[rawfeeding] Digest Number 11818

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
From: cypressbunny
1b. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
From: Sandee Lee
1c. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
From: Andrea
1d. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
From: Denise Strother

2a. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
From: Andrea
2b. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
From: tottime47
2c. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
From: Ross Senger
2d. Re: Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
From: Josephine Morningstar

3a. Re: Slippery Elm bark
From: Marguerite
3b. Re: Slippery Elm bark
From: ginny wilken

4. small dog newbie questions:
From: laurena_green

5a. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
From: cypressbunny
5b. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
From: Josephine Morningstar
5c. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
From: ginny wilken
5d. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
From: Maria

6a. Duck
From: Caren OConnor

7a. Newbie needs advice and encouragement
From: gina panza
7b. Re: Newbie needs advice and encouragement
From: Denise Strother

8. Re: Was stinky gaaaas/now Organs?
From: Marguerite

9a. Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
From: K Carolyn Ramamurti
9b. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
From: ginny wilken
9c. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
From: pet.wellness

10a. Pork safety?
From: millser25
10b. Re: Pork safety?
From: cypressbunny

11a. Re: liver
From: bluefilly

Messages
________________________________________________________________________

1a. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
Posted by: "cypressbunny" cypressbunny@yahoo.com cypressbunny
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:08 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, susan/foxfire <fxfireob@...>
wrote:
>
> In other
> words, she is thinking that it is the raw diet that caused Modi
to
> die, not poisoning.

*** Too bad you didn't have the dog or the rats tested. Do you have
neighbors that you could ask about whether they are using arsenic to
poison rats? Of course, do not do it in a way that will make them
defensive about accidentally killing your pup.

> The breeder is concerned
> that since we've fed raw for some time that the level of
salmonella
> in our yard is dangerously high, too high for small breed pups.

*** Rediculous. Salmonella can survive for several *months* in the
soil under the right conditions--it doesn't accumulate for years and
years.

> Since hearing about this I've been scouring the net trying to
find
> info to answer her questions

*** You might check the archives of this list too. It has been
discussed a lot. I wrote an article about salmonella in cats that
might interest you although it isn't specific to your situation:
http://www.rawfed.com/cat-salmonella.html

Carissa has a general article about germs and raw food here:
http://rawfed.com/myths/bacteria.html

> http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=2232&S=1

> adult animals are almost never affected by
> Salmonella infection.
>
> There is an important exception to the "Salmonella is rare in
adult
> dogs" rule and that is the case of dogs fed a raw food diet.

*** Total bunk. Salmonella infection is equally rare in raw fed
dogs. Notice the clever wording, though. "Adult animals are almost
never affected by Salmonella infection." Meaning they don't get
sick. They DO carry the bug, which is normal flora in the dog. The
next clever wording conflates carrying the bacteria and getting sick
from it, and conflates eating contaminated food with shedding the
bacteria afterword.

> A recent study evaluating raw food diets
> found that 80% of food samples contained Salmonella bacteria and
that
> 30% of the dogs in the study were shedding Salmonella bacteria in
> their stool.

*** These were commercial ground raw products, which we don't
recommend for several reasons. Grinding meat increases the bacteria
content exponentially, and ground meat does nothing for dental
health. These particular samples were also thawed at room temp for
12 or more hours, if memory serves me. Even so, even though 80% of
the samples were contaminated, only 30% of dogs shed enough
salmonella to be detected in the stool. Sounds like rawfed dogs are
really good at controlling salmonella, even when they are fed a lot
of it.

> Adult dogs are often asymptomatic but any infected
> animal or person will shed the organism for at least 6 weeks thus
> acting as a source of exposure to other animals or people.

*** More poppycock with no basis in fact. A study on salmonella in
sled dogs showed no correlation between diet, diarrhea, and
salmonella shedding.

> Again, dogs used for therapy around
> the elderly or children should be cultured for the presence of
> Salmonella.

*** Maybe so, if they are talking about all dogs, not only rawfed
dogs. Or perhaps the authors haven't read the studies showing no
correlation between diet and shedding salmonella.

> There are two syndromes associated with Salmonella: diarrhea and
> sepsis.

*** Gah. Who writes this stuff? Diarrhea isn't a syndrome, it is a
symptom. Sepsis is a fancy word for infection spreading through the
blood. Yes, if your immune system is so screwed up it allows
bacteria to penetrate the intestinal walls and spread through the
blood, you have very serious issues. Salmonella doesn't *cause*
this, it only takes advantage of the situation if it occurs, as
would two dozen other germs normally found in the intestinal tract.

> So I was hoping some folks here could help us address her
concerns
> regarding raw feeding, salmonella and small breed pups.

*** As Jane said, the size of the dog has nothing to do with
susceptibility to disease or the presumed dangers of feeding raw.
Salmonella infections do not cause dogs to bleed to death in 10
minutes, in any case. There are plenty of breeders on this list that
breed all sizes of dogs from mini dachsies to corgis to papillons
and on up to Great Danes. If their pups were keeling over from
salmonella they wouldn't rave about how healthy their rawfed dogs
are.

--Carrie

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

1b. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
Posted by: "Sandee Lee" rlee@plix.com mariasmom2001
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:16 pm ((PDT))

Hi Susan,

Seems they left out the fact that salmonella is everywhere in the
environment and is found in the gut and stools of a high percentage of
healthy dogs (and humans) *regardless* of what is fed! You are right...this
article is nothing but propaganda!

We have discussed salmonella many times if you would like to search the
archives. Here is one recent message that contains lots of good info....
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/123902

Oh, you might want to look at the rawfeeding myths also....
http://rawfed.com/myths/index.html

Sandee & the Dane Gang

From: "susan/foxfire" <fxfireob@mac.com>

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=2232&S=1

Although we don't buy into this I just don't have the background to
dispel this type of propaganda - I'm a painter not a scientist:) So
I was hoping some folks here could help us address her concerns
regarding raw feeding, salmonella and small breed pups.

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

1c. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:20 pm ((PDT))

Well, in all my research about salmonella and dogs it is always said
that healthy dogs aren't affected by it. Even in the quote you
found, it says that healthy adult dogs are asymptomatic. A sick
puppy might get sick from having salmonella around, but a healthy
puppy shouldn't. From my understanding even if a puppy got sick from
salmonella they would display vomiting and diarreah, and die from
dehydration, not from bleeding out.

I also noticed that the article mentioned "evaluating raw food diets"
which means the prefab stuff like Bravo, which are ground.
Salmonella doesn't actually live inside the meat, it is on the
outside. The more surface area you have, the more chance you have of
harboring bacteria, so ground foods will have a much higher bacterial
load than whole foods like chicken.

Besides, it isn't like ki**le is sterile, or salmonella isn't
naturally in the environment. Did you check out the rawfed myths
section? There is a good article about bacteria in raw
http://rawfed.com/myths/bacteria.html

Hopefully you can convince the breeder to open up their horizons a
little. Every little dog I've known has been as strong, if not
stronger than the big ones I have. Hope that helps a little.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, susan/foxfire <fxfireob@...> wrote:

> we lost Modi, our 4 mo Swedish Vallhund puppy, who had been eating
> raw since we brought him home at 8 wks old (thanks to SATS/Z he
> learned to eat "easy" and chew his food during his first week with
> us:)
>
> We are certain that Modi died from arsenic poisoning (the day he
> died, he showed some distress during the day and then he suddenly
> bled out that night and died within 10 mins; also we found some
> dead rats in our yard) However the breeder is not so sure and is
> seriously considering not giving us another pup. She is concerned
> that it was salmonella and not poison, because she says poisons
> cause neurological and clotting problems and not digestive problems
> (while this may be true of warfarin it is not true of arsenic). In
> other words, she is thinking that it is the raw diet that caused
> Modi to die, not poisoning.

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________

1d. Re: An Intro & A Question about Salmonella in Small Breed Pups
Posted by: "Denise Strother" denisestrother@yahoo.com denisestrother
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:12 pm ((PDT))

I have a Chihuahua who weighs a little over 3lbs and has a compromised
immune system that is raw fed. He weighed 2.2lbs when I got him. We
aren't sure how old he was when I rescued him from death row at the
local pound, somewhere between 6 mos and a year is the vets best
guess. I often buy out of date meat to feed and sometimes it gets left
out long enough to be a little gamey. He hasn't had a problem with the
dreaded Salmonella, so draw your own conclusions from that. Denise

Messages in this topic (6)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

2a. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
Posted by: "Andrea" poketmouse45@yahoo.com poketmouse45
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:14 pm ((PDT))

This is a risk we're taking just by owning and feeding carnivores,
period. Feeding "premium" crap in a bag still uses animals with the
heavy metals in them. Rendering it doesn't make the contaminants go
away, going strictly from the quotes provided, I would think raw
feeding is safer than crap in a bag. If the heavy metals collect in
the bones, most dogs don't/can't consume beef bones but bone meal is
often used in ki**le. Just my two cents.

Andrea

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "deep_ocean_of_sorrow"
<deep_ocean_of_sorrow@...> wrote:
>
> *** Mod Note: TRIM YOUR POSTS ! ***
>
> Thanks to everyone that replied, I suppose we cannot change the
> world to
> stop using unleaded gasoline..
> but there are some amount of lead in cattle, correct(whether it be
> little or a lot)? and like the quotes, wouldn't that mean that the
> more we feed these to our dogs, the more of a chance they will
> suffer from lead poisoning? Or is this a type of risk we're just
> taking to avoid dog foods/cat foods....?

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________

2b. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
Posted by: "tottime47" tottime@aol.com tottime47
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Hi Kate,

What are you eating? If you have that type of thinking then every
single bite of food you put in your mouth is poisioning
you......plants take up poisions and such from the
soils too...........

We can't get away from eating.....that's a fact.....so the next
best thing is to feed a species appropriate diet...

When it comes to k***le or canned have you checked out what's in it?
That should give you real nightmares, lol.

I think if you do, you'll decide raw feeding is not a risk but one
heck of a lot safer than any other way........

Carol, Charkee & Moli

===============

wouldn't that mean that the
more we feed these to our dogs, the more of a chance they will suffer
from lead poisoning? Or is this a type of risk we're just taking to
avoid dog foods/cat foods....?

Kate

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________

2c. Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
Posted by: "Ross Senger" rosssenger@shaw.ca rosssenger
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:40 pm ((PDT))

> Thanks to everyone that replied, I suppose we cannot change the
> world to stop using unleaded gasoline..

I have read many books that talk about the lead content in meat due
to this and have developed a few opinions.

1) I am feeding my dogs the same type of meat I eat (sometimes the
exact same meat). So if I am poisoning them I must also be poisoning
myself.

2) Lead was eliminated from most gasoline in the U.S. during the
1970s and 1980s so there has been 20 years of cars driving
on "UNLEADED" (no-Lead gas) in the US.

FYI: Possession and use of leaded gasoline in a regular on-road
vehicle now carries a maximum $10,000 fine in the United States. In
some parts of South America, Asia, Europe and the Middle East, leaded
gasoline is still in use.

So I would say that Meat comming from Canada and the US is probably
much safer then products comming from overseas. Lead in meat is the
least of our worries.

My two cents

-Ross

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________

2d. Re: Are we feeding poison to our dogs/cats?
Posted by: "Josephine Morningstar" josephine.morningstar@gmail.com jomorningstar
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:57 pm ((PDT))

On 7/17/07, Ross Senger <rosssenger@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> Lead in meat is the
> least of our worries.

some towns with older homes in them.. have to contend with lead in their
drinking water. which is a concern here in my home town.. enough so that
the epa fined the town for not taking care of it.

--
Josephine MorningStar & Heather, Pyr, Mobility & MASD
Native American in Massachusetts

Never threaten anyone. It ruins the surprise.
www.apachecreations.com

Nobody can make you feel inferior without your permission. -Eleanor
Roosevelt-

http://assistancedogsofnorthamerica.org/
Copyright (c) 2007 Josephine Morningstar

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

3a. Re: Slippery Elm bark
Posted by: "Marguerite" semitruestory@gmail.com margo532001
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:15 pm ((PDT))

I got the tablets too. How much/many would you give a 7 , 24 and/or 80 #
dog? Thanks.

--
Marguerite
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Marley- GR, Lucy-Cocker,
Liza-Yorkie,SmellyCat-PersianPolydactyl
Punkin- Pacific Parrotlet

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________

3b. Re: Slippery Elm bark
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:32 pm ((PDT))

On Jul 17, 2007, at 2:04 PM, Marguerite wrote:

> I got the tablets too. How much/many would you give a 7 , 24 and/or
> 80 #
> dog? Thanks.

If you're asking me, I'd say maybe a half tablet for the smallest, a
whole one for the 24#er and two for the big dog. It's not at all
harmful, and you can't OD, so you just need to get a feel for how big
their digestive tracts really are compared to ours.

You can repeat this at every meal until the situation improves. If
the animal is ill enough to need to fast, give it in a little cream
or broth.

ginny and Tomo

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

4. small dog newbie questions:
Posted by: "laurena_green" laurensa@earthlink.net laurena_green
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:17 pm ((PDT))

Hi rawfeeders!

I am a greatful one-week long convert in need of ideas or corrections in my reasoning,
after reading as much as I could take in from the list. First, my girl, "Gemma," is a 14-
month-old, 12# poodle-schnauzer who loves her new menu! However, yesterday it was
"canon-butt" in the dog park.-not pretty and I thought I was correcting for the more meaty
day before. Maybe I fed too much...? these are the issues/my understanding so far:

If my priorities in the initial adjustment period are to:
a) minimize digestive upset, while keeping her waste neat enough to pick up, (we spend a
lot of time in the dog park; don't want to leave "soft serve" behind),

then I should aim for the diet optimum in each meal, leaving organs for a bit later; before,
for example, alternating meaty and bony days or just keeping a loose weekly sense of the
diet structure?

and, if I want to:
b) minimize the choking hazard while not wasting meat, then I should:

feed "big" enough for at least two meals and take it up halfway to save the rest for the
next meal. If I don't get in there to pick it up until there's a smaller-than her-head sized
piece, then that piece is wasted as a next meal ('cause it's a choking hazard)?

and, there is the guarding issue:
c) Gemma is not a self regulator; if I pre-portion her meals then they are choking-hazard-
sized, but if I "feed big" I don't know what to use as a higher value distraction to remove
her leftovers. Today I dangled a bigger portion of what she was already eating over her
nose. Without averting her gaze, she growled so nastily, (as if to say: "take this away if you
want your arm ripped off!), Finally, I clapped my hands loudly and got a split second of her
attention to zoom in and take the rest. I am assuming this isn't a good long-term
strategy?

d) schnauzers, poodles, fat intake, and pancreatitis:
my understanding is that both breeds of this hybrid are predisposed to pancreatitis and
should not get too much fat in their diet; any advice on how to visually judge the fat
amount so you are feeding around 10-20%?

Thanks in advance for all feedback!

Lauren and "Gemma" in S.F.

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

5a. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
Posted by: "cypressbunny" cypressbunny@yahoo.com cypressbunny
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 2:57 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "cresco299" <gentry.jeffrey@...>
wrote:
>
> > Without insulting my only source of a budget saving miracle, how
do I
> tactfully point him in the right direction (not that I know where to
> look).
>
> You have to enjoy the irony....

*** It is a flat, squarish, granular organ stuck to the top of the
rumen (when the cow is standing up). They probably normally just pitch
the tripe and intestines, and with it the pancreas which is attached.
It should peel off the rumen fairly easily.

--Carrie

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________

5b. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
Posted by: "Josephine Morningstar" josephine.morningstar@gmail.com jomorningstar
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:57 pm ((PDT))

On 7/17/07, cypressbunny <cypressbunny@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> They probably normally just pitch
> the tripe and intestines, and with it the pancreas which is attached.
> It should peel off the rumen fairly easily.
>
> --Carrie
>
> Wouldnt the Green tripe also benefit the dog with EPI???

--
Josephine MorningStar & Heather, Pyr, Mobility & MASD
Native American in Massachusetts
Never threaten anyone. It ruins the surprise.
www.apachecreations.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________

5c. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:18 pm ((PDT))

On Jul 17, 2007, at 12:20 PM, cresco299 wrote:

>
> Without insulting my only source of a budget saving miracle, how do I
> tactfully point him in the right direction (not that I know where to
> look).
>
> You have to enjoy the irony....
>

Really.... Well, it's pink, not red, and kind of squishy like lungs.
It is nestled behind the stomach proper, just where the small
intestine starts. It's bigger than a spleen, which is more discrete,
covered with a membrane, and red, not pink.

You could offer to help:) I would.

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________

5d. Re: Help me, help the butcher!
Posted by: "Maria" plava_93@yahoo.com plava_93
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:34 pm ((PDT))

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Illu_pancrease.jpg

Maria

Messages in this topic (5)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

6a. Duck
Posted by: "Caren OConnor" cavkist@yahoo.com cavkist
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Hello list members -
Does anyone have experience feeding duck? Would you mind sharing your experience(s) and reason(s) for feeding?
I just spoke with a Cavalier owner who shared that duck was recommended by her vet after when her dog began scratching.
BTW, she feeds hers cooked but, of course, I would be interested in feeding it raw.
Caren O'Connor
Nansemond Cavaliers

---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (4)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

7a. Newbie needs advice and encouragement
Posted by: "gina panza" gpanza@austin.rr.com queenb787
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

Hi my name is Gina and I just started my 12.5 yr old Dalmatian
(Bandit) on a raw diet; 5 days so far! I have seen an improvement in
his energy and mobility.

I'm learning as I go...this is what i've been feeding him
-meaty bones
-egg w/shells
-gizzards
-mashed up carrots (i'm learning as I go and this list does not
condone vegetables; but now I know better)
He takes the bone out of the bowl, eats the egg, gizzards and
carrots; licks the bowl clean then takes his meaty bone into the yard
to eat.

I have also fed him fish and turkey (I'm trying to make do with what
I have until I get my freezer stocked with the right foods). Now that
I started I can't stop so I'm still confused about a couple of
elementary things.

1. Chicken backs? Is this just the bones? or bones with meat?
2. I woke up this morning and stepped on a 1 and almost 2 inch long
pieces of rib bone and a small bit of vomit. Is this normal? Could
this have caused a puncture in his intestine? This scared me! What
else am I doing wrong?

I know this gets easier the more information that one has but I
jumped in and then realized how much I did not know. I feel like a
bad parent for not doing more research FIRST. He was starting to not
eat his kibble and I wanted him off as fast as possible. (My 17 year
old cat recently died and her speedy decline started with refusing to
eat her canned food, one minute she was fine and the next minute she
was dying...so sad!)

Very worried and nervous but trying to keep the raw diet going,
gina
Austin, TX

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________

7b. Re: Newbie needs advice and encouragement
Posted by: "Denise Strother" denisestrother@yahoo.com denisestrother
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:34 pm ((PDT))

Gina,
Don't worry, it's ok to get started and learn as you go. Make it
easy on yourself and your dog. Your dog's intestines are just fine,
I'm sure. You're lucky if a bone and a bit of vomit is the only
issue your dog is having with the switch. This vomit you speak of,
was it yellow or foamy? Some dogs will vomit bile and bone until
their body gets up to speed on digesting bones. Unless your meaty
bones are really mostly meat with a little bone then your dog's diet
is heavy on the bone, especially if he is eating the eggshells too.
And you already know to scrap the carrots. Backs once again are
heavy on the bone and light on meat. A better choice would be to get
a whole chicken and cut it into quarters. Then give your dog a
quarter at a time. I don't think too much of gizzards as a big part
of a meal. I feed them if they come in a chicken, but I don't buy
gizzards as a separate entity. If your dog seems to like this menu,
then wait til he gets a whole chicken quarter. Pork shoulder roasts
(aka picnic roasts) are also great. Your dog doesn't have to have
bone in every meal. Also check the archives for more info. BTW, I'm
in Houston, howdy neighbor. Denise

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, gina panza <gpanza@...> wrote:
> I'm learning as I go...this is what i've been feeding him
> -meaty bones
> -egg w/shells
> -gizzards
> -mashed up carrots (i'm learning as I go and this list does not
> condone vegetables; but now I know better)
> He takes the bone out of the bowl, eats the egg, gizzards and
> carrots; licks the bowl clean then takes his meaty bone into the
yard to eat. I have also fed him fish and turkey (I'm trying to make
do with what I have until I get my freezer stocked with the right
foods). Now that I started I can't stop so I'm still confused about
a couple of elementary things.
1. Chicken backs? Is this just the bones? or bones with meat?
2. I woke up this morning and stepped on a 1 and almost 2 inch long
pieces of rib bone and a small bit of vomit. Is this normal? Could
this have caused a puncture in his intestine? This scared me! What
else am I doing wrong?

Messages in this topic (12)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

8. Re: Was stinky gaaaas/now Organs?
Posted by: "Marguerite" semitruestory@gmail.com margo532001
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 3:21 pm ((PDT))

So sweetbread would be considered organs?

--
Marguerite
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Marley- GR, Lucy-Cocker,
Liza-Yorkie,SmellyCat-PersianPolydactyl
Punkin- Pacific Parrotlet

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (1)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

9a. Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
Posted by: "K Carolyn Ramamurti" lilith23360@yahoo.com lilith23360
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:34 pm ((PDT))

I have a couple of terrific sources for grass-fed meat and poultry. Is there any harm in feeding almost exclusively grass-fed animals and fowl?

Thanks in advance,

Carolyn in Seattle

---------------------------------
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

9b. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
Posted by: "ginny wilken" gwilken@alamedanet.net ginny439
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:40 pm ((PDT))

On Jul 17, 2007, at 4:19 PM, K Carolyn Ramamurti wrote:

> I have a couple of terrific sources for grass-fed meat and
> poultry. Is there any harm in feeding almost exclusively grass-fed
> animals and fowl?
>

Oh, gosh, no! Think about what any prey animal in the wild would be
eating! There were no bad meats before man invented grain cultivation.

ginny and Tomo

All stunts performed without a net!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________

9c. Re: Probably stupid question re: grass-fed meat
Posted by: "pet.wellness" pet.wellness@yahoo.com pet.wellness
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:12 pm ((PDT))

Gosh I hope not. I just polished off a big burger of grass fed beef
and my dog demolished an enormous edible brisket bone. According to
the grass-fed beef ranchers I buy from grass-fed is the best!

http://slankersgrassfedmeats.com/grass_fed_beef_in_a_nutshell.htm

Call Ted Slanker. He'll talk your ear off with the benefits. Sold me.

Pamela

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, K Carolyn Ramamurti
<lilith23360@...> wrote:
>
> I have a couple of terrific sources for grass-fed meat and poultry.
Is there any harm in feeding almost exclusively grass-fed animals and
fowl?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Carolyn in Seattle

Messages in this topic (3)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

10a. Pork safety?
Posted by: "millser25" millser25@yahoo.com millser25
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:12 pm ((PDT))

I've been feeding raw for about a year now, and have shyed away from
pork for fear of trichinosis. I just recently joined this list, and
it sounds like a lot of you ARE feeding pork. How big is the risk of
trichinosis? Are there safer cuts of pork than others? Are certain
sources of pork safer?
Thanks!
Erica in NW Oregon

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________

10b. Re: Pork safety?
Posted by: "cypressbunny" cypressbunny@yahoo.com cypressbunny
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:02 pm ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "millser25" <millser25@...> wrote:
>
> How big is the risk of
> trichinosis?

*** In the US the rate of trich in pork is now about 0.007%.

If that is a risk that worries you, freezing for 3 weeks or so kills
the parasite.

--Carrie

Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

11a. Re: liver
Posted by: "bluefilly" bluefilly@gmail.com bluefillyausi
Date: Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:01 pm ((PDT))

know this is an old post, but have another suggestion. try liver from
a different animal. my dog will chow down on chicken liver, but is not
so keen on lamb or beef liver.

kim

On 12/06/07, Tina Berry <k9baron@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> "Any suggestions for flavoring the veggie mix? They will eat the raw chicken
> parts but not organ meat."
>
> As far as organs, 1 of my 4 does not like liver - he will eat it frozen, but
> not thawed - sometimes they don't like the ICK factor - imagine that, dogs
> grossed out by liver LOL. Baron used to not like it thawed, but now he eats
> it fine. So try feeding frozen liver and see if they will eat it. Increase
> your meat and see how it goes.

--
--------
My inferiority complex is not as good as yours.
Robin Banks
bluefilly@gmail.com

Messages in this topic (16)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

All information on this list represents personal opinion only. By staying on this list, you agree to never hold anyone from this list or associated with this list liable for any information posted through this list. You agree to take personal responsibility for your learning, and for personal responsibility for what you feed yourself, your family, and your dogs, cats, ferrets, or any other animal that lives under your care. If you don't agree, please unsubscribe immediately.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

<*> Your email settings:
Digest Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/join

(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
mailto:rawfeeding-normal@yahoogroups.com
mailto:rawfeeding-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
rawfeeding-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

------------------------------------------------------------------------