[rawfeeding] Digest Number 12138

There are 17 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1a. Re: New to raw diet and need help on getting started...Thanks!!
From: Giselle

2a. Re: Calories
From: Giselle
2b. Re: Calories
From: T Smith
2c. Re: Calories
From: Giselle

3. My first raw feeding
From: ryanbadie

4a. Re: Fwd: Message not approved: FEEDING SCHEDULE
From: katkellm

5a. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
From: bel_the
5b. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
From: Giselle
5c. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
From: bel olaÿfffff1o

6a. Re: Pup off feed & worming
From: harrynala

7a. Websites for raw information & guidelines
From: T Smith
7b. Re: Websites for raw information & guidelines
From: piperspetsittingservice

8a. Re: New dog, feeding question
From: caroline gebbie

9.1. question
From: Kathryn Starr
9.2. Re: question
From: piperspetsittingservice

10a. Re: What edible bones are there besides chicken bones? and a plethor
From: wolfwood53

11a. Re: Some thoughts/questions
From: wolfwood53

Messages
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1a. Re: New to raw diet and need help on getting started...Thanks!!
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Mon Oct 8, 2007 11:45 pm ((PDT))

Hi!
Here's a few links to archived messages and websites to help you get
started feeding raw;

http://www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html

http://www.rawfed.com/myths/index.html

http://rawfeddogs.net/Recipes

*http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/message/141374 *

*post # 141374*
You might want to print out some of the info for later reference.

Keep us posted on your progress, let us know how you and you dog is doing,
ask more Qs if you have them.

What's your name? Tell us about your dog.

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

On 10/8/07, fanhchan <fanhchan@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> MODERATORS NOTE:SIGN YOUR MAILS!!!
>
> I am a mom to a 1 year old Yorkie. She is currently on Canidae and I
> would like to switch it to RAW diet.
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (2)
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2a. Re: Calories
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 12:43 am ((PDT))

Hi, Suzanne!
Don't worry, you don't really need to worry about how many
calories your dogs need to maintain their svelte figures! ^_^

Just feed more if they get a bit thin looking or feeling and feed more if
they're getting fluffy.

BTW, Kcals, or Kcalories and calories are one and the same thing. There are
different types of calories, but the one most used is the Kcalorie, common
usage is just plain old calorie.

About.com says;
http://walking.about.com/cs/calories/g/calorie.htm
"Definition: A calorie is a measure of energy expenditure. The calories
referred to in diet and exercise are kilocalories (kcal) - 1000 of the
calories referred to in science labs for measuring chemical reactions."
wiki says;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calorie

Everything has calories! I bet if you asked your friends how many calories
they needed in a day, they wouldn''t know! ; )

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

On 10/8/07, susrob061174 <susrob061174@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I hate to mention the word "kibbles", sorry. Someone the other day
> asked me how many calories do you give to a adult GD that is very
> active. I told them I don't worry about it because my dogs are on raw.
> This got me thinking, how would you know how many calories you are
> giving your dog while on raw or would you worry about it at all. Does
> the calories only pertain to kibbles? Thanks
>
> Susanne
>

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Messages in this topic (6)
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2b. Re: Calories
Posted by: "T Smith" coldbeach@gmail.com lhasaspots
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 1:58 am ((PDT))

On the other side:
I'd like to know what raw food can I feed to help my youngster gain weight?
Trina

On 10/8/07, Sandee Lee <rlee@plix.com> wrote:
>
> Susanne,
>
> I wouldn't worry about calories at all. Feed the recommended %'s according
> to ideal weight... if the dog isn't getting enough, it's easy to add a bit
> more.
>
> Sandee & the Dane Gang
>
>

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Messages in this topic (6)
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2c. Re: Calories
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 2:40 am ((PDT))

Hi, Suzanne!
Feed more food. Not at the regular meal times, but add
another meal to his daily feeding schedule. Increased portions =
increased calories, results in weight gain.

Feed more meatymeat. Also fat. Chicken tends to be a fattier meat, if
you trim fat &/or skin now, trim less, or not at all. Pork shoulders
and fresh hams have lovely fat and skin on them. Mutton is fattier
than lamb. Beef and pork rib slabs have more fat and sinew than meat.
Tongue is nice fatty meatymeat. Beef heart has good fat, too, if you
can convince the meat man not to trim the cap fat from it.

Go slow. Increasing fat and boneless meals precipitously in a
new-to-raw dog can result in the dreaded cannon butt. Dogs don't often
care, but people do. ^_^

TC
Giselle

> On the other side:
> I'd like to know what raw food can I feed to help my youngster gain
weight?
> Trina

Messages in this topic (6)
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3. My first raw feeding
Posted by: "ryanbadie" ryanbadie@yahoo.com ryanbadie
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 1:58 am ((PDT))

++++++++++Mod note: Pls sign all your emails. thanks. ++++++++++

Ok great. Thank you! I fed him his ribs today and he loved it he was
outside for an hour playing with the bones and what not so i feel like
i made the right choice. He used to be indifferent about his food and
just leave it until he was starving, the big reason why I suspected
there might be something wrong. I bought some whole chickens today,
cut them down to portions for him without removing anything but the
organs, and froze them along with a piece of liver or organ in each
portion. Now in the morning, I let them thaw for a couple hours and
just let him go at it in the afternoon, eating once a day. Does this
sound right?

P.S. It was alot less expensive then I imagined it would be. I
calculated that it will cost me only 35 bucks a month to feed him this
way and he is loving it

Messages in this topic (1)
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4a. Re: Fwd: Message not approved: FEEDING SCHEDULE
Posted by: "katkellm" katkellm@yahoo.com katkellm
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 1:58 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:

> > I just am having a hard time understanding why someone wants to
> allow the
> > dog to gorge & then fast/starve their dog intentionally.

Hi Trina,
The dog doesn't starve. The dog just doesn't get hungry again for a
longer period of time. When a dog who is fed a big meal is ready to
eat again, he is no more hungry than the dog fed twice a day. No one
on this list would allow their dog to get so hungry that the dog is or
feels like he is starving. You are using human standards and emotions
to judge how a dog sees or feels things. Dogs is dogs and peoples is
peoples. I know that you think that your dog is living in luxury
eating twice a day, but the truth is that you enjoy it way more than
your dog. Dog full is different than people full. We were taught to
not let our dogs eat till they were full or they would get sick.
What? We make them stop eating when they are still hungry and then say
its for their own good. It might be good for a kibble fed tummy or a
new to processing raw food tummy, but it is not natural/good for a dog
to have to quit eating when he has not determined that he is full.
Obviously, we are not looking to recreate the hardships in the life of
a wolf, no food so you get really hungry and starve. Our dogs are
lucky because we hunt for them and the fridge always has food in it.
KathyM

Messages in this topic (4)
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5a. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
Posted by: "bel_the" bel_the@yahoo.com bel_the
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 1:58 am ((PDT))

at last, i stumbled on this thread. i was asking another forum
(pitbullforum.com) asking "once or twice/day feeding?'. almost all of
my replies went to twice/day feeding. reasons basically are sympathy
for the pet and human habits (as stated here earlier). this thread is
enough to convince me that once/day feeding is "preferable"..

i also do fasting once/week...

thanks!

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "costrowski75" <Chriso75@...>
wrote:
>
> "miensasis" <kpmnlm@> wrote:
> is there a compelling reason with this model of eating to
> > feed twice a day.
> *****
> The only compelling reasons would be dog related. If health or age
> require smaller meals more frequently then that of course is what
you
> should do. Often it's recommended that small breeds be fed several
> times day, but I don't believe there's consensus with this.
>
> Otherwise, there is no reason except human habit to feed twice a
day
> and there are plenty of good reasons to feed once a day. Or less.
> Chris O
>

Messages in this topic (11)
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5b. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
Posted by: "Giselle" megan.giselle@gmail.com megangiselle
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 2:46 am ((PDT))

Hi!
Welcome!

You didn't tell us your name.

Fasting, except in response to a meal that comprises 2 or more days of
food, or because of digestive upset or illness, has no purpose.

What exactly, are you feeding? Who are you feeding? Inquiring minds
want to know! : )

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> At last, I stumbled on this thread. I was asking another forum
> (pitbullforum.com) asking "once or twice/day feeding?'. Almost all of
> my replies went to twice/day feeding. reasons basically are sympathy
> for the pet and human habits (as stated here earlier). This thread is
> enough to convince me that once/day feeding is "preferable"..
>
> I also do fasting once/week...
>
> thanks!

Messages in this topic (11)
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5c. Re: FEEDING SCHEDULE
Posted by: "bel olaÿfffff1o" bel_the@yahoo.com bel_the
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 5:19 am ((PDT))

Thanks again...

i'm feeding 360g of chicken back and necks with chicken liver per meal to my dal and pitbull at least 4x/week, fish meal (sardines/yellow fin) twice/week and recreational beef bones every sunday (fasting day) with a cup of milk in between (and lots of water)

i would reconsider fasting though.

been in raw feeding for 6 weeks already and my dogs love it...

bel

Giselle <megan.giselle@gmail.com> wrote: Hi!
Welcome!

You didn't tell us your name.

Fasting, except in response to a meal that comprises 2 or more days of
food, or because of digestive upset or illness, has no purpose.

What exactly, are you feeding? Who are you feeding? Inquiring minds
want to know! : )

TC
Giselle
with Bea in New Jersey

> At last, I stumbled on this thread. I was asking another forum
> (pitbullforum.com) asking "once or twice/day feeding?'. Almost all of
> my replies went to twice/day feeding. reasons basically are sympathy
> for the pet and human habits (as stated here earlier). This thread is
> enough to convince me that once/day feeding is "preferable"..
>
> I also do fasting once/week...
>
> thanks!

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (11)
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6a. Re: Pup off feed & worming
Posted by: "harrynala" michelle@synertex.co.uk harrynala
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 1:59 am ((PDT))

++++++++Mod note: please sign all emails +++++++++++++

Many thanks for your reply Trina.

>>whether she's just naturally not needing all the food now she's
>>got rid of her worm?

> I think this is correct

I was kinda hoping that this was the case, however I would say food
intake has more than halved, which seems a heck of a lot going to the
worms! e.g. this morning I gave her her normal 350gr/0.77lb beef
meat (no bone this time), she left alot so I re-weighed what was left
and it was 225gr/0.49lb

I have always fed around 3% of body weight (she's 25kg/55lb) split
into two meals. If this is her new intake, that means she's now only
on 1% of body weight. Can this be ok?

On the worming front with raw feeding, I had originally understood, a
natural healthier diet meant the likelyhood of worms was very much
reduced and had even read some reports that during the change from
commercial to raw that the body had naturally expunged existing
worms. As a result I haven't wormed her since first getting her 6
months ago when she was wormed as part of her health check. Was this
misguided do you think? I just hate pumping chemicals into her if
it's not necessary.

> I think if she does eat, looks good, acts healthy, she is fine.

That's what my husband thinks! He also thinks I fret too much :)

Messages in this topic (3)
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7a. Websites for raw information & guidelines
Posted by: "T Smith" coldbeach@gmail.com lhasaspots
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 2:00 am ((PDT))

Can anyone point me in the direction of some websites that give me some
bone, meat, food guidelines & information for raw feeding please?
I need alot of information & would really like some websites I can read
otherwise, I don't feel I am doing this raw correctly. We seem to be stuck
in first gear & I need to get alot more info.
Thank you,
Trina
--
Chip (deaf Dalmatian)
Casper (deaf Great Dane)
Whisper (deaf Great Dane)
Louie (hearing Great Dane)
Joey (deaf & blind Lhasa Apso)
Amy (disabled Lhasa Apso)
Cassandra (disabled Lhasa Apso)
Mr Paris (Lhasa Apso)
Chloe (deaf & blind Spaniel mix)

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Messages in this topic (2)
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7b. Re: Websites for raw information & guidelines
Posted by: "piperspetsittingservice" piperspetsittingservice@yahoo.com piperspetsittingservice
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 4:55 am ((PDT))

Trina, BLESS YOU for caring for those disabled pets!

I have a ton of links in my favorites that should help you. As a
rather new raw feeder (my 10 year old grey has been on raw for almost
7 weeks) I can tell you that these sites, as well as several yahoo
groups, helped me get over my nervousness and answered many questions.

I also read several books with Raw Dog Food by Carina Beth McDonald
being my favorite.

Good luck to you!

http://www.njboxers.com/faqs.htm
http://www.dogtorj.net/id51.html
http://www.rawlearning.com/fish.html
http://rawfed.com/myths/honest.html
http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm

Sandra in Florida

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "T Smith" <coldbeach@...> wrote:

Can anyone point me in the direction of some websites that give me
some bone, meat, food guidelines & information for raw feeding please?
I need alot of information & would really like some websites I can
read otherwise, I don't feel I am doing this raw correctly. We seem
to be stuck in first gear & I need to get alot more info.
Thank you,
Trina

Messages in this topic (2)
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8a. Re: New dog, feeding question
Posted by: "caroline gebbie" caz320ml@yahoo.com caz320ml
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 4:02 am ((PDT))

They are talking about meals with 50 or 60% of undigestable items in it, so obviously larger amounts of undigestable will cause more trouble, IMO.

Caroline, Bonnie and Londo
2 weeks on raw, Londo has always had a back problem and had very low energy, at last he is a proper Boxer. LOL

katkellm <katkellm@yahoo.com> wrote: why do most professional say bigger meals cause bloat

---------------------------------
Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.

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Messages in this topic (10)
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9.1. question
Posted by: "Kathryn Starr" tishbash@gmail.com scatteredlite
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 4:42 am ((PDT))

Hello everyone,
I have just joined the group a few days ago. I have not yet started to feed
my GSD raw.

I would like to hear from the people who have been feeding raw for a year
or longer and describe the benefits they have noticed.
How it is different (or easier) for you now than in the beginning.
My dog has never done well on anything I feed him. From the most expensive
kibble etc. He is healthy but not where I would like to see him.
Thank you all for your responses.
Kathryn

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Messages in this topic (120)
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9.2. Re: question
Posted by: "piperspetsittingservice" piperspetsittingservice@yahoo.com piperspetsittingservice
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 4:58 am ((PDT))

Kathryn, I don't fit into the "feeding for a year or more" category
but can tell you that after just 2 WEEKS by 10 year old greyhounds
teeth and gums were healthier, her once dull, dry coat was soft,
smooth and shiny and she finally started looking forward to meal time!
Also, her stools are smaller and harder now since she is "using"
more of her food than she did when she was on the "K word".

The changes are not hard, you just need to put a little more thought
into mealtime as opposed to tossing in a cup or two of dry food or
canned. I plan my meals out 3-4 days in advance so I only need to
pick out today's meal and we're all set.

You don't need to be feeding raw for over a year to see the benefits.
I think they start immediately. If I can SEE improvements I can only
imagine what great changes are going on inside that I CAN'T see!

Good luck to you.

Sandra in Florida

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "Kathryn Starr" <tishbash@...> wrote:

Hello everyone,
I would like to hear from the people who have been feeding raw for a
year or longer and describe the benefits they have noticed.
How it is different (or easier) for you now than in the beginning.

Kathryn

Messages in this topic (120)
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10a. Re: What edible bones are there besides chicken bones? and a plethor
Posted by: "wolfwood53" fiona_laidlaw@hotmail.co.uk wolfwood53
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 5:42 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, "spricketysprock" <jess.hamway@...>
wrote:
> Lastly, just about EVERY time after my dog eats, his face seems to
> be very itchy.

My dog also does this although not every time he eats, and strangely
enough I was thinking last night I should ask about it on this forum.
He rubs his face on his mat or rubs his muzzle with his paws. I
suppose he could be cleaning himself (although being clean is not high
priority with him!). I did wonder if maybe he gets little bits of
meat or bone stuck between his teeth (like we do)sometimes and is
trying to dislodge them.

Fiona and Ayasca

Messages in this topic (8)
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11a. Re: Some thoughts/questions
Posted by: "wolfwood53" fiona_laidlaw@hotmail.co.uk wolfwood53
Date: Tue Oct 9, 2007 6:13 am ((PDT))

--- In rawfeeding@yahoogroups.com, Giselle <megan.giselle@...> wrote:
Hi Giselle

Thanks for the advice re messaging and thanks for the links, which
I'll check out.

> Bigger food can be a little puzzling for dogs at first, when they
are used
> to getting their meals in little brown nuggets.

Well, its not so much that I've been feeding him small pieces
intentionally but the diet I was using was more boney type stuff
(lots of chicken wings which he eventually totally lost interest in -
as you would I suppose!). I may well try your tip of making some cuts
in the meat to give him something to get hold of. Perhaps he was
puzzled by his first big bit of meat as you say, at one point he had
hold of it and was shaking it. Presumably in the hope that it would
fall apart (unless he was just making sure it was dead!!).

Take Care

Fiona and Ayasca

Messages in this topic (8)
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