It costs a fortune to have it shipped from Hare Today.
Pamela

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "CarrolOliphint" <carrolo@...> wrote:
>
> I found a lady who delivers fresh killed rabbit to Lancaster, TX
> twice a month...any way you want it. Fur, or not, gutted or not. I'm
> using what I've learned here to "educate" her about prey model and
> she's quite willing to work with it any way she can. She's offered
> me skinned (no head or fur--because *I* can't quite handle that yet)
> at $2.25 lb. Rascal only eats a little over half a lb. a day, so
> that's doable for me. If anyone is interested, let me know and I'll
> get the two of you in contact.
> Carrol & Rascal
>

Messages in this topic (11)
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12a. My grass.......
Posted by: "Val Kilmer" DPM333@aol.com dferris23
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:51 pm ((PDT))

***MODERATOR'S NOTE: SIGN YOUR MESSAGES.***

My Raw feed dog is killing my grass. Every time he pees the next day
the grass is dead where he went. What am I doing wrong? My lawn looks
like my grandmas old pockodot dress. Not that I dont like my grannys
old dress, I just dont like my lawn to look like it. Any tips/info
would help.

Messages in this topic (2)
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12b. Re: My grass.......
Posted by: "Sonja" ladyver@sbcglobal.net lonepalm77
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

Our dogs burned the grass whether or not they were fed raw. We solved the problem about 5 years ago by building a wood frame (nothing fancy, just four 2x6 pieces of wood nailed together) and filling it with pea gravel in a convenient and inconspicuous part of the yard. We trained the dogs to use it, and it's nice not having landmines or burns on the lawn. Pickup is easy on the peagravel. On the days where you realize you fed too much liver, you hose off the pea gravel or remove that small section of gravel. As for training, we've trained older rescue dogs and puppies to use the area without difficulty. It just takes persistence.

Sonja

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
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13a. Re: what to do while we're on holiday
Posted by: "Nathalie Poulin" poulin_nathalie@yahoo.ca poulin_nathalie
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:59 pm ((PDT))

If you are PAYING to have your pets stay there, I
think it's completely irresponsible that she would
forget to de-thaw and THEN use the microwave.
Maybe you should tell her that you'll be reducing her
fee if she can't manage to feed your pets properly.
Is there any way that you can find somewhere else to
house them for a week? Do you have any friends that
could stop in to feed your dogs? I would be so upset
if I found out that someone was microwaving food for
my dogs... mind you I won't eat microwaved food
myself, so I might be over-reacting just a little..
Tell her just to give them the food frozen, if she
forgets again.

Nathalie

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Messages in this topic (4)
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14a. Re: Raw Feeding in OZ (was: offal variety - how necessary?)
Posted by: "Belinda Mitchell" dubhruah@velocitynet.com.au dubhruadh
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:10 pm ((PDT))

Hi Lindsay,

I live outside Toowoomba at the moment and used to be down Canberra
way for a long time, but many of the not well known pet shops may or
may not stock frozen pet mince. If you explain to your local butcher
what you want they can generally be accommodating. For instance I
have a deal with a butcher to get the chicken carcases when he bones.
As long as I give him two days notice it isn't an issue. I worked
out a price with him $1/kg 18months ago and he hasn't considered
changing it, of course he would only get 5-10cents per kilo on the
obne truck. I also used to have an arrangement that the butcher
would get in offal for me straight from the supplier (usuallly their
abbatoir) and because they didn't have to do anything with (I would
do my own packing) they just had to have the boxes in the cool room
for the day, I generally got it at fairly close to wholesale price.
I also laid down the law so to speak on how much I would pay for
anything, and I think I have said not over $2/kg on anything. The
guy that takes my order at the butcher often has bargains for me when
I order the chisken.

I also have another supplier - a greyhound guy who runs a pet food
business that specialises in meat. I get fresh roo tails from him as
well as offal, and roo meat. I am off on a two week showing circuit
next week so am stocking up and he gets in what I want and although a
little more expensive than the butcher it works well for me. In fact
so we don't have to take as much food, a friend of mine has rung the
butcher in the location where we will be based out of for the two
weeks and lined up supplies. They may be a little more expensive,
but it saves on esky space!

A wee bit of judicious asking around will often get you the bargains!

Cheers

Belinda

Messages in this topic (3)
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15. Hare Today
Posted by: "sgubernatis" sgubernatis@clearviewcatv.net sgubernatis
Date: Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:00 pm ((PDT))

Is there a website for Hare Today?

Sue Gubernatis
Forest Hill, MD

Messages in this topic (1)
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