[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11822

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: carnesbill
1b. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: bonniepunch
1c. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: Sarra
1d. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: lizwehrli
1e. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: anjumdanielle
1f. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
From: Chia

2a. Question - to fast or not to fast? what is the answer...
From: kaebruney
2b. Re: Question - to fast or not to fast? what is the answer...
From: costrowski75

3a. Re: new and a corgi question
From: carnesbill

4a. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
From: pet.wellness

5a. Re: Regarding Fats and Oils
From: jackie
5b. Re: Regarding Fats and Oils
From: jeff wissler

6a. Re: Bad meat - good?
From: millser25
6b. Re: Bad meat - good?
From: Christy B
6c. Re: Bad meat - good?
From: helpshelteranimals

7. New to group/raw feeding and a few ?'s
From: lou_losgatos

8. teething and diarrhea
From: Jen S

9a. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
From: ginny wilken

10a. Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and loose
From: Yasuko herron
10b. Re: Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and lo
From: Chia
10c. Re: Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and lo
From: Erica Mills

11a. Re: Slippery Elm bark
From: Yasuko herron

12. Re: Digest Number 11819
From: Bumble1994@aol.com

13a. Re: Trip to the vet (tribute to raw)
From: linoleum5017

14.1. Puppy
From: Anna Labriola

Messages
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1a. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:36 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "sueJM" <suejm@...> wrote:
>
> Hello All - I have been mulling this over for some time...I LOVE raw
> feeding my 3 Standard Poodles BUT I am also very environmentally
> conscious and always have been eg I've used my own bags for
> 27 years.

If you think long enough you can come up with a list reasons not to do
anything.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (7)
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1b. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "bonniepunch" bonniepunch@gmail.com bonniepunch
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:44 pm ((PDT))

I'm also more than a bit of an eco nut, with all the old cotton bags
to prove it, so environmentally friendly ways to feed raw were
important to me too. I don't/won't own a car, so I can't
comment on saving gas :-)

> The plastic packaging it comes in, the amount of
> washing up/water I use over the grain-free k***** where bowls/towels
> don't require the amount of cleaning or the same amount of packaging.

The place where I buy most of my chicken meat is a small local
butcher. He is willing to package up my chicken meat into pyrex or
tupperware containers that I provide. Normally they use those
disposable styro trays. He just weighs the empty container first and
subtracts that from the total cost. I buy enough at a time so that it
is worth his while to do this. If you explain the environmental
reasons behind it, your butcher might be willing to do this for you too.

Use grey water to wash out the bowls and towels then rinse them in
fresh water. I always have a large bucket that I fill with soapy
laundry water for this kind of thing.

> Also the energy the little freezer uses where I store their food so I
> can buy in quantity. We do put our 20+ pounds of ground chicken
> carcasses plus other items in Pyrex containers where possible. Has
> anyone else thought about this and if so, any suggestions for reducing
> the enery in all its forms that RF'g requires?

Chest type freezers are more energy efficient than regular fridge
freezers anyway. Use the freezer that is part of your fridge for
things you don't take out often. Package up big meat buys and put them
in there as much as will fit - put the rest in your chest freezer. Ice
cubes, daily meals, and anything that might make you open the freezer
frequently should go into the chest freezer.

BP

Messages in this topic (7)
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1c. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "Sarra" wildlycrafty@gmail.com sarradee
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:45 pm ((PDT))

carnesbill wrote:
> --- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "sueJM" <suejm@...> wrote:
>> Hello All - I have been mulling this over for some time...I LOVE raw
>> feeding my 3 Standard Poodles BUT I am also very environmentally
>> conscious and always have been eg I've used my own bags for
>> 27 years.
>
> If you think long enough you can come up with a list reasons not to do
> anything.
>

In addition, unless you're living completely off the grid, isn't any
feeding decision you make for your pets going to impact the environment.
The kibble makers use electricity, fuel, product packaging and etc
when creating their foods. I'm sure most of them even the grain free
varieties are produced in a factory setting. I'd think that has a
pretty negative environmental impact.

Maybe you should consider raising your own livestock?

Sarra

Messages in this topic (7)
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1d. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "lizwehrli" lizwehrli@yahoo.com lizwehrli
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:51 pm ((PDT))

I guess I value my dogs health over those concerns expressed here.

Liz

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "sueJM" <suejm@...> wrote:
>
>
> SO, lately I've been aware of the "energy" and resources going in to
> feeding my dogs this way. For example the added gas I use to drive
to my sources of inexpensive yet high quality food (out of my usual
> circuit of shops).
>
> Susan and Rose'n'Buds
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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1e. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "anjumdanielle" anjumdanielle@yahoo.com anjumdanielle
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:56 pm ((PDT))

Susan - you're not thinking of the energy costs to produce that bag of
kibble. Just because you don't have to expend energy to feed kibble,
doesn't mean that energy isn't being spent elsewhere. Grain-free
kibble contains the same (well, probably lesser quality) meat that you
are feeding raw, but has been cooked & processed (lots of energy
spent). The meat is shipped to the kibble manufacturer & then the
kibble is shipped all over (energy spent). I think right there you can
rationalize the feeding of raw over kibble, energy-wise.
You could always try to source meat directly from the farm. You might
have to expend more energy to pick up & freeze the meat, but it's
likely less net energy than meat coming from a factory farm to an
industrial processor to a major grocery chain.
JMHO
-Anjum

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "sueJM" <suejm@...> wrote:
> SO, lately I've been aware of the "energy" and resources going in to
> feeding my dogs this way. For example the added gas I use to drive to
> my sources of inexpensive yet high quality food (out of my usual
> circuit of shops). The plastic packaging it comes in, the amount of
> washing up/water I use over the grain-free k***** where bowls/towels
> don't require the amount of cleaning or the same amount of packaging.
> Susan and Rose'n'Buds
>

Messages in this topic (7)
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1f. Re: some thoughts on "cost" of raw feeding
Posted by: "Chia" chia.m@shaw.ca cia22m
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:06 pm ((PDT))

I guess I value my dogs health over those concerns expressed here.

#### same! I could care less if I had to walk across fire for my dog who
relies on me to care for him always. If it means I spend less on 'my '
groceries, then that's the way it is.

My boy isn't going to live to 80... why on earth would anyone not give all
they could for the short life of an innocent, gorgeous creature!

Chia & Ricco

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Messages in this topic (7)
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2a. Question - to fast or not to fast? what is the answer...
Posted by: "kaebruney" kaebruney@yahoo.com kaebruney
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:37 pm ((PDT))

It's me again.. the one year raw feeder wit more questions than a
newbie. This group has taught me so many errors in my ways, I just
can't get enough! I love you guys!!...

So, what's the thought on fasting raw fed dogs?

What are the benefits?

If you do fast, how often do yu do it and is it on a particular day?
i.e - following their fish meal or organ meal, etc.

Also, is it a true fasting day (like no food at all) or can I make it
a rec bone day? Like giving a soup bone for hem to work on all day
Sunday..

All contributions are appreciated!

thanks again..

Kae

Messages in this topic (2)
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2b. Re: Question - to fast or not to fast? what is the answer...
Posted by: "costrowski75" Chriso75@AOL.COM costrowski75
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:27 pm ((PDT))

"kaebruney" <kaebruney@...> wrote:
> So, what's the thought on fasting raw fed dogs?
*****
I don't fast my dogs. I generally feed big meals--complicated,
complex, difficult, awkward, clumsy, satisfying meals that are as big
as they are, whatever that size is. I feed these for nutrition, for
mental health, for dental health and for plain old fun. They range in
size from maybe 3% body weight to 6% or 7% body weight. My dogs get
fed 12-15 times a month. In between big meals they do not eat.
They've been adequately and thoroughly fed. They don't need to eat
every day.

I let the meal determine whether there's a next-day meal or not.
Sometimes I feed a blop of green tripe--hardly a "real" meal--and the
next day I will feed another meal. But I don't insert an
arbitrary "fast" based on someone's theory of digestion or
purification. If the meal warrants a skipped day, I do. If not, not.
Chris O

Messages in this topic (2)
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3a. Re: new and a corgi question
Posted by: "carnesbill" carnesw@bellsouth.net carnesbill
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:42 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "joan_alane" <joanalane@...>
wrote:
>
> (I know there's some disagreement about veggies, but for now,
> it's part
> of our weaning -- we cut the grains out completely when we
> switched and I'm not sure if I'll
> phase the veggies out or not.)

There is no disagreement ... veggies are not needed by carnivores.
If they were, dogs would be omnivores which they aren't. I have
asked veggie feeders to point out one nutrient in veggies that is
not in meat, bones, or organs and so far haven't received an
answer. Feeding veggies to a carnivore is like feeding meat to a
cow or horse.

We have been told since we were children, "eat your veggies so you
will be healthy." Don't try to equate human nutrition with canine
nutrition. We are different animals.

Bill Carnes
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Feeding Raw since October 2002

"Unnatural diets predispose animals to unnatural outcomes"
Dr. Tom Lonsdale

Messages in this topic (5)
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4a. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
Posted by: "pet.wellness" pet.wellness@yahoo.com pet.wellness
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:44 pm ((PDT))

I'm glad you found what you need. Please keep us posted on how it
goes. In the meantime, let me express my sympathy once again. I lost
my first dog this way when a neighbor threw a poisoned bone into the
yard with the deliberate intention of killing her. Death by poisoning
is an extremely ugly way to go. Pamela

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, susan/foxfire <fxfireob@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks everyone, all your replies were helpful. One thing I realized
> is that we made a mistake from the get go - we used the wrong
> terminology. Modi bled out rectally, which is not the same as

Messages in this topic (8)
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5a. Re: Regarding Fats and Oils
Posted by: "jackie" jackiehale1@bellsouth.net jackieoscar2000
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:56 pm ((PDT))

Hello!
I have been lurking for quite a while...feeding raw to my 3 big boys
since May and they and I love it...
Regarding this post, are you saying that my dogs should be fine Omega
wise, if I am feeding raw eggs? Which I do every morning? I feed
grain fed meat...right now I mix in a fish oil but would prefer to
drop it if I can just continue with the eggs...

Thanks,
Jackie

> Hey Guys,
>
> Thought I would just interject something here.
>
> >
> SO WHEN are omegas good? Well if the diet is very
> lopsided with high omega 6 from eating grains etc (and
> the meat of grain fed animals), then Omega 3 is needed
> to bring the balance back as the balance IS important.
> >

Messages in this topic (22)
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5b. Re: Regarding Fats and Oils
Posted by: "jeff wissler" wisslewj@yahoo.com wisslewj
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:31 pm ((PDT))

Jackie,

I would get on one of those guides online that say
whats in stuff and get a rough idea of the omega 6 in
beef. (or whatever you feed.) And then whats in egg
yolks. As long as the overall ratio is close to
1:1-2:1 you would be fine.

I would still strongly suggest making sure they are
getting roughly 50% of their fats as good saturated
ones though.

Jeff

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Messages in this topic (22)
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6a. Re: Bad meat - good?
Posted by: "millser25" millser25@yahoo.com millser25
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:02 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "millser25" <millser25@...> wrote:
Citing that dogs/wolves
> will often bury a carcass and come back to it after it has "purified"
> and is easier to digest.

I just wanted to clarify my spelling error - Bury a carcass and come
back to it after it has "PUTRIFIED"... as in rotted. Sorry, the spell
checker messed me up.
Thanks,
Erica

Messages in this topic (4)
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6b. Re: Bad meat - good?
Posted by: "Christy B" christyb@cox.net christyb14
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:12 pm ((PDT))

On Jul 18, 2007, at 12:13 PM, millser25 wrote:
> He suggested that raw meat was difficult for a dog (and wolf) to
> digest. Citing that dogs/wolves will often bury a carcass and come
> back to it after it has "purified"
> and is easier to digest. I don't know, but it is an interesting
> concept to explore...
> What are your thoughts? Erica

Hi Erica,

I live in a condo with only a balcony so Lola does not have the
opportunity to bury her food. Usually she is fed big hunks of meat
and when she walks away I wrap any leftovers back up and offer food
again a few days later. Recently I found a steady supply of whole
rabbit (fur, head, insides - every thing!). After not eating for 3
days, on the fourth day I gave her a 3+/lb rabbit thinking that she
would eat the whole thing at once. Well, she didn't. My ability to
not throw up while picking up her leftovers such as lamb head,
spleen, etc... has increased incredibly but I could not bring myself
to pick up the 2 legged, one eared, eviscerated rabbit nor could I
imagine it in my fridge next to the mustard! I also know that if she
had a yard or did not have me to feed her, a lot of her food would
"marinate" for quite a while! I decided that since the chances of
anyone being able to actually see anything on my balcony floor was
slim I would just leave it. She nibbled on that thing for 3 days.
On the morning of the third day I looked out on the balcony and all
evidence of cute bunny was gone. It was a beautiful day so I decided
to grab a book and lay out in the sun for a bit. I was about to sit
down on the chaise until I had that feeling someone was staring at
me. I looked and there was a bunny head (lower jaw long gone)
starring back up at me from the seat of my chaise - thanks Lola!!

Anyway, I have been leaving the hunks out for her to eat at her
leisure. She generally is taking 1.5 to 3 days to eat 2 to 4 pounds
of food (whole rabbit, lamb neck, lamb ribs, lamb trim). She has not
had any ill effects from this (and she tends to have a very sensitive
digestive system), she likes to go outside now and 'be with her
food'. The only drawback is timing the feeding with contractors - I
have had to rush outside and pick up scattered bunny parts before the
air conditioning guy made his way out there. I also forgot about the
lamb trim that was well into it's 3rd day when I had my windows
worked on - they must have thought I was c-r-a-z-y!! The police made
a visit and all I could think was that somebody did see a white fury
thing on my balcony and had reported that I was feeding my dog
neighborhood cats and frantically trying to figure out how I would
explain that there was no need to panic - it's just rabbit!!
Fortunately, he knocked on someone else's door! Unexpected guests
would be an issue - especially board members!! Imagine that letter!

On another interesting note, last summer when she was eating every
day outside but I was picking up the leftovers the fly population
skyrocketed on my balcony. Now, there are some flies out there but
maybe one or two - weird. Maybe because it's not as hot?

Thanks,
Christy

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Messages in this topic (4)
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6c. Re: Bad meat - good?
Posted by: "helpshelteranimals" helpshelteranimals@yahoo.com helpshelteranimals
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:23 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Christy B <christyb@...> wrote:
I could not bring myself
> to pick up the 2 legged, one eared, eviscerated rabbit nor could I
> imagine it in my fridge next to the mustard!

I looked and there was a bunny head (lower jaw long gone)
> starring back up at me from the seat of my chaise - thanks Lola!!

all I could think was that somebody did see a white fury
> thing on my balcony and had reported that I was feeding my dog
> neighborhood cats
> Thanks,
> Christy
*****************

This post had me in stitches! I almost fell out of my chair! Thanks
for the laugh!

AG & Ruffian (Mystery Mutt)

Messages in this topic (4)
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7. New to group/raw feeding and a few ?'s
Posted by: "lou_losgatos" lchandler@austin.rr.com lou_losgatos
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:04 pm ((PDT))

Hi everyone, just wanted to introduce myself. I am just learning about
feeding raw and want to make the switch. I have a collie and 2
dachshunds. My collie has never really liked kibble and the more I
learn about feeding raw the more sense it makes! Although it seems
easy, there is still a lot to learn. Here are a few questions I
have....

* are digestive enzymes necessary?
* where do I get raw meaty bones small enough for my dachshunds? (10 &
13 lbs) Do I ask the butcher to cut smaller pieces for me?
* do the dogs need to eat only 1 protein source per week, or is that
just the recommened way to get them started on a raw food diet?

Thanks for any help/advise you can pass on to me!

Louisa Chandler
Austin, TX

Messages in this topic (1)
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8. teething and diarrhea
Posted by: "Jen S" jennilist@gmail.com bowiegirl1979
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:45 pm ((PDT))

Hi all! My almost 4 month old lab mix, Tiberius, is teething, and is having
trouble eating bone right now. I know bone is what helps to make stools
solid, and he has been having some diarrhea. Any suggestions on what I can
give him to harden it up some? He did eat some chicken bones (I guess
they're softer than other types), and yesterday his stool was normal, but I
want to give him variety while he is teething, I don't want to have to feed
him only chicken until he is past this. Thanks for any suggestions!

Jen

--
The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
-Mahatma Gandhi

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9a. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:58 pm ((PDT))

On Jul 18, 2007, at 11:57 AM, carnesbill wrote:

>
> A word of advice to everyone. Always be wary of advice or "facts"
> given to you by someone who stands to make money depending on a
> decision you make. That would include vets, doctors, lawyers, and
> beef associations and used car salesmen among many others.

So, presumably, that could include conventional meat producers who
insist their product is wholesome, no?

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

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10a. Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and loose
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:46 pm ((PDT))

Hi. We went to Petsmart,just to get my dog out for walking around other than neighborhood and give her some refreshment of smell and meet other buddies there.

Well,since petsmart has vet inside the store,we just went there just to weigh my dog.

I was shocked. She gained weight.. She weigh 34lb now..We do not give table scrap that is not fitted to her and no rice and not much stuff at all other than trats for training time and real meat for meal time.

It is wiered because when we started raw 2 months ago,she was around 30lbs.Since female Corgi,average could be around 28lbs.

She does NOT look chubby at all. She was biggest puppies among litters but,she looks smaller for Adult Corgi.

She does have Tuck-in tummy and not flatten belly with drum size tummy at all and,I see the muscle tones on legs and she has nice waist and I can feel ribs.

I cannot see ribs from side though because of fur and such.

We go for walk daily if weather was good and, she herself running around the house now and then and we do play balls and find it game or hide and seek stuff and she is not a couch potato dog.

Since the diet change, I started see more waist and muscle tones,I thought she is getting leaner but on scale,it was oposit.

As we introduce more variety protin sources,she will be losing weight?? I feed 2 days fish meal and meals are not all red meat.

I will have to keep an eye on her weight I guess and if it start gaining and gaining,I may have to get some intake amount down ??She noe be fed around 2% intake.

But if she had tuck in tummy with waist curve etc,then,no worries needed??

curious.

yassy

ps;Finally her poop got firm up today after 2 gooey poo.Tomorrow,I try feeding lamb tongue with chicken.I hope she handle ok...

---------------------------------
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10b. Re: Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and lo
Posted by: "Chia" chia.m@shaw.ca cia22m
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:09 pm ((PDT))

But if she had tuck in tummy with waist curve etc,then,no worries needed??

### exactly. Just like us. If we eat a nutrient rich, unprocessed diet,
and work out in moderation, not excess, the body becomes as nature meant it
to be. More dense, muscular, with a metabolism that functions efficiently.

The scale is not the indicator for us..it is measurements...pants etc...
with a dog...since they don't wear pants... ..not dogs on this list, at
least.... ;-))

our eye test of visually observing...and the feel test of the rib cage,
waist...is ALL we need to know how incredibly healthy and vibrant they have
become!

Chia & Ricco

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10c. Re: Dogs normally gain weight after being on raw diet a while and lo
Posted by: "Erica Mills" millser25@yahoo.com millser25
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:30 pm ((PDT))

Hi Yassy,
Sounds like your dog is probably healthy and active. I think your dog's weight gain is likely from increased muscle and increased bone density and not fat. I noticed similar changes in my dog after starting him on a raw diet. He hasn't lost or gained any weight, but I've noticed that he appears a bit smaller (leaner/less fat), but his muscles are now defined and rippling.
It is a fact that a volume of muscle weighs more than an equal volume of fat. So, your dog could stay the same size but gain weight from replacing fat with muscle - and of course, still be quite healthy. Also, the benefits from the calcium and other minerals in the RMB are likely contributing to thicker, denser, stronger bones - which would weigh more than frail bones.
Take care,
Erica

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11a. Re: Slippery Elm bark
Posted by: "Yasuko herron" sunshine_annamaria@yahoo.com sunshine_annamaria
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:30 pm ((PDT))

>You can repeat this at every meal until the situation improves.

Hi,Ginny. I think powder sounds convenient to me,and since Gisell put link on her posting,I will see about getting it if things still happens during intriducing new protin source in the future again.

So,you give it until you see firm up poo?I did not understand when you said you give cream or broth to dog if it did not improve.Cream is heavy cream,you mean?

Fortunately, my dog's poop got firm up and no gooey poo today.I will try lamb again with chicken 4 more times(this week) and if it went well,next time when we back on lamb again,I try increase the lamb amount. If it did not go well,try much smaller portion of lamb with chicken next time and see how it goes.If then still no go then,I consider feeding lamb as treats or something not meal.

Either way, since she is on lamb 2 weeks straight except fish days so far,I think I will try much less fattier buffalo next week.Hopefully she handle better.

And..I like to ask, diarrhea is watery yellowish or greenish poo with no solid and sometimes with mucous,and cannot control, correct?

And if dogs just goes once a day with such poo,still consider diarrhea although not going bunch of time with watery /loose poo?

In my case, mostlikely,she goes poo once a day and eithger loose stoool like alfread sauce consistency;rather thick than watery pesto,or watery poo and more like pesto if her poop was not firm ones,but just go once a day. Is this still considered diarrhea?Sometimes,head is firm and end is wet.I do not worry about end wet poo much though.

This is exception in the past when I fed tilapia.She went 2 times or more with greenish shapeless goo poo and definitely it was diarrhea.

Usually,her poo get firm up if given 2-3 days tops.

If she still do poo like shapeless poo longer than 3 days plus,do I need to get her vet check?

Or just throw in bones to firm up the poo and no worries?

I can imagine it will be a problems if you keep seeing the watery poo longer than 2 days or so but not too sure if it had shape but still softer side.Should I get alarmed if seeing continued long period of time than 3 days with soft but still have shape poo?

I am not quite too sure when I should get alarmed at this point.

thank you

yassy

ps: by the way,did you know you named your dog tomo;the friend/together,in Japanese?
Good name.

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Messages in this topic (3)
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12. Re: Digest Number 11819
Posted by: "Bumble1994@aol.com" Bumble1994@aol.com bumble1994
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:32 pm ((PDT))

In a message dated 7/18/2007 8:52:42 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
_carnesw@bellsouth.car_ (mailto:carnesw@bellsouth.net) writes:

Gizzards are sacks that hold rocks.

Say, what? I have always loved chicken gizzards myself, and all 3 of my cats
love them. (We all love liver, too--I know, all weird people!) I have never
found any rocks in the gizzards I have eaten. :)

Since chicken hearts and gizzards, packaged together and mostly gizzards,
were the only way I could lay hold of heart at all during the 1st two months I
was rawfeeding (FINALLY connected with beef hearts at a farmers' market!), my
cats probably ate more gizzards than anything else in their early days on
this diet, and they seemed to have gained weight and gotten shiny coats while
doing it!

Lynda

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Messages in this topic (1)
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13a. Re: Trip to the vet (tribute to raw)
Posted by: "linoleum5017" linoleum5017@yahoo.com linoleum5017
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:19 pm ((PDT))

$18 later, and the vet declared him to be incredibly healthy and
strong. Why do I pay for this assessment? He did have a 'hole in his
heart' at the first check-up. No evidence of that today, says the
vet. Thank you, Lord.

No grilling about what I'm feeding him. Maybe pearly whites are still
the norm at 8 months? Poor pup, Monday's his neutering, little does
he know.

Just thought I'd pass along the good news that from rawfeeding, he's
as healthy as can be, though I'm a wee bit poorer for the testimony.

Lynne

Linoleum wrote:

> Wow, expensive confirmation. I'm going today to the vet for
> a 'screening' b4 neutering. Another waste of $$$, as they saw him
as
> a pup once already. Shall I explain the beeeautiful teeth & coat?
> Maybe they won't ask............but I'm ready if they do, armed with
> months of super facts our mods and list contributors have provided,
as
> well as proof in the pup. Maybe I should print Bill's tot tasting
pig
> snout photo, as extra weaponry?
>
> linoleum
>

Messages in this topic (4)
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14.1. Puppy
Posted by: "Anna Labriola" taggartgalt@yahoo.com taggartgalt
Date: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:19 pm ((PDT))

Hi, all.

I searched the archives quite a bit but still aren't sure what to do.
I am feeding my doberman puppy(32 pounds, 4 months old tomorrow) whole
chicken, cut into quarters. Currently, he's eating half a chicken a
day in two meals(a quarter a meal.) This is about 2 pounds total a day
but varies depending on the chicken. He's not an overeater. He does
occasionally leave food in the cage.

My question is that he's been eating raw for what will be three weeks
on Saturday and he's still having very soft stool. It's too soft to
pick up all together with a bag. I would say that probably half to
three quarters of his stool is this soft. Normal? Hints?

Thanks in advance,
Anna and Khan

Messages in this topic (31)
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